New trailer features few more about the Season 8, it out on 23rd August.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TivqZTq5u6Y (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TivqZTq5u6Y)
Looks okay, I especially love that the redesigned Daleks have been forgotten about. They were worse than the new Mini, you don't mess with the classics.
Love this moment in new trailer;
(http://37.media.tumblr.com/20dcc8758530f5540dcbacf9a9d56251/tumblr_n8nuz32Lpe1rkeh8to4_500.gif)
Watched the leaked episode 1 last night, and it's very, very good - not at all like half of last season.
Some great character interaction, acknowledgement of past annoyance and laugh out loud lines.
I'm not a spolier, except for myself, and I am looking forward to the broadcast version.
I loved Matt Smith, but last season was very boring and confusing.
One thing I will say is it looks like we have another dreaded arc - such an overused convoluted device these days.
Listen! (To what?)
Also TARDIS console been updated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwhWDnff1sk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwhWDnff1sk)
New teaser for opening episode "Deep Breath"
http://youtu.be/KjQ2x2-kxNQ (http://youtu.be/KjQ2x2-kxNQ)
Looking forward to this, due to Capaldi. Haven't watched it for years, it's been camp as Christmas since Eccleston left, hard to stomach. And I have tried, several times...
Also looking forward to this....and am hopeful that it will be a 'darker' Dr Who than the previous incarnations....Slightly worried though as I had heard Frank Skinner was getting a role in one of the episodes....but will wait until I see it before passing comment..
Peter Capaldi does look good in the role though !!
Cheers
I haven't seen a full episode of Who since Sylvester McCoy's day but will be taking Mrs Zeal to the cinema to see the new episode this month. Is there any point in me trying to find out what has happened in the intervening years or should I just go to the cinema and fall asleep? She is a huge Who fan so won't appreciate me asking daft questions about what's going on.
Quote from: Colin Zeal on 12 August, 2014, 11:14:31 AM
She is a huge Who fan so won't appreciate me asking daft questions
'
Who's that?' :o
Just look at the pretty explosions and don't try and follow the plot.
Titles of Doctor Who Season 8.
Deep Breath.
Writer: Steven Moffat
Director: Ben Wheatley
Into The Dalek
Writers: Phil Ford and Steven Moffat
Director: Ben Wheatley
Robot Of Sherwood
Writer: Mark Gatiss
Director: Paul Murphy
Listen
Writer: Steven Moffat
Director: Douglas Mackinnon
Time Heist
Writers: Stephen Thompson and Steven Moffat
Director: Douglas Mackinnon
The Caretaker
Writers: Gareth Roberts and Steven Moffat
Director: Paul Murphy
Kill The Moon
Writer: Peter Harness
Director: Paul Wilmshurst
Mummy On The Orient Express
Writer: Jamie Mathieson
Director: Paul Wilmshurst
Flatline
Writer: Jamie Mathieson
Director: Douglas Mackinnon
In The Forest Of The Night
Writer: Frank Cottrell Boyce
Director: Sheree Folkson
Dark Water/Death In Heaven
Writer: Steven Moffat
Director: Rachel Talalay
A couple of things - firstly isn't it nice to have a proper full season again (this is a full season right?)
Secondly am I the only one who fines the title 'Into the Dalek' a little weird?
Third did Dan Abnett write these title 'Robot of Sherwood' and 'Mummy on the Orient Express' are puns you'd think he decided to reject?
can't wait - fingers crossed - the writing helps the actress who plays clara - no empathy for her last series
Ben Wheatley? Seriously? Ben fucking Wheatley? Haven't they seen anything else he's done, or are they really determined to have parents joining their kids hiding behind the couch, quaking with terror? Michael Smiley would make a great villain.
managed to watch four episodes so far and will say the folowing:
Moffat seems to have finally cracked it.
Capaldi has the makings of the best Doctor of the current era.
Clara isn't irritating.
It's often very funny.
Episode 5 has a great, clever plot.
Mark Gatiss does his best yet with "Robots Of Sherwood", a very tongue in cheek, silly sci fi romp with loads of funny lines. Just don't take this one seriously.
I love how episode one appeares to be a rip off of Asylums Sherlock Holmes movie.
blue , you in the biz? how did you get to see four already?!
I am looking forward to this tonight . sky plus cadburys whole nut and a grolsch get the girls to bed and enjoy 80 mins of peace!
I am pleased its going back to an older doc and less cuddly no matter how much I loved matt smiths tenure. I was also pleased about the reset button of the pandorica and the daleks ,proper daleks back as a constant.
Quote from: Grugz on 23 August, 2014, 01:41:36 PM
blue , you in the biz? how did you get to see four already?!
I am looking forward to this tonight . sky plus cadburys whole nut and a grolsch get the girls to bed and enjoy 80 mins of peace!
I am pleased its going back to an older doc and less cuddly no matter how much I loved matt smiths tenure. I was also pleased about the reset button of the pandorica and the daleks ,proper daleks back as a constant.
Nah, just sneaked around on the internet.
Some people don't like doing it that way, but I'm okay with it. Looking forward to watching them again in glorious colour!
Well that was okay. It got better as it went along. Hold out hope that Peter Capaldi could be very good indeed, Clara was less annoying. I already have a theory about 'heaven', we'll see.
Sheesh, I dunno about that lads. Does every single thing have to be meticulously spelled out with metatextual wryness? Not exactly 'lots of planets have a North' was it? Found it a bit dull all in all, although Capaldi himself was grand and the effects were terrific.
Quote from: Official Hawkeye Pierce Action Figure on 23 August, 2014, 09:13:32 PM
Does every single thing have to be meticulously spelled out with metatextual wryness?
I wish I'd said that as its so, so true.
"Please keep watching, fan-girls, we know he's not hot any more, but he's all vulnerable. We need your viewing figures. Stay! Stay!" Have a bit of dignity, Moffat.
It got better once the largely irrelevant opening spectacle was disposed of and the pace slowed down a little. Capaldi himself was great, and Jenna Coleman, who I've found fairly anonymous to date, was also noticeably improved. Trying to help the viewing public cope with the change by including familiar faces isn't a new idea – even JNT tried to get Sarah-Jane or Leela to come back for Peter Davison's era – but I wish they'd been braver and not bothered with the Paternoster lot. Having you-know-who on the phone was pathetic.
You're all taking this far too seriously. Capaldi was great. Moffat will probably fuck it up, but I'll coast a good couple of episodes on sheer goodwill to our new Scottish overlord.
Cheers
Jim
The Doctor should ditch Clara and start knocking about with Strax instead. Strax is brilliant.
Quote from: Greg M. on 23 August, 2014, 09:38:46 PM
Having you-know-who on the phone was pathetic.
There was a time when having past Doctors show up in episodes gave me a fanboyish thrill, but this wasn't one of them.
It would take a lot for me to dislike Capaldi however, and he was indeed pretty good in this episode.
I just wish it had diverged more from the (IMO unnecessary) finding-it's-feet opener.
'Deep Breath'...felt more like a slow, raspy exhale.
Anyway, I'm cranky cause I (uncharacteristically) moronically drove my car 2K up the town earlier with the handbrake partially on.
No cool TARDIS sound effect alas, just the burning smell of a boy-racer's wet dream. :'(
Three very different reaction to the cross-species, gay snog.
Eva (9): Is this alowed in the bible?
Charlie (5): Yuck.
Hector (3): Is she a crocodile? Wouldn't she snap her wifes face off?
I'm so proud.
Having Smith there and the rest of that side of the episode was clearly Moffat speaking directly to the audience as much as the characters interacting. As for the episode, I quite enjoyed it, but that new theme tune is awful—nearly as bad as its nadir during the late 1980s.
I watched most of this episode with the kids, and really enjoyed it, even though I was slightly confused. I have not watched an episode before, so its all new to me and the kids too. I have a vague Idea of what its about from the (great) Gibbons comics.
We have threatened to watch it for a while, this seemed like an ideal jumping on point. Good fun, bits scary in parts, and funny too, enough for them to ask when the next episode is on. We will give it another few week and see.
Quote from: Greg M. on 23 August, 2014, 09:38:46 PM
"Please keep watching, fan-girls, we know he's not hot any more, but he's all vulnerable. We need your viewing figures. Stay! Stay!" Have a bit of dignity, Moffat.
Yep. There were so many Moffat mouth-pieces in here his awful metagenda irritatingly weighted the whole episode although in my mind it was swung into the positive by the bleak brilliance of director Ben Wheatley and the infinite depth of the everglorious Capaldi whose performance - forty percent blustery Tom Baker, twenty percent arrogant snippy Colin Baker and forty percent pure Capaldi was inspired. Jenna Coleman was brilliant also and shows here how much she was clearly phoning it in before as the half-character Clara - suddenly desperately sad to see her go.
[spoiler]Also 'missy'=mistress=female master - lipservice to the endless 'female regeneration' requests by making the master a woman - a brilliantly cast counter-Capaldi in Green Wing's Michelle Gomez.[/spoiler]
TALKING OF AMAZING CASTING. This series will have it in spades - next week features MICHAEL SMILEY and ZAWE ASHTON :D
Conclusion:
A strong start but Moffat's era lacks consistency and I hope it can maintain its mood from here.
Quote from: sauchie post office on 18 August, 2014, 05:23:11 PM
Ben Wheatley? Seriously? Ben fucking Wheatley? Haven't they seen anything else he's done, or are they really determined to have parents joining their kids hiding behind the couch, quaking with terror? Michael Smiley would make a great villain.
Well Michael Smiley is in the next episode, also by Ben Wheatley.
I was not happy about the title sequence or the new music, but it might grow on me. What happened to the simple vortex/face, eh? Back in my day all we had was the radiophonic worship, dontcha know. You whippersnappers don't know how easy you have it.
Anyway, Capaldi was excellent, but the story was confusing and lacklustre.
I'm still looking forward to the rest of the series though!
I loved it all. I watched it with my kids and we all had lots of fun. Capaldi was great and the story was exciting, with several laugh-out-loud moments. Strax, as ever, was hilarious.
And that's about as far as a review should go, in my opinion. Either you liked it or didn't, and in either case it's polite to explain why. There's a hell of a lot of deep analysis on this thread and far too much criticism of an individual. I complained about it when these threads were full of rants about RTD and it's just the same now.
It's all-ages TV. Don't like it? Turn it off.
Also, please don't post information about coming episodes that you've seen online. That's just plain wrong.
- Trout
Fell asleep halfway through :-[
Can't say I was over impressed by what I saw up until the snooze.
Have taped it and will watch all the way through next week sometime.
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 24 August, 2014, 12:18:56 AM
Jenna Coleman was brilliant also and shows here how much she was clearly phoning it in before as the half-character Clara - suddenly desperately sad to see her go.
Intriguingly, the Clara / Doctor relationship now has the potential to grow into the most interesting one of the modern era. She's like a new character, in that she now
has a character. I'm particularly happy to see that she now seems to suit her job, when it previously seemed an afterthought. When Capaldi called her a control-freak, I thought "Well, of course she is - she's a teacher." It's probably the defining trait of the profession - I should know.
Quote from: Goaty on 24 August, 2014, 12:24:11 AM
Quote from: sauchie post office on 18 August, 2014, 05:23:11 PM
Ben Wheatley? Seriously? Ben fucking Wheatley? Haven't they seen anything else he's done, or are they really determined to have parents joining their kids hiding behind the couch, quaking with terror? Michael Smiley would make a great villain
Well Michael Smiley is in the next episode, also by Ben Wheatley.
As long as he kills a paedo with a hammer, I'll be happy. The dinosaur should have been a paedo, and Capaldi should have killed it with a hammer.
i enjoyed the slower pace and the music seemed toned down.
Quote from: Greg M. on 24 August, 2014, 08:00:26 AM
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 24 August, 2014, 12:18:56 AM
Jenna Coleman was brilliant also and shows here how much she was clearly phoning it in before as the half-character Clara - suddenly desperately sad to see her go.
Intriguingly, the Clara / Doctor relationship now has the potential to grow into the most interesting one of the modern era. She's like a new character, in that she now has a character. I'm particularly happy to see that she now seems to suit her job, when it previously seemed an afterthought. When Capaldi called her a control-freak, I thought "Well, of course she is - she's a teacher." It's probably the defining trait of the profession - I should know.
I loved Jenna in this episode she's really coming into her own.
Loved the episode!
But it is dark, and the Doctor is so darker!
Capaldi is perfect as the Doctor!
(http://www.radiotimes.com/uploads/images/original/55602.jpg)
Jeez, but some of you are miserable bastards!
Quote from: Trout on 24 August, 2014, 03:33:35 AM
It's all-ages TV. Don't like it? Turn it off.
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 23 August, 2014, 09:43:49 PM
You're all taking this far too seriously.
Cheers
Jim
Nah. If you go onto a forum made up of rabid genrefans you must expect a certain level of overanalysis. I don't think it's right at all to say "if you don't like something, just ignore it - don't criticize it", everybody has a right to be critical about anything surely and just because most Whofans are hyper critical doesn't mean its so much of a cliche that we should all just not bother and blindly enjoy it.
Also what I posted in the spoiler tag was personal speculation (actually my mate's speculation) rather than actual knowledge I've gleaned from spoilerhunters there. So it may not be true although it seems terribly likely.
I've enjoyed Coleman ever since she started wearing that wee tartan skirt.
Also, nice pins in that interview afterwards!
Sorry, someone's gotta bring the tone down.
:D
I never said people couldn't/shouldn't discuss it, only that if you're not prepared to extend a new Doctor a bit of a grace period then maybe you're taking the whole thing a bit too seriously.
Personally, I think it's both baffling and more than slightly hilarious that a TV show whose fundamental premise includes changing the lead actor and often the entire tone of the show every few years should have a fan base that seems so consistently and doggedly resistant to change.
Cheers
Jim
I remember when Colin Smith criticised an issue of Spider-Man for having the main character torture someone, no less than the editor of the comic took to Twitter to indulge in name-calling and suggest that maybe a grown man shouldn't be reading comics for kids. I'm getting that vibe from some of the dismissal of criticism on here, and while I don't necessarily agree with some of what's been said, Who is an all-ages show and not just a kids thing (unless CBeebies shows have blowjob jokes in them) and its adult audience is entitled to say if they feel shortchanged by the bits meant for them.
That first scene wasn't funny and felt like it went on forever, then the person I was watching with went "what is this shit?" during the title credits. A lot of scenes that felt pointless then followed, along with some really poor cgi work that abandoned any sense of scale by not being composite shots but being people pointing off-camera - was that t-rex really supposed to be in the Thames? But it picked up a bit later, I thought. I liked some of the interaction, the deep breath bit with Clara walking out of the ship, and the monster of the week, and while the lady detectives' witty banter stuff felt very forced and overplayed, I imagine that's a sop to the watching kiddies. Capaldi was good when he - eventually - stopped doing that whacky guff.
Some good bits, but overall I didn't enjoy it very much.
All fanbases look like that from the outside - but I think actual change is really what's needed and what I'm personally craving - and really it's difficult to extend a 'fresh start' grace period to a show which began its new era with the exact same inconsistent show-runner, one- dimensional companion and heavy-handed and overused side characters as before.
Having said that though I do think last night was a strong start and said inconsistent showrunner did a solid job of instantly giving nothingy Clara a bit more weight, the tone was a lot darker and Capaldi is a fantastic Doctor. The real proof will be in the long pudding though and I'll see it all and judge each and every new episode WITH EVER-INCREASING LEVELS OF SERIOUSNESS. :think:
If they don't have Daleks, crossness, shouty technobabble, and tartan miniskirts in the coming episodes I will write a letter of complaint.
I enjoyed it some smallish weaker moments, the bit with the tramp going on far too long IMHO, but overall a good start and Capaldi looks like a great doctor, love some of the steam-punkish elements like the organ legging robot guy.
Fun and I'll be watching next week and we'll see how it goes.
Quote from: Zarjazzer on 24 August, 2014, 02:48:12 PM
I enjoyed it some smallish weaker moments, the bit with the tramp going on far too long IMHO
I think that was in part because the trampchap is the widow of the late great Lis Sladen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Miller_(actor))...
Erm hold on, even if something was aimed at children its still entirely open to critical evaluation, both good and bad. Dismissing evaluation of kiddies telly is akin to saying it doesn't matter if children's entertainment is good or bad?
If that's what anyone is saying, which I'm not sure anyone is exactly, but if they were that'd get me heckles up...
It should be done in context of course.
Nobody's saying that it's wrong to offer an opinion. Just, for me, the detailed criticism of how television is made tends to suggest expert knowledge from some of you. Knowing you don't have expert knowledge undermines your opinion. But I also know you're mostly good people (except Owen, who eats living puppies) so I don't want to start a fight.
Also, the vitriol isn't quite so bad as it was during the RTD era. Take a look back at those threads. So much hatred. I never understood why so many people put themselves through watching a TV show that made them feel so bad. Just turn it off.
It's interesting to me that I was never that into Doctor Who before the Eccleston launch. But now I love it, and I love Old Who the most. Like it or not, this show has been an astonishing worldwide success and that continues.
Yay!
enjoyed capaldi very much ,glad the whole young flirty boyfriend thing is dead but saying that loved [spoiler]matt's cameo reminding clara it was him under all the wrinkles[/spoiler] as she was ready to dump him but then loved the bit when doc dumped her and seemingly left her to die .
clockwork man jumped or pushed?
Quote from: Trout on 24 August, 2014, 03:45:20 PM
But I also know you're mostly good people (except Owen, who eats living puppies) so I don't want to start a fight.
used to eat living puppies - that was before I got a solid quality control person in - now my puppies are most rigorously tested and assuredly dead before they enter my slavering maw.
I'm not sure why they made that big a deal of it, the 11th Doc effectively shoved the Sycorax leader to his death in his regeneration episode.
The Family of Blood punishment was pretty theatrical from what I recall.
I found Deep Breath pretty disappointing, tbh.
New Who has been a mixed bag from the off, with many, many dreadful episodes, interspersed with some good ones (which is why I haven't stopped watching).
Then Day of the Doctor was genuinely wonderful. I found myself hoping it would be the start of a new era, but it seems that level of quality is basically impossible to maintain and now we've gone back to the same old RTD template, produced on a shoestring, that was holding the programme back before.
Capaldi was wonderful in Deep Breath, of course. David Tennant and Matt Smith were both consistently wonderful as well. It is very much to be hoped that one day the writers will reach the same level, and that the BBC will actually start ploughing some of the large amount of cash they make from Who back into the show.
Shut yer stinkin' bear mouth.
Motherfucker.
Jim
I enjoyed it - I thought the quieter parts with Clara and the Doctor and the Doctor and the homeless guy worked really well, the whole cafe scene and subsequent scenes below were great.
The fight with the androids and the Paternoster lot didn't really work for me, but good fun overall, enjoyed the cameo too.
[spoiler]I thought the villain was going to be disposed of in a 'beast with 5 fingers way', I was waiting for the hand to do something, as it was hanging around his shoulder.[/spoiler]
Shoestring? Look at some of the old stuff. The budget for New Who is phenomenal!
The sets used to be wobbly - now it's just the scripts!!
*I'll leave it alone now*
I enjoyed last knights episode :D
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 24 August, 2014, 05:19:37 PM
Shut yer stinkin' bear mouth.
Motherfucker.
Jim
My comments weren't aimed at you, Jim. But now they are, you degenerate Scotsman.
Quote from: Trout on 24 August, 2014, 07:38:38 PM
Shoestring? Look at some of the old stuff. The budget for New Who is phenomenal!
No matter how much the actual cgi costs, it does look a bit cheap when they don't composite human footage into the SFX shots and instead just have reactions from people pointing. Mind you, this being Doctor Who, there's no reason to assume something like that isn't a deliberate anachronism in order to call back to the old show.
I don't think it's compositing that's the huge expense, more that to get a wide shot of real people requires a lot of extras (and costumes), regardless of whether it was a real set or live action inserted into a VFX shot.
It does take time to film people in blocks and at the angles required for the shot for crowds.
