Prog 1566 - Endgame

[Thursday]

"Bolt-01, never miss a pimp..."

Shouldn't that be 'never miss an opportunity to pimp' or is there something you're not telling us?

[The Monarch]

The only thing that would have made that awesomely cool time twister better was if the story was the last one and the last page was the back page of the prog

[Bolt-01]

I told the police that it was an accident, but it took me weeks to get that pimp out of the tyre tread....

Bolt-01

[red_fan]

The Hitler story - a few little quibbles.

First, Hitler's bunker was /a bunker/. The only way I could imagine a tank being able to force its way through into the structure would be if it could somehow miraculously tunnel through the Earth like the Thunderbirds' Mole. I mean, what's the point otherwise of building a /bunker/ above ground? Did they paint a target on the walls or something?

Second, it's remarkable that the timetravelling Eva and Adolf didn't materialise inside solid rock, half a mile up in the air or the middle of the ocean. Or maybe bump into Johnny Alpha and Wulf along the way ...

Third, at the time those big mammals were around in the panel on the last page, it's probable that humans were also around, spreading outward from Olduvai Gorge. I don't think Hitler would have liked their company, bearing in mind that he was one of the most maladjusted bigots in human history - but he'd have had very little choice, because two organisms on their own are not enough to jump start any kind of species. Not enough genetic diversity - which, again, is a source of much ironic laughter.

Lastly, can you honestly believe that the founding father of nazism, instigator of the Holocaust, would be prepared to be the progenitor for what would eventually be /every single human race in the world/ ... including all the Jewish people that will ever live, from Abraham on up?

All I could think of, when I read the story, was "Oh dear God, I hope nobody in my synagogue read this week's 2000AD, because they'll be burning copies of Prog 1566 up and down the length and breadth of Britain." It was nice to see a 2000AD tackling the topic of nazism and bigotry ... only, erm, I think you were kind of giving off the wrong signals, kind of like that New York grocery store which, this week, tried selling "delicious hams for Chanukkah."

Anyhow, otherwise a deliciously irony-free prog. Looking forward to the big one next week. What will you come up with for us then?

Shalom.

[red_fan]

The Hitler story - a few little quibbles.

First, Hitler's bunker was /a bunker/. The only way I could imagine a tank being able to force its way through into the structure would be if it could somehow miraculously tunnel through the Earth like the Thunderbirds' Mole. I mean, what's the point otherwise of building a /bunker/ above ground? Did they paint a target on the walls or something?

Second, it's remarkable that the timetravelling Eva and Adolf didn't materialise inside solid rock, half a mile up in the air or the middle of the ocean. Or maybe bump into Johnny Alpha and Wulf along the way ...

Third, at the time those big mammals were around in the panel on the last page, it's probable that humans were also around, spreading outward from Olduvai Gorge. I don't think Hitler would have liked their company, bearing in mind that he was one of the most maladjusted bigots in human history - but he'd have had very little choice, because two organisms on their own are not enough to jump start any kind of species. Not enough genetic diversity - which, again, is a source of much ironic laughter.

Lastly, can you honestly believe that the founding father of nazism, instigator of the Holocaust, would be prepared to be the progenitor for what would eventually be /every single human race in the world/ ... including all the Jewish people that will ever live, from Abraham on up?

All I could think of, when I read the story, was "Oh dear God, I hope nobody in my synagogue read this week's 2000AD, because they'll be burning copies of Prog 1566 up and down the length and breadth of Britain." It was nice to see a 2000AD tackling the topic of nazism and bigotry ... only, erm, I think you were kind of giving off the wrong signals, kind of like that New York grocery store which, this week, tried selling "delicious hams for Chanukkah."

Anyhow, otherwise a deliciously irony-free prog. Looking forward to the big one next week. What will you come up with for us then?

Shalom.

[red_fan]

Gosh, a double post. Dreadfully sorry. I'll try not to make it a triple. :)

[Mardroid]

Even without the flying brick (which should have been left, in, definitely makes more sense) the story still works. Even if Eva was intending to go with Hitler all along, it's doubtful with the 1 only rule that she would have been allowed, i.e. she would have been forcibly detained. The tank sequence served as a disruption hence Eva was able to get her way. Only her little funny 'tached husband could prevent her and he was taken by surprise.

As for the above ground bunker stuff.... some bunkers were above ground. Actually Hitlers wasn't, I don't think, but in the world of the story it is. That's ok by me. And the fact he's the father of the human race including those he tried to exterminate, well surely that's ironic too and just serves to prove the foolishness of race hate.

