(Atten: Rebellion) 2000AD is the new Marvel

[Art]

Yeah, mad props to Blackthrashthere for not being nala nad hanging onto the prog and instead using it to do something interesting (or at least mildly diverting).

[IndigoPrime]

:: Also, mentioned above, the Winter Special from 1995 has the first ever appearance of Sinister Dexter and for some reason does not appear very often on ebay but when it does, it sells for about ?10. ::

Apart from when I tried to sell it and got nowhere. Maybe I'm just unlucky, but I rarely bother trying to sell 2000AD-related stuff on eBay anymore. After all, if it takes four goes to sell Shocking Futures by Alan Moore, despite a low starting price and a sensible title and description (with photo), I think that speaks volumes.

[Quirkafleeg]

tsk, fools! The real money is in cd display frame things!

[DavidXBrunt]

Tarantino - Can I make a request? I'm not doubting  you're as big a fan as the next guy, and that you enjoy reading the prog. But I just get the impression that your buying/selling reduces the comic from an entertainment product into a marketable commodity. And I think that's a shmae.

Take the Dredd-Con message thread where you posted that you didn't enjoy the con. Well, fair enough. Not everyone enjoys the same thing. But you said there was nothing there. And there was. There were 20 or so creators. Did you get the chance to speak to any? Almost uniformally they were fun and interesting and a pleasure to talk to. And the boarders were there too. If you didn't fancy meeting a droid you could have tracked us down and had a chin wag and a pint. I'm a fat, ugly, boring, tosser personally but the rest of the guys and gals are fun people.

I think most people get so annoyed because they percieve you to be acting in a way that strikes them as odd. I'm a collector, I love hunting down progs and books and stuff but I get much more pleasure reading them, as do most people.

So here's my point, my request. Two requests. Firstly could you tell us what's your favourite story, or droid, or character. Tell us what you read recently that blew you away, or what got you hooked. Cause I don't recall you contributing to any thread like that. Not that you have to, but it'd help get a picture of you as a fan, not a collector.

Also, next year if you go to the con don't take any cash. Just come along, track us down and hang out. I think you'll have a much more fun time than you did this year...

Of course, you retain the right to tell me to go vuck myself. With a brick.

[stront692]

hi tarantino - im going to attempt to claify my point again, i agree with priv8eye and i think u are making too many comparisons to the american market

like i said in my first post, this is an easy mistake to make as 2000AD is as u say up to prog 1371 - BUT

2000AD is a weekly comic, ACTION and DETECTIVE are monthly it has taken them over 50 years and they have been weekly or fortnightly for only a year collectively of this whole time, they have a much greater heritage and a much bigger fanbase

the americans have tried to do brit style weeklies and ACTION itself went multi story for a while, they could not sustain it as costs were too high and the creators could not turn around the stories fast enough

2000AD is not as old as the american superhero comics but has a much stronger link with its fans due to being weekly, maybe when it is 50 years old collectors may well start collecting only ROGUE TROOPER etc but at the moment they want the whole comic, not just one character

as priv8eye states the characters are not published indidvidually outside of the comic, so they have no individual identity outside of the quality/EAGLE reprints and they are not published in order - they did not do well bcos of the high amount of filler material in them which makes them look like a poor comic

REBELLION has looked in depth at making 2000AD monthly and joining the meg/tooth together, your comments may only encourage them to do this, thus blighting the item that u love so much

the back issues will only increase if 2000Ad continues to be published, REBELLION only has a responsibility to keep all the material available to fans thru reprints etc and already there is a definite turn away from this with some stories i feel being produced for the american market and specifically for collection into graphic novel format

(DEAD MEN WALKING, a lot of the stories in the recent autumn offensive, was anybody else surprised at how quickly that strange dan abnett story that was about commandos in another dimension was collected, RAIN DOGS i think but cant remember the name)

[Queen Firey-Bou]

do i have to put my pitch fork away? tsk.

but he started his post "Hi guys" thats insight to riot as far as I'm concerned.


Un-Guyish Bou.

[stront692]

by the way i meant glimmer rats not raind sogs (duh) and psynnamon shoulkd in brackets at bottom too?

[Smiley]

Heh. He's a writing machine, that Abnett.

[Buddy]

Shocking Futures by Alan Moore - I'll have that if it's still available.

Email me, please.

[Tarantino]

Wow! I know I can inspire heated debate but I?m starting to feel like Salmon Rushdie, I may go into hiding until the Fat One is lifted, co?s he?s starting to feel heavy and I?m finding it hard to breath!

OK, I will try to defend myself one more time, although if anyone else takes another shot, I may go down.