They could have done more with foreground crowds in a medium/close shot - they did one with Jenny with the T-Rex in the b/g, but it's not something that I noticed while watching it originally.
Yeah, I think you need the imdb boards for that chat. I genuinely never considered it that deeply. I just watch it with my kids, who love it even more than I do. I doubt we'll ever get technical.
Quote from: Trout on 24 August, 2014, 09:06:16 PMI just watch it with my kids, who love it even more than I do.
Yes but as they're not ACTUALLY working for the media that undermines their opinion a little.
*leaving it alone now*
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 24 August, 2014, 11:21:10 PM
Quote from: Trout on 24 August, 2014, 09:06:16 PMI just watch it with my kids, who love it even more than I do.
Yes but as they're not ACTUALLY working for the media that undermines their opinion a little.
*leaving it alone now*
Again, I have never said there is anything wrong with expressing an opinion.
However, people who offer detailed assessments using specialized film-making terms leave me scratching my head a bit. See also the people who, every week, review the layout of the prog's front cover. (Unless that reviewer actually a graphic designer, in which case fair enough.)
Quote from: Trout on 24 August, 2014, 11:47:30 PM
See also the people who, every week, review the layout of the prog's front cover. (Unless that reviewer actually a graphic designer, in which case fair enough.)
Who's to say they haven't?! Unfortunately we're not yet at a point where someone when they have a frank opinion about something must also hyperlink to a CV so that those who don't quite agree can look over their work and life experiences and go "the two weeks you did a course in Adobe Illustrator mean you may have some grasp on font choice but the four months you subsequently spent working in Burger King means you clearly weren't committed enough to design in the first place to now comment !"
I just have a problem with the "you're not qualified to comment" argument on the grounds that it is snotty and marginally elitist. And as someone who is snotty and marginally elitist I feel I'm in the best place to feel that way.
I don't mean to be snotty, and I'm never elitist. For the third time, I am not saying anyone isn't qualified to comment. I'm just a bit uncomfortable with the way some are commenting. Ah, whatever. It's become an argument about the argument and I try not to do those.
Maybe you're right and we should leave it. :)
It had a dinosaur and scary robots in it.
The Sontaran hit Clara on the nose with a newspaper and we laughed.
This was good.
I enjoyed the show. And as with others felt it dragged a little until the restaurant scene. Loved when the Doctor pined for Amy's long legs.
Quote from: Trout on 24 August, 2014, 11:47:30 PMHowever, people who offer detailed assessments using specialized film-making terms leave me scratching my head a bit. See also the people who, every week, review the layout of the prog's front cover. (Unless that reviewer actually a graphic designer, in which case fair enough.)
I don't letter comics - on account of letterers only being prevented from being the lowest of the low because of the existence of colourists - but like most people I know the consensus on Comic Sans.
Behind-the-scenes production-y stuff from various media and how it is implemented is neither a mystic art nor a purely nerdy concern - especially not in this day and age - and lay people can have perfectly good insight into what makes a good comic cover, or even what makes a good car. I recall the untrained and self-taught Jim Campbell pointing out the "tangents" and other basic design flaws in official Torchwood promotional posters a while back, and those insights are not invalidated by Jim's being technically an amateur and the makers of said posters being paid professionals. Likewise I don't think PJ took Draw Comics Good at university, but he does that for a living and I trust his opinion on how to make them, though again, I don't think you need to be an actual paid professional comics creator to point at - for instance - that Rob Liefeld Captain America picture and be able to articulate what's wrong with it.
I agree with personal criticism of individuals being out of order, though. There are better ways to express frustration with the utilising of particular tropes that you find repetitive and unhelpful to the larger narrative than "he's a shit writer." I think the boarder who expressed the opinion that everything a particular writer has ever done has been complete shite because he met him once for three minutes thirty years ago and they didn't get on probably takes the biscuit.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bv3BA3bCEAA0Bz9.jpg)
Mostly enjoyable, felt like there were four different stories shoehorned into one episode, none of which got the full attention/time they deserved, hopefully with the new Who and Clara established, we can crack on with the adventures :D
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 25 August, 2014, 11:41:53 AM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bv3BA3bCEAA0Bz9.jpg)
It begins.
I don't get it. But if you and I are arguing, CFM - and, frankly, I think you're one of the good guys so I don't want to argue with you - then I'm not coming across properly here. Maybe I seem grumpier than I really am.
This has happened a couple of times recently with people on this board so maybe it's best if I take a break for a while. Cheers. :)
I think the Fuckity BYe thing is just a Thick of It joke and not a reference to your discussion with CFM, Trout.
I enjoyed it. And so did the rest of the Tips' household.
Particularly for that line near the end which went along the lines of:
Doctor: I'm not your boyfriend.
Clara: I never thought of you like that.
Doctor: I never said the mistake was on your part.
And I loved seeing Matt Smith pop up again. Brave and bold for a regeneration episode I thought.
But I dressed up as Commander Riker last weekend and paid Kenny Baker for an autograph this weekend so you may wish to disregard anything I say.
Quote from: Tiplodocus on 25 August, 2014, 03:14:36 PM
I think the Fuckity BYe thing is just a Thick of It joke and not a reference to your discussion with CFM, Trout.
This - was just intending to lighten the mood sir! Honestly I have no beef with you at all, not a single piece in the house even!
with the exception of strax I find the pasternoster gang to be tedious can they be killed please?
does the dr know vastra is eating folk? ok they may be baddies but really!
Quote from: The Enigmatic Dr X on 25 August, 2014, 08:09:30 AM
The Sontaran hit Clara on the nose with a newspaper and we laughed
True. Limiting discussion of the comic to whether we thought some aspect of it was either good or bad, but not
why we thought it was either good or bad, would make for a very dry read. Might as well just replace the forum with an electronic equivalent of the old voting slips, where you listed the stories in order of preference.
I'm not sure what function barring the laity from using technical terms would serve, except to ifantilise the discussion, and I can't think of any other sphere of life where such strictures apply. My mum knows what an RSJ is and could explain what function it performs; that doesn't mean she's trying to pass herself off as a builder.
Quote from: Grugz on 25 August, 2014, 04:36:20 PM
with the exception of strax I find the pasternoster gang to be tedious can they be killed please?
Really. I lurve Jenny and if I can find a decent enough image she is deffo gonna be my next profile pic. ;)
Quote from: sauchie post office on 25 August, 2014, 04:50:22 PM
Quote from: The Enigmatic Dr X on 25 August, 2014, 08:09:30 AM
The Sontaran hit Clara on the nose with a newspaper and we laughed
True. Limiting discussion of the comic to whether we thought some aspect of it was either good or bad, but not why we thought it was either good or bad, would make for a very dry read. Might as well just replace the forum with an electronic equivalent of the old voting slips, where you listed the stories in order of preference.
I'm not sure what function barring the laity from using technical terms would serve, except to ifantilise the discussion, and I can't think of any other sphere of life where such strictures apply. My mum knows what an RSJ is and could explain what function it performs; that doesn't mean she's trying to pass herself off as a builder.
And this is why I think I'm out of tune with this board. It becomes an argument about the argument, and people jump in to show how clever they are. Yawn.
Thanks for the replies, CFM and Tips. I never really watched The Thick of It. I can swear creatively on my own. ;)
Typical Scotsman American - no staying power in a fight.
Quote from: Trout on 25 August, 2014, 05:20:20 PM
Quote from: sauchie post office on 25 August, 2014, 04:50:22 PM
Quote from: The Enigmatic Dr X on 25 August, 2014, 08:09:30 AM
The Sontaran hit Clara on the nose with a newspaper and we laughed
True. Limiting discussion of the comic to whether we thought some aspect of it was either good or bad, but not why we thought it was either good or bad, would make for a very dry read. Might as well just replace the forum with an electronic equivalent of the old voting slips, where you listed the stories in order of preference.
I'm not sure what function barring the laity from using technical terms would serve, except to ifantilise the discussion, and I can't think of any other sphere of life where such strictures apply. My mum knows what an RSJ is and could explain what function it performs; that doesn't mean she's trying to pass herself off as a builder.
And this is why I think I'm out of tune with this board. It becomes an argument about the argument, and people jump in to show how clever they are. Yawn.
Thanks for the replies, CFM and Tips. I never really watched The Thick of It. I can swear creatively on my own. ;)
No, I didn't understand it either.
Well my wife & kids enjoyed it but it bored the tits off me, I'll let it off though as its just the intro episode. If I enjoy half the eps a series then Im happy enough.
The Doctor was to zany at the start for my liking. Hope he calms down or he can fuck the fuck off!
another Tucker joke just for the Trout
you used to be cool
;)
Just like the Doctor you used to be young!
;)
So did I :'(
Quote from: Satanist on 25 August, 2014, 06:23:06 PM
Just like the Doctor you used to be young!
...my Sunday morning was a bit like his wandering around that alley!
Quote from: 8-Ball on 25 August, 2014, 05:19:40 PM
Really. I lurve Jenny and if I can find a decent enough image she is deffo gonna be my next ...
You had me worried there for a second!
Some people seem to be much more vocal about the silly over the top relationship between Jenny and Vastra than any of the other silly over the top relationships in Nu-Who. Some people are so bad at hiding their bigotry.
Just watched this on iPlayer and I thought it was pretty good.
It got better as it went on with Capaldi being more entertaining once he'd had his sleep!
I'm not a massive fan of the 'Who family', I think it's better with him and one or two companions. The battle with the automatons wasn't very convincing.
Those are minor niggle really though and I think for an opening episode it showed lots of promise.
I'm pretty sure Missy is a time lord and Heaven is a Tardis. The layout of the garden looked pretty Tardis-like with the big round fountain taking the place of the control console.
Quote from: JamesC on 25 August, 2014, 09:20:27 PM
I'm pretty sure Missy is a time lord and Heaven is a Tardis. The layout of the garden looked pretty Tardis-like with the big round fountain taking the place of the control console.
Yeah, definitely something along those lines.
I'll go with CFM's theory that she's [spoiler]a female iteration of The Master[/spoiler].
This seasons 'arc' storyline no doubt.
Gomez is great- as a fan of both Green Wing & The Book Group I know she's got the chops for the role.
Well okay I'll go with my bit of wild speculation, which is almost certainly wrong, but that's never stopped me before. I go with Heaven being a part of The Doctors sub-conscious, a place that fosters his guilt and self recrimination. I'll co-opt CFM's theory, cos I like it and its better than mine, that the Master is in there in the form of Missy collecting all the victims of the Doctor's time and allowing them to get their revenge by tormenting the Doctor. Hence its heaven to them.
(http://38.media.tumblr.com/7380e73c8561a48ce6416d4e7724da91/tumblr_nass9uJCja1r912s3o2_400.gif)
Two nice thoughts there -
[spoiler]I do think it's most likely physical rather than purely imagined though as Missy is pictured filming stuff with Capaldi later in the series (unless that's set in his own mind?) hmmm [/spoiler]
After avoiding all DW references I finally got to see Deep Breath. Overall it was a fairly enjoyable episode. I was a bit worried in the beginning with Capaldi being all manic and such, but that was just the post regeneration nonsense. He got much better towards the end. I think Capaldi may become the best Doctor of the modern shows. Oh and Clara was there.
Using[spoiler] Matt Smith [/spoiler] at the end was pointless I thought. Clara either accepts the new Doctor or she can sod off. As was mentioned earlier in the thread. Strax should be the Doctor's companion for the glory of the Sontaran Empire.
I look forward to the next episode.
I was just coming back to put the spoiler tag in. Thanks Richard.
Also, I though the opening music was really great. Modern with a nod to the past.
Quote from: von Boom on 26 August, 2014, 01:59:45 PM
Also, I though the opening music was really great. Modern with a nod to the past.
Yeah, I thought the music was really good, and I liked the more complex title sequence too.
Watched it... I thought it was OK - Capaldi was good, but the meta was so meta it was arguing with its own meta almost as if in meta comment on this very thread - and I say that as someone who actually lives his life as a meta rather than real life, so I should know!
The "please love him even though he is different" is a perfectly good point to mine in the subtext, but it really did feel like a glowing 50 foot banner saying "don't stop watching because he is old"... which wouldn't have been so bad if the actual story had sold her disaffection and concerns through the story rather than the speeches - so you had the Vastra interrogation making the point, with Clara seemingly coming round - then you had the MAtt Smith call making the same point - I'd have rather have been hand held through it more from Clara's POV without comment until she had to make a choice about whether she was accepting this new chap.
The story itself again had a nice counterpoint to the Doctor's regeneration with the robots having "regenerated" themselves over and over again, but on one viewing it felt a bit confused and if it has taken them millions of years to get to the point they are at, it was odd they seemed to abandon it so easily when they seemed to have the upper hand - I'll watch again without the kids, but since its all ages, I should really be able to follow it with the kids distractiing me occasionally.
I didn't read it as the robots having abandoned anything. The node was the controller, and once he was taken care of, the rest powered down, using that well-known sci-fi trope. Also, I'm assuming The Doctor gave him a flying lesson.
Quote from: Leigh S on 26 August, 2014, 02:44:04 PM
The story itself again had a nice counterpoint to the Doctor's regeneration with the robots having "regenerated" themselves over and over again...
I thought this bit was very interesting. The Doctor gives the baddy the 'favourite old broom' speech, concluding that a broom whose elements have been replaced over and over isn't the same broom (a point of view to be sure), while later on he explicitly insists that after all
his changes he somehow
is the same man. Is this some essential self-deception on his part?
I always imagine The Doctor like someone who's survived a brain injury. They are technically the same being, but the brain itself has been reconfigured. They may retain memories, but that doesn't mean they act in the same way nor have the same preferences. The result is a discussion about the sense of self—what are you? Are you how you are now? How you were then? The sum of memories and experiences? How other people saw or see you? All of those things, somehow?
I really enjoyed it, but I think that [spoiler]ancient buried spaceship [/spoiler] stories should be banned from all fiction. I'm sick of them!
Heh. Next week, will The Doctor be in a VR prison?
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 26 August, 2014, 03:29:34 PM
I always imagine The Doctor like someone who's survived a brain injury. They are technically the same being, but the brain itself has been reconfigured. They may retain memories, but that doesn't mean they act in the same way nor have the same preferences. The result is a discussion about the sense of self—what are you? Are you how you are now? How you were then? The sum of memories and experiences? How other people saw or see you? All of those things, somehow?
I think this is a good way of looking at it. He certainly seems to remember everything from each of his lifetimes and his personality may change on the surface but his essential motivations appear to stay the same. He always remains a basically good (although this seems like it's about to be questioned) travelling meddler. Likewise, the Master changes personality but remains a baddie.
No, I think next week he visits a paradise planet which turns out to be a front for a sinister secret
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 25 August, 2014, 06:45:15 PM
Some people seem to be much more vocal about the silly over the top relationship between Jenny and Vastra than any of the other silly over the top relationships in Nu-Who. Some people are so bad at hiding their bigotry.
whos being reptilist?
Quote from: Grugz on 26 August, 2014, 06:07:23 PM
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 25 August, 2014, 06:45:15 PM
Some people seem to be much more vocal about the silly over the top relationship between Jenny and Vastra than any of the other silly over the top relationships in Nu-Who. Some people are so bad at hiding their bigotry.
whos being reptilist?
Some guys from a film forum i'm a member of. They'r an ok bunch so long as you don't mention female empowerment and equality.
I don't think the idea of Missy's garden being a "heaven" for the enemies of the Doctor works. Didn't half-faced bloke say he'd been searching for paradise long before he met the Doctor?
As with many people the heaven he's found might not be the heaven he was looking for?
Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 27 August, 2014, 03:09:32 PM
As with many people the heaven he's found might not be the heaven he was looking for?
Well he didn't wake up in the
Man Cave, did he?
Watched it all the way through today.
Mixed bag. Lots to like, some things...Not so clever.
Overall a decent 7/10 I think, especially for a regeneration episode.
Capaldi +
Coleman +
Script + (in general)
Unwarranted dinosaur -
Silly, unrealistic fight at the end -
That look on Capaldi's face when you don't know if half face man jumped or was pushed ++
Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 28 August, 2014, 04:32:22 PM
That look on Capaldi's face when you don't know if half face man jumped or was pushed ++
(http://37.media.tumblr.com/20dcc8758530f5540dcbacf9a9d56251/tumblr_n8nuz32Lpe1rkeh8to4_500.gif)
That'll be the one.
Worth the episode for that alone.
Cheers :D
SPOILERS.
Marvel UK comic character created by 2000ad luminaries to appear in episode 5. First time comic character has made it into the TV series (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2014/08/26/a-doctor-who-comic-book-character-is-about-to-enter-tv-canon-for-the-first-time-spoilers/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook)
My first reaction there was "YES!", but by the sound of it, it's only a cameo, which is a shame - I'd love to see him make a proper appearance. Of course, Eccleston already paid tribute to the character's most iconic line at the end of 'Bad Wolf'. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYoLG_iP9Ec)
Quote from: Greg M. on 28 August, 2014, 06:34:45 PM
Eccleston already paid tribute to the character's most iconic line at the end of 'Bad Wolf'. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYoLG_iP9Ec)
Presumably, after seeing Billie Piper's lips.
Jesus! :o
Colour me a happy fan!
That- if it comes off- is brilliant news. That character was always a fave of mine.
Sounds like an excuse to post this again...
(http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o320/Lobo_Baggins/princessclara_zps3bea3f24.jpg) (http://s123.photobucket.com/user/Lobo_Baggins/media/princessclara_zps3bea3f24.jpg.html)
Boo. I was hoping that the character alluded to was going to be [spoiler]Frobisher in penguin form.[/spoiler]
Oh well, maybe the precedent sets out some hope.
Re-watched Deep Breath again...because.
Somehow missed the gay porn joke.
(http://33.media.tumblr.com/f4729969756d1e5339bcc6c188a419e7/tumblr_nati7xPvT41qhfog3o3_250.gif)
Man, as ever I tried with Dr Who.... tonight I lasted about 20 mins with episode 1, then with a heavy heart gave up and deleted it from series link. I won't list the problems I have with this - people seem to lap it up. Plus. It is a Dr Who thread..... :-X
What a shame, given it's Capaldi.
Quote from: Fungus on 30 August, 2014, 12:45:40 AM
Man, as ever I tried with Dr Who.... tonight I lasted about 20 mins with episode 1, then with a heavy heart gave up and deleted it from series link. I won't list the problems I have with this - people seem to lap it up. Plus. It is a Dr Who thread..... :-X
What a shame, given it's Capaldi.
It may be worth giving it another go in a couple of weeks. This episode definitely got better as it went on and it may be good to see what one of the ther writers does with the new doctor.
Quote from: JamesC on 30 August, 2014, 08:37:09 AM
It may be worth giving it another go in a couple of weeks. This episode definitely got better as it went on and it may be good to see what one of the ther writers does with the new doctor.
Yeah you've got to give it a bit of time before you say 'this is not really happening for me'. I'll certainly be watching tonight.
New poster for this episode tonight;
(http://www.radiotimes.com/uploads/images/original/55954.jpg)
So good, strong start, Doctor is so brutal! Dark Doctor :)
Quite enjoyed that. Lots of similarities to Dalek with Chris Eccles cake.
There was a bit of a continuity error with everyone being bone dry 2 minutes after getting out of the goop and the sets were a bit 'classic' Doctor Who with all the plastic tubing. Very unconvincing battle scenes too, with everyone waving their guns about like children in the playground.
None of that really matters though, the episode was good fun and Capaldi continues to impress as The Doctor.
Great episode, bit repeat of "Dalak" episode.
Again still puzzle by[spoiler] Missy and the Heaven! Missy is Master? [/spoiler]
Quote from: JamesC on 30 August, 2014, 08:22:17 PM
There was a bit of a continuity error with everyone being bone dry 2 minutes after getting out of the goop.
I think the Doctor mentioned something about the piping they went through immediately after being quite hot, so that probably covers that. Could have imagined / mis-heard that bit though.
