2000 AD Online Forum

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 29 May, 2013, 12:03:58 PM


There'll be a rush to get those over-priced Titan trades on ebay before anyone notices. Great news though.

Quote from: James Stacey on 29 May, 2013, 12:05:43 PM
Just seen the price that's been set for it. Those overpriced Titan trades may still be cheaper  :o

QuoteThe collection will feature all four series, or 'phases' as well as later stories by Morrison and Mark Millar.

Quote from: James Stacey on 29 May, 2013, 12:10:13 PM
http://2000ad.wordpress.com/2013/05/29/so-anyone-been-waiting-for-zenith/

Price £100

Quote from: James Stacey on 29 May, 2013, 12:10:13 PM
http://2000ad.wordpress.com/2013/05/29/so-anyone-been-waiting-for-zenith/

Price £100

Quote"It will also include later stories by Morrison and Mark Millar."

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 29 May, 2013, 12:09:43 PM
So, how much is this going to cost me?

QuoteThe collection will feature all four series, or 'phases' as well as later stories by Morrison and Mark Millar.

Wait, what? When did Millar ever write Zenith?

Quote from: radiator on 29 May, 2013, 12:20:17 PM
Crikey, that's a lot of money for a book.... Think it's safe to say that anyone willing to pay that will be able to get one.

Quote"It will also include later stories by Morrison and Mark Millar."

Anyone know what this means?

Quote from: JayzusB.Christ on 29 May, 2013, 12:21:01 PM
Alan Moore will be writing the next Halo Jones book next.

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 29 May, 2013, 12:23:47 PM
Curious to see it's a limited edition, but that presumably—or at least possibly/potentially—gives Morrison/Rebellion (who must have come to some kind of deal) wiggle room in 2014 or later to issue individual phases.

Quote'We have informed Grant of our intention to republish, but we maintain that we own the rights to reprinting the series.'

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 29 May, 2013, 12:45:40 PM
nice to know everyone is playing nice now. I wonder what agreements have been reached? Is this a one off or has ownership been settled?

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 29 May, 2013, 12:47:45 PM

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 29 May, 2013, 12:45:40 PM
nice to know everyone is playing nice now. I wonder what agreements have been reached? Is this a one off or has ownership been settled?

I think Gordon gave you a clue.

Quote from: GordonR on 29 May, 2013, 12:39:15 PMhttp://comicsbeat.com/zenith-lives/ (http://comicsbeat.com/zenith-lives/)
The important bit:

Quote'We have informed Grant of our intention to republish, but we maintain that we own the rights to reprinting the series.'

QuoteThe collection will feature all four series, or 'phases', the latter two of which have never been reprinted. It will also include later stories by Morrison and Mark Millar

QuoteIf we assume those books would be about £8 to £12 each, then add something for the upgrade to hardback, we're already well past half of this £100 charge.

Quote from: Trout on 29 May, 2013, 02:32:18 PM
Yes, please. I'll buy it. I still have a UK credit card I can charge it to.  ;)

I don't think the price is silly. This would take up at least four, and possibly five, individual volumes if it was reprinted as it has been in the past, or in a similar way to Dante, for example. If we assume those books would be about £8 to £12 each, then add something for the upgrade to hardback, we're already well past half of this £100 charge. If it's in a prestigious format, add a bit more.

I've talked a lot lately about how books are becoming fetishised among comics fans, especially people who read comics and other things digitally. Increasingly, we're happy to buy a beautiful book because it gives us pleasure to have it on the shelf, even if we own it in another form. Good examples would be Bryan Talbot's Grandville series, the Edgington/D'Israeli books like Kingdom of the Wicked, and the slipcase reprints of things like Sandman or Lost Girls. I don't think it's wrong to assume this Zenith book, although more expensive, would fit into that category.

Anyway, WAAAAAAANT.

Quote from: radiator on 29 May, 2013, 02:49:09 PM

QuoteIf we assume those books would be about £8 to £12 each, then add something for the upgrade to hardback, we're already well past half of this £100 charge.

I actually think it's more likely that going by current pricing each separate phase in paperback would be closer to £14/15rrp, with phase 3 probably nearer £17/18 as it'd be a pretty chunky book, so yeah, it's not as outrageous as it initially sounds.

Quote from: GordonR on 29 May, 2013, 12:39:15 PM
http://comicsbeat.com/zenith-lives/ (http://comicsbeat.com/zenith-lives/)

The important bit:

Quote'We have informed Grant of our intention to republish, but we maintain that we own the rights to reprinting the series.'

Quote from: James Stacey on 29 May, 2013, 03:37:04 PM
If Morrison doesn't kick off about this release, surely he has no basis to complain about a trade paperback following it.

Quote from: Patrick on 29 May, 2013, 04:10:38 PM
I'm not a lawyer

Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 29 May, 2013, 04:17:30 PM

Quote from: Patrick on 29 May, 2013, 04:10:38 PM
I'm not a lawyer

Making the rest of your post a fantastically unwise thing to post on the official site of the publisher whose motives you are questioning.

Cheers

Jim

Quote from: sauchie on 29 May, 2013, 03:34:40 PM
It's priced to offset the cost of the court case.

Quote from: Dunk! on 29 May, 2013, 05:50:01 PM
£100 payable on order in July or on despatch in Dec?

The Nemesis Colour Collection was pay up front and then wait.

Quote from: Tjm86 on 29 May, 2013, 06:01:07 PM

Quote from: Dunk! on 29 May, 2013, 05:50:01 PM
£100 payable on order in July or on despatch in Dec?

The Nemesis Colour Collection was pay up front and then wait.

They normally do pay up front and wait. 

On subject of price £100 is not far off the DC absolute editions.

Quote from: Tjm86 on 29 May, 2013, 06:01:07 PM

Quote from: Dunk! on 29 May, 2013, 05:50:01 PM
£100 payable on order in July or on despatch in Dec?

The Nemesis Colour Collection was pay up front and then wait.

They normally do pay up front and wait. 

On subject of price £100 is not far off the DC absolute editions, the Martha Washington hardback was about this price as well and the same is true of the Walking Dead slipcase GN's.  That said they do tend to have a range of extras to justify the extra price.  Somehow though I doubt an intro by the writer / artist or a signed and numbered edition is going to be forthcoming.  Shame really.

Quote from: sheldipez on 29 May, 2013, 06:17:29 PM
I'd love to see what he'd inscribe on these. Leave Morrison alone with1000 books. ;D

Quote from: hippynumber1 on 29 May, 2013, 06:15:13 PM

Quote from: Tjm86 on 29 May, 2013, 06:01:07 PM

Quote from: Dunk! on 29 May, 2013, 05:50:01 PM
£100 payable on order in July or on despatch in Dec?

The Nemesis Colour Collection was pay up front and then wait.

They normally do pay up front and wait. 

On subject of price £100 is not far off the DC absolute editions.

Where are buying those from!?  :o I've never paid more than £60...

Quote from: Judge Jack on 29 May, 2013, 06:27:14 PM
Meanwhile over on FB.

(http://i.imgur.com/2LWWOat.jpg)

Quote from: Tjm86 on 29 May, 2013, 07:31:04 PM

Quote from: hippynumber1 on 29 May, 2013, 06:15:13 PM

Quote from: Tjm86 on 29 May, 2013, 06:01:07 PM

Quote from: Dunk! on 29 May, 2013, 05:50:01 PM
£100 payable on order in July or on despatch in Dec?

The Nemesis Colour Collection was pay up front and then wait.

They normally do pay up front and wait. 

On subject of price £100 is not far off the DC absolute editions.

Where are buying those from!?  :o I've never paid more than £60...

arguably £60 is not far off £100 but if you look at some of the hard to find ones such as Planetary or LOEG then well over £100 is not outside the realms of possibility.  Granted it is not that common for initial listings to be that high but some folks have tried.  Personally never paid more than £60 but there is the advantage of them being listed on multiple sites to bring down the price.

Quote from: Tombo on 29 May, 2013, 09:04:02 PM
Two days ago I ordered the last five progs I need to complete my Zenith collection, and now I find out about this.  I am torn  :-\  £100 is a lot of money.

Quote from: Goaty on 29 May, 2013, 10:19:36 PM

£100

Quote from: Buttonman on 29 May, 2013, 11:16:16 PM
All things considered I'll probably grab one and then feel obliged to read it every six month to get my money's worth.

Quote from: dweezil2 on 29 May, 2013, 08:46:23 PM
What if Grant Morrison buys all 1,000?   :o

Quote from: dweezil2 on 29 May, 2013, 08:46:23 PM
What if Grant Morrison buys all 1,000?   :o

Quote from: TordelBack on 29 May, 2013, 07:38:53 PM

Quote from: Judge Jack on 29 May, 2013, 06:27:14 PM

Excellent points, well made. However, The Great Lost Work of Grant Morrison is the USP of this project, so you can hardly blame Rebellion for leading with that, even allowing for the great artists whose brilliance made it work.

Quote from: Bolt-01 on 30 May, 2013, 12:22:59 PM
I don't work for Rebellion and I won't be slapping £100 down for this, but as far as I'm concerned this is a 'very' limited edition to a work that has been out of print for a heck of a long time. I've no idea what the print costs would be for a product like this, but to be blunt- Rebellion can charge what they like. If the market is there it will sell, otherwise we might find a copy or two in the works at a nifty discount.

Quote from: Bolt-01 on 30 May, 2013, 12:22:59 PM
I don't work for Rebellion and I won't be slapping £100 down for this, but as far as I'm concerned this is a 'very' limited edition to a work that has been out of print for a heck of a long time. I've no idea what the print costs would be for a product like this, but to be blunt- Rebellion can charge what they like. If the market is there it will sell, otherwise we might find a copy or two in the works at a nifty discount.