I agree that humans probably existed at the time of the mamoths in the real world. However being realistic and setting it in an earlier time period with small mammals wouldn't have had the same impact, mamoths are iconic. I.e. we get the point and thats what matters.

[johnone]

On this weeks prog

Droid Life : strangely brilliant

Dredd: What other way could it end, also a simple throw away line at the end hints at the future.

Time Twister: Seriously , how long has it been since there was a Time twister and a fine story to start with , I think those who are nitpicking Mikes work are thinking too hard , it's supposed to be a bit of pulpy fun...( as most of the great Time Twisters and future shocks of the eighties were)I will say however that the artwork wasn't the best the last page in particular, I have to ask what was Erskine thinking....

Bob Byrne...Simply Brilliant.

Button Man..Ok I love Button Man but this is simply pointless, well written but where was this going..and why is Harry Heading for Ireland? In the original Buttonman some of the Buttonmen were Irish so why go there?...and as for fraziers art..Don't get me wrong He is a fantastic artist but his style is just unsuitable for this character..can sonmebody tell me again why Arthur didn't do this  story?

Red Seas : Good fun

an ok issue ,far stronger than the Meg , Micheal Carroll and Bob Byrne  should be given far more to do , they seem to have more enthusiasm and Ideas than other writers( Cough, Mills,cough Grey Suit cough!)at the moment.
 And I can't wait to see what the hell happened in the Red Seas!

[Richmond Clements]

Anyhow, otherwise a deliciously irony-free prog.

Well, your copy certainly seems to have been!

[Leigh S]

Have to say - well done Mike.  its' a nicely put together story and its always a thrill to see a new naem in the writers credit box.  I also thought the American soldiers seemed like a bit of padding, but as you described it up there, they were integral to the plot and the reason for Eva and Adolf both being transported much more fun - a very odd rewrite that, taking away some sense rather than adding it! Love to know whether that was a Tharg rewrite before the art went, or a way of fitting the art into the script. Though given Thargs mysterious ways, we'll probably never know...

[TordelBack]

Just to critique some of red-fans space-maths here...

Hitler's bunker had access to the Chancellery gardens (unless The Downfall misleads me, and  I rather doubt it does), so at least part of it was at ground-level - who's to say that isn't where the Time Machine was kept?  After all, who wants to re-appear 10m under ground?

Mammoths as a genus of Pliocene elephants are about 4-5 million years old, only becoming extinct maybe 4-5,000 years ago.  So Hitler and Eva could either have been the first humans, contemporaries of Homo Erectus, or trespassers in some farmer's fields.   It all sort of depends whether the time machine shifted them in space as well.  And I think any useable time machine would have to have that facility, otherwise you're going to find yourself in a vacuum pretty fast.  

[Robin Low]

"But the last page, bloody hell. Wittle is pissed off! Dredd has been breaking his balls since the beginning, and he doesn't like it. Is this the start of a whispering campaign against Dredd from the Street Judges, who have traditionally been his biggest supporters? With one panel John Wagner turns Mandroid into part of the Fargo revelations/ mutant rights storyline.
The best comic strip in the world."

My thoughts exactly. You know, I had to agree with people that this story was a little slow and drawn out, and I thought Nate's final actions were a waste... and then we get a final page of potentially enormous significance. Wagner never ceases to impress me.

I quite enjoyed the rest of the prog, too.

Regards

Robin

[Jim_Campbell]

"My thoughts exactly. You know, I had to agree with people that this story was a little slow and drawn out, and I thought Nate's final actions were a waste... and then we get a final page of potentially enormous significance. Wagner never ceases to impress me."

Agreed. Like I said in another thread recently, for all the "Worlds will live, worlds will die" gubbins other publishers throw around (or even for the unwelcome - and thankfully now seemingly abandoned - trend of increasing bodycounts in the Dredd epics) the real power of Dredd is in Wagner's ability to drop in lines like this and shake the strip to its foundations.

Cheers

Jim

[scutfink]

Ok,a bit off topic to start, but on the Dog Sentience thing, doesn't anything which is capable of even the most minimal acts of self preservation display some degree of self awareness?

'Course, this doesn't mean Dogs are intelligent, I'm a Cat person myself, I heartily advocate the idea that Dogs are special needs pets for the emotionally retarded, but that's a different argument for a different time (Usually when I'm more drunk...)

Back on topic, twas a good prog this week, I liked the cover, everything wrapped up neatly, nice short stories...

One quibble, is it just me or did Red Seas seem to be missing something through this current run, I dunno, Pirates?

[I, Cosh]

One quibble, is it just me or did Red Seas seem to be missing something through this current run, I dunno, Pirates?
I believe that's what made it so mental.