Very solid sci-fitacular episode with a lot of Capadlidarkness - Vod from Fresh Meat being BRILLIANT as well as Michael Smiley.
Interesting "soldier issues" being crowbarred in so as to make Danny Pink's transition into companionship slightly more fraught. Up for it though - if it stays this interesting.
....but next week we've got a comedy Robin Hood and Robots episode so...
Quote from: chris_askham on 30 August, 2014, 11:27:43 PM
Quote from: JamesC on 30 August, 2014, 08:22:17 PM
There was a bit of a continuity error with everyone being bone dry 2 minutes after getting out of the goop.
I think the Doctor mentioned something about the piping they went through immediately after being quite hot, so that probably covers that. Could have imagined / mis-heard that bit though.
Gloopy stuff like that would leave residue and have a distinct effect on hair, even if it dried. As Vic Reeves says though - 'It doesn't really matter does it?'
Quote from: IAMTHESYSTEM on 30 August, 2014, 02:46:50 PM
Quote from: JamesC on 30 August, 2014, 08:37:09 AM
It may be worth giving it another go in a couple of weeks. This episode definitely got better as it went on and it may be good to see what one of the ther writers does with the new doctor.
Yeah you've got to give it a bit of time before you say 'this is not really happening for me'. I'll certainly be watching tonight.
Thanks both for your reasonable replies - seriously. I expected abuse and got understanding :)
But I have re-tried many times in the last few series, and been exasperated by Dr Who. Each time wondering if the show is great but it's just me. So I'll bow out of this thread, cheers.
Groovy stuff! Clara rules, Capaldi is great but they better keep Coleman around for years, years I say! Still will take a bit longer to really get a feel for Capaldi's Doctor.
Best episode in ages, with some great directorial touches from Wheatley. Capaldi's Doctor is reminding me most of Eccleston's - damaged and driven. You can imagine Tennant's Doctor in that episode, apologising constantly, but the 12th Doctor is a bit of a callous bastard, which is greatly appreciated after the last sappy pair. The unpredictability of the character has definitely been restored, and I loved the swerve they pulled near the end when [spoiler]it looks like it's heading towards a Matt Smith-style 'beauty and love save the day' moment, and in fact it's hatred that triumphs.[/spoiler] Hurrah!
I was thinking about the Doctor's supposed 'soldier issues' and how that tallies with his time in UNIT, but I suppose it's a callback to the days when the Brig was incurring the 3rd Doctor's ire by blowing up Silurians - though the UNIT chaps were the Doctor's friends, the only one he ever took on extended travels was a (military) doctor.
The soldier thing is incredibly condescending and hypocritcal on face value (in an episode where he has been made to face his genocidal hatred, he has the gall to call out someone for fighting against similar), but with a bit of fannish jiggery pokey feels slightly less so - the Doctor needs "good, non violent" people around him to stop him from, for example, stoving in cave men skulls - the Doctor himself is not a good man - he is only made good by the ccompany he keeps... still a bit rubbish from my viewing, and the poor soldier wouldnt have taken that message, just been told they were bad for fighting, something the Doctor has always done....
I think the whole "Doctor is divine/Dalek" angle the series has mined since it came back is pretty poorly realised - if you are going to try and Alan Moore up your saturday afternoon adventure serial with deep and searching questions about morality you need to A: pose questions that aren't laughable/nonsensical and B: Try and be consistent about where you stand and how you are portraying such (for example, the Doctor loved "good" Dalek at the start of this episode when he wanted to "EXTERMINATE ALL DALEKS", then got all sad and angsty when he made the Dalek good again at the end and he starts stating exactly the same thing?
Either way, we are still getting the same question re the Doctor being a force for good or evil, without making much headway into it, mainly because there really isnt that much headway to make on the topic in general.
Quote from: Leigh S on 31 August, 2014, 08:00:21 PM
(for example, the Doctor loved "good" Dalek at the start of this episode when he wanted to "EXTERMINATE ALL DALEKS", then got all sad and angsty when he made the Dalek good again at the end and he starts stating exactly the same thing?
I wondered at that too, but I think that the point was that, yest he Dalek was saying the same thing, but for very different reasons.
A good episode. I thought the idea that the inside of a Dalek's backup cpu would have readily pushable panels for tiny people a bit silly but that didn't really matter,.
Doctor loved "good" Dalek at the start of this episode "
I didn't get that at all. Curious, yes.
Good fun with a great high concept and a quality proctologist joke.
Usual faults apply but years back, becausevrest of family liked it, I decided to give in and let New Who wash over me. I have more fun with that then by analysingbit to death and finding fault everywhere. But not watching at all is equally valid.
iTunes. We are a week behind so only saw first episode. I am In and sold!!
Was it just me who wanted the Doctor to stop the rampaging Dalek by turning back to full size and kicking it inside out?
Not a great episode but nowhere near the worst.
Quote from: Satanist on 01 September, 2014, 02:00:21 PM
Was it just me who wanted the Doctor to stop the rampaging Dalek by turning back to full size and kicking it inside out?
I was expecting that - I thought they'd squeeze out of a crack and then re-biggify the capsule. And why didn't they remove it's gun before starting all these experiments? I was also surprised by the large amount of empty space inside a dalek.
My opinion after 2 stories is generally positive. Clara may be gorgeous but I still find her rather annoying, I hope Capaldi shakes off his post-regen confusion soon though and gets a bit of confidence back.
My 8-yr old's best pal of the moment is a nice lass called Clara. Her mam calls her 'that Impossible Girl', and he runs over to theirs at 7 on a Saturday for Dr. Who and hot chocolate, no alternative arrangements are to be considered. Someone's doing something right in that there BBC.
Just watching a convention video of Karl Urban and he's just said that he was offered a part in Dr Who but he couldn't do it, as he was filming Dredd at the time!
Quote from: COMMANDO FORCES on 02 September, 2014, 03:30:41 PM
Just watching a convention video of Karl Urban and he's just said that he was offered a part in Dr Who but he couldn't do it, as he was filming Dredd at the time!
So Dredd filmed in 2011, and Doctor Who filmed in 2011 for 2012 season so ideally he could be for "A Town Called Mercy"? Karl Urban as
Gunslinger sounds perfect!
(http://slouchingtowardsthatcham.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/doctor-who-season-7-episode-3-a-town-called-mercy-gunslinger-2.jpg)
Finally got around to this one (which says a lot itself I guess) and pretty much loved it. Okay it stretched credibility at times but was entertaining enough to let that just float past. Clara wasn't anywhere near as annoying as she was last series and as Greg said I had dread fears of some tears of a Dalek saving the day but in the end far from it.
Matt Smith was a superb Doctor served by tosh often, could Pete Capaldi be a superb Doctor served with delights... could be... but that trailer doesn't fill me with hope. We'll see how we go.
Political correctness gone mad?
http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/sep/04/bbc-edits-doctor-who-beheadings-steven-sotloff
No.
You've had two widely reported murders by beheading, a third person is being held hostage and since then, an 82 year old woman was has been reported (though unconfirmed) as being beheaded in North London.
Come off it, though horrific acts indeed these things are sadly common place. They aren't going to stop with censoring a family TV program and it's hardly going to offend the deceased is it?
It's like when Gangster Squad got set back due to the cinema shooting for the Dark Knight Rises opening night.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 05 September, 2014, 08:07:32 AM
Political correctness gone mad?
http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/sep/04/bbc-edits-doctor-who-beheadings-steven-sotloff
Asolutely. I find it hard to fathom that the notoriously grim and transgressive teatime children's serial Doctor Who is even considering bowing to pressure from theroetically upset descendents of Marie Antoinette.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 05 September, 2014, 08:49:53 AM
Come off it, though horrific acts indeed these things are sadly common place. They aren't going to stop with censoring a family TV program and it's hardly going to offend the deceased is it?
It's like when Gangster Squad got set back due to the cinema shooting for the Dark Knight Rises opening night.
OK, how about the families of the deceased or the BBC would rather not give the likes of the Daily Mail a handy stick to beat them with?
They apparently have other concerns than you, unbelievable I know...
So whats the next step. Cutting out beheadings in tudor time dramas? Removing the decapitation scenes in Predator? People take drugs it seems so maybe In The Night Garden will arouse some forgotten trauma?
I've always believed that a work of fiction should be left un-bastardised irregardless of whats going on in the world right now, indeed fiction exists so I can forget how bullshit the world is right now.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 05 September, 2014, 09:08:13 AM
So whats the next step. Cutting out beheadings in tudor time dramas? Removing the decapitation scenes in Predator? People take drugs it seems so maybe In The Night Garden will arouse some forgotten trauma?
I've always believed that a work of fiction should be left un-bastardised irregardless of whats going on in the world right now, indeed fiction exists so I can forget how bullshit the world is right now.
By portraying things that explicitly remind you of what's going on in the world?
The thing that's bothering me is that this is what they're telling us they're censoring. What about the stuff they haven't admitted to cutting out?
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 05 September, 2014, 09:08:13 AM
So whats the next step. Cutting out beheadings in tudor time dramas? Removing the decapitation scenes in Predator? People take drugs it seems so maybe In The Night Garden will arouse some forgotten trauma?
I've always believed that a work of fiction should be left un-bastardised irregardless of whats going on in the world right now, indeed fiction exists so I can forget how bullshit the world is right now.
Now you're just being silly.
This is de to the timing and nothing more. Particularly with the 85 year old woman murdered in this fashion yesterday - or do you think her friends and family would not be upset to see this on Saturday night?
I'm sure that if this episode had been due to be screen nearer the end of the season, it would not have been an issue.
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 05 September, 2014, 09:13:57 AM
Particularly with the 85 year old woman murdered in this fashion yesterday - or do you think her friends and family would not be upset to see this on Saturday night?
Well given their situation, I think it's unlikely that they'll be watching Dr Who. What WOULD happen though is that some scrote from the Mail would ring them up, describe it in graphic detail and then ask if they find it upsetting, just to manufacture some outrage or offense that would otherwise not have happened.
So rather than cutting out the material itself shouldn't we just do the sensible thing and ignore the rags? Or do people still give a shit what The Daily Hate Mail think?
But it is very sensible!
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 05 September, 2014, 09:38:15 AM
So rather than cutting out the material itself shouldn't we just do the sensible thing and ignore the rags? Or do people still give a shit what The Daily Hate Mail think?
Come back to us on that when you're Director General.
Seems like a sensitive response to very unfortunate timing. No need for a fun kids' show to smear itself with topical controversy of a particularly unpleasant nature.
For comparison, this summer we visited Place de la Concorde, site of the Guillotine during the Terror, and I had good fun waxing Horrible-Histories about mounds of heads to the kids, complete with grisly reminder that they'd been in Marie Antoinette's bedroom just the day before. Don't think I'd be doing that routine this week.
Quote from: Steve Green on 05 September, 2014, 09:59:36 AM
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 05 September, 2014, 09:38:15 AM
So rather than cutting out the material itself shouldn't we just do the sensible thing and ignore the rags? Or do people still give a shit what The Daily Hate Mail think?
Come back to us on that when you're Director General.
And when your corporation isn't under constant attack from MPs, the entire rest of the media, and quite a lot of the population.
Dr who, new season for me GREAT!!!
new style new way, older Dr great actor
this is what makes it perfect for me,
loving it.
Quote from: TordelBack on 01 September, 2014, 04:14:40 PM
My 8-yr old's best pal of the moment is a nice lass called Clara. Her mam calls her 'that Impossible Girl', and he runs over to theirs at 7 on a Saturday for Dr. Who and hot chocolate, no alternative arrangements are to be considered. Someone's doing something right in that there BBC.
Fantastic this is what it is all about.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 05 September, 2014, 08:07:32 AM
Political correctness gone mad?
http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/sep/04/bbc-edits-doctor-who-beheadings-steven-sotloff
I'm not sure that showing a bit of decent human sensitivy is the same as "political correctness".
I can see WHY they are doing it, just that I don't agree with it. It'll be uncut on BD anyway so i'll wind my neck in.
Also, I apologise if I came off as cold hearted, i'm just struggling to agree with the logic being applied here.
You are being a bit overly cynical here Hawk not necessarily cold hearted - it's perfectly understandable why at this current time they're doing it - that kind of thing has been going on for years but I'm sure it'll be on the DVD etc
This brilliant League moment was either postponed or edited due to an unfortunate national incident with wolves the week that it aired - but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie8G-ktwMqY 'beheadings' is a bit of a button at the moment.
Don't mean to reinstate everyone else's points but political correctness, as I'm sure doesn't need saying, isn't a bad thing (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmsV1TuESrc).
Quote from: Dandontdare on 05 September, 2014, 09:33:24 AM
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 05 September, 2014, 09:13:57 AM
Particularly with the 85 year old woman murdered in this fashion yesterday - or do you think her friends and family would not be upset to see this on Saturday night?
Well given their situation, I think it's unlikely that they'll be watching Dr Who.
Exactly. What I was thinking. Don't be stupid.
New poster for latest episode "Robot Of Sherwood"
(http://www.radiotimes.com/uploads/images/original/56362.jpeg)
That was a fun bit of hokum.
This Capaldi chap is shaping up nicely.
The [spoiler]cameo was a nice touch[/spoiler]
an enjoyable romp :D
Quote from: Steve Green on 06 September, 2014, 08:30:32 PM
The [spoiler]cameo was a nice touch[/spoiler]
Sorry I miss it out, who?
So I'm a little behind. I watched the first episode of the new series and thought it rubbish. Terrible plot, aweful pacing and dreadful dialogue. So pretty much the way Doctor Who has been going the last four or so years. Still, I held out hope. It's Peter Capaldi after all. So today I watched Into the Dalek as I missed it last week. It was an improvement. Not by much, but an improvement nonetheless. Then I saw the teaser for todays episode. Robin Hood?!? So I go do a quick search at upcoming episodes. The conclusion is, I'm done. I am depressed that this is what is passing for quality Science Fiction television these days. I have just been getting increasingly bored and underwealmed by the Doctors adventures and it is now at the point that it's not entertaining. I would have given Capaldi's Doctor more of a chance if Moffat had left with Smith, but I really can't stand what he does with Who. I also have a sneaking suspicion that if Moffat left, then Gattis will take over the reigns and I don't like his Who episodes and never have done.
Quote from: Goaty on 06 September, 2014, 09:47:45 PM
Quote from: Steve Green on 06 September, 2014, 08:30:32 PM
The [spoiler]cameo was a nice touch[/spoiler]
Sorry I miss it out, who?
think it was the pic of [spoiler]Patrick troughton as robin hood [/spoiler]
and didn't he do a Venusian karate chop on robin's sword? very pertwee!
Thought that was quite fun actually. WHAT HAVE I BECOME. :o
Also - where's the spoilers here:
TroughtonHood - let it not be said he wasn't DASHING AS FUCK.
(http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/imageArchive/images/10301_gall_002.jpg)
What was edited out.
http://www.doctorwhotv.co.uk/robot-of-sherwood-what-was-cut-66300.htm (http://www.doctorwhotv.co.uk/robot-of-sherwood-what-was-cut-66300.htm)
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 05 September, 2014, 07:18:32 PM
You are being a bit overly cynical here Hawk not necessarily cold hearted
Sounds about right.
I'm about to watch the episode now, hopes set to modest.
Can't believe they cut that bit out! if you download the pre transmission b&w version you can see it.
Bloody pathetic not leaving it in.
Best Gatiss ep by far, very silly and funny!
Quote from: Bad City Blue on 07 September, 2014, 01:23:52 PM
Bloody pathetic not leaving it in.
Yes. God forbid the BBC should be sensitive to a more than one very horrible incident, all of them very current in the news, and behave with a modicum of human decency over the whole thing.
Honestly: if you hadn't known that it had been cut, you wouldn't have known there was anything missing, so why the outrage?
Cheers
Jim
Okay, I liked this episode overall (altough of the three I've seen, I think last week's Inside the Dalek was the best) but I did find the constant arguing between The Doctor and The Hood a bit irritating, but I think that says more about my tastes than anything as I can see that many would find that highly entertaining.
[spoiler]
I thought the resolution with the arrow at the end was a bit rubbish though. [/spoiler] But overall it was good fun and very funny in places.
I liked the robot design too.
I liked the fact Robin Hood [spoiler]turned out to be the real thing.[/spoiler]
[spoiler]
Radiation makes the grass green though? Eh?[/spoiler]
I thought it was alright, but as usual the tone was a bit over the place. I love how it was basically playing up to the idea of the Doctor as a grumpy old man ruining people's fun by being stuck inside a sci-fi romp - seriously: shoot an arrow at it together to save the day? Fuckin hell.
For some reason, this combination of old duffer/camp romp now makes me want to see an episode of the show that's a homage to the Carry On films.
Quote from: pictsy on 06 September, 2014, 10:04:31 PMI am depressed that this is what is passing for quality Science Fiction television these days.
I don't think anyone is pretending that the show is
Solaris each week - in fact, the vast majority of criticism aimed at it is because it is clearly a kids' show that sometimes has blowjob jokes in it.
I have found Who is best viewed as televised panto, that way when it sticks its head above "camp nonsense" and does something good, you'll be far more inclined to give credit where it's due (by contrast, I watched four years of Battlestar Galactica while treating it as deadly serious as it wanted me to and came away constantly disappointed by how juvenile and cowardly the drama and politics of it were).
Of course, some people don't get along with panto, as Panto ideally requires indulgence rather than patience, so it's no bad thing to walk away if you find yours being tested.
Quote from: Bear McBear on 07 September, 2014, 02:08:16 PMthe vast majority of criticism aimed at it is because it is clearly a kids' show that sometimes has blowjob jokes in it.
Bonafide kid's shows surely try a bit harder to avoid heavy-handed gender stereotypes as well. ANOTHER elderly flirty evil woman.... Surely not.
Speaking of - where was [spoiler]the female Master[/spoiler]in this week's episode?
Out a walk this afternoon I heard two young boys playing in the park. One shouted "I'm the Doctor and this is my spoon!"
This renders all arguments invalid.
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 07 September, 2014, 05:06:33 PM
Out a walk this afternoon I heard two young boys playing in the park. One shouted "I'm the Doctor and this is my spoon!"
This renders all arguments invalid.
Brilliant! :D
I honestly don't understand why you'd watch a show if you hate it.
If it's not for you in its current incarnation there are plenty of Tom Baker stories on DVD to choose from.
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 07 September, 2014, 05:06:33 PM
Out a walk this afternoon I heard two young boys playing in the park. One shouted "I'm the Doctor and this is my spoon!"
This renders all arguments invalid.
:D Amazing
More Men in Tights... than a a good serious Hood (Is the old Michael Praed stuff any good? I remember loving it back in the day) and the perfect example of why we shouldn't take the whole thing so seriously. I found it a bit hit and miss. A nonsense fluff romp which passed the time harmlessly enough but wasn't really for me, 'cos its not meant to be. Very good for what it was. Or to but it better...
QuoteOut a walk this afternoon I heard two young boys playing in the park. One shouted "I'm the Doctor and this is my spoon!"
This renders all arguments invalid.
Yeah, 'harmless' and 'fluff' were the two main words floating around in my head when viewing that, but given that my expectations were low, that probably counts as a win. I felt the last third was a bit of a mad rush to cram in too much, and a lot of it didn't seem to make a huge amount of sense, but it was acceptably daft. And Jenna Coleman continues her unexpected transformation into the best companion of the modern era, whilst looking affa bonny in her 12th-century gear.
i really enjoyed that. i loved [spoiler]how the doctor was suspicious of mr hood. i cringed as i imagined if the episode had been written for tennant and him fawning over robin and his merry men calling them all brilliant!!.[/spoiler]
whooda thunk Clara would be so good?
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 07 September, 2014, 05:06:33 PM
Kipping in the park this afternoon I heard two young boys playing in the park. One shouted "I'm the Doctor and this is my spoon!"
This renders all arguments invalid.
FTFY
Quote from: Proudhuff on 08 September, 2014, 09:51:56 AM
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 07 September, 2014, 05:06:33 PM
Kipping in the park this afternoon I heard two young boys playing in the park. One shouted "I'm the Doctor and this is my spoon!"