I initially started buying duplicate issues of prog 2, because the first time I purchased one it was such a thrill, as I am a huge Dredd fan. I then bought another one to recreate that buzz and it spiralled from there. I now own more than I probably should but I never bought them in the first place in order to sell them on and I still do not plan to sell them on. I am trying myself to understand why I own so many and I believe the reason is as follows. If a dedicated Superman fan got hold of Action Comics number 1 it would be a fantastic thrill, as there are very few in existence. I consider myself a dedicated Judge Dredd fan and although owning prog 2 was a thrill, it was somehow diminished by knowing that there were many copies still out there. To counter this I started buying duplicate issues and I now believe that I have a collection which is not matched by any other Tooth fan. I think this equals the feeling that a Superman Fan would have in owning issue one of Action Comics. I have gone to a lot of trouble to obtain copies of prog 2 and have travelled up and down the country in pursuit of my goal. I will admit, I am pleased when they increase in value but still do not plan on selling them and I probably never will (I say probably because everyone has their price).

My previous threads have mainly been about promoting Tooth. I have done this by hyping back issues because I believed that if there was a thriving market in back issues, this would also create an interest in the current progs amongst collectors and investors, who do also have an interest in reading comics. I believe that this is also a way of getting in through the back door in America. As with music, if we can crack the American market then Tooth would be sitting pretty. Despite what various boarders have said, I still believe the above to be true, or at least, as part of a strategy.

Without being critical, I don?t see anyone else on the board trying to promote 2000AD, although I may be wrong, as I don?t read all the threads. To be honest, and I have avoided saying this but I am not too happy with the current story lines, characters and art in 2000AD and do not believe that Rebellion are doing a good job at the moment. I would hate this to be the beginning of the end. If they do not have the success with the Judge Dredd game as that hope to, then they might just drop the comic like a bad apple, but I think Rebellion have their own agenda and only time will tell.

I would just like to finish by saying thanks to Devons Daddy for being my only ally in the last thread, it was nice to have a voice of support amongst all that hostility. Thank you DD.

Also, my collection does not just consist of prog 2?s. I also probably have the biggest collection of Judge Dredd and 2000AD paraphernalia in the world. I do have a life outside of 2000AD but this is my hobby and I get great pleasure from it.

Now, as requested in my last thread, I will create another thread, unrelated to promoting back issues. I will talk about Tooth and my likes and dislikes, I may even tell you a little bit about myself and I promise never to post another thread related to hyping back issues, although the first appearance of Lobster Ransom might be worth getting hold of.......just kidding.

Thank you for listening and come on PaulVonScott, lift that Fat One, he?s heavy and he ain?t my brother!

[paulvonscott]

"Thank you for listening and come on PaulVonScott, lift that Fat One, he's heavy and he ain't my brother!"

Er, what are you trying to say, I'm fat?  Okay (?)

Look, what thrill can you get from buying multiple copies of prog 1208 for ?15?  I have to say that basically I don't believe you, I don't believe you are doing anything to promote 2000AD (I think you have the whole back progs/success of 2000AD formula entirely the wrong way round for a start), and that you are just promoting the value of your own back progs.  Have I really got this wrong?  You've said nothing to convince me otherwise.

2000AD, is arguably in it's best state since the late eighties, the Megazine is the best it has ever been.  In what way aren't Rebellion doing a good job compared to IPC or Egmont Fleetway?

How 2000AD could crack America, or if America could ever warm to 2000AD would make an interesting thread, as long as it didn't revolve around back progs somehow.

[Leigh S]

?If a dedicated Superman fan got hold of Action Comics number 1 it would be a fantastic thrill, as there are very few in existence.?

The difference being that there are 10?s of Thousands of Prog 2 out there?

?I consider myself a dedicated Judge Dredd fan and although owning prog 2 was a thrill, it was somehow diminished by knowing that there were many copies still out there.  To counter this I started buying duplicate issues and I now believe that I have a collection which is not matched by any other Tooth fan.?

Which you agree with ? so your intention is to buy so many prog 2s that they become as rare as Action 1? Is that really an achievable goal?  2000AD back progs interest will only go up if more people want to buy the back progs, which means Rebellions only concern should be to improve the quality of the comic (which barring the odd hiccup, they have done a fairly admirable job at IMO). Your attempts at creating a shortage are unlikely to succeed on your own? which is what these messages are about ? if not for financial gain, then for some psychological satisfaction in owning something that?s difficult for others to get?  

Hell knows, as anyone who knows me would attest, I understand the thrill of the collecting bug, but why not turn your energys onto other areas of 2000AD collecting ? Wouldn?t it be more of a thrill to find the gronk knitting pattern or a MACH 1 T shirt  or the October issue of Big K, than the 89th Prog 2?  Just how does having loads of the same thing make a collection better? Bigger, I?ll grant you.. J

Probably the favourite item in my collection is the IPC internal news magazine that commemorated a Royal Visit to Kings Reach Tower and had a feature on Prince Phillips visit to the nerve centre!  I got this from a carboot for 50p.  It more than recreated the thrill of getting Prog 2 (which TBH, you can get at any decent comics fair or back issues shop half the time anyway ? its really not that difficult).  