Quote from: JSouth5942 on 30 May, 2013, 12:37:44 PM

Quote from: Bolt-01 on 30 May, 2013, 12:22:59 PM
I don't work for Rebellion and I won't be slapping £100 down for this, but as far as I'm concerned this is a 'very' limited edition to a work that has been out of print for a heck of a long time. I've no idea what the print costs would be for a product like this, but to be blunt- Rebellion can charge what they like. If the market is there it will sell, otherwise we might find a copy or two in the works at a nifty discount.

Sure they can charge what they like for it, its just a shame the people they are taking advantage of are the people who have supported them all these years. Of course the market is there for this book and they know it that's why they have decided to rinse people for so much money. I'm sure there was nothing stopping them offering a more standard edition along side the limited edition for those that wanted it, but they haven't.

Quote from: sheldipez on 30 May, 2013, 12:41:31 PM

Quote from: JSouth5942 on 30 May, 2013, 12:37:44 PM

Quote from: Bolt-01 on 30 May, 2013, 12:22:59 PM
I don't work for Rebellion and I won't be slapping £100 down for this, but as far as I'm concerned this is a 'very' limited edition to a work that has been out of print for a heck of a long time. I've no idea what the print costs would be for a product like this, but to be blunt- Rebellion can charge what they like. If the market is there it will sell, otherwise we might find a copy or two in the works at a nifty discount.

Sure they can charge what they like for it, its just a shame the people they are taking advantage of are the people who have supported them all these years. Of course the market is there for this book and they know it that's why they have decided to rinse people for so much money. I'm sure there was nothing stopping them offering a more standard edition along side the limited edition for those that wanted it, but they haven't.

But that's going back to the legal grounds that this is currently in, don't mean to repeat others posts earlier in the thread but if these 1000 get out in the wild with "no issues" then that'll put Rebellion in clear for futher individual volumes sold via normal retailers (and Diamond can list with confidence), which I'll be first in queue for.

QuoteSure they can charge what they like for it, its just a shame the people they are taking advantage of are the people who have supported them all these years. Of course the market is there for this book and they know it that's why they have decided to rinse people for so much money. I'm sure there was nothing stopping them offering a more standard edition along side the limited edition for those that wanted it, but they haven't.

Quote from: JSouth5942 on 30 May, 2013, 12:44:29 PM
Surely any legal issues would have needed to have been sorted no matter the size of the print run or distribution method?

Quoteits just a shame the people they are taking advantage of are the people who have supported them all these years.

Quote from: Richmond Clements on 30 May, 2013, 01:11:58 PM
And as someone has pointed out, a low print run of a hard back book is going to cost a lot of money.

Quote from: Dash Decent on 30 May, 2013, 12:52:11 PMI'd prefer a more affordable trade, but if I knew for certain this would be the only way to get it for a very long time, I'd do my best to save up.

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 30 May, 2013, 04:55:46 PM
Funny also how quite a few people don't realise that the five Titan books are only in fact three phases, since the first two were split between two books.

Quotesince the first two were split between two books.

Quote from: JSouth5942 on 30 May, 2013, 12:37:44 PM
they are taking advantage of are the people who have supported them all these years

Quote from: Sideshow Bob on 30 May, 2013, 04:50:07 PM
I agree that £100 is a lot of cash to pay for a book.....
However,  it is a limited edition, hardback and provided it has good quality reproduced artwork in it...it isn't really too bad for what you are getting !..
As an example, the 1st  five Graphic Novels are for sale on eBay,  and if you were lucky enough to get all of these it would cost you,  including postage at least £100.....That's providing they all don't go over £20 each...

Just saying... :D

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 29 May, 2013, 03:40:31 PM
I think it'd be more a case of Rebellion having to distribute it themselves, or via someone other than Diamond which they may not want to do.

Quote from: TordelBack on 31 May, 2013, 08:02:41 AM
We are a perfect example of the fanboy mentality, aren't we?

1.  DO IT DO IT DO IT, OH WHY WON'T YOU DO IT, IF YOU DID IT IT'D BE LIKE PRINTING MONEY!
2.  YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG!

Quote from: TordelBack on 31 May, 2013, 08:02:41 AM
We are a perfect example of the fanboy mentality, aren't we?

1.  DO IT DO IT DO IT, OH WHY WON'T YOU DO IT, IF YOU DID IT IT'D BE LIKE PRINTING MONEY!
2.  YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG!

Quote from: TordelBack on 31 May, 2013, 08:02:41 AM
We are a perfect example of the fanboy mentality, aren't we?

1.  DO IT DO IT DO IT, OH WHY WON'T YOU DO IT, IF YOU DID IT IT'D BE LIKE PRINTING MONEY!
2.  YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG!

Quote from: opaque on 01 June, 2013, 12:13:04 AMThis is sounding more like Kickstarter where you pay your money and x months later you get your stuff.

Quote from: The Adventurer on 01 June, 2013, 12:27:08 AM
For you Brits, remember us Yanks will be paying over $150 for this. And that doesn't include overseas shipping.

So quit your bitch'n

Quote from: The Adventurer on 01 June, 2013, 12:20:37 AM
Except clearly the print quality will be far superior to 'print on demand'.

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 01 June, 2013, 12:17:27 AM
I think there's a fairly good indication of what we're getting, unlike Kickstarter. Consider it a print on demand.

Quote from: opaque on 01 June, 2013, 12:47:17 AM
I know exactly what I'm getting with Kickstarter, just as I would with Rebellion.

Quote from: Trout on 30 May, 2013, 09:42:56 PM
Quote from: The Adventurer on Today at 12:27:08 AM
For you Brits, remember us Yanks will be paying over $150 for this. And that doesn't include overseas shipping.

So quit your bitch'n

See also we residents of Canada. Well said, sir.

Quote from: opaque on 01 June, 2013, 12:47:17 AM
I know exactly what I'm getting with Kickstarter...

Quote from: TordelBack on 01 June, 2013, 08:06:12 AMKickstarter guarantees you nothing

I tend to be buying books from people/websites I already know and trust and for which the product has already been created, so it's just a way for them to get the money up front.

Quote from: TordelBack on 01 June, 2013, 08:06:12 AM
Pre-ordering from Rebellion is entering into a contract - they get your money, you get your book or have access to the usual avenues of reddress.

Quote from: opaque on 01 June, 2013, 01:50:04 PM
Just like Kickstarter.

Quote from: opaque on 01 June, 2013, 03:48:32 PMSo if I buy Zenith on July 1st I'll get it right away? No I won't.

Quote from: Art on 01 June, 2013, 09:42:01 PM
I would totally pre-order a pre-order of this, if I could.

Quote from: WhizzBang on 02 June, 2013, 07:26:35 AM
I am highly likely to order this but I wouldn´t be surprised if a just a short while later a cheaper Rebellion standard edition is also released for those who missed this.

Quote from: The Adventurer on 03 June, 2013, 12:43:17 AM
It's typical operating procedure for publishers to not announce paperback plans while pushing a limited edition HC. As it might impact the HC sales.

I'd hope we'd see a standard non-limited edition paperback (+digital) edition within a year of the HC release. As that would be fair.

Quote from: opaque on 04 June, 2013, 05:19:14 PMIs it just the ABC Warriors Volgan books that are only in hardback atm?

Quote from: strontium71 on 04 June, 2013, 08:37:07 PM
Just realised that the order date is the day after the 50% shop voucher expires...

Quote from: opaque on 04 June, 2013, 08:50:03 PM
Well you couldn't use it on the Termight edition for the same reason ;)

Quote from: opaque on 04 June, 2013, 09:49:15 PM
Wasn't it you could on the normal and not the special edition?

Quote from: robert_ellis on 04 June, 2013, 10:12:26 PM
What can we expect from THE COMPLETE ZENITH? Well phase I is 81 pages, Whitlock and Payne add 10 more. phase II is longer at 93 pages. The non Steve Yeowell Maximan and Mandela annual/special stories add 16 more pages. Phase III is a whopping 133 pages of inter dimensional warfare. Mark miller pops in for a 6 page barely Zenith related (although good fun) text story Tales of Alternate Earths. Phase IV adds 82 pages. ZZzenith is 8 pages of craziness plus the 1 page from a night 2 remember. This gets us to 430 pages plus 3 star scans, 17 covers from 2000ad and the 2 best of covers. Perhaps the Titan reprint covers and the odd datafile and the odd pin up. I'd seriously love it if Steve Yeowell could redraw the 2 stories he didn't illustrate. Did I miss anything? Putting COMPLETE on a cover is a serious boast!

Quote from: robert_ellis on 04 June, 2013, 10:12:26 PM
What can we expect from THE COMPLETE ZENITH? Well phase I is 81 pages, Whitlock and Payne add 10 more. phase II is longer at 93 pages. The non Steve Yeowell Maximan and Mandela annual/special stories add 16 more pages. Phase III is a whopping 133 pages of inter dimensional warfare. Mark miller pops in for a 6 page barely Zenith related (although good fun) text story Tales of Alternate Earths. Phase IV adds 82 pages. ZZzenith is 8 pages of craziness plus the 1 page from a night 2 remember. This gets us to 430 pages plus 3 star scans, 17 covers from 2000ad and the 2 best of covers. Perhaps the Titan reprint covers and the odd datafile and the odd pin up. I'd seriously love it if Steve Yeowell could redraw the 2 stories he didn't illustrate. Did I miss anything? Putting COMPLETE on a cover is a serious boast!