This renders all arguments invalid.
FTFY
:-)
I thought that was a fun episode, but they've clearly found a discarded copy of Russell T Davies' Big Book of Implausible Denouements - [spoiler]I can understand melting the gold to make circuits, or even a ship powered by gold, but firing a golden arrow at the ship to give it a power-boost is surely like chucking a bucket of unleaded over a car to make it go faster.[/spoiler]
And I'm sorry, but Clara isn't getting any less annoying week on week. Hard to put a finger on just waht irritates me, I think it's her air of smug know-it-all-edness.
I did like the robots though.
I thought if was a good romp, not enough thigh slapping.
I'm liking the Doctor but I'm a grumpy old Scot fecker so probably ID with him a bit too much, the whole laughing thing( Just stop it) made me laugh, and now we're past the will they/won't they Moonlighting/Pond Family soap stuff we can get on with enjoying space and time, bring it on.
yep ddd, clara is annoying. the best companions of the new who have been rory and donna ,most of the new ones seem too blasé with aliens and death on a grand scale.
(http://wp.production.patheos.com/blogs/exploringourmatrix/files/2014/08/Doctor-Who-and-Consensus.jpg)
I was enjoying it but disappointed that the Doctor's theory that Robin was just an automaton programmed with the Robin Hood legend to give people hope didn't turn out to be the case. It could have been made to work, is more satirical, and could have led up to a Buzz Lightyear-esque identity crisis for Robin and a brief appearance by the 'real' Robin Hood at the end.
Quote from: Adrian Bamforth on 09 September, 2014, 11:18:13 AM
I was enjoying it but disappointed that the Doctor's theory that Robin was just an automaton programmed with the Robin Hood legend to give people hope didn't turn out to be the case. It could have been made to work, is more satirical, and could have led up to a Buzz Lightyear-esque identity crisis for Robin and a brief appearance by the 'real' Robin Hood at the end.
you should write this stuff down ;)
Quote from: Bear McBear on 07 September, 2014, 02:08:16 PM
Quote from: pictsy on 06 September, 2014, 10:04:31 PMI am depressed that this is what is passing for quality Science Fiction television these days.
I don't think anyone is pretending that the show is Solaris each week - in fact, the vast majority of criticism aimed at it is because it is clearly a kids' show that sometimes has blowjob jokes in it.
I have found Who is best viewed as televised panto, that way when it sticks its head above "camp nonsense" and does something good, you'll be far more inclined to give credit where it's due (by contrast, I watched four years of Battlestar Galactica while treating it as deadly serious as it wanted me to and came away constantly disappointed by how juvenile and cowardly the drama and politics of it were).
Of course, some people don't get along with panto, as Panto ideally requires indulgence rather than patience, so it's no bad thing to walk away if you find yours being tested.
Actually, my experience of comments about Doctor Who is that is held in high regard as far as Science Fiction goes. I'm not actually sure I have seen or heard anyone criticising it for being a kids show. The only criticism I have personally experienced have been towards the writing and I am in agreement.
I really enjoyed the Robin Hood episode. I thought it was good fun and Robin was hilarious. The grumpy Capaldi Doctor is far preferable to any of the other New Who Docs in my opinion (apart from Hurt and McGann).
I agree that Clara is a bit annoying but she's still tolerable.
The golden arrow thing was a bit silly but in my head the tip of the arrow pierced the craft and bridged a gap in a circuit or something.
Any Capaldi fans should catch up on the radio series The Further Adventures of the First King of Mars (R4extra 11am and 9pm - 15 min episodes and you have 7 days to catch up on the first couple)
It's a monologue in which Capaldi reports from an ill-fated Mars expedition - it's really funny, a sort of perfect bridge between Malcolm Tucker and the Doctor.
Quote from: Dandontdare on 11 September, 2014, 02:41:32 PM
Any Capaldi fans should catch up on the radio series The Further Adventures of the First King of Mars (R4extra 11am and 9pm - 15 min episodes and you have 7 days to catch up on the first couple)
It's a monologue in which Capaldi reports from an ill-fated Mars expedition - it's really funny, a sort of perfect bridge between Malcolm Tucker and the Doctor.
Caught the last bit of this and everything DDD says is true! shock ;)
Can't say I enjoyed this Robin Hood one but that's okay - when I'm watching a Who that's not drawing me in I kinda' drift off and make my own stories and plot points up in my head. Like JamesC, in my head I had the Golden Arrow being the equivalent of Luke Skywalker's shot at the Death Star's exhaust port.
.
It's hard to criticise the episodes I don't like because it is a family show and besides, every now and then Who is excellent - and those diamonds are definitely worth waiting for. I find Star Trek the same - a lot of mediocrity with the occasional superb episode. In some respects the poor episodes can be the most engaging, at least to me, because it gets me thinking about how I would (try to) improve it. Tv that makes you think? A rarity indeed these days!
.
Doctor Who, exactly like Judge Dredd, is a character and format that can be used to tell any kind of story you like. Some of them work really well, some of them don't. Some writers really grasp the characters, some aren't so successful.
In the case of both Dredd and the Doctor though, the characters are robust enough to weather the weaker moments.
I thought the Robin Hood episode was a bit of silly fluff but I, and my kids, enjoyed it as that. Capaldi is already the best Doctor since Tom Baker and I would watch him ironing his socks.
One thing with the series so far is I've found myself laughing more than I did with the last 2 incumbents - the grumpy Doctor delivering a funny line has much more impact than the zany Doctors delivering it.
And I really would love for him to do a Tuckerp-ism at some point.
Yes - I too am enjoying The Cap's portrayal of The Doctor.
Are we not talking about this yet? Or are you all just too blown away?
That was the Moffatt that I thought was taking over the show all that time ago. Bloody loved that one.
Only trouble is we have to be careful what we wish for. Was a fan of the last one but took great solace in the fact that its not meant to be for me anymore. Then I get one I love and wonder whether da kids would have liked it at all. Its very possible I'm underestimating Da Kids greatly in which case they have my unreserved apologise but I do wonder.
Brilliant.
Yeah. Some absolutely fantastic lines in that episode too. Capaldi's Doctor rocks.
I missed the first ten minutes so I don't know what set the Doctor off on this quest, but I really enjoyed this episode. Capaldi is settling into the role and has some great lines [spoiler]"it's too late anyway, you've already taken your make up off"[/spoiler]
really enjoyable, even though we didn't see what was under the duvet ,nice touch with the barn.
Best episode of new who i've seen. capaldi is so very good. excellent.
Wasn't much impressed with the Robin Hood episode, the mcguffin of an ending set it way below my expectations.
However, Listen, was absolutely belting. Proper Who, proper weird (astronaut in a restaurant is straight out of a Lynch movie) and Capaldi has really sunk his chops into the role. Loving it.
Great work from the leads, some brilliant running gags, beautifully shot as well.
Guys, any ideas as to who was underneath the bedsheet tormenting poor little Rupert and Clara (as well as the Doctor?). Because from what I understand, the 'others' are basically a summation of our fears, so in that instance, was the bedsheet guy also a manifestation of Rupert's fear? I doubt it was another boy seeing as he/ it was taller than Clara and about same height as the Doctor.
But overall, I thought it was a cracking good show. It did get a bit surreal when we saw the different versions of Mr.Pink, but I thought the last moments in the last planet at the end of time was superb. A really eerie moment. My son was clutching my arm throughout the show!
I thought it
[spoiler]could be read a couple of ways, either it was just a kid spooking Rupert, or the Doctor's own fears acted as an amplifier to Rupert's and Orson's own - where it became a physical manifestation, either as the person under the bedclothes, or the thing at the end of time.[/spoiler]
Well, I didn't have a feckin clue what was going on.
Capaldi was great though, and I'm really digging Clara more and more.
That was a superb episode, probably the best since Blink and the kind of writing I was hoping to see a lot more often that we have since Moffatt took the reigns.
I really don't want to find out what was under the blanket, I'm perfectly happy to just leave it there and never know rather than see some kind of reveal and have another monster to be overused further down the line.
Quote from: Steve Green on 14 September, 2014, 10:26:51 AM
I thought it
[spoiler]could be read a couple of ways, either it was just a kid spooking Rupert, or the Doctor's own fears acted as an amplifier to Rupert's and Orson's own - where it became a physical manifestation, either as the person under the bedclothes, or the thing at the end of time.[/spoiler]
I think that's the best theory and one I would go with.
And of course, I think the reason why they added it was in reference to M.R James' short ghost story, "Oh, whistle and I'll come to you my lad."
http://en.m.wikisource.org/wiki/Ghost_Stories_of_an_Antiquary/%27Oh,_Whistle,_and_I%27ll_Come_to_You_My_Lad%27
Yes, that was a good episode. The best one of this series, yet. (And possibly the last few for that matter, and I'm not a hater of Moff-Who, although I'd like more episodes of this tone and calibre.)
[spoiler]I don't really buy the idea that the thing under the bed sheets is just a physical manifestation of the folks fears since, that doesn 't apppear to have happened before. Unless you mean it was a representation of what they're imagining. I.e. it's not actually there, it's just a bit of dramatic licence to show us the viewers what they're imagining....
Then again this Doctor seems more unglued than the others, a tad insane maybe, and as he has minor telepathic abilities, maybe he is unconsciously projecting his hallucinations to the others as well. That does leave me wondering who opened the airlock, but maybe it was him after all, although he probsbly geninuely thinks he didn't.
I wonder if it's a real person/creature and we'll get reveal later in the series.[/spoiler]
I like that idea, Mardroid.
My son was pestering me, trying to know what was underneath the bed sheet. So we went to that scene again, rewatched it a few times and there's a moment where the sheet drops off from the entity and you can see a ghastly face, albeit blurred and for a split second. That actually got me thinking if it was a real entity as opposed to a manifestation? It also didn't look like a human to me.
But I'd also go with my first thoughts as well as you could understand how it could be a manifesation of fear. I mean either way, it was a great moment in the story along with the final act.
We all loved it. Brilliant stuff. Great gags. Worked as a standalone episode and also as part of future (and past) episodes.
Imagine watching that with a child of impressionable age.
Well, I wasn't keen to be honest. It all felt a bit half baked.
Capaldi continues to impress but the plot was a bit of nothing.
[spoiler]The Doctor has always been scared of something under his bed, caused by Clara grabbing his leg when he was a bairn in a barn. So there was nothing in the Doctor's theory after all? Who wrote 'Listen' on the blackboard? Who was under the sheet in the children's home? Why was Clara so reluctant to admit to a connection between herself and the various Pinks?
Basically nothing happened apart from a dull romantic comedy between Clara and Danny, some poorly explained shenanegans at the end of time and baby Doctor in a barn.
How the hell did Clara know that "One day, you'll return to this barn..."? She was never there was she?[/spoiler]
Maybe the Doctor told her off-screen.
Regardless, one of the good things about old-school horror is that everything doesn't get explained. I like that in these kinds of Who episodes, in the same way I enjoy it in Hellboy.
Quote from: Spaceghost on 15 September, 2014, 09:06:28 AM
[spoiler]How the hell did Clara know that "One day, you'll return to this barn..."? She was never there was she?[/spoiler]
Yes, she was. [spoiler]When the Doctors were going to push the big red button.[/spoiler]
You can interpret it either way. There are monsters under the bed and they did all those things. Or there aren't and there's a rational explaination for everything (pipes banging, you did it and forgot etc.)
Strange tent pole like things quite often manifest themself under my blankets.
The reviewer in the Metro seems to have got the impression that [spoiler]Danny Pink was supposed to be a future incarnation of the Doctor![/spoiler] Not sure where that came from.
I really hope that they do leave it at that and [spoiler] we don't find out in a later story that the thing under the sheet was the Doctor or Clara going back to do things that they have already experienced[/spoiler]
Good, I'm glad it's not just me left asking 'what the ferk actually happened?'
Quote from: Steve Green on 14 September, 2014, 09:40:39 AM
Great work from the leads, some brilliant running gags, beautifully shot as well.
woteesaid :thumbsup:
Despite some minor niggles, 'Listen' was the most enjoyable episode of Who I've seen in years.
Capaldi is EXCELLENT, Anderson is a welcome addition and Coleman is finally winning me over.
Thumbs up.
...not bad and certainly a welcome change of pace for the CapalDoc but crikey I couldn't get past the Moffat-bingo awareness of it all...
childhood fear .... companion as a child... etc etc he MUST know he's doing it!
Pink is fairly likeable although I'm undecided whether it's cool that they didn't fanny around with [spoiler]getting them together[/spoiler] or it's weird that [spoiler]the oppressing inevitability of their offspring seems to have swayed her[/spoiler]
Ahem doublepost! :-[
BEST EPISODE IN A LONG TIME
that was old school WHO.
slightly scary, great time travel story, decent pacing and overall great fun.
Devons Mummy was a little lost, but she would be,
explaining time travel is a bit like the off side rule for her.
Theirs this ine critic I follow who is complaining about the very (none) issues brought up before, that their was no clear cut answer. And he's lompasted it as the worst story since Asylum of the Daleks! Bit harsh to say the least.
(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10635719_962629513751076_447965163601334398_n.jpg?oh=3d66bf0a5f0adb84073860812e075a08&oe=548CFF86)
....it's official that Nick Frost is in the christmas special but I see this and I just think...
A Hyperdrive crossover?! That's fairly obscure.
Sorry as was away, great episode of LISTEN! So enjoyable and scary episode, here the poster for it.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BxWEZ-GCYAEzK8F.jpg)
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 19 September, 2014, 06:45:58 PM
(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10635719_962629513751076_447965163601334398_n.jpg?oh=3d66bf0a5f0adb84073860812e075a08&oe=548CFF86)
....it's official that Nick Frost is in the christmas special but I see this and I just think...
A Hyperdrive crossover?! That's fairly obscure.
That looks like a publicity shot from Hyperdrive alright. Maybe it actually is. Maybe they just used the most sci-fi looking shot they had to hand. We'll have to wait and see if Miranda Hart's in it too
That would actually be really cool.
Quote from: King Pops on 19 September, 2014, 10:26:33 PM
That looks like a publicity shot from Hyperdrive alright. Maybe it actually is. Maybe they just used the most sci-fi looking shot they had to hand.
Yup.
(http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j260/MalcolmKirk/hyperdrive_wt_l_1_zps3db2a85a.jpg)
Quote from: sauchie co-op on 28 August, 2014, 06:19:18 PM
SPOILERS.
Marvel UK comic character created by 2000ad luminaries to appear in episode 5. First time comic character has made it into the TV series (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2014/08/26/a-doctor-who-comic-book-character-is-about-to-enter-tv-canon-for-the-first-time-spoilers/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook)
Sorry for any big spoilers, but it was in Next clip on end of Listen episode;
(http://www.dalek-killer.net/Screenshot%20from%20Doctor.Who.2005.S08E04.Listen.720p.HDTV.x264-FoV.mkv.png)
A Hyperdrive crossover would be ...interesting.
I kind of liked that show. I caught a few episodes when it was originally shown, and thought there was potential for something good there. I gave it another go when I found it on Netflix.
While it was good enough to fill the odd half hour while I was trying to find something to replace Breaking Bad, it's not something I would actively recommend. I liked the notion that people working in space will be just as enthused by their jobs as yer average schlub today. They're not yer Super Competent Star Trek Crew, they're a buncha mismatched misfits confined on the same spaceship. Y'know... like Red Dwarf, or even Farscape, but not as good as either.
Basically, it had lots of interesting little ideas, but no big idea to tie it all together. The world building wasn't great. If it's now being brought into the Whoniverse(s), then all the heavy lifting has already been done for Hyperdrive.
Stephen Moffat is planning on making a Doctor Who Comedy Spin-Off Series.
That's an Official Unconfirmed Internet Rumour.
...really?!
I'm the only one rushing on here with my Time Heist opinion?!
Again - a strong one, I think we've got a fairly solid first Capaldi series here and I didn't see the ending coming at all. Very nice and even the unqualified sweaty internet fanboy in me can't come up with much to criticize in it.
There's even a very minor Malcolm Tucker-type reference that may or may not be intentional. [spoiler]Fuckityesque[/spoiler]
Doctor's Eleven... well, four
Nicely done, good ending, plenty of fun and well written.
Moffatt haters will hate it.
Quote from: Bad City Blue on 20 September, 2014, 10:50:08 PM
Moffatt haters will hate it.
I didn't! He needs to collaborate more often ;)
I enjoyed it more than last weeks. Which everyone else seemed to drool over.
I loved it! Self contained, made sense, and just thoroughly entertaining.
Yep, I'm pretty content with the series so far - no complaints.
They got their money's worth out of that corridor...
As much as I'm enjoying Capaldi as an angry, disinterested Doctor, I've been really disappointed by the quality of the writing so far. Nonsensical/paradoxical spoilers...
[spoiler]taking your time machine specifically to the only point in time during which you will be able to open the vault door, rather than just flying your time machine to the inside of the vault during any other point in it's existence.[/spoiler]
[spoiler]Having to get inside the vault in the first place, rather than just, say, sending an email.[/spoiler]
[spoiler]Traveling in time to give someone your phone number, so they can call you in the future and get you to travel in time to give them your phone number.[/spoiler]
[spoiler]The most secure bank in the universe, which can be broken into using technology available on the open market[/spoiler]
[spoiler]An unbreakable vault with massive security, but within it in a private vault which has practically no security.[/spoiler]
[spoiler]shooting the first half as if it was an episode of The Hustle. I hate The Hustle.[/spoiler]
I thought it was pretty entertaining but the cyborg, the mutant and Clara are all really dull in comparison to Capaldi's Doctor.
Quote from: King Pops on 19 September, 2014, 10:26:33 PM
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 19 September, 2014, 06:45:58 PM
it's official that Nick Frost is in the christmas special
We'll have to wait and see if Miranda Hart's in it too
Most BBC shows broadcast over the Christmas holiday feature Miranda Hart.
Any new BBC show stands a 95% chance of involving Miranda Hart in some capacity - she's like a pony club/Aga saga/holiday cottage in the Cotswolds version of Agent Smith.
The Clan Tips enjoyed that and then looked at the gorgeous stars down in Galloway.
Nice script, nice paradox and good Capaldi doctoring.
Tempunaut, I still think you ar[spoiler]e imagining the episode was a bank heist. He needed to be there at that exact moment to make her feel regret and then to release the[/spoiler] beasties.
i get the purpose, i just don't get why [spoiler]that particular moment. Why not stop the big bad before she imprison and murders people. Also, there didn't seem to be much convincing going on- everyone was concerned about the clones she was murdering, but she seemed nonplussed by the whole visit.[/spoiler]
I thoroughly enjoyed that, I'm a sucker a good heist story.
I find that I enjoy Dr Who much more if I don't ask pesky plot-related questions such as [spoiler]why the most secure bank in the universe had every room connected by handy man-sized ventilation grilles[/spoiler].
I guessed two twists early on, but was wrong on both (I think) - [spoiler]I guessed that The Teller would turn out to be the architect and inside man - I'm not sure if everything was set in motion by the nasty lady in the future, or did the Teller instigate the heist and leave all the clues? I also thought that memory-wipe boy would turn out to be the nasty lady's son.[/spoiler]
Niggles aside, a really good episode with lots of funny quips and at least one image [spoiler]- the guy with his head flattened -[/spoiler] that will have seared itself onto the eyeballs of the kiddies to give them endless nightmares!
I liked one response to the question of why The Doctor 'allows' these things to get so convoluted: he likes adventure. He doesn't want to be bored.
All those poor bank customers won't be bored any more - I assume the flare got them while the Doctor was running around after the Teller. Seemed a bit cold to me, unless I've misunderstood (which is a fairly common event).
I'm not sure this Doctor gives much of a shit. He has his 'missions', but has already shown that he's not too fussed when people are killed off.
I suppose so. People die all the time and at all times, so he can't save them all. Still, time was the Doctor would have at least tried to throw up a planetary reversed polarity neutron brolly to save as many as possible. I dunno', it's like the Doctor doesn't think big any more - he just thinks.
