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Messages - TordelBack

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Prog / Re: Prog 2077: New York State of Mind
« on: 20 April, 2018, 11:22:54 pm »
I'm not saying that was the writers' original intent, rather that it was my interpretation. 

Oh I'd say you're not far off.  "Nain! Genetik infantryman! Stak!" isn't a million miles from "Nein!  Britisher schweinhund! Achtung!".

I've said it before many times, but Helm off to Rennie, between Jeagir and Hunted he's managed to make Rogue Trooper way more interesting than it was in it's stretched-pun heydey*.  After 30-odd years of others trying (and Rennie himself!) I thought it couldn't be done.

*Each week's plot: take a placename, song/movie title or turn of phrase, modifiy it along the lines of the credits of the Simpson's Halloween Special, and write an episode so that delivers that phrase as a punchline... Next!

Prog / Re: Prog 2077: New York State of Mind
« on: 20 April, 2018, 10:05:03 pm »
Robinson and Collins - what a great team!

Testify brother.

Oooohhh yeah,  that is one fantastic pairing. Two classic artists looking fresh as all get go.  More,  please!

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 19 April, 2018, 05:16:32 pm »
Most of you regular YouTube viewers have probably already seen this, but I was just sent the link recently.
Very funny, and spot on too.


That was pretty painful to watch, but I'm not surprised its fans are falling over themselves to make excuses for it.  And the How It Should Have Ended based on it wasn't very good either.

Heh, I liked it.  Increasingly I spend HISHE videos marvelling at how much the visuals have improved, but that's a thing too.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 19 April, 2018, 10:51:07 am »
In my head-canon, "using the Force" isn't even the point of Jedi/Sith training - they're philosophies of focus, interpretation, approach and aims. The ability, the pull of light and dark, these are innate, simply honed and developed.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 18 April, 2018, 11:57:04 pm »
Demonstrating to the audience what they all ready guessed was true is hardly going against what had all ready been set-up...

She explicitly demonstrates Force ability as recently as TFA, when she senses Han's death, so the viewer doesn't even need to delve back as far as Bespin.  Plus Ben didn't lick it off the stones. 

As to being a Jedi, well, the movie goes to some length to establish that that isn't a requirement.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 18 April, 2018, 10:01:30 pm »
I like the way you think, Andy.  As for their snakes, they seem about the same length.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 18 April, 2018, 09:23:10 pm »
That is one of the silliest things in TLJ, absolutely: a very risky way to teach someone in Poe's role the meaning of responsibility and restraint.  Also, as I argued somewhere in one of these threads, I'm pretty sure Poe's actions in the Illenium system actually saved the fleet by destroying the dreadnaught (the Raddus was about to be destroyed by it, and if it could have jumped sooner, why didn't it? Could have met up with the fighters later).  Imagine being chased by a ship specifically designed to punch through planetary shields, or how long their little bolthole on Krait would have lasted against that firepower: no need to laboriously drag miniature superlasers into position.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 18 April, 2018, 08:51:56 pm »
"He can see things before they happen, that's why he appears to have such quick reflexes.  It's a Jedi trait."
"The Force is strong in my family. My father has it. I have it. My sister has it."

Why were Anakin and Luke such precocious pilots?
Who taught Luke to summon his lightsabre?
Who taught Rey to summon Finn's lightsabre?
Who taught Leia to hear Luke's call for help at Bespin?
Who taught Leia to sense her husband's death?

No-one did. 

Some abilities are demonstrably innate, or instinctive, in those pre-disposed to them.  I can't imagine that Leia didn't tinker with her potential gifts once she was aware of them, some time in the 30 years we missed, even if only to understand her son better.

"Pass on what you have learned". 

And that's even without the strong possibility that Luke actually found a few moments to teach her about moving rocks and making people do what you want.