Quote from: robert_ellis on 04 June, 2013, 10:12:26 PM
What can we expect from THE COMPLETE ZENITH? Well phase I is 81 pages, Whitlock and Payne add 10 more. phase II is longer at 93 pages. The non Steve Yeowell Maximan and Mandela annual/special stories add 16 more pages. Phase III is a whopping 133 pages of inter dimensional warfare. Mark miller pops in for a 6 page barely Zenith related (although good fun) text story Tales of Alternate Earths. Phase IV adds 82 pages. ZZzenith is 8 pages of craziness plus the 1 page from a night 2 remember. This gets us to 430 pages plus 3 star scans, 17 covers from 2000ad and the 2 best of covers. Perhaps the Titan reprint covers and the odd datafile and the odd pin up. I'd seriously love it if Steve Yeowell could redraw the 2 stories he didn't illustrate. Did I miss anything? Putting COMPLETE on a cover is a serious boast!

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 06 June, 2013, 12:52:16 AM
Nope. My ideal Zenith collection also has him redraw those two stories, along with having a black and white plate for the colour page of Phase I and somehow reverting Phase IV to colour. The annual/special stories would be included in their original forms as extras, perhaps two pages per page.

Quote from: Trout on 06 June, 2013, 01:07:50 AM
But you'd need a time machine. Every artist's style evolves over time, so Yeowell now is not Yeowell back then. I'm not keen on seeing things redrawn. It happened as it happened and we should accept it.

Quote from: matty_ae on 06 June, 2013, 08:52:20 AM
The McCarthy cover is half-traced off Steve Yeowell anyway.

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 06 June, 2013, 07:19:13 AM
I can understand why it might be nice for to have a single artist throughout, but that's not quite how it happened and the last thing Zenith needs is Lucasification.

Quotethe last thing Zenith needs is Lucasification

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 06 June, 2013, 12:45:15 PM
Frankly, the redrawn stuff wasn't great, but it at least helped you make more sense of what was going on. (Less helpfully, DC inexplicably cut a couple of pages from the collections.)

EDIT: SPOILER ALERT There's an overview of three amended pages on Comic Vine (http://www.comicvine.com/the-invisibles-volume-three-2-the-invisible-kingdo/4000-51819/). Clearly, do NOT go there unless you've already read The Invisibles, because this is right near the end of the entire run.

Quote from: matty_ae on 06 June, 2013, 02:59:31 PM
Obviously 'Lucasfilmification' is meant as a derogatory change but not all tinkering is bad.

I loved Brian Bollands re-colouring of Killing Joke and felt he had the right to do it. So if Steve Yeowell felt strongly he didn't do those scripts because of time, he should have a go. If alternatively he passed because one was a treading water recap and the other bizarre Alice in Wonderland tosh, he may have passed originally. Certainly Annuals and Special felt like the home of sub standard strips in those days so you have to suspect the latter.

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 06 June, 2013, 08:17:16 PM
However, if I had any revisionist tendencies (which I don't), I would be more interested in seeing zzzenith.com redone to be a proper Zenith story that actually made sense.

Quote from: Dark Jimbo on 06 June, 2013, 08:24:04 PM

That remains my only encounter with the character, and I've never been quite so bemused (and stuggled to see what the fuss was about).

Quote from: Trout on 04 June, 2013, 10:24:49 PM

Quote from: robert_ellis on 04 June, 2013, 10:12:26 PM
What can we expect from THE COMPLETE ZENITH? Well phase I is 81 pages, Whitlock and Payne add 10 more. phase II is longer at 93 pages. The non Steve Yeowell Maximan and Mandela annual/special stories add 16 more pages. Phase III is a whopping 133 pages of inter dimensional warfare. Mark miller pops in for a 6 page barely Zenith related (although good fun) text story Tales of Alternate Earths. Phase IV adds 82 pages. ZZzenith is 8 pages of craziness plus the 1 page from a night 2 remember. This gets us to 430 pages plus 3 star scans, 17 covers from 2000ad and the 2 best of covers. Perhaps the Titan reprint covers and the odd datafile and the odd pin up. I'd seriously love it if Steve Yeowell could redraw the 2 stories he didn't illustrate. Did I miss anything? Putting COMPLETE on a cover is a serious boast!

I'd pay £100 for that!

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 06 June, 2013, 08:27:19 PMAs far as I can make out, it was some sort of parody.

Quote from: O Lucky Stevie! on 07 June, 2013, 03:42:50 AM
& anyone who isn't prepared to do so could try requesting it at their local library.

Quote from: robert_ellis on 07 June, 2013, 02:23:10 PM
I wish more writers could go off the boil and still write Flex Mentallo, We3, the Invisibles, New X-Men and All Star Superman. Not every Morrison projects strikes gold but I think he really tries hard to push the medium and not repeat himself. I don't think he could ever be accused of treading water as a writer. I too have great affection his Animal Man and Doom Patrol days but I think its very strange to dismiss his work since then.

Quote from: robert_ellis on 07 June, 2013, 02:23:10 PM
I wish more writers could go off the boil and still write Flex Mentallo, We3, the Invisibles, New X-Men and All Star Superman. Not every Morrison projects strikes gold but I think he really tries hard to push the medium and not repeat himself. I don't think he could ever be accused of treading water as a writer. I too have great affection his Animal Man and Doom Patrol days but I think its very strange to dismiss his work since then.

QuoteI have read every page of All Star Superman and I hated it with a passion.

Quote from: Richmond Clements on 07 June, 2013, 07:10:17 PM
:o You're weird..!

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 07 June, 2013, 07:23:35 PM

Quote from: Richmond Clements on 07 June, 2013, 07:10:17 PM
:o You're weird..!

I loved Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow, though.

Quote from: Richmond Clements on 07 June, 2013, 07:48:24 PM
That was Alan Moore..!

Quote from: Hawkmonger on 07 June, 2013, 07:47:32 PM
Anyone read Next Wave?  I got a big Tooth vibe from that, not your regulare super lark.

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 07 June, 2013, 07:58:18 PM

Quote from: Richmond Clements on 07 June, 2013, 07:48:24 PM
That was Alan Moore..!

My point exactly.

Quote from: moly on 09 June, 2013, 07:32:12 PM
Would love to buy this, but couldn't justify £100. To the mrs, I tried though lol

Quote from: Hawkmonger on 10 June, 2013, 10:53:09 PM
Come 1st anyway. :lol:

Quote from: TordelBack on 11 June, 2013, 08:25:58 AM

Quote from: Hawkmonger on 10 June, 2013, 10:53:09 PM
Come the 1st of July anyway. :lol:

It's not a race darling.  Think of it more like synchronised swimming.  This at least would explain the horrid rictus the wife affects when relations are scheduled.

Quote from: robert_ellis on 11 June, 2013, 12:21:37 PMI'd imagine that each phase will come out as seperate softcover so you'll be paying £50 - £60 for all 4. Does the hardback seem so bad?

QuoteOr it might come out as a single fat 'case files' style volume at around £20

Quote from: Mark Taylor on 10 June, 2013, 02:22:06 PM

Quote from: moly on 09 June, 2013, 07:32:12 PM
Would love to buy this, but couldn't justify £100. To the mrs, I tried though lol

£100 is very little in the scheme of things. S

Quote from: Mark Taylor on 11 June, 2013, 02:30:51 PM

Or it might come out as a single fat 'case files' style volume at around £20 - which you could probably then pick up from Amazon for around £15 or less... then all those who bought the hardback but don't care about the format will wind up feeling a little queasy.

Chances, chances... roll the dice. ;)

Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 11 June, 2013, 02:42:26 PM

Quote from: Mark Taylor on 10 June, 2013, 02:22:06 PM£100 is very little in the scheme of things. S

If only that were true

Quote from: Mark Taylor on 11 June, 2013, 06:51:35 PM

Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 11 June, 2013, 02:42:26 PM

Quote from: Mark Taylor on 10 June, 2013, 02:22:06 PM£100 is very little in the scheme of things. S

If only that were true

Obviously circumstances vary. I will say though that my wife is unable to work for medical reasons and doesn't receive any benefits for reasons I won't go into. I do a full time job in which I earn, admittedly, significantly more than minimum wage. But it's still less than double minimum wage. So looking at it that way, my wife and I each survive on less than minimum wage - and I still stand by the above, for our (less than salubrious) circumstances. YMMV.

Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 11 June, 2013, 07:45:00 PMAnd I'll, maybe, go one better.

Quote from: robert_ellis on 11 June, 2013, 07:57:34 PM
What you could be getting for £100...
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PEtyu7r2RDw&feature=plcp

Quote from: Trout on 12 June, 2013, 03:24:02 AM
There are some terribly heartbreaking tales of woe on this thread. Oh, wait, I just remembered: it's only a fucking book!

Quote from: TordelBack on 12 June, 2013, 09:42:55 AM
Cardboard box?

Quote from: TordelBack on 12 June, 2013, 10:22:51 AM
No, really, thank you so very much for reminding me of that one Bikini Snowden.

Quote from: Molch-R on 12 June, 2013, 12:19:09 PM
Right, the clock on the front of the website should *finally* be showing the correct time...

Quote from: Molch-R on 12 June, 2013, 01:34:33 PM
Wasn't correct for people in other time zones, mind.

Quote from: Raymond Revue on 12 June, 2013, 09:29:02 AM

Quote from: Trout on 12 June, 2013, 03:24:02 AM
There are some terribly heartbreaking tales of woe on this thread. Oh, wait, I just remembered: it's only a fucking book!

I agree; producing a book everyone could afford would be communism. Since we're being treated to everyone's best impressions of Little Nell and Oliver Twist anyway,  we should all club together to buy one of the wretched tomes and give it away to whoever treats this thread to the tale of tears which most palpitates the gland which produces the milk of human kindness. The only question would be what to call our contest ...

(http://gaminghell.co.uk/images/jdreddottosumpcomic.jpg)

Quote from: Mark Taylor on 12 June, 2013, 08:35:24 AM

Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 11 June, 2013, 07:45:00 PMAnd I'll, maybe, go one better.