.
And I am aware of the irony of me grumbling about the inhabitants of a bank being sizzled.
Quote from: The Legendary Shark on 22 September, 2014, 06:41:14 PMtime was the Doctor would have at least tried to throw up a planetary reversed polarity neutron brolly to save as many as possible
Depends on which incarnation of the Doctor, surely? Some of them would have gone all-out to save everyone, all of the time. Capaldoctor doesn't seem to care
that much.
It was pretty standard fare to me. It was fun but very happy with its own cleverness... except it wasn't so clever. The memory worm idea was such a simple crutch to set up and sustain the mystery kinda a deux ex machina in reverse... christ I'm spouting nonsense now... but I kinda know what I mean.
All that said Capaldi was great but I'm getting tired of say Doctor X Y or Z was great but the episode was little more than a fun distraction.
So what did everyone think of the latest episode, then?
Personally I thought it was pretty poor...
I really enjoyed The Caretaker. It was one of those episodes where they save a bit of money by setting most of it in a single present day location. I liked the robot soldier - he was cool. Capaldi was great again and I quite like Mr Pink.
Quote from: JamesC on 27 September, 2014, 10:12:05 PM
I really enjoyed The Caretaker. It was one of those episodes where they save a bit of money by setting most of it in a single present day location. I liked the robot soldier - he was cool. Capaldi was great again and I quite like Mr Pink.
Agree with this. It had us laughing out loud more than a couple of times but I thought there was a a clash of tones. May have been improved by being a totally comedy episode.
The robot thing was just a foil for the interaction of the trio, so it wasn't the greatest if you're into Dr Who for the marvels and wonder of the Universe they kept banging on about.
That said, I thought the interplay of the trio was fantastic! The soldier/gym teacher vibe was funny, and I liked [spoiler]that the dude stood his ground in front if the Doctor's belligerence. [/spoiler]And yet again, Capaldi was absolutely bloody superb. His angry, grumpy, cynical portrayal has got me totally hooked! Oh, and Clara was quite good too, though I found her acting a little hammy occasionally, such as when [spoiler] trying to explain away the robot and vortex as special effects in a school play.[/spoiler]
That was good and funny episode! One thing got me chuckles is that doctor think Clara's new boyfriend is that teacher who looks likes You-Know-Who!
And for the ending, [spoiler]nice cameo from Capaldi's former show! [/spoiler]
It's not a cameo [spoiler]Chris Addison is confirmed to be in the finale - so he'll be back with Missy (?female master) and that "afterlife" will get elaborated on[/spoiler] Looking forward to that!
Yeah - again I quite liked that - Moffat playing to his strengths as a sitcom writer and the tension between CapalDoc and Danny was very engaging. I also thought it was brilliant having the Doctor believe Clara had fallen for the Matt Smithalike.
Starting to get into the swing of this now - It's clear that the first episode wasn't really representative of the tone of the series and it's rattling along quite nicely. Far more consistent than the risible final Smith series which felt completely half-hearted.
Loved it. just cant get enough of a proper doctor.
Yeah, good stuff that, some hearty chuckles (Adrian was pure genius) and decent character stuff, with a lovely-looking monster and a highly enjoyable Doctor.
Capaldi is great. Just great. Almost every line he say's feels like a quote to remember (loved the Otter gag. I actually want to see that story) but he just oozes the acting chops needed for the role.
For those of you worried about the impact of the later time slot:
Quote
One show not to have suffered a ratings hit over the weekend was cult sci-fi series Doctor Who, which was shown an hour later than usual on Saturday to accommodate the start of Strictly.
The usual average of 4.8m viewers tuned in to catch up with the adventures of new Doctor Peter Capaldi.
From www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-29400258
Thought it was the worst one (by some distance) so far.
Liked Capaldi as a dark and broody Doctor. In The Caretaker he came across as a clown.
Pink is whiny and annoying.
Worth watching though because Clara gets better and better if you know what I mean.
Episode finished and my ten year old Son simply said, "I would rather have watched 'The Moonbase.'" Can't say I disagreed with him.
Next weeks episode looks much better though.
Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 29 September, 2014, 07:39:09 AM
Next weeks episode looks much better though.
My wife has already set up a tent for herself behind the sofa, in preparation for it.....she no likey [spoiler]spiders[/spoiler]
Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 29 September, 2014, 07:39:09 AM
Thought it was the worst one (by some distance) so far.
Whereas I thought it was one of the most enjoyable so far - the monster was a bit crap, but the banter was superb throughout
Quote from: Dandontdare on 29 September, 2014, 10:54:18 AM
Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 29 September, 2014, 07:39:09 AM
Thought it was the worst one (by some distance) so far.
Whereas I thought it was one of the most enjoyable so far - the monster was a bit crap, but the banter was superb throughout
vive la difference (although I appreciate we are both males).
A bit late, I know, but I wasn't a forum member when Robot of Sherwood was shown, but, and I say this as a proper Doctor Who fan, the line:
"Nottingham is not enough. After this......Derby" is the best line in Who ever. Ever!
Quote from: StrontiumFish on 01 October, 2014, 04:56:54 PM
A bit late, I know, but I wasn't a forum member when Robot of Sherwood was shown, but, and I say this as a proper Doctor Who fan, the line:
"Nottingham is not enough. After this......Derby" is the best line in Who ever. Ever!
the Brian Clough Trophy not enough? Oh dear.
Well as it currently resides in Derby....
That I've not watched it until now is a worrying sign. That said there were some genuinely funny moments. The problem the show has is when they are trying to do these character episodes there is a need to add a sci-fi story onto it and the whole thing suffers as it all feels very tacked on. Now there's nowt wrong - of course - with having a character driven piece but the two elements need to be inter-weaved much better (see Listen which did that much better).
Still some genuinely great moments.
That was a quality episode, and in my opinion, the best of the season so far.
Great effects but more importantly a great story line.
As it should be.
Kill the Moon had a nice atmos but got a bit RTD-ey.... Had a good dark edge to it though and the end was a little jarring which was nice. Ultimately continues the consistency of the series alright.
I wasn't too keen on that one. It was all going well up to the point that the spiders stopped being the main threat and we were told that they were actually bacteria (that spin webs!)
I thought the moral dilemma thing was overplayed. We all knew they weren't going to kill the creature and the idea that the moon was a big egg was handled in a rather silly way in my opinion.
On the plus side Capaldi was very good again and Clara had a funny line about Tena Lady.
Enjoyed again....Capaldi is so Bill hartnell
I think it suffered from jumping between threats and tone. The crying was well executed though.
Some lovely dialogue and characterization. I thought that the Doctor's refusal [spoiler]to tell a school kid she was "special"[/spoiler] was brilliant, especially when compared to Smith's [spoiler]"you are all made of stars" shtick[/spoiler].
Nice, creepy atmosphere. Some impressive and not-over-used monsters.
Then some plot happened, which just seemed silly. Ignore that bit.
Finishing on some nice dialogue and character development as Clara finally realises that [spoiler]the Doctor is a dick[/spoiler].
Again, I'm not really enjoying much by way of plot, but have enjoyed Capaldi. I've felt that this season has referred back to previous episodes to demonstrate the change in the character...
Tennant stood before a massive Devil, and called on human ingenuity and love to save the day. [spoiler]Capaldi stood before a massive Dalek, and was saved by hate.[/spoiler]
Smith was trapped in a maze with a bunch of innocents, facing a monster that needed saving. [spoiler] Capaldi breaks into a maze, messes with the lives of innocents and stands by whilst a whole bunch of lives are endangered, to save the Teller from its own maze.[/spoiler]
Smith pretended to be a comedy human and though everyone was brilliant. [spoiler]Capaldi pretends to be a comedy human and thinks everyone is annoying and deserving of their impending death[/spoiler]
Smith and Tennant warn their companions not to blink. [spoiler]With Capaldi, they can't even breath, whilst he disappears and leaves them to fend for themselves.[/spoiler]
So the moral of that story is 'abortion is bad, and we'll just dump the pro-choicer so they can walk home?'. is it?
Quote from: Steve Green on 05 October, 2014, 10:33:03 AM
So the moral of that story is 'abortion is bad'
Yeah I thought that too. It's a bit of a stretch but you could read it that way if you want - [spoiler]and then Clara whacked the button and it said
ABORTED[/spoiler] and I was like :-X
The RTD-ness to clarify my drunken comment was [spoiler]"the WHOLE planet decides -!!! But... what about the ones that didn't see the broadcast, the ones that can't speak English, the ones who are on the daylight side of the world and the majority of people that don't have the ability to TURN OFF THEIR STREETLIGHTS WHICH IS THE MAIN REASON WE CAN SEE CITIES FROM SPACE[/spoiler] *breathe* So that bit was INCREDIBLY stupid - but the rest I thought was alright.
[spoiler]Also that the only (on screen) people debating it are women, both male crew members killed by the parasites, and the Doctor standing aside.
I'll also add, to the 'stupid Clara idea', they're in bad shape down there, according to the discussion with mission control, you'd think if they're desperate to send a shuttle up to nuke the moon, there might be a problem with power down there?
Oh and no matter how underfunded/slapdash, one of the team is not sure how the bombs are supposed to work? When the fate of the planet rests on his shoulders?[/spoiler]
asides from the thing laying an egg as it was born (ouch) the astronaut woman wanting to blow up the moon instaed of letting the space chicken hatch was flawed ,she was worrying about chunks of egg raining down on the earth killing squillions,wouldnt blowing it up with a hundered nukes have the same effect?
Some of the physics I found troubling.
An egg usually weighs the same from ovulation to hatching. The amniotic fluid within is used as the energy/nutrients for the growth of the embryo. Why then did the Moon get heavier? Neither it's weight nor mass should have changed!
Also, does anyone know of any creature that ovulates the moment it is born?
That leads to another tricky question - were they saying there was an egg within the egg that was roughly the same size and shape as the moon, hence allowing the Earth to carry on having tides etc?
Sorry, it made no sense at all, and was a load of gibbering bollocks.
That said, I'm loving this new Doctor's ruthless streak.
Quote from: shaolin_monkey on 05 October, 2014, 12:18:41 PM
Some of the physics I found troubling.
Coffee all over the keyboard here.
None of it made a whiff of sense, and the idea that the moon is the egg/prison/corpse of a vast space creature is as old as storytelling itself. It was, however, pretty good fun and it's great to see something new in the Doctor/Companion dynamic.
If you want some rationalising, a creature of that scale is presumably not based on ordinary matter, so we could suggest that it is syphoning matter/dark matter from a wormhole/another universe/subspace to create itself, and that the regular baryonic rock of the moon was all surplus to requirements once this process is complete, and hence recycled into a new egg the same way that hens do with eggshells (although note: it's not a chicken).
However if you want to know how unicellular lifeforms make webs, or how a littoral dune system is completely unaffected by monster tides that are destroying the world, and or how the moon/egg is only 100 million years old (and thus younger than most of its major craters), you're entirely on your own.
As always, most of this anti-scientific rubbish could have been avoided with a few seconds' thought, largely just by
not having the Doctor say it. Luckily, I've been enjoying the drama more than enough that I'm not mildly bothered: Dr Who and science are simply not related, and despite its educational origins, I don't think they ever were.
I rate this as the worst of NuWho, & right bellow the Happiness Patrol in quality. Nearly unwatchable.
Real life scientisty folk have genetically fiddledaboutified e coli bacteria so that it produces spider silk.
Quote from: M.I.K. on 05 October, 2014, 03:28:48 PM
Real life scientisty folk have genetically fiddledaboutified e coli bacteria so that it produces spider silk.
Woah, this I did not know, and indeed struggle to understand. Fascinating stuff: http://www.geek.com/science/spider-silk-is-finally-ready-to-be-commercialized-1587359/ Cheers, MIK - looks like the educational role of Dr. Who is alive and kicking.
Did they make them grow legs and teeth too? :D
Quote from: shaolin_monkey on 05 October, 2014, 12:18:41 PM
Sorry, it made no sense at all, and was a load of gibbering bollocks.
That said, I'm loving this new Doctor's ruthless streak.
Couldn't agree more. But, I did still enjoy it. One thing I must say is the effects work has been so good in this series, the shot of the lunar landscape looked bloody marvellous at times.
Yeah, I still enjoyed it. Not sure what they were getting at re the choice to kill or allow to live, but the Doctor was brutal. I like that side of him.
Hey, I don't suppose this incarnation is the Valeyard..?!
every week my wife tells me she doesn't like capaldi ,mind you she didn't like smith when he started or tenant...
Quote from: Judge Brian on 05 October, 2014, 03:20:59 PM
I rate this as the worst of NuWho, & right bellow the Happiness Patrol in quality. Nearly unwatchable.
The Happiness Patrol was great, so not sure I understand this ranking system.
I'm enjoying the Grumpy Doc, only my age old pedant: 'sorry, what do they eat to get and stay that size/ in those numbers?' applied to the spiders.
Am I the only one who thinks Clara looks like a manga drawing?
QuoteAm I the only one who thinks Clara looks like a manga drawing?
Nope! There are times when I'm convinced they've made her eyes bigger with sfx!
Quote from: Proudhuff on 09 October, 2014, 09:32:02 AM
I'm enjoying the Grumpy Doc, only my age old pedant: 'sorry, what do they eat to get and stay that size/ in those numbers?' applied to the spiders.
Am I the only one who thinks Clara looks like a manga drawing?
They probably eat each other! And I'm sure if I ask my kids, in particular my girl, she'll tell me they survive on the over abundance of cheese on the moon (thanks to Wallace and Gromit)! :lol:
They live beneath the surface of a giant egg. I think it's pretty obvious what they're eating.
Smarties or chocolate buttons. They have those teeth to get through the cellophane bags.
I stand corrected. ;)
Threadjacking alert!
One of my problems with Harry Potter was where the power for all that wizardry came from? Was the source of all that cosmic wand power creating the Mouldymort? I'd hope in the final there would be a reveal of the balance between good and bad, a yingyang chicken and egg thing, but no, both sides used cosmic energy willynilly, but we all know energy has to come from somewhere right?
Apart from magic. Magic's, well, magic...
Quote from: Proudhuff on 11 October, 2014, 11:34:50 AM
....but we all know energy has to come from somewhere right?
Muggle.
Well now, I wasn't looking forward to this one but ended up enjoying it very much. Best one yet, for me, pitch-perfect. My only criticism is that Clara's imprisonment for half the episode was too static - she needed some peril of her own to highlight what she was struggling with. To mirror her inner struggle, I'd have found a reason to have her trying to get to the engine; away from the Doctor. Apart from that little missed trick, loved it.
Great one that, best of the season so far. Liked the nod to the Bechdel Test, but most of all the Tom Baker cameo(s).
Capaldi is actually magnificent. I can't objectively say whether the scripts are better than last series, but this strange, ambiguous, unpredictable alien that now sits at the series' heart is just electrifying.
Cheers
Jim
Yes, definitely the best episode of the Capaldi era to date. The characterisation of the Doctor was superb, and the story was focused and engaging. I think this might have been Capaldi's best performance too. Both he and Coleman (the latter looking particularly stunning in her 1920s garb) are compelling and charismatic enough to give even mediocre stories a lift, so when the pair get a cracking script like this one, the results are excellent. Next week's looks really promising too.
Quote from: TordelBack on 11 October, 2014, 09:37:19 PM
Great one that, best of the season so far. Liked the nod to the Bechdel Test, but most of all the Tom Baker cameo(s).
Yeah, weird that! Was Capaldi just doing a really good impression, or was it dubbed with Baker? It was great !
Sorry I miss out when he does Tom Baker? (Not easy being Deaf!)
No deafness issue - I feel like you Goaty, whaddya talking about guys?!
I think 'Gus' was John Sessions. Nice episode again - !
When he's talking to himself, he's asking himself a question - the line 'A mummy that only the victims can see' (or something like this) and it sounds very much like Tom Baker.
There's also the cigarette case with jelly babies in it.
I really enjoyed that one BTW.
Ahh! thanks!
Also I like when Capaldi did "Are you my mummy?" nice ref!
Well that was a bloody good episode that! Probably the best one yet. And it took a while, but I've finally taken to Capaldi (so has my boy!). :D
QuoteCapaldi is actually magnificent. I can't objectively say whether the scripts are better than last series, but this strange, ambiguous, unpredictable alien that now sits at the series' heart is just electrifying.
a thousand times this. i am glued to the screen wondering what he will do/say next (and all without the worry that he will kiss girls or turn into Timmy mallett, bliss)
I remember someone mentioning on Twitter that he thinks Capaldi will be a one series Doctor like Christopher Eccleston. But on this evidence, I sure as hell hope he sticks around for a couple of seasons. He's doing a great job in my opinion, and Coleman too.
This series has been more darker in tone than the previous ones, and all the better for it.
Mm. I was wondering about Capaldi's longevity in the role, but on the basis of what we've seen, he needs to stay for a while. This is without doubt my favourite run of new-Who, and both he and Coleman have been excellent. I've also noticed a general upswing in scripts and direction, too. It's like cobwebs have been blown away, and everyone's taking full advantage of a kind of fresh start.
Quote from: Mabs on 12 October, 2014, 12:55:24 PM
I remember someone mentioning on Twitter that he thinks Capaldi will be a one series Doctor like Christopher Eccleston.
I seem to remember hearing this, too. However, Capaldi — unlike Ecclestone — is undoubtedly a fan, so I'm also hoping he'll give us a few years.
Cheers
Jim
He's at the wrong end of his career to worry about being forever linked to a single signature role in the public imagination, which is what worried Eccleston (and, to a lesser extent, the other two). Capaldi already has that problem anyway, because of The Thick Of It.
hope he sticks around but his prescence will be missed on musketeers... anyone else like the "don't stop me now" song reference to shaun of the dead ( a mummy being an Egyptian zombie after all)
I enjoyed this episode a lot. Not sure if it's my favourite of the series but it was very good.
I worry for Clara. I have a feeling she's going to kark it at the end of the series. I have a feeling that her decision to carry on travelling with the Doctor will be a big mistake and that he'll endanger his companion once too often. This will leave the Doctor with a lot of guilt to get over and an enemy in Mr Pink who has already taken a dislike to the Doctor because he reminds him of irresponsible military top brass.
Quote from: JamesC on 12 October, 2014, 01:50:36 PM
I enjoyed this episode a lot. Not sure if it's my favourite of the series but it was very good.
I worry for Clara. I have a feeling she's going to kark it at the end of the series. I have a feeling that her decision to carry on travelling with the Doctor will be a big mistake and that he'll endanger his companion once too often. This will leave the Doctor with a lot of guilt to get over and an enemy in Mr Pink who has already taken a dislike to the Doctor because he reminds him of irresponsible military top brass.
That's a great analysis James, never thought of that! It'd be interesting if it does go that route, especially when you have the mysterious Missy in the background. Imagine Clara does kark it as you say, and the Doctor comes up against her (Missy)? It'd make for an interesting encounter.
This episode was without the best one, and probably my favourite alongside 'Listen' (which took me a second viewing to truly appreciate).
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 12 October, 2014, 01:08:46 PM
Quote from: Mabs on 12 October, 2014, 12:55:24 PM
I remember someone mentioning on Twitter that he thinks Capaldi will be a one series Doctor like Christopher Eccleston.
I seem to remember hearing this, too. However, Capaldi — unlike Ecclestone — is undoubtedly a fan, so I'm also hoping he'll give us a few years.
Cheers
Jim
I seem to remember reading somewhere that Capaldi has signed for three series and (with reference to another post) that Clara will be exiting the show at Christmas
(...trundles off to look for evidence of the above...)
Some people seem to be dislikeing Capaldi's Doctor because of anfew remarks he's made towards Clara, believeing him to be mysogynistic.
Nah. I just think he's a dick. That's why I love him.
Anyway, I enjoyed Mummy on the Orient Express. Very well executed episode by all accounts.
More to the point, he's an alien, and actually acting like it in this incarnation.