?My previous threads have mainly been about promoting Tooth. I have done this by hyping back issues because I believed that if there was a thriving market in back issues, this would also create an interest in the current progs?.

Well there is a thriving market in back progs ? it thrives because prices are so low.  The level of cost of progs really does nothing to make the market thrive.  

And why would increasing the cost of ?key? issues do anything but make money for dealers?  Why is making 1208 an expensive item going to encourage people to keep up their collections, or starting to collect?  I can think of no greater disincentive to people trying to get a full set than being faced with a gap that is so costly to fill, for a relatively recent and not exactly mind blowing prog.  I really can?t follow the logic.




?Without being critical, I don?t see anyone else on the board trying to promote 2000AD, although I may be wrong, as I don?t read all the threads.?

Well, without being critical, that?s a load of rubbish ? people here are doing loads more than your suggestion to promote 2000AD, if only by enthusing about the comic in this very forum (but many are doing a lot more than that).  

The American market is not really a great example of  a thriving comics market IMO.  Its tiny ? 2000AD probably sells more per head of the population of the UK than US comics do in a country with a population many times the size.  Look at Europe, and comics sell by the bucket load there ? that?s the model we should be trying to emulate ? a mass market rather than the cult collectors market of the US.

[stront692]

ACTION 1 is fifty years old, i think u are making an incorrect analogy like i say

compare an EAGLE no 1 to ACTION NO1 but not 2000AD and therein lies my point, EAGLE is not running anymore so the back issue have stagnated, u need REBELLION to keep the comic alive

they are actually a very small company, i know they have their own agenda as i have followed since the days of the ATARI JAGUAR AVP release, they did exactly the same mistakes then as they did on DREDD vs DEATH by releasing a rushed game and then announcing that preview had been sent out to review by accident

they are relying on a minimum number of fans that are not game players buying the game and enjoying it (as they dont know any different), just taking advantage of cross merchandising by sellng licenses to fans as well

they need all their resources to keep the comic afloat, its never actually quantified but producing an american comic with a hit artist is a multi million ??? operation now, the current 2000AD crop of talent will eventually be poached and they have to create new or the comic will die

i think the guys that own REBELLION really want to make movies, i think thas where their heart is, i dont think the JD will be brill when it comes but for the budget they are doing the games on now (if im right) they will have filmed some of the stuff and will be getting the programmers experienced enough so that they dont have to use ILM (mr lucas) as they cost a lot of money

if REBELLION are not successful, they can always make another movie and sell 2000AD on but if the comic does not survive then your investment will fall just as the EAGLEs have done without new blood (although they are currently enjoying a revival thanks to the animated tv series)

if 2000AD turns in to MARVEL thn we are all in trouble and that will also be bad for u (as any back issue or story that rises they will reprint it simply bcos it has risen in value, when they start creating rare issues we are all in trouble as the comic is then just a cash cow)

they originally said that the comic would tapped in to the computer game company as a loss each, but when it was making a profit they would start to raise the price (which they have done recently)

i think the autumn offensive where they sold all the subscribers (a captive audience) helped that but i dont think they will get away with it again

finally i think all this would be cleared up if stopped referring to yourself as a 'collector' and at least used the term 'collector dealer' as many americans are proud to use this term - i would consider it loosely myself in that my comic collecting is self supporting

but i dont 'horde issues' or specifically buy multiple copies and u cant be buying them infinitely without at least an idea of selling them on eventually

[Slippery PD]

Without being critical, I don't see anyone else on the board trying to promote 2000AD, although I may be wrong, as I don't read all the thread

Yawn.  So you buy back issues.  I subscribe, whats the difference?  This is my hobby.  I make no money from it, in fact I lose money (now theres a concept for you) I promote it amongst my freinds and family, thats it.  Like many people, I have a wife, children, a house and a number of other interests that I devote time to.  I dont have the time to devote to promoting 2000ad, other than the time I spend on the board and the discussions I have with my freinds and the time I spend at comic conventions.  

Now are you saying because I dont have multiple copies of every back issue, that Im not promoting 2000ad.  thought not?  And I suppose that means your going to give yours away as a promotional tool?  Thought not.  

Dont take this personally, coz Im not sure exactly what you are getting at.......  Lets discuss how we the fans can promote 2000ad?  Yes?

Yer Slips

[judge dreddd]

ya see tarantino, you gotta realise, you aint in charge of rebellion, someone else, and er, you gotta live with that