I'd call it one worse, at least financially speaking. I admire the sacrifice you are making for your son, however.

Quote from: Max Headroom on 16 June, 2013, 06:30:05 PM
Just wanted to ask anyone who is familiar with the story: is it any good? And is it worth one hundred pounds? I'm tempted to try and get my order in come July 1st, but just can't decide...

Quote from: Max Headroom on 16 June, 2013, 06:30:05 PM
Just wanted to ask anyone who is familiar with the story: is it any good? And is it worth one hundred pounds? I'm tempted to try and get my order in come July 1st, but just can't decide...

Quote from: The Cosh on 17 June, 2013, 02:19:15 PM

Is it any good? I'd say it's the second best story 2000AD's ever printed.

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 17 June, 2013, 05:20:37 PM
Dash Decent, obv.

Quote from: The Cosh on 17 June, 2013, 02:19:15 PM
Is it any good? I'd say it's the second best story 2000AD's ever printed. Is it worth the money? Hard to say. It seems like it's going to be a pretty nice volume but, given that you could probably pick up all the original Progs on eBay for £10-£20, it comes down to whether you think the value is in the package or the content.

Quote from: Recrewt on 18 June, 2013, 02:34:09 PM
In an ideal world we would have a paperback version that probably comes in at about 20 - 25 quid tops.  It would be nice to see a time where Zenith is as accessible as something like Watchmen - just because something is good, doesn't mean it should be restricted!

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 18 June, 2013, 04:09:25 PM
Bit harsh.

Quote from: TordelBack on 18 June, 2013, 04:14:13 PM

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 18 June, 2013, 04:09:25 PM
Bit harsh.

Against a backdrop of numerous earlier reprints, but I wasn't being harsh, I was singing their praises!  It's a good thing!  Bolland for everyone, on any budget! 

Oh internet, wherefore is thy I'm-not-being-sarcastic smiley?

Quote from: TordelBack on 18 June, 2013, 04:15:41 PM
EDIT BUTTON PLEASE

Quote from: TordelBack on 18 June, 2013, 04:14:13 PMI wasn't being harsh, I was singing their praises!  It's a good thing!  Bolland for everyone, on any budget!

Quote from: Recrewt on 18 June, 2013, 02:34:09 PM
Something like this is fine for those already familiar with the story and collectors but is your average 16 year old going to drop a ton to have this?

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 18 June, 2013, 04:56:33 PM

Quote from: TordelBack on 18 June, 2013, 04:14:13 PMI wasn't being harsh, I was singing their praises!  It's a good thing!  Bolland for everyone, on any budget!

Ah, right. Apologies. There's so much grumbling about formats/trades/etc. here that I misread your comment similarly.

Quote from: Molch-R on 12 June, 2013, 12:19:09 PM
Right, the clock on the front of the website should *finally* be showing the correct time...

Quote from: hippynumber1 on 11 June, 2013, 06:09:22 PM
Be prepared for the shop to crash...

Quote from: Mardroid on 18 June, 2013, 04:56:41 PM
It's not aimed at them though. It's aimed at those who frequent the site, mainly 30 plus guys who grew up reading these stories.

Quote from: Large48 on 19 June, 2013, 09:00:33 AM
Am I the only one that though Zenith was a bit pony?

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 17 June, 2013, 05:20:37 PM
Dash Decent, obv.

Quote from: Large48 on 19 June, 2013, 09:00:33 AM
Am I the only one that though Zenith was a bit pony?

Quote from: sauchie on 19 June, 2013, 10:23:00 AM
I lost interest somewhere during Phase Three, but I think that was mostly due to the way the story was published in what seemed like four episode chunks, several months apart, and the fact that it was obviously trading on being a burlesque of the huge superhero crossover stories I hadn't read, still haven't read, and have no interest in reading. I really enjoyed all the other phases, and Phase Three reads much better in one sitting.

Quote from: Recrewt on 20 June, 2013, 03:48:25 PM
It gets better, Ian Edginton left a comment:

"Actually Jim, Rich hasn't spoken to me or, to my knowledge Pete Hogan at all. He's just lifted a chat we were having straight off Facebook. Would've been nice if he asked first but then again, it would have meant that Pete and I weren't 'creator's taking sides' but just a couple of blokes having a chat about comics. Where's the fun in that tho' eh?"

Quote from: TordelBack on 20 June, 2013, 09:13:16 AM
i thought the hollow-earth-dinosaurs sequence of Red Seas came close to the level of Phase III - in places Yeowell conveyed vast spaces, fortifications and armies of giant beasts with a couple of lines and blocks.  It's very impressive.

Quote from: Patrick on 20 June, 2013, 07:34:35 PM

Quote from: TordelBack on 20 June, 2013, 09:13:16 AM

Quote from: Patrick on 19 June, 2013, 07:13:28 PM
Phase 3 did have the attraction of watching Steve Yeowell progressively dismantle not only his own drawing style, but almost the fundamentals of drawing comics. Here's a black shape, here's a white shape, forever dancing on the very edge of making sense. He hasn't done anything nearly so exciting since.

i thought the hollow-earth-dinosaurs sequence of Red Seas came close to the level of Phase III - in places Yeowell conveyed vast spaces, fortifications and armies of giant beasts with a couple of lines and blocks.  It's very impressive.

Oh yeah, no criticism of his current work intended. He's a fantastic artist who really knows how to pick his lines. But he's a mature artist now. Zenith phases 2-3 were his experimental period, his creative adolescence if you like, when he loosened up and branched out and found his own voice, and there's something particularly exciting about watching that happen.

Quote from: Recrewt on 20 June, 2013, 03:48:25 PM
It gets better, Ian Edginton left a comment:

"Actually Jim, Rich hasn't spoken to me or, to my knowledge Pete Hogan at all. He's just lifted a chat we were having straight off Facebook. Would've been nice if he asked first but then again, it would have meant that Pete and I weren't 'creator's taking sides' but just a couple of blokes having a chat about comics. Where's the fun in that tho' eh?"

Quote from: Professor James T Bear on 20 June, 2013, 11:39:52 PM
I'm not defending Rich Johnson here because I am unaware of what "The Beefs" may be, but public comments left on a social networking site for all to see might arguably be fair game for reporting.

Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 21 June, 2013, 06:52:04 AMThat is unarguable. What's reprehensible is the failure to cite the source and the changing of context by the way they're presented.

Quote from: Professor James T Bear on 21 June, 2013, 06:31:31 PM
I cede that it's muckraking (I believe the coined phrase specific to the web is "click bait") and I do hear where you're both coming from, but I don't really view it as much different from what many other comics commentary sites do.

QuoteUnfortunately as we shall see, the publisher has a habit of not hiring back those who challenge for rights...

QuoteDo note that no mention of actual signed contracts is made anywhere – that's not damning in itself of course, but its worth pointing out all the same.

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 23 June, 2013, 06:07:34 PM
The inference is that part's yet to be published. Certainly, part one has nothing about this, bar Moore going off in a strop.

Quote from: GordonR on 23 June, 2013, 07:18:44 PMand Hilary Robinson's work was - frankly - just awful.

Quote from: TordelBack on 23 June, 2013, 05:52:36 PM
Long piece by Laura Sneddon...

http://comicsbeat.com/mad-mental-crazy-the-true-life-of-the-fabulous-zenith/

Quote from: Montynero on 24 June, 2013, 08:21:51 AMThe contract for creating Zenith was clear: 'You get paid a page rate, you don't own the rights!'

Quote from: Dandontdare on 24 June, 2013, 08:33:52 AM

Quote from: Montynero on 24 June, 2013, 08:21:51 AMThe contract for creating Zenith was clear: 'You get paid a page rate, you don't own the rights!'

I think the point is that there was no contract.

Quote from: Dandontdare on 24 June, 2013, 08:33:52 AM
I think the point is that there was no contract.

Quote from: Montynero on 24 June, 2013, 08:45:49 AM
It's 'missing paperwork' isn't it, Dan?  Anyway, the point I'm making is he knew the terms and pretending otherwise later is silly.

Quote from: GordonR on 23 June, 2013, 07:18:44 PMMark Millar and Hilary Robinson [...] Neither of them have worked for the title since, but I don't think that's anything to do with a blacklisting policy. Mark's enormously successful elsewhere, and doesn't need to, and Hilary Robinson's work was - frankly - just awful.

Quote from: Richard on 24 June, 2013, 03:41:43 PM
A contract doesn't have to be in writing with all of the terms written down on a piece of paper. It can be verbal and the terms can be implied as well as express.

QuoteWhen you ask or commission another person or organisation to create a copyright work for you, the first legal owner is the person that created the work and not you the commissioner, unless you otherwise agree in writing. However, in some circumstances, for example when copyright is not dealt with in the contract to commission the work, Courts may be willing to find there is an implied licence from the contractor to the commissioner so that the commissioner is able to use the work for the purpose for which it was commissioned. That does not necessarily result in a transfer of ownership. Instead, the company commissioning the work may only get a limited non-exclusive licence. This situation demonstrates the importance of establishing who owns copyright through a contract.

QuoteThere are certain contracts and agreements that must be made in writing and these will include the sale of property, tenancy agreements, copyright transfer, and contracts for consumer credit.[/blockquote]

If Morrison signed a docket of the sort the Beat article talks about, I think that would probably count as a written contract.

Quote from: Richard on 24 June, 2013, 03:41:43 PM

Incidentally, he wrote a Zenith one-off around 2000 or 2001, years after the original series finished, so if he thinks he got such a raw deal at the time then why did he come back and work for them again all that time later?