The whole "It's a mistake to think I'm your boyfriend line" (with the follow up to Clara, "I didn't say you made the mistake") encapsulates Capaldi's take on the character.
I'm loving the Cap, too. I think it was at the end of the last episode when the Doctor was dancing about, drawing in the sand with a stick, that it struck me how much of a fusion between Hartnell and Troughton this new character is; an irascible clown.
.
The Cap is, I predict, going to be one of my favourite Doctors of all time. Top three at least.
Yeah - others have difficulty prizing him and Malcolm Tucker apart in their minds but for me the definition is very clear. Capaldi's no one trick pony and his characterization here is extraordinarily good - acres of malice and darkness but you have no doubt his intentions are ultimately good... although good for who exactly...
I really hope he sticks around because he's an effortlessly and irresistibly iconic Doctor already and it's only been a few months!
Oh! I was not sniding the Capaldi! He's truely magnetic in everything he does but gosh damn it he's phenomenal in Who! Probably one of my favourite moments in Mummy on the Orient Express was his utter boredom with Clara's eye game monologue on her inner conflict. When all he wanted to do was talk about the planets. Brilliant.
I don't think that was meant to be boredom so much as uncomfortableness.
Wow! That was so creepy and great episode tonight! Same writer of last week episode :)
And the SFX effects is amazing!
Another really good episode. Clever idea, visually well-realised, with a couple of wonderfully creepy moments. Capaldi continues to be electrifyingly good.
More!
Jim
I thought that was great - loved it.
Is there a picture of the Boneless??
Another 'excellent' vote from me - what creepy fun that was, with very effective effects. Between Capaldi's depth and energy, and Coleman's pleasingly underplayed delivery and mesmeric gorgeousness, this series is blessed with two great leads. Two great supporting players this week too in the gaffer and the young lad.
I really enjoyed that. I liked the sort of claymation effect they gave the monsters. I expect we'll see that effect ripped off elsewhere before long.
Capaldi gave a very Tennant-esque speech at the end which makes me wonder if his channeling of other Doctors is a deliberate theme.
Quote from: JamesC on 18 October, 2014, 10:23:15 PM
Capaldi gave a very Tennant-esque speech at the end which makes me wonder if his channeling of other Doctors is a deliberate theme.
I wondered that after last week, and this really confirmed it for me. We had Baker's yo-yo on the Moon, then his Jelly Beans, voice and manic grin on the Orient Express... what other stuff have I missed or forgotten?
Quote from: TordelBack on 18 October, 2014, 10:36:17 PM
Quote from: JamesC on 18 October, 2014, 10:23:15 PM
Capaldi gave a very Tennant-esque speech at the end which makes me wonder if his channeling of other Doctors is a deliberate theme.
I wondered that after last week, and this really confirmed it for me. We had Baker's yo-yo on the Moon, then his Jelly Beans, voice and manic grin on the Orient Express... what other stuff have I missed or forgotten?
I'm pretty sure there was some Pertwee in the Robin Hood one.
Well that was one hell of an episode! Just when you think it can't get any better they manage to top it each week with something even more heart pounding and spectacular! Wow. Brilliant!
I haven't watched this episode yet but I'll join the discussion anyway.
I felt it was a bit patchy, but overall it was silly in a good way. The science seemed off and they would have been better saying it was magic behind everything and Dr Who was a space wizard and this would maybe stop some fans moaning, but I doubt it. I liked Peter Capaldi and Jenna Coleman is very pretty. Next week's looked interesting.
Not feeling the love for that episode at all really - Capaldo good as per and enjoyed the dimensionally shifty TARDIS but um... Bristol doesn't have an underground train network.... it just doesn't. Yes graffiti. No underground. The whole thing felt very cheap and tacky for me - it just screamed "we're trying to save the budget this week".
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 19 October, 2014, 01:41:29 AM
Bristol doesn't have an underground train network.... it just doesn't.
It does have an
abandoned underground railway, though, somewhere near the Clifton Suspension Bridge.
I really liked this one, but for some reason Clara's nose seemed pointier than usual. Weird.
If you're talking about Clifton Rocks Railway it's abandoned yes but it's just a little Victorian cliffside railway thing:
(http://www.nettleden.com/uploads/4c476b968f3fb-gallery.jpg)
It's just a minor niggle - I mean, graffiti yes. We do have graffiti. There's graffiti in Bristol. Spot on there, well researched. Riggsy as well. Close to Banksy. Nice.
I think it would've been better if instead of Riggsy, he was called Rigby, and shouted "yeahyah" at every turn! :lol:
Quote from: Muscleman on 19 October, 2014, 11:29:41 AM
I think it would've been better if instead of Riggsy, he was called Rigby, and shouted "yeahyah" at every turn! :lol:
Well, you
would say that.....!" ;)
Quote from: Darren Stephens on 19 October, 2014, 06:45:27 PM
Quote from: Muscleman on 19 October, 2014, 11:29:41 AM
I think it would've been better if instead of Riggsy, he was called Rigby, and shouted "yeahyah" at every turn! :lol:
Well, you would say that.....!" ;)
:lol:
So anyone got ideas or guess about the final scene with Missy "Clara, my Clara. I have chosen well..."
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 19 October, 2014, 01:41:29 AM
Not feeling the love for that episode at all really - Capaldo good as per and enjoyed the dimensionally shifty TARDIS but um... Bristol doesn't have an underground train network.... it just doesn't. Yes graffiti. No underground. The whole thing felt very cheap and tacky for me - it just screamed "we're trying to save the budget this week".
What about the Clifton Down tunnel? It's been a while since I last took it but I remember being underground for
ever. (Mind you, I was 8 at the time). Nowhere near where the exterior shots were filmed, admittedly...
Quote from: Goaty on 19 October, 2014, 09:19:36 PM
So anyone got ideas or guess about the final scene with Missy "Clara, my Clara. I have chosen well..."
As JamesC mentioned a few pages back, I think it means Clara will be her next victim, and then Missy will piss the Doctor off proper. A bad move.
It could also mean that Clara has some sort of relationship with Missy. Could Clara be an infiltrator of sorts? Unwittingly collecting information for Missy?
Whatever the meaning behind the words, I can't wait to see what unfolds as we approach the finale. By the way, did anyone notice the Little Red Riding Hood reference in the trailer for next episode? It was my son who pointed it out to me!
Maybe Missy will get to Clara, and thus the Doctor, by being evil at Mr Pink in some way. Kill Pink, make it look like the Doctor did it (or force the Doctor to 'save' either Pink or Clara), thus inciting Clara to kill the Doctor, who will then regenerate into Joe Pesquali and kill the whole series stone dead by breaching the Fourth Wall.
.
Or not. Probably not.
.
This series is managing to be reasonably inoffensive, no classic episodes, but nothing terrible either.
I find the Missy scenes particularly annoying, but I suspect she's the one who put the Doctor and Clara together, and that's why she's "chosen well".
Yup. Probably the "woman in the shop" who handed over the Doctor's phone number in (this incarnation of) Clara's first episode.
A bit off current episode but. Missy saying she chose Clara, reminded me that Capaldi had asked himself why he had chosen his face (first episode I think). This clearly means that the Doctor has a choice of what he can look like, does that mean he can also pick his personality. If so did he chose to be older looking and a darker character, perhaps to stop himself and his companion becoming too 'close'
Really enjoyed Flatline. Very mixed bag of characters, slightly alternative modern setting and some outstanding CGI (i'm used to saying good CGI, but the animation in this was really, really great. Particularly liked the 3D spooks and how they moved. Very eerie.).
Looking back at this series it's deffinetly had a higher hit to miss ratio than last series. Last series, discounting the Night and Day of the Doctor, their where really only two stand outs in the Rings of Akaheteen and Cold War. Everything else was varying levels of crap.
This time the Moff seem's to have released some creative control over the team and aloud them to do their own thing. And it's much more noticable. The only story I didn't much care for was Robots of Sherwood but I can see why people did like it.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 22 October, 2014, 05:03:29 PM
only two stand outs in the Rings of Akaheteen and Cold War.
The Rings of Akhaten... really? I thought that was episode was
terrible. Almost no plot, and what little there was made no sense whatsoever!
QuoteThis time the Moff seem's to have released some creative control over the team
Of the first six episodes (ie: the entire first half) of this series, only
Robots of Sherwood, is the only episode not written or co-written by Moffat — that's hardly the mark of a man relinquishing control...!
Cheers
Jim
Horses for courses I guess, but I for one really enjoyed Akhaten. Fun little story. But saying that, season seven could be considered as bad as McCoys first season (shudder).
But thats surprised me that. I was under the impression Moffet was only scripting Deep Breath, Listen and the finale. Good stuff then. Marks for improvement to Moffat.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 22 October, 2014, 05:17:44 PM
Horses for courses I guess, but I for one really enjoyed Akhaten. Fun little story. But saying that, season seven could be considered as bad as McCoys first season (shudder).
A tad gratuitous with the classic series hate, there.
Series 7 was ok, but it was no season 24.
Season 22 could have been a better comparison. But even that had three good stories.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 22 October, 2014, 06:29:08 PM
Season 22 could have been a better comparison. But even that had three good stories.
Attack of the Cybermen, Revelation of the Daleks and Two Doctors?
Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 22 October, 2014, 06:40:09 PM
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 22 October, 2014, 06:29:08 PM
Season 22 could have been a better comparison. But even that had three good stories.
Attack of the Cybermen, Revelation of the Daleks and Two Doctors Vengeance on Varos?
Fixed it for you.
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 19 October, 2014, 01:41:29 AM
Not feeling the love for that episode at all really - Capaldo good as per and enjoyed the dimensionally shifty TARDIS but um... Bristol doesn't have an underground train network.... it just doesn't. Yes graffiti. No underground. The whole thing felt very cheap and tacky for me - it just screamed "we're trying to save the budget this week".
Pretty sure Britain hasn't been sending manned rockets to Mars since 1970 either.
So, Clara just decided that letting a whole bunch of kids die was kinder than saving them and allowing them to travel anywhere in the universe. What a cow.
First dud of the season for me. Incoherent to the point of tedium. Ah well, they can't all be good.
Well now, as sci-fi that was rubbish - but as pure fantasy I thought it was superb. The Cap just gets more awesome every week and this series just keeps on getting better. Bravo!
That was utter shite. Felt VVVVVEEEEERRRYYYYY RTD-esque.
should be a rule that they can only 'talk to the world' once a season.
Seemed a whole lot of 'short of ideas' that.
Looking forward to Clara being over. Not a participant in 'the assistant wars' but there is just something terribly dull and unconvincing about her character.
I have to agree with Tordelback on this one; this episode was utter balls. Not even the William Blake references could save it from some of the mediocrity on show. That ending just had me rolling my eyes, Maebe's sister was hiding behind the bushes all this time right? ::)
Why am I always in the feckin' minority? I thoroughly enjoyed that; from the Doctor as the fairy tale trickster, to the exploration of basic fears, to basic 'monsters' of wolves and tigers - and that line "I don't want to be the last of my kind". Class project - save the world, heh. I liked the core message too - the planet actually is on our side - it keeps us oxygenated, hydrated, fed and warm despite the fact that we abuse her terribly. There was fear and love and humour and magic and science that didn't make a lick of sense - but I loved it.
.
So there! :-P
Quote from: Grant Goggans on 22 October, 2014, 09:10:46 PM
Pretty sure Britain hasn't been sending manned rockets to Mars since 1970 either.
(NOTE TO GCHQ: Good work lads, the yanks haven't noticed Operation Galactic Empire yet)
Good to know a pocket torch will fend off a hungry tiger though, eh?
Quote from: The Legendary Shark on 25 October, 2014, 09:29:43 PM
Why am I always in the feckin' minority?
That's why we love you. Do carry on :D
Indeed. On reflection, there were some good lines and scenes, and the germ of a good idea, but the whole was a mess. The completely stupid elements would make for a hell of long list so I won't bother, but the core idea of a recurring magical forest that inspires fears and fairytales is an enticing one.
A lot more more fun for me would have been an 'accidental' fieldtrip visit to a forested London in the recent past, say the 1970s, with the puzzle of where/when they were, what had happened and why no-one remembered, or even a more distant 17th C where they could have worked with Hooke and Newton to solve it. Anything other than a modern central London that has exactly one worried parent on a bicycle for a population.
Perhaps the most embarrassing thing was that they clearly couldn't shoot/afford location shots of the Natural History Museum - 'London Zoological Museum' me arse. Come back Age of the Wolf, all is forgiven!
Obligatory: Capaldi is great.
They could, however, afford internal location shots of Cardiff Museum! ;)
It was alright, at a push, although The Doctor's not the last of his species, and knows he's not, so some of the dialogue was weird.
Oh, and that's twice so far they've re-enacted this scene from Pyramids of Mars in series 8:
http://youtu.be/Syt3twu3SlI (http://youtu.be/Syt3twu3SlI)
Yeah, sorry didn't think much of it - as people have said it felt like a throwback to the 'phone the planet' stuff of RTD era Who.
The whole wolves/tiger bit - they didn't seem awfully interested in getting themselves on the other side of the fence - despite explaining away 'rubbish wolves', all you've done is waved a torch at tiger.
The sister in the shrubbery came out of nowhere as far as I could tell.
It felt like it would have worked better making the woods darker and more threatening - the way it was shot it felt more like a picnic.
I thought they might have gone with having the children picked off by the trees, protecting them from animals/the solar flare - although the rest of the group wouldn't know that.
Then the sister in the shrubbery wouldn't have been such a WTF? moment.
I'll leave the 'we're going to defoliate enough of the forest in one day to make a difference, and pay attention to random schoolkids ringing up'
I liked it up to the point that they found out the world was going to end.
I have no idea what the little girl, her lost sister or the fire flies were all about though.
Gawds but I can reisist pathetic nitpickery no longer! I shall permit myself one lapse: the big red tree ring in the museum. Why was it ever there, when at the end of the episode we see that the additional 'defensive' growth in existing trees just magically melts away, leaving all the hedgerows nicely trimmed? I appreciate that this isn't SF, so I'm not questioning the idea of the 'solar flare', or the defensive value of an oxygen-rich atmosphere, or the unburnable trees, etc. etc., but this is just plain sloppy logic, within the premise of the story.
This seemed over-long. Which for a 45 minute show about the end of the world seems odd.
Too much wandering about in the bushes, not enough story.
Still, my eldest was utterly enthused to see the Cybermen at the end.
As I been enjoy this season of DW, honesty this episode is one of shite episodes, too many plot holes, it very RTD theme :( as I hated those RTD seasons.
Highlight was next week teaser!
Quote from: JamesC on 26 October, 2014, 01:52:46 PM
I have no idea what the little girl, her lost sister or the fire flies were all about though.
(http://b2b.cbsimg.net/blogs/midichlorians_pvp.jpg)
I've enjoyed this series so far but that was just terrible, it's not even worth picking holes in the plot as the entire thing was just utter nonsense. It felt like it was cobbled together from a bunch of ideas that RTD wrote on the back of a beermat and then decided they were too crappy for even him to pursue.
Like Goaty said, the best part was the preview of next weeks episode.
For a programme with two charismatic leads, a funny script, a great central idea and lots of brilliant echoes and references to fairy tales and myth, that wasn't half a bag of shite.
Forgive me all, but what is an RTD? :|
RTD : Russel T Davies (previous show runner and bringer-back of Doctor Who for the 21st century)
Quote from: Daveycandlish on 26 October, 2014, 07:39:56 PM
RTD : Russel T Davies (previous show runner and bringer-back of Doctor Who for the 21st century)
Oh, silly of me! I was thinking you guys were referring to a fantasy TV series or something which I was missing out on! Thanks Davey. :)
Quote from: Tiplodocus on 26 October, 2014, 06:54:06 PM
For a programme with two charismatic leads, a funny script, a great central idea and lots of brilliant echoes and references to fairy tales and myth, that wasn't half a bag of shite.
^^^was what this tree hugger thought too.
I'm a bit behind but the one where the TARDIS was shrunk.
Shit. That was some seriously poor Doctor Who.
Seriously poor.
Like. Poop.
I liked that one.
Come and sit next to me on the Naughty Step.
But no talking mind you two!
I'm genuinely interested to know if any of the nay-sayers on the board watch this programme with their children.
I do. I can see its faults, but for me there is a sheer joy in sharing with my children a programme I remember watching with my parents.
Anyway: I think Missy is the Master.
Quote from: The Enigmatic Dr X on 01 November, 2014, 06:41:19 PM..for me there is a sheer joy in sharing with my children a programme I remember watching with my parents.
Spot on there, Dr. X - I've been particularly enjoying this season watching as a family, and even with my son's friends.
Doesn't mean I can't also enjoy eviscerating it in the privacy of the internet afterwards, mind.
That was good episode tonight!
Utter piffle from start to finish.
.
Get to the naughty step again!
[spoiler]Missy is the Master? ::)[/spoiler]
My son pointed out the Cybermen before they even showed up. Sometimes kids can see or sense things we 'dults can't I suppose, but I'm mighty impressed with his enthusiasm. :)
Okay, if the Doctor and Missy were in the 'Nethesphere', how did she open the door and end up in London? Or was it here (i.e in London) all the time? Must be a dimensional thing surely?
Good episode though, a big improvement on last week.
The best bit of the episode was, of course:
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad84/ronniecraven/Obvious1_zps198995e0.png)
Had they not already spoiled who the baddies were in last week's trailer, it would have had even more impact.
Quote from: Muscleman on 01 November, 2014, 09:15:39 PM
[spoiler]Missy is the Master? ::)[/spoiler]
My son pointed out the Cybermen before they even showed up. Sometimes kids can see or sense things we 'dults can't I suppose, but I'm mighty impressed with his enthusiasm. :)
Okay, if the Doctor and Missy were in the 'Nethesphere', how did she open the door and end up in London? Or was it here (i.e in London) all the time? Must be a dimensional thing surely?
Good episode though, a big improvement on last week.
The cyber men were in last week's trailer.
The Matrix core is from the Matrix. A computer simulated world (like the film the MatrIx but done in dr who 29 years or so earlier) into which minds can be uploaded. So the minds go there to have emotion removed and then are installed into cybermen bodies, which are corpses turned into mostly robot
Quote from: Muscleman on 01 November, 2014, 09:15:39 PM
[spoiler]Missy is the Master? ::)[/spoiler]
My son pointed out the Cybermen before they even showed up. Sometimes kids can see or sense things we 'dults can't I suppose, but I'm mighty impressed with his enthusiasm. :)
Okay, if the Doctor and Missy were in the 'Nethesphere', how did she open the door and end up in London? Or was it here (i.e in London) all the time? Must be a dimensional thing surely?
Good episode though, a big improvement on last week.
[spoiler]
The Nethersphere is clearly that constant-thorn-in-the-submission-pile a virtual reality "prison". Missy probably exists in both, if brain waves can be captured and placed in the nethersphere then it seems reasonable you can duplicate brainwaves (this btw is ground well covered by Ian Bank's Contact series).
The Doctor/Clara/Missy were all in a building in london that holds the physical remains of the dead (who have been 'upgraded' and stored) and while intelligence of those bodies are stored within the nethersphere (which was the round orbiting Gallifrayan 'hard drive'), but it was clearly intended to confuse and make you think they were somewhere else - maybe somewhere more futuristic or alien.
Only disappointment to me is that the cybermen always look like there should be millions to be a real threat, but they only ever seem to have a dozen or so.
[/spoiler]
Otherwise, I thought it was a great episode.
A lot of that was just... inappropriate.
The[spoiler] Steve Jobs reference[/spoiler]? Bit much especially the [spoiler]murdered child - I know a few soldiers who watch it. Fun night in for them having that kind of thing rubbed all up in their gob on Saturday primetime.[/spoiler]
Also - the minute she [spoiler]called herself 'Missy' in the first episode it was hugely obvious - I'm a bit disappointed it's that straight-forward actually... and of course she flirts with him excessively because Moffat[/spoiler] peh. Fan entitlement aside it was stronger than last weeks (in that it actually made some sort of sense) - and the [spoiler]cyberman reveal was a cracker.[/spoiler]
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 01 November, 2014, 09:23:56 PM
A lot of that was just... inappropriate.