Film & TV / Re: Last movie watched...
« on: 18 April, 2018, 12:16:29 pm »
It was an 80s arcade game.Which Warner Bros have made free to play on t'internet, right here:


Had totally forgotten the arcade game, wasted some quality insomniac hours on that last night!

Off Topic / Re: The Black Dog Thread
« on: 18 April, 2018, 12:12:56 pm »
Bolt is spot on.  Talk, talk, talk.  It's when this dark shit echoes and rebounds in your own skull that it amplifies to unbearable levels: let it out into the light and air where it can fuck off.

Equally importantly Tjm, it's never just you.  Been feeling the nip of many sharp canines at the cuffs of my trousers this past while too, but have been managing to keep it at that irritating but still-functional level, hence I haven't been making use of this thread lately (prefering to rant on about Star Wars, and rebut bigots on social media as a release valve).  Although I have come as close as drafting and deleting posts more than once. Reasoning: we're not there yet, and maybe never again.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 17 April, 2018, 01:30:10 pm »
That's the size of it, alright, but while I hate to be That Guy (all my life), there does appear to be an airlock, or at least double doors, between the Bridge and the corridor.  You can see Leia heading for it at the end of her Unscheduled EVA.  Also, every hangar on every starship and space station is open to vacuum bar an almost invisible force field, not a big stretch to imagine the command bridge of a starcruiser might have an emergency one of those.

As to the non-sciencey aspects of the Force Poppins business, both the canonical cartoon series and the personal-ur-canon Tartakovsky series have Jedi propelling themselves in zero-G in exactly this manner.  I'm endlessly pointing out that prior to TESB, we had never seen a Jedi move an object with the Force, never seen a Force Ghost, never seen any precognition, never seen the super-speed Luke uses in the freezing chamber, indeed never seen Jedi have any kind of physical prowess at all - just choking people (possibly in Admiral Motti's mind rather than a physical constriction of his airway), sensing great disturbances/each other, making illusory sounds,  and talking a checkpoint guard out of Stop-and-Search on a charge of driving-while-golden. (Prior to RotJ, no blocking blaster bolts, no Force Lightning). 

So Leia suddenly up and flying, or Jedi projecting perfect images of themselves across the galaxy, why the outrage?  The implication is that we have already seen everything, and thus new things aren't welcome.  Ughh, I say.  UGHH! 

Another clever thing I hadn't noticed until the most recent rewatch was the way Rey and Ben's facetime sessions are depicted.  Ben notes that he can only see Rey, not her surroundings, and Rey seems in the same boat, as they are both shot (at least initially) from the front, staring into space, seeing each other as if in the space they themselves inhabit.  This sets up Luke's projection wonderfully - he goes one step forward and projects his image into everyone's minds, even through sensors etc., but he's under no obligation to show his actual circumstances. Equally the raindrop shows the potential persistence of the illusion after the connection is broken.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 17 April, 2018, 06:12:36 am »
Fair dos. Although I probably am going to go on and on about it, it seems inevitable.

So in the spirit of rapprochement, here are some things I really don't like about TLJ:

Rose's theme.  While I like the character, and what her relationship with Finn brings,  her musical theme is overly cutesy,  and badly overused. There's a lot of pretty heavy handed dueling of character themes in TLJ,  and it largely works,  but when every line Rose has is underscored by this very distinctive, wishy-washy, vaguely preachy snippet,  it makes me cringe each time the camera swings her way. SW is all about the music, so this is a shame.

The explicit timescale. Was there any need to count down the rebels' fuel crisis in hours?  It makes the Canto Bight excursion ludicrous (all the way there in a tiny shuttle, land,  find the casino and the codebreaker, spend time in chokey and meet DJ,  escape and go for a ride, then travel all the way back to the fleet, sneak on to the Supremacy,  steal uniforms, find the circuit breaker, get caught,  all in less than 18 hours....). I know we have no idea how far the fleet is from CB, but that tiny modified B-Wing cockpit doesn't look like even the second-fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy. And that doesn't even begin to address what this means for Rey's entire badgering Luke/training/Ren-communing/finding the fleet storyline.