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 26 June, 2013, 12:31:38 PM
(http://gallery.mailchimp.com/a6e40236aa24d482cfff600d2/images/zenithad.1.jpg)

got me so excited... or that really needs to be jealous of you folk who will be getting it... I won't... oh no I won't... defo.... defo not getting this...

...defo...

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 26 June, 2013, 12:49:59 PM
Uh just seen the shadow too, cute!

QuoteJust thought of something else. How much is the shipping going to be?

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 26 June, 2013, 12:31:38 PM
Now I was resisting this, I simply don't have 100 quid to spend on stories I already have BUT this tiny wee picture on the 2000ad e-mail

(http://gallery.mailchimp.com/a6e40236aa24d482cfff600d2/images/zenithad.1.jpg)

got me so excited... or that really needs to be jealous of you folk who will be getting it... I won't... oh no I won't... defo.... defo not getting this...

...defo...

Quote from: maryanddavid on 27 June, 2013, 12:36:13 AM
Interview with Steve Yeowell from 1988 here https://www.facebook.com/HiberniaComics?ref=hl (https://www.facebook.com/HiberniaComics?ref=hl) if anyone would like a peek.

Quote from: Bat King on 27 June, 2013, 01:56:24 AM
A few more details about the book have been released.

http://judgetutorsemple.wordpress.com/2013/06/27/july-1st-2012-is-z-day-according-to-2000ad/

Quote from: opaque on 27 June, 2013, 07:41:51 AM

Quote from: Bat King on 27 June, 2013, 01:56:24 AM
A few more details about the book have been released.

http://judgetutorsemple.wordpress.com/2013/06/27/july-1st-2012-is-z-day-according-to-2000ad/

So that's the same size as (just grabbed off the shelf) Robo-Hunter 2. Which is only 400 pages long according to Amazon.

QuoteA few more details about the book have been released.
http://judgetutorsemple.wordpress.com/2013/06/27/july-1st-2012-is-z-day-according-to-2000ad/

Quote from: Hawkmonger on 27 June, 2013, 03:51:16 PM
The dimensions shifted me from "But the price..." to "Yeah, paperbacks please".

Quote from: Richard on 27 June, 2013, 10:49:22 PM
This article lists all of the stories in the book, and the list omits the "Zenith Interlude" episodes. So unless the article is not accurate (hope so), it's not actually complete.

Quote from: matty_ae on 28 June, 2013, 08:26:30 AMSo i thinks its exhaustive, if a relatively expensive case file.

Quote from: Ancient Otter on 27 June, 2013, 08:49:29 PM
Don't think anyone has posted this up yet: MAD MENTAL CRAZY! The True Life of the Fabulous Zenith. (http://comicsbeat.com/mad-mental-crazy-the-true-life-of-the-fabulous-zenith/) First part of a series about the history of the creation of Zenith and it's copyright struggles.

Quote from: TordelBack on 23 June, 2013, 05:52:36 PM
Long piece by Laura Sneddon...

http://comicsbeat.com/mad-mental-crazy-the-true-life-of-the-fabulous-zenith/

Quote from: TordelBack on 28 June, 2013, 08:55:56 AM
and I like that this would nestle on the shelf with the other casefiles rather than sticking out all over the place like my Lost Girls and Art of Watchmen.

Quote from: opaque on 28 June, 2013, 09:53:51 AM
So we won't be able to judge for ages either.

Quote from: opaque on 28 June, 2013, 09:53:30 AMThing is when the TPB version comes out at some point (as it hopefully will) it will be exactly the same size but without the hardback cover.

Quote from: matty_ae on 28 June, 2013, 12:34:59 PMI dont think Rebellion publishing any other 80 - 120 page books any more and all those old ones like verdus etc seem to be low sellers.

QuoteWhy?

QuoteLast time round books 4 & 5 were so unpopular Titan slashed them to 1.99 in in-house adverts.

Quote from: matty_ae on 28 June, 2013, 01:51:59 PMYes. My belief is that if they issued the books to an American market individually, the would get a diminishing uptake largey based on how short the books would be

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 28 June, 2013, 03:31:09 PM
Have I got the correct time in London here?

Friday, 28 June 2013 at 3:28:25 PM BST

Fuuny ,because I thought you guys in the UK were ahead od us in Australia by afe hours. Looks like your behind us as it's.....

12:30AM on the 29th right where I am now!

Quote from: TordelBack on 28 June, 2013, 03:47:56 PM
Nope, the earth spins anti-clockwise and the dateline is mid-Pacific, so you lucky boys and girls get the sunrise first, then Asia, the Europe and Africa, then the Americas.

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 28 June, 2013, 04:42:07 PM
Thing is, I was under the impression, America was behind us in Australia and the U.K. was in front.

Quote from: TordelBack on 28 June, 2013, 04:59:09 PM

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 28 June, 2013, 04:42:07 PM
Thing is, I was under the impression, America was behind us in Australia and the U.K. was in front.

You're wrecking my head, man!   :lol:

This is like every single skype conversation my mother has with my brother in Sydney:
"Is it Wednesday with you yet, love?".
"It's Thursday, Mam."
"But it's Wednesday here and it looks dark where you are".
"That's cos it's after midnight".
"On Thursday?".
"Yes.  I mean no.  Maggie, what bloody day is it?"

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 28 June, 2013, 05:45:45 PM
Well, it has always appeared to that Australia is in the middle, with the U.K. on the left and the U.S.A. on the right :-\

Quote from: matty_ae on 28 June, 2013, 12:34:59 PM...I dont think Rebellion publishing any other 80 - 120 page books any more...

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 28 June, 2013, 05:45:45 PM
Well, it has always appeared to that Australia is in the middle, with the U.K. on the left and the U.S.A. on the right :-\

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 28 June, 2013, 04:42:07 PM
Thing is, I was under the impression, America was behind us in Australia and the U.K. was in front.

Quote from: TordelBack on 28 June, 2013, 04:59:09 PM

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 28 June, 2013, 04:42:07 PM
Thing is, I was under the impression, America was behind us in Australia and the U.K. was in front.

You're wrecking my head, man!   :lol:

This is like every single skype conversation my mother has with my brother in Sydney:
"Is it Wednesday with you yet, love?".
"It's Thursday, Mam."
"But it's Wednesday here and it looks dark where you are".
"That's cos it's after midnight".
"On Thursday?".
"Yes.  I mean no.  Maggie, what bloody day is it?"

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 27 June, 2013, 01:07:05 PM
it seems to have US dimensions (at least height wise) rather than reproducing the art in its original size (as printed that is).

Quote from: Dash Decent on 28 June, 2013, 08:56:08 PM

I hope that when ordering is opened up in a few days time they publish a shot of the open book so every punter can get a fair idea of what it looks like before they order, rather than end up with deflated expectations later.

Quote from: opaque on 28 June, 2013, 10:50:52 PM
There's also a shadow underneath it that I don't think is real either ;)

Quote from: opaque on 28 June, 2013, 10:50:52 PM
Probably mock ups or maybe 1-2 real trial versions for quality and printer decisions but as they won't be shipping them out till December 1st the 1000 can't exist yet. After all they'd have to have lots of loose cash floating around to have already paid for them now. They're taking our pre-order money and then getting them published surely?

Quote from: Dash Decent on 29 June, 2013, 12:24:28 AM
That's neither here nor there.  You can take a photo of a real item, remove all the background to show it in isolation and add an effect to give it some lift.  A fake shadow doesn't automatically discount it from being real.

Quote from: Dash Decent on 29 June, 2013, 12:24:28 AM
Most definitely, but I had assumed there would be a sample copy or spread about they would use to show us some of before we buy, even if it only appeared on the webpage going up on 1st July.

Quote from: Dash Decent on 29 June, 2013, 12:24:28 AM
I'll reserve judgement until then but as a customer I'm making them aware what I'd like to know/see in order to induce a purchase.

Quote from: Bolt-01 on 30 June, 2013, 08:15:57 AM
The Great Trade Robbery was originally planned for Zarjaz and would have been in the November issue, but events have conspired against us and so we present it here for you. Words by the Emperor, astoundingly good art by newcomer to Zarjaz Jason Davies and letters by Bolt-01.

(http://www.futurequake.co.uk/imagebucket/Promo/TradeSwindleWeb01.jpg)
(http://www.futurequake.co.uk/imagebucket/Promo/TradeSwindleWeb02.jpg)
(http://www.futurequake.co.uk/imagebucket/Promo/TradeSwindleWeb03.jpg)
(http://www.futurequake.co.uk/imagebucket/Promo/TradeSwindleWeb04.jpg)
(http://www.futurequake.co.uk/imagebucket/Promo/TradeSwindleWeb05.jpg)
(http://www.futurequake.co.uk/imagebucket/Promo/TradeSwindleWeb06b.jpg)

Quote from: klute on 30 June, 2013, 10:48:40 AM
Is there any indication on  how much the deposit is for the book or is it full price up front?

Quote from: strontium71 on 30 June, 2013, 01:51:30 PM
Seeing as it's an expensive price , I reckon a non-returnable deposit of - say £25-30 - could have been been used to hold a copy by , and then the remaining amount payable in 6 months.

Quote from: strontium71 on 30 June, 2013, 02:00:24 PM
But I wonder what'll happen if - highly unlikely - only a fraction of the amount sells?

Quote from: opaque on 30 June, 2013, 01:58:43 PM
We could all be amazed by many details on the pre-order page. I bet a lot of people will be looking even if not buying.

Quote from: sauchie on 30 June, 2013, 10:40:40 PM
The Watchmen/Miracleman/Kirby/Siegel & Schuster aspects of those early takes on the material just emphasize the important role the ideas of Brendan McCarthy and Paradax in particular played in the development of Zenith.