The[spoiler] Steve Jobs reference[/spoiler]? Bit much especially the [spoiler]murdered child - I know a few soldiers who watch it. Fun night in for them having that kind of thing rubbed all up in their gob on Saturday primetime.[/spoiler]
Got to say, I totally agree with you on those points, can't have been easy for some.
Quote from: pauljholden on 01 November, 2014, 09:22:25 PM
Quote from: Muscleman on 01 November, 2014, 09:15:39 PM
[spoiler]Missy is the Master? ::)[/spoiler]
My son pointed out the Cybermen before they even showed up. Sometimes kids can see or sense things we 'dults can't I suppose, but I'm mighty impressed with his enthusiasm. :)
Okay, if the Doctor and Missy were in the 'Nethesphere', how did she open the door and end up in London? Or was it here (i.e in London) all the time? Must be a dimensional thing surely?
Good episode though, a big improvement on last week.
[spoiler]
The Nethersphere is clearly that constant-thorn-in-the-submission-pile a virtual reality "prison". Missy probably exists in both, if brain waves can be captured and placed in the nethersphere then it seems reasonable you can duplicate brainwaves (this btw is ground well covered by Ian Bank's Contact series).
The Doctor/Clara/Missy were all in a building in london that holds the physical remains of the dead (who have been 'upgraded' and stored) and while intelligence of those bodies are stored within the nethersphere (which was the round orbiting Gallifrayan 'hard drive'), but it was clearly intended to confuse and make you think they were somewhere else - maybe somewhere more futuristic or alien.
Only disappointment to me is that the cybermen always look like there should be millions to be a real threat, but they only ever seem to have a dozen or so.
[/spoiler]
Otherwise, I thought it was a great episode.
I think that's a great explanation of how the Nethersphere works, PJ, certainly clears things up for me at least.
Cheers! :)
A Government inspection? So soon? And why is there all this swearing?
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Quote from: The Enigmatic Dr X on 01 November, 2014, 09:18:37 PM
Quote from: Muscleman on 01 November, 2014, 09:15:39 PM
[spoiler]Missy is the Master? ::)[/spoiler]
My son pointed out the Cybermen before they even showed up. Sometimes kids can see or sense things we 'dults can't I suppose, but I'm mighty impressed with his enthusiasm. :)
Okay, if the Doctor and Missy were in the 'Nethesphere', how did she open the door and end up in London? Or was it here (i.e in London) all the time? Must be a dimensional thing surely?
Good episode though, a big improvement on last week.
The cyber men were in last week's trailer.
The Matrix core is from the Matrix. A computer simulated world (like the film the MatrIx but done in dr who 29 years or so earlier) into which minds can be uploaded. So the minds go there to have emotion removed and then are installed into cybermen bodies, which are corpses turned into mostly robot
Sorry Dr X, missed your post!
I didn't realise they were in the trailer, and funny you should say The Matrix 'cos that's the first thing I thought of when I saw it. Good to know the good old Doctor was here first though! I've really vague memories of the older series, hence my lack of knowledge on certain Who lore, sadly. :'(
Thanks for the recap though!
I'll be watching it tonight after several dives up Anglesey way. From what I can see though it's basicly The Invasion Part 2. Which is no bad thing as I loooove The Invasion.
Quote from: shaolin_monkey on 02 November, 2014, 02:26:42 AM
A Government inspection? So soon? And why is there all this swearing?
Forgot about that! :D
Will him and Chris Addison meet do you think?!
I'm a bit disappointed to see The Master back again, I was hoping Missy would be a totally new Who villain. But, on the plus side, it's great they brought the character back as a woman now. There's something about Missy which I find really creepy, especially when we see her immitating a robot! And I love that kiss, it knocked the Doctor back for six! :D
i never liked the master as a villain for some reason ... I do hope they wont turn the doc into a woman
Quote from: Grugz on 02 November, 2014, 10:25:17 AM
i never liked the master as a villain for some reason ... I do hope they wont turn the doc into a woman
Why?
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 02 November, 2014, 10:26:00 AM
Quote from: Grugz on 02 November, 2014, 10:25:17 AM
i never liked the master as a villain for some reason ... I do hope they wont turn the doc into a woman
Why?
Because with Moff writing it would be
UTTERLY
HIDEOUS
Dr Whore.
.
Hmmmm......
Quote from: Grugz on 02 November, 2014, 10:25:17 AM
hope they wont turn the doc into a woman
They've done boyish
twice; now he's an old man. It's either female or an ethnicity other than white Northern European next - not for reasons of political correctness, just the same marketing process that demands a new assistant every year (except in years when the Doctor regenerates) *. A different Doctor is the biggest PR tool the BBC has, except maybe
Top Gear. Like the antics of Clarkson, doing the same thing you did last time isn't enough - they have to keep pushing things further every time to continue getting the same result.
*
looking forward to being proven wrong on that un-researched blanket statement - I expect charts and interactive graphs, people, not just gainsaying
Heh. Got me their. But give it to Gatiss or Geiman and it would be something fantastic indeed.
Quote from: Cardinal Woofsey on 02 November, 2014, 10:44:00 AM
Quote from: Grugz on 02 November, 2014, 10:25:17 AM
hope they wont turn the doc into a woman
They've done boyish twice; now he's an old man. It's either female or an ethnicity other than white Northern European next - not for reasons of political correctness, just the same marketing process that demands a new assistant every year (except in years when the Doctor regenerates) *. A different Doctor is the biggest PR tool the BBC has, except maybe Top Gear. Like the antics of Clarkson, doing the same thing you did last time isn't enough - they have to keep pushing things further every time to continue getting the same result.
* looking forward to being proven wrong on that un-researched blanket statement - I expect charts and interactive graphs, people, not just gainsaying
New doctor will be a manatee.
This entire series has been crappier than usual and has shown none of the promise in the teaser trailers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9dcGBS2X8Y
Horses for courses. I can't think of another series of New Who I've enjoyed more than this one. There hasn't really been a Blink, but by the same token, bar the iffy opening episode, I've at worst been entertained by all the others.
I really enjoyed last nights episode. It had a good premise, creepy moments, a fantastic reveal, and a great cliffhanger. All the ingredients of great Dr Who!!!
I think this has been the best Who series for ages.
Capaldi is great and Olivia Colman has been much better than in the last series. I'm not a massive fan of her character though.
She must have been good if she's managed to be a totally different actor.
Quote from: JamesC on 02 November, 2014, 01:35:59 PM
I think this has been the best Who series for ages.
I'd agree - it's been a very consistent season, certainly the best in quite some time. Most of the stories have been good or at least had good bits, with the exception of the Forest one. 'Into the Dalek', 'Listen', 'Mummy on the Orient Express', and 'Flatline' were all great, the latter two showcasing a really promising writer in Jamie Mathieson. We've also got the best Doctor / companion pairing since Eccleston / Piper. There are still a lot of things to nitpick at, and god knows I've done my share, but overall, it's been a success.
Quote from: Steve Green on 02 November, 2014, 01:38:57 PM
She must have been good if she's managed to be a totally different actor.
Ha ha - I'm always getting her name mixed up for some reason!
Really enjoyed that , can't wait to the final next week
Y'all see how Sean Pertwee went trick or treating this year? Not so much fancy dress as a sales pitch:
(http://i.imgur.com/CYa3eYP.jpg?1)
He is perfect as his father if they doing more of An Adventure in Space and Time
Three thumbs up from Clan Tips. Annoyed about the trailer from last week spoiling what would have been a great reveal (but Mrs Tips, who doesn't pay attention to trailers etc.) was hoodwinked.
I'm not sure that the flirting is "because Moffat". But more that "because funny". Capaldi's reaction was great and garnered big laughs.
Yeah all that kissing malarkey preceeded Moffat. And it was amusing, considering this much less touchy feely doctor, compared to the last two.
I guessed the Cyberman twist although that was largely due to the ad for last week. I thought it was cleverly done though.
As I get the impression that the 'download consciousness' gig is fairly new, shouldn't those corpses have been much fresher though? Or at least of varying stages of decay if it's been n going on a while, but I guess they can't really show rotting corpses on a prime-time TV show.
Anyway, I enjoyed it a lot. In fact I enjoyed this entire series, although I though the woodland episode a bit weak.
Despite my last comment, which was posted for a comic effect it failed to initiate, I too have been enjoying this series immensely.
.
The biggest thing that spoils it for me are those "Next Week" previews after the titles. I do try not to watch them but you know how it is. The cyberman reveal at the end of last week's otherwise superb episode did somewhat spoil the reveal of this story. I would have loved the opportunity to "get it" when those doors closed on the pondering Doctor but that pesky trailer had already robbed me of that experience.
.
So, here's a suggestion - I know they have to hook in the audience for next week, or at least they think they do, but must they do it so brutally? Why not show the first 20 or 30 seconds of next week's episode instead? Like those little teasers at the end of the Marvel films?
.
Time was a tv series would sometimes save money by putting the hero into a coma and then doing a clip-show stitched together from previous episodes. This is the same thing but in reverse, saving money by re-using clips from future shows and it's tacky.
.
Such a little "scenette," which I think would add value to each episode in its own right, might also greatly improve the box-set experience.
.
(Not that Dr Who is the only tv show guilty of this.)
I agree totally. The Cybermen turning up was completely spoilt.
I can see the episode was designed to be a slow reveal - the Cyber-eye was hinted at right from the outset, in the company logo etc, and when the doors closed to form the two eyes it should have been an 'ah!' moment. But you're quite right - all that had been spoiled by the stupid teaser last week.
On the plus side, at least they didn't spoil the Missy reveal. That was just brilliant!
Quote from: The Legendary Shark on 03 November, 2014, 10:33:12 AM
The biggest thing that spoils it for me are those "Next Week" previews after the titles. I do try not to watch them but you know how it is. The cyberman reveal at the end of last week's otherwise superb episode did somewhat spoil the reveal of this story.
I agree about that particular trailer, but I have no problem with Who-trailers in principle - they could easily have made an equally effective one by omitting the cybermen and just showing us the skeletons moving in the tanks. The cybermen are such damaged goods in New Who, it's not like knowing they're in the next episode will make it more likely people will tune in. (I suspect that does happen for Dalek episodes though.)
Quote from: Greg M. on 03 November, 2014, 12:03:08 PM
I also agree about that particular trailer, but I have no problem with Who-trailers in principle - they could easily have made an equally effective one by omitting the cybermen and just showing us the skeletons moving in the tanks. The cybermen are such damaged goods in New Who, it's not like knowing they're in the next episode will make it more likely people will tune in. (I suspect that does happen for Dalek episodes though.)
I agree about the trailer, although not about the Cybermen being damaged goods. Cyber-episodes have generally been okay, and certainly not any worse than the Dalek ones. I suspect their appearance in the trailer was considered an important inducement, especially as the viewing figures this season have hardly been stellar.
Screw the viewing figures. You produce quality and the figures will take care of themselves. The Campaign Requesting Amended Previews movement starts here!
Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 04 November, 2014, 12:01:59 PM
Cyber-episodes have generally been okay, and certainly not any worse than the Dalek ones.
I feel the Daleks have had several great modern episodes, albeit interspersed with a few clunkers - inevitable given their ubiquitous status. 'Dalek' is a definite modern classic and absolutely set the tone for their current incarnation. The Cybermen, on the other hand, have ended up a bit of a confused mess - their inaugural two-parter was poor, and apart from the Dalek vs. Cyberman finale of Tennant's first season, I'd struggle to think of many modern Cyber-episodes that haven't been rotten. 'Nightmare in Silver', the story that should have redefined them as proper threats, was one of the worst stories of modern times. My big hope is that this week's finale gives them back their credibility.
In my opinion the main things that made the Cybermen scary have been removed.
Originally, they'd cyberised themselves. It was their own choice to survive by cybernetic modification which gives us some kind of empathy with them. However scary they are now, they were once like us.
Also, they've just become far too robotic. They're supposed to be part human - SHOW DON'T TELL. When they were human in a silver balaclava with bits of machinery stuck to them it was horrific to imagine what their body may be like without the cyber elements. Just look at the modern Robocop film to see how scary and horrific this can be.
No. I wrote something cruel - the edit was to remove it. Sorry.
If your talking about the new Doctor Who, I thought Peter Capaldi needed more work and didn't think he put enough preparation into performance in his episode. It's like didn't come up with any plan and just decided to wing it with terrible results.
I'm really sorry about this after all the hype and hope he work it out before his time is up as well.
BTW Love the new intro sequence.
May watch this properly someday.
Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 04 November, 2014, 06:27:34 PM
I thought Peter Capaldi needed more work and didn't think he put enough preparation into performance in his episode
I'm fairly sure he's in all of them.
Quote from: sauchie tower on 04 November, 2014, 06:52:14 PM
Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 04 November, 2014, 06:27:34 PM
I thought Peter Capaldi needed more work and didn't think he put enough preparation into performance in his episode
I'm fairly sure he's in all of them.
But what's that got to do with S***e?
Quote from: sauchie tower on 04 November, 2014, 06:52:14 PM
Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 04 November, 2014, 06:27:34 PM
I thought Peter Capaldi needed more work and didn't think he put enough preparation into performance in his episode
I'm fairly sure he's in all of them.
I left out the word
Performance.....as in......
I thought Peter Capaldi's performance needed more work.It did seem like he wasn't sure of what he was doing and I hope he works it out very soon.
I had bigger expectations for this one.
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 04 November, 2014, 07:46:30 PM
Quote from: sauchie tower on 04 November, 2014, 06:52:14 PM
Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 04 November, 2014, 06:27:34 PM
I thought Peter Capaldi needed more work and didn't think he put enough preparation into performance in his episode
I'm fairly sure he's in all of them.
But what's that got to do with S***e?
I just assumed this thread was about the new doctor. Would that be
Season-Eight?I'm not sure.....now!
Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 04 November, 2014, 07:49:05 PM
Quote from: sauchie tower on 04 November, 2014, 06:52:14 PM
Quote from: ThryllSeekyr on 04 November, 2014, 06:27:34 PM
I thought Peter Capaldi needed more work and didn't think he put enough preparation into performance in his episode
I'm fairly sure he's in all of them.
I left out the word Performance ...
No you didn't. I've highlighted it in bold and 14pt type (above).
The absolute worst thing about this new Who is having to put up with the end of Drippy Scum Prancing before it starts.
Did that...really happen?
I found that a tad frustrating after a generally solid series.
Not sure about that episode. There were some truly awful moments and the Cybermen were shit once again. The emo Cyberman was a bad idea when they did it in Torchwood and it was a bad idea here - I thought that scene in the graveyard would never end.
Having said that the bits with the Doctor and Missy were really good and the scene with Missy killing the scientist was about as scary as Who gets.
Due to a telly box problem I ended up missing an episode. Much to my surprise, nah HORROR, I found as timed drifted I really couldn't be bothered catching up... was Who dead to me?
Well we watched tonight, well I half watched as my wife watched and have to be honest what I saw did nothing to change my mind... my wife however loved it ... so do I need to catch up... well my guess is I'll end up watching the X-Mas special, but that trailer... well oits not fair to judge by the X-mas special is it...
That was terrible.
You can see what they were trying to do with the threads and themes through the series but it just didn't work. And it didn't work for me because I don't care about these people, I don't believe them.
Also, the total bunkum factor was through the roof, even for Who.[spoiler] People who died in 1756 getting rained on and then suddenly having a body again and constructing the metal and electronics from soil?[/spoiler] Good grief. [spoiler]Glad Danny Pink exploded, hope he doesn't come back.[/spoiler]
Yes, I liked some of the themes in this one (loved the [spoiler]lying to each other "break up")[/spoiler], but not exactly the execution - when the resolution is "yes I am an idiot in a box", I can only say, well.... yes - the idea of the Doctor as an officer leading others to their deaths while safely away from the trenches was a bit of a false premise in the first place (at least how it was presented). Now if when the Doctor had [spoiler]given Danny the bracelet Danny had said "there you f**ing go again, expecting me to sacrifice myself to sort out your problems - no go, matey"[/spoiler]....
Yeah bit of a damp finale given the strong start of the series -
[spoiler]CONS:
Annoyed they killed off one of the only MoffWoman who doesn't flirt.
Agreed Minky the internal logic of it was rushed and rubbish - "HERE'S A SUDDEN MASSIVE GLOBAL THREAT" "NO WAIT IT'S OVER NOW"
Also agreed on the overarching heavy-handed 'soldier' thread - the pay-off wasn't worth it.
"SQUEEEE" - Addison was totally wasted here - not to mention Sanjeev he just seemed like he was a fan who'd won a competition 'appear as a speaking role in Who'. Or the casting directors have made a bet they can get every working British TV comedian on it at some point. In which case roll on Stewart Lee's cameo -
"...wow, that Davros has really let himself go."
PROS:
CyberBrig. Super cheesy but I kinda liked it.
The heartbreaking mutual lying ending was well done.
Introducing Nick Frost as Santa Claus :D Utterly fantastic[/spoiler]
(http://cdn.bleedingcool.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/d10-600x334.png?9098e0)
Some lovely moments in this - and a lot of sentimental pap. I don't think the Cap was quite as good in this one, maybe because the script was a bit naff.
.
I'm getting tired of this "save the universe" schtick being rolled out for every series finale. The universe is a big and ancient place and, if the relative ease with which it can be erased, deformed or overrun by any relatively bright loon with a crackpot scheme and a pile of magi-science, far too fragile for its own good. What's wrong with just having to save a little bit of the universe? A single solar system, planet, landmass, island, city, town, village or even just one person? I think there would have been more power in a story about just rescuing Mr Pink from his enslavement to the Cybermen than saving the universe from an army of cybermen. The struggle became too abstract for me to care.
.
The best bit of this episode for me was Clara's exchange with the cybermen right at the beginning - because it made me think "you're who?" and then laugh. Unfortunately, it was all downhill from there and, at the very bottom of that hill, in a pit created by its own massive pathos field, That Cyberman who used to be Someone the Doctor Knew. Yeurgh - pass the sick-bags, please.
.
Quite a frustrating finish to an otherwise very enjoyable series, I thought.
Yeah, it could have been much better.
I just about bought the whole [spoiler]'cyber-rain causes dead bodies to become cybermen' as it could be a form of nano technology (although I'd like to know where the got all that extra metal from) but Mr Pink blowing up the dark cloud all by himself...?
And if he blew up, what world did he communicate from at the end? I guess the explosion could have been an energy pulse rather than a conventional explosion and he shifted afterwards. But then how did he get the boy? Use the ring or the masters tardis to go back along timeline and prevent the boy getting killed?[/spoiler]
Overall I liked it but it should have been better
This programme seriously needs to put a moratorium on 'the power of love saves the day' stories. Forever. (And yet... I found the [spoiler]Cyber-Brig[/spoiler] bit oddly touching.) That felt much more like a Smith-era story than the rest of the series - not a recommendation. I am glad [spoiler]Danny stayed dead though - not because I don't like him (quite the opposite), but because I was worried we were in for a Rory-style cheap resurrection.[/spoiler] There were bits I liked - irrespective of logical issues, the image of the Cybermen doing a 'Night of the Living Dead' was enjoyable, but overall the episode was a mess.
A good series though, albeit book-ended by two of its poorest episodes.
Herm....I think I might need to watch that again before I pass judgement.
But that christmas trailer though! [spoiler]Krynoids? :D[/spoiler]
I really didn't understand the ghostly appearance and the boy coming back from the dead.
Also, I think Chris Addison was awful and far too OTT so I'm glad he won't be coming back!
I agree with Shark that the smaller scale stories are far better. The world wide threats are normally pretty laughable in Who. It's much easier to make the audience care about a small group of characters.
Maybe I wasn't paying attention but that whole [spoiler]'bracelet can send one person back thing' seemed to come out of nowhere.
Also, the guards on the plane... where the fuck did UNIT find those dozy twonks?