I get that hyperspace travel has always been at plotspeed,  and that Jedi training can be super-quick, but it's putting actual numbers - of hours - on it that pulls me out of things. There must be better ways of conveying time pressure.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 16 April, 2018, 11:49:06 pm »
And Leia floating was just shite.

This is true.  The cruiser was established to be burning fuel, and thus accelerating at the time,  and therefore Leia and the rest of the expelled debris should have had rapid relative motion along the axis of acceleration: far from floating, Leia should have been falling 'down' towards their pursuers! However,  I choose to believe the Raddus' advanced shield envelope contained both debris cloud and frosty princess so that they continued to accelerate with the rest of the ship. 

That is what you meant,  right?   ;)

Look,  Dr X,  you have every right to your negative reaction, I'm not denying that. I'm just reporting my own,  different,  reaction. FWIW I also thought the Leia scene (while a strong idea) was awkwardly executed,  although I have warmed to it on successive viewings.

Other Reviews / Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« on: 16 April, 2018, 10:58:10 pm »
Alas Rogue Friday in the Golden Fox Rebellion isn't much better. At least Rogue Friday isn't a twat he's just dull.

I'll this for the late Mr. Fleisher, he had a great ear for Rogue Trooper titles: Golden Fox Rebellion, Saharan Ice Belt War, Apocalypse Dreadnaught - every bit as good as Ascent to Buzzard 3, From Hell to Eternity or personal fave All Hell on the Dix-I Front: these are stories I want to read (sadly, I did).

Anyway, I heard Colin Taylor went into the steam tunnels under the local library and was never seen again.  But sometimes, when the staff come in in the morning, the Graphic Novels section has been reshelved according some incomprehensible and possibly non-euclidean system.

Film & TV / Re: The Last Jedi - Forum Opinion
« on: 16 April, 2018, 09:32:17 pm »
Except that kind of shock death isn't that unusual.  Buffy did it back in its first season with the kiddie vampire chosen one thingy.

Granted.  But that was good too, wasn't it?  I'm not suggesting the twist was unprecedented in the history of fantasy drama, but I am suggesting it was completely unexpected in the context of the established pattern of SW movies - and yet at the same time entirely in keeping with the second-movie rug-pull exercise we were expecting.  Hence, clever.

I don't get that about Vader being less than the villain of the piece because there's someone above him - what about the Sheriff of Nottingham or Milady DeWinter - or any enemy Nazi that isn't Hitler himself?  Vader represented the Emperor's agency, much as Ren did Snoke's, and that's why they always presented as more of a threat to the protagonists.

On a more holistic note, Star Wars inspired countless knock-offs where the Darth Vader analogue was the big baddie behind the evil space empire, and Star Wars doing the same might have seemed a little underwhelming in the long run. 

Both good points, which I happen to agree with - but it is something I've seen RotJ (and to a lesser extent Empire) criticised for on a number of occasions: you create the ultimate super-baddie and then make him, to coin a phrase, "a rabid cur in a place of power".  Reducing Vader to the level of the Sheriff, or any other feudal ladder-climber, could be seen as diminishing such an iconic villain. Notably the (omniscient) historical intro to the Star Wars novelisation (which of course predates the completion of the movie itself) absolves Palpatine of any evil agency, instead he's just a figurehead manipulated by corrupt underlings, but equally the very first chapter casts Vader as just one (admittedly the most sinister one) of the Dark Lords of the Sith. By the time the film actually gets made, the Emperor seems to be pulling the strings, and Tarkin is 'holding Vader's leash'.  So Lucas' conception seems to have shifted in one respect, if not the other.

As Tips notes, its relevance to the current trilogy is that it shifts the films' focus away from a poor relation of the original dastardly duo to one (IMHO) genuinely interesting villain.

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