Quote from: O Lucky Stevie! on 01 July, 2013, 05:17:40 AM
Absolutely. Hands up everyone else who read that synopsis & went Hang on Grant, isn't that pretty much every book that you wrote for DC?  ;)

Quote from: TordelBack on 01 July, 2013, 10:20:50 AMAll very interesting, and a tad more balanced in tone than the first part.

QuoteWe've all been over the Alan McKenzie-not-issuing-contracts-to-Alan-McKenzie thing so often that's there no need to start that argument again

QuoteI always find it interesting to note that Morrison explicitly retained copyright to Really & Truly and Big Dave, implying that he understood that this was not the case with his other work.

Quote from: TordelBack on 01 July, 2013, 10:20:50 AMbut I always find it interesting to note that Morrison explicitly retained copyright to Really & Truly and Big Dave, implying that he understood that this was not the case with his other work. 

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 01 July, 2013, 10:37:00 AM
• "Having previously sold text stories to other publishers, Robinson had assumed that comics worked the same – that the author retains the copyright." — Not true, or misdirection in how it's worded. Depends entirely on the publisher and the contract signed. Assumption when it comes to such things is something that should never be done.

Quote from: opaque on 01 July, 2013, 11:17:50 AMI was wondering about the Luke Kirby thing as well. Was it that it was one of the better things that time so seemed more popular or looking back at the strength of Harry Potter etc?

Quote from: opaque on 01 July, 2013, 11:32:01 AMWouldn't you look at the contract/agreement for each piece of work you do to make sure of such a thing?

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 01 July, 2013, 10:37:00 AMOne might argue that showcases poor management at the time, but I'm sure an editor would just love it if a senior manager had to sign off on every strip or contract.

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 01 July, 2013, 12:27:51 PM
It was never that popular and it's certainly not been influential in comics or otherwise.

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 01 July, 2013, 12:58:02 PM
It was one of the better things at the time though; popular enough to run intermittently for 7 years in 2000AD/specials/yearbooks and it was one of the stories featured in the fleetway film/TV option portfolio. I think it would be well up for reprinting, if possible.

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 01 July, 2013, 12:58:02 PM
it was one of the stories featured in the fleetway film/TV option portfolio.

Quote from: TordelBack on 01 July, 2013, 12:45:34 PMMaybe not every contract, but possibly the ones representing a direct conflict of interest, eh?

QuoteIt's a good if frustrating read, and it's saddening to hear agai of creators who feel that the work that made the comic such fun has been stolen from them, but again and again I come back to one central point:  Rebellion bought 2000AD because of its ownership of mountains of juicy IP.  Without that lure, no Rebellion, no 2000AD, no lunch money for today's creatives.

QuoteIt's tragic that comics professionals work in an environment where they find themselves selling some of their precious finite store of creativity in order to pay the bills, and then watch others profit from it.

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 01 July, 2013, 12:58:02 PMIt was one of the better things at the time though

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 01 July, 2013, 02:44:10 PM
Only three and a half more hours to go now:)

Quote from: Molch-R on 01 July, 2013, 04:26:46 PM
Since it's been on our Facebook and Twitter for a while now, worth mentioning the details here:

Page count: 480
Size: 259mm x 187mm
Details: individually numbered hardback with dust jacket & ribbon

Quote from: Molch-R on 01 July, 2013, 04:26:46 PM
Details: individually numbered hardback with dust jacket & ribbon

Quote from: opaque on 01 July, 2013, 05:36:52 PM
But is the ribbon black or yellow?

Quote from: Molch-R on 01 July, 2013, 05:45:10 PM

Quote from: opaque on 01 July, 2013, 05:36:52 PM
But is the ribbon black or yellow?

That's the surprise.

Quote from: O Lucky Stevie! on 01 July, 2013, 05:51:48 PM
Yeah, it's not like Stevie's ever stayed up listening to Broadcast at 2:30am Central Auxtralian Time on a school night before  ;)

Quote from: The Cosh on 01 July, 2013, 05:49:17 PM
I'll buy it with comes with a chimera shaped paperweight.

QuoteYeowell's work is lovely and captivating, a great contrast and realization of Morrison's writing. It's not innovative but it is the kind of solidly professional cartooning that a storyline like this needs to have.

Quote from: TordelBack on 01 July, 2013, 05:57:15 PM
Here's some nonsense from a Jason sacks review (http://comicsbulletin.com/reviews/5878/review-grant-morrison--steve-yeowells-the-complete-zenith-is-really-good-but-costs-150/):

QuoteYeowell's work is lovely and captivating, a great contrast and realization of Morrison's writing. It's not innovative but it is the kind of solidly professional cartooning that a storyline like this needs to have.

Quote from: TordelBack on 01 July, 2013, 05:47:34 PM
Best of luck in the scrum, all!

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 01 July, 2013, 06:17:09 PM
I GOT ONE

Was it my imagination, or was my browser and the payment process painfully slower :)

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 01 July, 2013, 06:17:09 PM
I GOT ONE

Was it my imagination, or was my browser and the payment process painfully slower :)

Quote


HTTP Status Code:    500
HTTP Status Message:    The request was unsuccessful due to an unexpected condition encountered by the server.
Error Code :    5006
Error Description :    Unable to redirect to Vendor's web site. The Vendor failed to provide a RedirectionURL.

Quote from: O Lucky Stevie! on 01 July, 2013, 06:22:33 PM
Anyone else get the following message after entering their card?

Quote


HTTP Status Code:    500
HTTP Status Message:    The request was unsuccessful due to an unexpected condition encountered by the server.
Error Code :    5006
Error Description :    Unable to redirect to Vendor's web site. The Vendor failed to provide a RedirectionURL.

Quote from: strontium71 on 01 July, 2013, 06:33:49 PM
Call me a dunce , but if there have only been 119 people online today ( as of 18.33 ) , how come half have sold? I presume you have to be logged in to order one?

Quote from: strontium71 on 01 July, 2013, 06:33:49 PM
Call me a dunce , but if there have only been 119 people online today ( as of 18.33 ) , how come half have sold? I presume you have to be logged in to order one?

Quote from: dweezil2 on 01 July, 2013, 06:33:58 PM
What size is the T-shirt? There's no size drop down.

Quote from: dweezil2 on 01 July, 2013, 06:19:55 PM

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 01 July, 2013, 06:17:09 PM
I GOT ONE

Was it my imagination, or was my browser and the payment process painfully slower :)

It was slow processing. All that traffic I suspect!

My hands were shaking as the payment was going through!  :o

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 01 July, 2013, 06:17:09 PM
I GOT ONE

Was it my imagination, or was my browser and the payment process painfully slower :)

Quote from: dweezil2 on 01 July, 2013, 06:42:42 PM

Quote from: dweezil2 on 01 July, 2013, 06:33:58 PM
What size is the T-shirt? There's no size drop down.

Apologies, there is a drop down now!   :)

Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 01 July, 2013, 06:48:07 PM

Quote from: dweezil2 on 01 July, 2013, 06:42:42 PM

Quote from: dweezil2 on 01 July, 2013, 06:33:58 PM
What size is the T-shirt? There's no size drop down.

Apologies, there is a drop down now!   :)

Yes, there was a drop down menu for me!





I got the XL

Now, when do we get them?

Quote

There has been an error processing your credit card
Please try again and if problems persist, please try another payment method.

Quote from: credo on 01 July, 2013, 06:37:11 PM
Got one. Well I've got a confirmation at least. Won't believe it until it's sitting in my own sweaty hands.

Quote from: Richard T Field on 01 July, 2013, 08:12:04 PM
Got mine ordered. Just spied the t shirt. Any clue on the sizes? How big is the m?

Quote

System Error.

Due to a system error this transaction is unable to be completed. Click Continue to return to the merchant's website so that you may enter another form of payment.

Quote from: O Lucky Stevie! on 01 July, 2013, 09:43:21 PM
Praise Cal!

Quote from: Colin Zeal on 02 July, 2013, 12:48:53 PM
Maybe he meant of your interior Molch.  :o

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 02 July, 2013, 01:11:13 PM


You have a proctologist?

Quote from: ming on 02 July, 2013, 02:27:43 PM
It seems that Elvis has left the building!

Quote from: Colin Zeal on 02 July, 2013, 12:48:53 PM
Maybe he meant of your interior Molch.  :o

Quote from: Richmond Clements on 02 July, 2013, 01:37:31 PM

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 02 July, 2013, 01:11:13 PM
You have a proctologist?

Well, I do it more as a hobby than anything else...

Quote from: Colin Zeal on 02 July, 2013, 12:48:53 PM
Maybe he meant of your interior Molch.  :o

Quote from: opaque on 03 July, 2013, 09:11:42 AMConsidering they've not even been printed yet it's not that they are finding them down the back of the filing cabinet so why the confusion?

Quote from: opaque on 03 July, 2013, 09:38:04 AM
I wonder how many are actually being printed. Obviously 1000 for sale but then there will have to be promotional ones for the authors/artist, ones to the bosses etc.

Quote from: sauchie on 03 July, 2013, 11:33:43 AM
Someone linked to a review of the actual book (not just the content), so review copies have gone out.

Quote from: sauchie on 03 July, 2013, 11:33:43 AM
Someone linked to a review of the actual book (not just the content), so review copies have gone out.

Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 03 July, 2013, 11:50:48 AM...which will make it pretty easy to track back if the inevitable torrent appears on the P2P networks.

Quote from: opaque on 03 July, 2013, 11:49:27 AM
Do you mean the Comic Bulletin link Sauchie?

Quote from: sauchie on 03 July, 2013, 11:33:43 AMIf sales of this are good enough, maybe we can get a compendium of stuff like The New Adventures of Hitler and Bible John. I wouldn't mind paying to own those stories twice if they promise to reprint them on something other than the brittle school toilet paper on which Crisis was smeared.

Presumably there's no ownership issues with those stories, which were commissioned underCrisis's first-reprint-then-the-rights-revert-to-the-creators deal - right?

Quote from: Link Prime on 29 May, 2013, 02:37:20 PM
Really glad its in print.
I think they're havin a fackin giraffe with the price though...100 quid is too much- that'd be almost 120 Euro.

No, I'll wait for a paperback or digital trade.

Quote from: The Cosh on 03 July, 2013, 12:47:16 PM
Would there really be much of a market for (Morrison's early Crisis work)? Sure plenty people here would probably buy it, so that's twenty copies sold. Zenith's a different thing as it's a hefty chunk of Morrison's early career as well as being known for the ongoing controversy.

QuoteMini-reviews: New Adventures of Hitler. Great stuff; vintage Morrison; Yeowell's art looks uncharacteristically good coloured (something to do with D'Israeli, I believe, even though he professes to be embarrassed by it.) Would read again. Please reprint in a single volume alongside St Swithin's Day, Kill Your Boyfriend and Big Dave. Thanks.

Bible John. Dugshite. To expand: a bald-faced grafting of some superficial elements of From Hell onto a far less interesting Scottish case retaining pretty much none of the insight or power of the original. One or two pages do look very nice though.

Quote from: Proudhuff on 03 July, 2013, 01:30:12 PM
So, as far as we know there has been no, ahem, fallout from this?

Quote from: TordelBack on 03 July, 2013, 01:38:13 PM
Kill Your Boyfriend ... seems to lurk in the bargain bins of many a comics shoppe. 

Quote from: johnnystress on 03 July, 2013, 01:58:10 PM
I expect a press release from the creators shortly that will make me hang my head in shame for buying this

Quote from: johnnystress on 03 July, 2013, 01:58:10 PM
I expect a press release from the creators shortly that will make me hang my head in shame for buying this

Quote from: TordelBack on 03 July, 2013, 02:56:28 PM
Silk Spectre was a good fun comic that would have worked equally well under another title but did okay as an 'alternate universe Watchmen' story, and I suppose Minutemen wasn't too bad (although i don't think I lasted until the end) - quite an appealing volume with those two in it, and certainly the best of the BWs I read.  Good enough to risk your immortal soul though?  That's the question.

Quote from: Link Prime on 03 July, 2013, 03:16:43 PM
I didn't give a monkeys toss about any perceived controversy when I read and enjoyed those particular BW comics, and likewise feel the same regarding Zenith.

Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 03 July, 2013, 11:50:48 AM

Quote from: sauchie on 03 July, 2013, 11:33:43 AM
Someone linked to a review of the actual book (not just the content), so review copies have gone out.

I'm pretty sure the 'review copies' are PDFs. Some (I presume all) are watermarked with the intended recipient, which will make it pretty easy to track back if the inevitable torrent appears on the P2P networks.

Cheers

Jim

Quote from: Bat King on 03 July, 2013, 05:39:53 PM
I think Jim has the right of this matter.

Quote from: credo on 03 July, 2013, 04:22:55 PM
With all this talk of reprinting Grant Morrison's old Crisis work, can I be the first (on this thread) to call for the reprint of John Smith's/Jim Baikie's astounding New Statesmen.  Another great 2000AD does superheroes story that's been lost in the mists of time!

Quote from: TordelBack on 03 July, 2013, 06:23:44 PM
Somebody remind me who owns the rights to the non-creator-owned Crisis stuff?

Quote from: TordelBack on 03 July, 2013, 06:23:44 PM
Imagine the bulging veiny Hicklenton Third World War squeezing its way through your letter box!

Quote from: Harry 20 on 03 July, 2013, 07:32:35 PM
Anyone know how many more are left?

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 03 July, 2013, 06:35:17 PM
Egmont inherited Crisis, and are unwilling to allow interested parties such as Titan to reprint from it, if the ECBT2000AD podcast interview with Pat Mills is anything to by.

Quote from: Richmond Clements on 03 July, 2013, 08:40:59 PM
Well, as we've already been told they're numbered, and what is being described here is fraudulent and probably illegal behaviour, then no, I don't think they will...

Quote from: maryanddavid on 03 July, 2013, 11:39:38 PM
According to one creator in Derry, Titan are looking to put together a collection TWW.

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 04 July, 2013, 06:29:11 AM
Sorry I'm probably being very slow but what does TWW stand for?

Quote from: ming on 04 July, 2013, 06:54:53 AM
Brendan McCarthy has left a lengthy comment on the Zenith article at the Comics Beat (was also put on FB)...  Worth a read, I think.

http://comicsbeat.com/mad-mental-crazy-the-true-life-of-the-fabulous-zenith-part-2/#comment-569818

Quote from: ming on 04 July, 2013, 06:54:53 AM
Brendan McCarthy has left a lengthy comment on the Zenith article at the Comics Beat (was also put on FB)...  Worth a read, I think.

http://comicsbeat.com/mad-mental-crazy-the-true-life-of-the-fabulous-zenith-part-2/#comment-569818

Quote from: ming on 04 July, 2013, 06:54:53 AM
Brendan McCarthy has left a lengthy comment on the Zenith article at the Comics Beat (was also put on FB)...  Worth a read, I think.

http://comicsbeat.com/mad-mental-crazy-the-true-life-of-the-fabulous-zenith-part-2/#comment-569818

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 04 July, 2013, 06:42:15 AM

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 04 July, 2013, 06:29:11 AM
Sorry I'm probably being very slow but what does TWW stand for?

Third World War.

That was the story Mills said Titan weren't able to reprint on the podcast I mentioned. Be nice if things have changed.

QuoteGrant has subsequently claimed that he invented Danny The Street whilst walking backwards around Paris in a Situationist hash-trance... or something.

Quote from: ming on 04 July, 2013, 06:54:53 AM
Brendan McCarthy has left a lengthy comment on the Zenith article at the Comics Beat (was also put on FB)...  Worth a read, I think.

http://comicsbeat.com/mad-mental-crazy-the-true-life-of-the-fabulous-zenith-part-2/#comment-569818

Quote from: Montynero on 04 July, 2013, 04:32:45 PM
haha! I love Brendan. He really is a visionary, artistically. His ideas, his sensibility. But I do wonder who'll pop up next with an even earlier 'down to earth' take on superheroes. Really, it's not a difficult idea to have. I'm sure it's a concept which has independently occurred to hundreds of creators at different times throughout the decades, reflecting the fashions of their particular time. The magic comes from what you do with an idea, how you realise it and blend it with other notions to create a compelling story. That's what Grant and Steve did so well, initially.

Quote from: Montynero on 04 July, 2013, 04:32:45 PM
I do wonder who'll pop up next with an even earlier 'down to earth' take on superheroes. Really, it's not a difficult idea to have. I'm sure it's a concept which has independently occurred to hundreds of creators at different times throughout the decades

Quote from: Montynero on 04 July, 2013, 04:32:45 PM...I do wonder who'll pop up next with an even earlier 'down to earth' take on superheroes. Really, it's not a difficult idea to have. I'm sure it's a concept which has independently occurred to hundreds of creators at different times throughout the decades, reflecting the fashions of their particular time.

Quote from: Montynero on 04 July, 2013, 04:32:45 PMVery interested to read Paradax now!

Quote from: sauchie on 04 July, 2013, 05:08:09 PM
Anyone got any thoughts on what specific bit of magic bollocks (presumably imagery) Our Bren' is referring to when he says ""the 'magickal' stuff in Zenith wasn't original (2000AD had to pay off some artist for having his stuff ripped off later on in the series)"? Or is that just Brendan's own bit of "legend-buffing"?

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 04 July, 2013, 05:44:05 PM

Quote from: sauchie on 04 July, 2013, 05:08:09 PM
Anyone got any thoughts on what specific bit of magic bollocks (presumably imagery) Our Bren' is referring to when he says ""the 'magickal' stuff in Zenith wasn't original (2000AD had to pay off some artist for having his stuff ripped off later on in the series)"? Or is that just Brendan's own bit of "legend-buffing"?

It was author Peter Carroll and his chaos magick books.

QuoteWho's in?

Dunk!

Quote from: opaque on 03 July, 2013, 10:14:34 PM
Gone from the shop again! Is that finally it?

Quote from: Judge Jack on 06 July, 2013, 10:05:58 AM
I noticed over on 2000ad's FB page last night that its now sold out. Not a suprise really.

Quote from: Judge Jack on 06 July, 2013, 10:05:58 AM
I noticed over on 2000ad's FB page last night that its now sold out. Not a suprise really.

Quote from: Minkyboy on 06 July, 2013, 10:35:16 AM
See this week's (1840) Damage Report for a behind the scenes peek at the Droid's travails with the Zenith book.

Quote from: Jo-L on 06 July, 2013, 04:04:45 PM
Does that mean it sold out three days ago, but they announced that it sold out yesterday?  Sounds conspiratorial to me...

Quote from: Proudhuff on 06 July, 2013, 04:24:03 PM

Quote from: Minkyboy on 06 July, 2013, 10:35:16 AM
See this week's (1840) Damage Report for a behind the scenes peek at the Droid's travails with the Zenith book.

That Marg is a one isn't she?

Quote from: Jo-L on 06 July, 2013, 04:04:45 PM
I was surprised at this quite from the Beat story: "it's the fastest selling title we've ever had and sold out in just 48 hours"

Does that mean it sold out three days ago, but they announced that it sold out yesterday?  Sounds conspiratorial to me...

Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 30 June, 2013, 10:03:40 PM
Second part of Laura Sneddon's investigation into the facts of Zenith ownership.

QuoteSo how does UK copyright work? Very basically (and bearing in mind that I am a freelance writer, not a lawyer!)

Quote from: Buttonman on 07 July, 2013, 07:24:39 PM
Gave up at this point :

QuoteSo how does UK copyright work? Very basically (and bearing in mind that I am a freelance writer, not a lawyer!)

Quote from: TordelBack on 07 July, 2013, 07:32:13 PM
If I ever get off this night-time working lark long enough.

Quote from: sauchie on 07 July, 2013, 07:50:52 PM

Quote from: TordelBack on 07 July, 2013, 07:32:13 PM
If I ever get off this night-time working lark long enough.

Congratulations, neebs.

Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 07 July, 2013, 09:09:16 PM"making things personal"

Quote from: Recrewt on 09 July, 2013, 03:08:47 PM
Wasn't aware that Rebellion have a contract for Steve Yeowell's rights so it seems Rebellion/Grant are locked forever in an eternal struggle that neither can break free of - kind of like Thor/Loki

Quote from: matty_ae on 09 July, 2013, 07:25:59 PM
Creators would only be a few grand better off? The IP is worth loads more than that. Dredd is worth millions in perpetuity. Halo jones. Abc warriors. Strontium dog, rogue.  Cgi will only get cheaper. All these properties will in the end be immortalised in another media whether thats film, gaming or so app based hybrid. If grant morrison proved the docket signing thing was invalid and it set a precedent for john wagner and alan moore they'd be immeasurably richer. Have i misunderstood your remark?

QuoteDisney bought Marvel for £4billion

Quotebut seriously what value would you put on the characters IP then?

Quote from: matty_ae on 09 July, 2013, 08:57:14 PM
One made 60 times the other.

Quote from: matty_ae on 09 July, 2013, 08:47:01 PM
I realise ive just generated 2 spurious made up stats but care to put a different figure on either?

Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 09 July, 2013, 09:13:45 PM

Quote from: matty_ae on 09 July, 2013, 08:47:01 PM
I realise ive just generated 2 spurious made up stats but care to put a different figure on either?

Don't be ridiculous. Intangibles are worth precisely what another party is willing to pay for them at the time they're in a position to make an offer.

(If, for example, Dredd 3D had been a box office juggernaut then there would now be substantially more interest than is currently the case but, absent a bidding war, rights would still only be worth what a potential buyer wanted to offer and what the potential seller wanted to let them go for.)

Cheers

Jim

Quote from: robert_ellis on 13 July, 2013, 10:04:32 AM
This whole ZENITH legal battle is a ruse to hide the publication of a Complete Big Dave volume... Look at what you could have won...http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=plcp&v=MAgoEGwB-Fw

Quote from: sauchie on 13 July, 2013, 11:25:34 AMand the idea that it didn't belong in a title that was home to strips as diametrically opposed as Halo Jones and Slaine is an odd one.

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 13 July, 2013, 12:28:29 PM
Big Dave (had) a broad streak of anti-English sentiment.

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 13 July, 2013, 11:56:43 AM
2000AD began with the assassination of Thatcher's fictional counterpart Shirley Brown, and Big Dave is closer to Bill Savage (after too many lagers) than he is to either Judge Dredd or Strontium Dog, plus, it's hilarious.  More than that, Steve Parkhouse belongs in 2000AD, on anything.

Quote from: sauchie on 13 July, 2013, 05:13:39 PM

Quote from: JOE SOAP on 13 July, 2013, 11:56:43 AM
2000AD began with the assassination of Thatcher's fictional counterpart Shirley Brown, and Big Dave is closer to Bill Savage (after too many lagers) than he is to either Judge Dredd or Strontium Dog, plus, it's hilarious.  More than that, Steve Parkhouse belongs in 2000AD, on anything.

Aye, it seemed to me at the time there was a direct parallel to be drawn between Pat Mills's truck driving Cockney geezer and Manchester's hardest man - and the reaction of some readers to Big Dave as an uncouth and vulgar strip they didn't want to see in their comic seems eerily similar to the views of IPC's board of stuffy big wigs, who Mills describes as engaged in an eternal struggle to make everything in 2000ad as safe and anodyne as everything else they published.

I'd only ever seen Parkhouse on The Bo Jeffries Saga (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/16/Complete_Bojeffries_Saga_Cover.jpg) and the last parts of Full Mental Jacket (http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-EEhzve_JxJA/TpJuNskrJGI/AAAAAAAAAPs/TXUUSALvFcg/s400/bojeffries.jpg), so the confident solidity of his figures and the expressiveness of their actions, and the easy way he handled big visuals such as the British Army being turned into [spoiler]'mincing nancy boys'[/spoiler] by Saddam Hussein's massive cock-shaped love gun, were a revelation to me. The low opinion of 2000ad readers Parkhouse expresses in David Bishop's Thrillpower Overload doesn't lead me to hope he'll share his prodigious talents with us again anytime soon. Boo.

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 13 July, 2013, 04:02:56 PM
I never got Big Dave. To me, it felt like a third-rate Viz strip and was wildly out of place in 2000 AD. I'd happily have Parkhouse back in 2000 AD every week, though. (Also, at least Big Dave wasn't as bad, to my mind, as that dire garbage about a trucker—"The Driver"—that ran in Toxic, that a lot of people inexplicably seemed to love.)

Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 13 July, 2013, 07:33:48 PM
I thought Dave was certainly better than the cretinous Maniac 5 which ran alongside it and which --ostensibly-- was more of a fit for 2000AD.

Quote from: Mark Taylor on 13 July, 2013, 07:08:41 PM
My sentiments exactly at the time, "What is a Viz strip doing in 2000AD?", basically. Big Dave slightly warped version of reality didn't make it's appearance in 2000AD appropriate any more than Slaine's streak of irreverent humour would justify its inclusion in Viz.

Quote from: Mark Taylor on 13 July, 2013, 07:08:41 PM

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 13 July, 2013, 04:02:56 PM
I never got Big Dave. To me, it felt like a third-rate Viz strip and was wildly out of place in 2000 AD. I'd happily have Parkhouse back in 2000 AD every week, though. (Also, at least Big Dave wasn't as bad, to my mind, as that dire garbage about a trucker—"The Driver"—that ran in Toxic, that a lot of people inexplicably seemed to love.)

My sentiments exactly at the time, "What is a Viz strip doing in 2000AD?", basically.

Big Dave slightly warped version of reality didn't make it's appearance in 2000AD appropriate any more than Slaine's streak of irreverent humour would justify its inclusion in Viz.

Quote from: dweezil2 on 13 July, 2013, 08:11:48 PMButton Man.

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 13 July, 2013, 08:53:46 PM

Quote from: dweezil2 on 13 July, 2013, 08:11:48 PMButton Man.

OBJECTION! Button Man wasn't rubbish. :D

Quote from: sauchie on 13 July, 2013, 09:15:00 PM

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 13 July, 2013, 08:53:46 PM

Quote from: dweezil2 on 13 July, 2013, 08:11:48 PMButton Man.

OBJECTION! Button Man wasn't rubbish. :D

If Tharg had only printed stories which weren't rubbish, 2000ad's publication schedule would have been annual instead of weekly. We're all fond of shite stories which have seen print over the years, but everybody's fond of different shite stories from everyone else.

Quote from: sauchie on 13 July, 2013, 08:04:49 PMI'm not sure that leaves many genres which still qualify as not our kind of thing.

Quote from: IndigoPrime on 13 July, 2013, 08:53:46 PM

Quote from: dweezil2 on 13 July, 2013, 08:11:48 PMButton Man.

OBJECTION! Button Man wasn't rubbish. :D

Quote from: opaque on 13 July, 2013, 12:25:28 PM

Quote from: sauchie on 13 July, 2013, 11:25:34 AMand the idea that it didn't belong in a title that was home to strips as diametrically opposed as Halo Jones and Slaine is an odd one.

I really hope you're not comparing Big Dave to the quality of Halo Jones or Slaine!

QuoteI understand that there are legal moves afoot from Scotland.

Everyone stand around in the playground and start chanting "Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight!"

Quote from: opaque on 03 August, 2013, 07:07:08 PM
I agree. But also if there wasn't any legal action when it was announced, and went on sale and eventually sold out is it likely to be happening now?

Quote from: Hawkmonger on 07 August, 2013, 12:13:18 PM
When (if at all) can we expect to here/ see production updates?

Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 03 August, 2013, 09:25:17 PM
I could only see lawyers benefitting from any such legal moves

Quote from: hippynumber1 on 18 August, 2013, 11:42:34 AM
I've just had an e-mail from Colin at Rebellion.  It informed me that my order for a second copy of Zenith has been cancelled as the book was limited to one per household (guess I should have read the smallprint). I had ordered a second copy to send on to a fellow boarder who, for one reason or another, couldn't order a copy himself. Now, I can't be the only person in the 1,000 who ordered more than one so are those 'extra' copies going to be made available in store?

Quote from: hippynumber1 on 19 August, 2013, 12:38:10 PM
I try and help a brother out and I get baseless accusations thrown my way. Screw you guys, I'm going home...

Quote from: Link Prime on 19 August, 2013, 12:42:06 PM

Quote from: hippynumber1 on 19 August, 2013, 12:38:10 PM
I try and help a brother out and I get baseless accusations thrown my way. Screw you guys, I'm going home...

Any truth to the rumour you've so many copies of Prog 1208 that you use it as toilet paper?

Quote from: hippynumber1 on 19 August, 2013, 12:47:38 PM

Quote from: Link Prime on 19 August, 2013, 12:42:06 PM

Quote from: hippynumber1 on 19 August, 2013, 12:38:10 PM
I try and help a brother out and I get baseless accusations thrown my way. Screw you guys, I'm going home...

Any truth to the rumour you've so many copies of Prog 1208 that you use it as toilet paper?

To be fair, that one's true!  :-[