It wouldn't have killed to have at least mentioned a fighter escort for a plane escorting the President of Earth, even if you didn't have the budget to show them getting taken out by the Cybermen[/spoiler]
The only redeeming feature of this entire season has been nick frost dressed as father christmas for 3 seconds.
The rest is forgettable shite.
Killing UNIT scientist woman was irritating to say the least. She'd have made a good companion.
santa will make it all better ,danny and clara will be reunited in a mofftacular timey wimey moment the masteress will be resurrected by the bracelet as she was with mrs masters ring .
asides from that it grated that moff spent ages getting matt smith to step back into the shadows then have an rtd style world alien threat and the doc as president .ARGGH!
I'm not even a Doctor Who fan but have casually watched all the Doctors recently
Peter Capaldi just isn't doing it for me on any level
As for the season finale it was more widow twanky than time lord
Cheesy doesn't even cover it
Awful
Weird, Peter Capaldi's been pretty much consistently great for me, and Jenna Coleman's seemed to have more to work with compared to the previous series.
Quote from: Beeks on 09 November, 2014, 11:58:59 AM
Peter Capaldi just isn't doing it for me on any level
I agree that last episode was drivel, but profoundly disagree about Capaldi. He's ridiculously wonderful, and it's not his fault the material is largely beneath him.
Could have been worse.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-5Ypy933Y3Gk/VFpcm7ef6hI/AAAAAAAAHVg/aCr1CY1Fn_c/s1600/NS2014DrWhoCover.jpg)
Fez Ed rather than Red Ed.
Quote from: Jimmy Baker's Assistant on 09 November, 2014, 12:33:34 PM
Quote from: Beeks on 09 November, 2014, 11:58:59 AM
Peter Capaldi just isn't doing it for me on any level
I agree that last episode was drivel, but profoundly disagree about Capaldi. He's ridiculously wonderful, and it's not his fault the material is largely beneath him.
I think that's the nail on the head..the episodes I have caught this season have been terrible..even if reality is suspended
The forest taking over the planet one was ludicrous..As an outsider I've always found Doctor Who enjoyable as an occasional watch..always liked the varied subject matter and scope in the storylines
But either they have a new script/plot team on board or they are running out of ideas
Don't get me wrong..I love Capaldi as an actor..I just think he's been dealt a busted hand
I've watched some of the comments over the past few weeks on this thread and I am reassured in my decision to stop watching the show after the second episode. Running out of ideas and scripts that are beneath Capaldi are what I felt way back then. Well, I actually thought they were running out of ideas last series which I felt was appallingly bad.
Quote from: pictsy on 09 November, 2014, 01:22:09 PM
I've watched some of the comments over the past few weeks on this thread and I am reassured in my decision to stop watching the show after the second episode. Running out of ideas and scripts that are beneath Capaldi are what I felt way back then. Well, I actually thought they were running out of ideas last series which I felt was appallingly bad.
you've missed out on some of the best nu who eps and by far the best nu doctor.
Capaldi is great as narky-Doctor but the whole series has been terrible script wise. The writing isn't in keeping with the budget, thus often making it look terrible but mainly the plotting hasn't been tight enough. The finale replaced constructed intelligent story-telling with emotional exploitation upon emotional exploitation. So many things just didn't make sense but 'who cares' as long as Clara hugs Danny, the missy cries to the doctor, then the cyber-dad getting his salute.... 20 minutes of tear-welling stuff with very little of the previous 30 minutes necessary to get there.
Thank Christ 2000ad has WAY better writers.
I didn't feel that way about a lot of the stories this series. Mummy on the Orient Express and Flatlines where superb.
Quote from: Bad City Blue on 09 November, 2014, 01:27:21 PM
Quote from: pictsy on 09 November, 2014, 01:22:09 PM
I've watched some of the comments over the past few weeks on this thread and I am reassured in my decision to stop watching the show after the second episode. Running out of ideas and scripts that are beneath Capaldi are what I felt way back then. Well, I actually thought they were running out of ideas last series which I felt was appallingly bad.
you've missed out on some of the best nu who eps and by far the best nu doctor.
I have heard similar sentiments about the previous series or the 50th anniversary. For this girl, the series has been on a decline since the end of Matt Smith's first series as the Doctor. 50th anniversary was almost the straw that broke the camels back but I wanted to give Capaldi a chance. I have no complaints about Capaldi as Who but those first two episodes were so poor I gave up. I might return to Who when Moffat leaves as head writer.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 09 November, 2014, 01:40:26 PM
I didn't feel that way about a lot of the stories this series. Mummy on the Orient Express and Flatlines where superb.
Mummies is the only one I haven't seen, flat liners had a good idea but, villains aside, terrible sfx, and a bobbins resolution. The 'swinging out the window' bit was worse than daytime TV cheap. I enjoyed 'listen' and 'Space Heist' was silly fun but way too many were unbalanced - kill the Moon could have been great but for the Gert big dragon and the 'call the earth (again)' stupidity. It's like it needed someone to say 'okay, this is the space horror epsoide, what the hell is Puff doing at the end of it?' Too much of it just isn't up to par. Sadly as Capaldi is great as the doctor.
Quote from: BPP on 09 November, 2014, 02:20:39 PM
Mummies is the only one I haven't seen
It's ace, and still on iPlayer, hurry, hurry!
Quote from: IAMTHESYSTEM on 09 November, 2014, 12:56:37 PM
Fez Ed rather than Red Ed.
Does
this count as a monkey in a hat?
Well that was a pretty appalling end to the series, I think overall I enjoyed three episodes (Listen, Mummy and Flatline) and hated the moon egg and forest stories and the rest was just meh. Capaldi was great throughout though.
I think they need to concentrate on creating some fresh adversaries for the doc, the Cybermen, Master and Daleks have been flogged into a greasy horse shaped smear by now, I wouldn't care if we didn't see them again for a good while. I agree that we need some smaller scale stories, more episodes like Blink would be very welcome.
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 09 November, 2014, 11:17:45 AM
Killing UNIT scientist woman was irritating to say the least. She'd have made a good companion.
I have a theory about that.
Yeah, I'm not sure how many times you can set the sky on fire without it starting to lose significance, and doing it twice within a few weeks...
I feel the same way about the city destruction in Transformers/Marvel/DC/Destructo porn - it becomes a bit numbing.
Mostly bobbins but with a couple of good individual scenes.
I really don't know what they were going for. Everything that appeared to have significance or was built up to be dramatic was tossed away a few seconds later. As a result, it had so much plot there was almost no plot.
Pixie dust and hugs.
(This is me paraphrasing a fourteen and a twelve year old).
All your arguements are invalid: http://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2014/nov/10/peter-capaldi-doctor-who-video-autistic-boy
The "Don't cremate me" controversy has been as bewildering as it is intruiging. The line did 't strike a chord with me despite having been present at two cremations for close friends last year, but had they been closer i'm sure it would have unsettled me. Even more so if it had been a family member.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 10 November, 2014, 09:21:11 AM
The "Don't cremate me" controversy has been as bewildering as it is intruiging. The line did 't strike a chord with me despite having been present at two cremations for close friends last year, but had they been closer i'm sure it would have unsettled me. Even more so if it had been a family member.
If people are determined to be offended, they'll find something.
Quote from: M.I.K. on 09 November, 2014, 07:12:44 PM
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 09 November, 2014, 11:17:45 AM
Killing UNIT scientist woman was irritating to say the least. She'd have made a good companion.
I have a theory about that.
Let's hear it then, 'cos that bit thoroughly annoyed me. She did so well against the Zygons that bumping her off so casually was almost as bad as Judge Giant/Orlok.
She was a good character and her death was a great character action from Missy, underlining her personality with the audience. The poor scientist should remain dead to deepen the effects of Missy's actions and provide a future foundation for more Missy stories.
.
Sometimes, a good character should remain dead to deepen the lives of others.
QuoteSometimes, a good character should remain dead to deepen the lives of others.
I agree (see: [spoiler]Wash[/spoiler] in the Serenity/Firefly universe), but what I didn't like here was how the character's very nature was bent out of shape in order to facilitate that death. Osgood would never have put herself in that position in the first place. It's also another example of fridging a woman, which is becoming a tiresome and unnecessary trope to showcase someone's evil nature and/or make the 'heroic' protagonist redouble their efforts.
Moffat's argument was: "One thing I was very determined about was that the Master/Missy would have to kill somebody we liked in the most cruel, heartless and terrible way to absolutely say that this person is shockingly evil."
Which is just garbage. It was already perfectly clear how callous and nasty The Master/Missy was; all his script shows is a casual disregard for characters that have a modicum of depth—one of his big weaknesses in a show increasingly full of cyphers. (And I say this as someone who broadly enjoyed this series.)
Well that was...disappointing. Capaldi is a great Doctor and I'd travelled in hope that the whole 'am I a good man?' would come to something more solid that that souffle of sound bites.
The one interesting bit of the trailer turned out to be red herring and the Cybermen mere walk-ons. sigh
The Missy/Master thing was fumbled too, a great turn ruined with by the numbers TV tropes. Wouldn't it have been better if a male Master had that script including the kiss? The Nu-Who lurve/hugs/tears conquers all tosh was really the final insult, and you know what would be nice? Actors, you know real actors not knowing 'oh look at us' comedians smirking as they remind us its all just fun will The Doctor kills people with a (space) handgun?
Yes, I think I can broadly agree with that. The end was justified but the means were flawed.
.
Another, somewhat oblique, point is that keeping her (and those like her) dead increases the impact of a story that requires a character to be "brought back - Marvel style". After all, if death is so easy to cheat it loses its potency and weakens the series' opportunities for dramatic peril.
.
I'm not big on Whoology so the only other significant "true death" of a good character I can remember was Adric, although I'm sure there must be more. The point is that "true" death has become the exception rather than the rule. Now, when I see any of the Doctor's allies killed there's no shock or sadness because I know that somebody's technosorcery will bring them back soon. Probably too soon. (Although I do think that now would be a good time to bring back Captain Jack for an episode or two because his cheesy efforvescence might make for an interesting counterpoint to the Cap's miserable, almost grudging optimism.) Bringing back too many characters also cheapens the Doctor's regeneration process - one of the chief things that sets him apart from everyone else.
.
If a character gives its life to save the day and then somehow continues to exist, as a disembodied voice for example, then that character's sacrifice is diminished significantly. The only relevant contribution from a dead hero are the boots that need filling and the most poignant reply from a dead hero is utter, infinite silence.
.
That said, I think there's a good episode to be written around The Last Cyberman (he exists now, despite his piffle-based origins and might as well be used to tell a story exploring mortality or medicine or something) - and I would have saved the salute for that episode. But Hell, what do I know, right? We'd all do it differently.
I thought that scientist character was awful so I was quite pleased they bumped her off.
What annoys me is the human races total acceptance of and reliance on The Doctor as a saviour. We could do with a Lex Luthor style character who begrudges the Doctor's meddling (maybe this is what they were going for with Danny Pink?) and refuses to accept that he is greater than humanity.
Quote from: JamesC on 10 November, 2014, 12:24:46 PM
I thought that scientist character was awful so I was quite pleased they bumped her off.
What annoys me is the human races total acceptance of and reliance on The Doctor as a saviour. We could do with a Lex Luthor style character who begrudges the Doctor's meddling (maybe this is what they were going for with Danny Pink?) and refuses to accept that he is greater than humanity.
The Torchwood institute was originally set up to be something like that, but they then scuppered it all with the cyberman invasion and then decided to make the spin-off into something quite different.
I've enjoyed this series a lot more than most of the others. Of course there are gaping plot holes and things that don't make sense, but that has always been the case so I just suspend disbelief and enjoy it for what it is. The finale was a bit disappointing - why is it so hard to write a decent cyberman story?
I liked [spoiler]cyber-brig and Michelle Gomez as Missy, and I don't mind science-girl getting vaped, as she was quite annoying[/spoiler].
I don't know what to make of that episode to be honest, it's a right mess. The resolution to the Cybermen epidemic is very poor. So much built up about the mysterious nature of Missy throughout the season and such a poor end. As a character, I thought Michelle Gomez's potrayal of Missy was one of the highlights of the series and indeed, the two part conclusion. Her performance was cackling with dark humour, malevolence and unpredictability. For me, her incarnation of the Master is the best one yet. And Peter Capaldi has also been a delight. The doubt I had about him as a Doctor, and whether he could pull it off, soon evaporated. In fact, I think he's the best one since Tennant (not a surprise to be honest! And I still do love Smith).
My favourite episodes from the series are Listen, Into the Dalek, Mummy on the Orient and Flatline. I wish we can explore the interdimensional world of the Boneless in future episodes.
Looking forward to the Christmas Special, Father Christmas an' all! :D
Yes, for all my gripes and "suggestions" I have enjoyed this series a lot. A lot of the saccharine seems to have been flushed away by Capaldi - but by no means all. (I think saccharine is like pus and it all came to a head in the finale. A head that should have been squeezed harder. Get that squirt going instead of a bloody dribble.)
.
Capaldi is my favourite Doctor since, um, John Hurt who was, to be fair, my favourite since Christopher Eccleston, who was my favourite since Tom Baker... er, and so on. I'm going to keep watching, of course I am, because there's always Something in it worth enjoying - and from now on, I think the Cap's interpretation of the character is going to be it.
.
Give me more!
Well broadly speaking I've enjoyed the series but my enjoyment is always tainted by the knowledge that the potential for this show far outweighs the reality.
I agree entirely. Often the enjoyment I get from Who comes in imagining how I would have made this episode. When the answer is "just like it is, I wouldn't change a thing (Blink, Midnight)" then my enjoyment is doubled at the least.
.
Imagining the Cap in an episode like "Midnight" gives me the chillies.
Quote from: shaolin_monkey on 10 November, 2014, 10:10:22 AM
Quote from: M.I.K. on 09 November, 2014, 07:12:44 PM
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 09 November, 2014, 11:17:45 AM
Killing UNIT scientist woman was irritating to say the least. She'd have made a good companion.
I have a theory about that.
Let's hear it then, 'cos that bit thoroughly annoyed me. She did so well against the Zygons that bumping her off so casually was almost as bad as Judge Giant/Orlok.
Well, this might be a load of guff, but...
[spoiler]MissyMaster is a compulsive liar, she acknowledges that scientisty woman is more important to her alive than dead, we've already seen people in a previous episode apparently being disintegrated when they're actually being teleported, (we know Missy has also been keeping an eye on The Doctor of late), and when it looks like The Doctor is going to kill Missy, it's her disintegratey device that's used. If she was as good at planning stuff out as she appeared to be, then she would have already guessed that would be a possible eventuality. The fact CyberBrig kills her instead with a well-aimed laserbeam might suggest that he wasn't merely 'saving The Doctor's soul', but was actually killing her before she got the chance to teleport away to her secret base full of useful scientists and soldier types with guns in hypnotic trances which make them look right dozy and ineffective when they just stand about looking thick when evil psycho timeladies are escaping.[/spoiler]
Or something.
Or maybe it was her Zygon double. Can't say it bothered me at all (I very seldom like 'fannish' characters), but apparently that particular death has caused a tumblr meltdown.
Personally, I think the show's not bloodthirsty enough any more. When he was bringing it back in 20005, RTD said something like "If you've gone more than 15 mins of Who without killing someone off, you've made a mistake." It's no longer "Just this once everybody lives!" - instead, it's often "Yet again, everyone's fine." I'm betting part of the reason so many of us loved 'Mummy on the Orient Express' was because it felt like proper Who - nasty and with a bit of a body count. But of course, my Doctor Who era is that of Peter Davison, whose stories were frequently nihilistic and featured the Doctor failing to save people.
Again, it's not that someone got killed off—it's the manner in which it happened. Osgood wouldn't have been dumb enough to have been caught out quite like that, and the guards were, what, from the simpleton brigade? And it also had that whiff of fridging that I'm noticing more and more in mainstream media. (Maybe had there have at least been a modicum of a struggle and less idiocy, it would have worked. I've no idea if it was a moment of iffy writing or dreadful direction.)
As for the theory, [spoiler]someone mentioned somewhere else that there were red and blue settings on the device Missy had, respectively for death and teleportation, but that Osgood was hit with red and is therefore dead[/spoiler]. No idea if that's the case or not.
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 10 November, 2014, 05:49:55 PM
Again, it's not that someone got killed off—it's the manner in which it happened. Osgood wouldn't have been dumb enough to have been caught out quite like that, and the guards were, what, from the simpleton brigade? And it also had that whiff of fridging that I'm noticing more and more in mainstream media. (Maybe had there have at least been a modicum of a struggle and less idiocy, it would have worked. I've no idea if it was a moment of iffy writing or dreadful direction.)
As for the theory, [spoiler]someone mentioned somewhere else that there were red and blue settings on the device Missy had, respectively for death and teleportation, but that Osgood was hit with red and is therefore dead[/spoiler]. No idea if that's the case or not.
Hadn't seen that theory, but upon googling, it seems to be based on [spoiler]the beam Missy being hit with being blue instead of red. Thing is, she wasn't hit by a beam from the device, she was hit by a cyberman lasergun. [/spoiler]
I'm guessing Missy had hypnotic powers, as did her previous male incarnations, which would explain the guards and Osgood's poor judgement.
.
If not hypnotic powers then at least some sciencey whiencey, magicy wagicy doohickey thing hidden in her lipstick - which may be the insane counterpart to the Doctor's screwdriver.
These would be the hypnotic powers that the Doctor (and presumably Osgood) would presumably be aware of?
Yes, leading to an arrogant overconfidence.
Previous episode... Doctor has [spoiler]patches that induce a dream state and "makes you very suggestible"[/spoiler].
I thought that was good finale, very dark as well,[spoiler] with both lied to each other at end, very cold farewell. [/spoiler]
Quote from: The Legendary Shark on 10 November, 2014, 06:59:29 PM
If not hypnotic powers then at least some sciencey whiencey, magicy wagicy doohickey thing hidden in her lipstick - which may be the insane counterpart to the Doctor's screwdriver.
The Freudian psychologists would have a field day with that.
Well I DID enjoy it, the episode that is. But I have many of the quelms other people share regarding how willfuly they dispose of characters for the hell of it, thus losing any of the shock factor.
But I did enjoy the Cybermen once again but they felt underutilised. I adored the original The Invasion (cute cameo from one of their helmets from that story) but this wasn't a sctratch on that story.
So, I'm guessing that this is a third strain of cybermen? Mondas orignal, other dimension and now Master-model? More reboots than Batman.
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 10 November, 2014, 09:25:50 AM
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 10 November, 2014, 09:21:11 AM
The "Don't cremate me" controversy has been as bewildering as it is intruiging. The line did 't strike a chord with me despite having been present at two cremations for close friends last year, but had they been closer i'm sure it would have unsettled me. Even more so if it had been a family member.
If people are determined to be offended, they'll find something.
Exactly! We had both of my parents cremated and that line didn't offend me at all. It's just a story...
Watched the final episode last night.
Thought it was a pile of overlong wank to be honest.
I have been disappointed with this season in general and have only enjoyed one or two episodes at best.
Haven't been this disappointed with Doctor Who since 'Dragonfire' with Sylvester McCoy.
Dragonfire wasn't that bad - it had a melty face in it.
It also got rid of Bonnie Langford's ginger Bush and introduced Ace, so it clearly is far from the worst thing to happen to Who.
Quote from: Allah Akbark on 23 November, 2014, 04:48:44 PM
It also got rid of Bonnie Langford's ginger Bush and introduced Ace, so it clearly is far from the worst thing to happen to Who.
That presupposes that Ace is in any way less of a fucking annoyance than Bonnie Langford.
Cheers
Jim
I'm not sure I'm grasping this concept you've invented that Langford is not just the absolute worst.
Mel has at least been given a second chance thanks to Big Finish and a she's actualy a very competant companion in them.
I liked Ace because she was so underdeveloped she was essentially just a thug.
I recall reading how her character was expanded upon in spin-off media and it read like something a 13 year old boy would come up with if his teachers had expressly forbid him to do anything interesting or original, so I much prefer the explanation for her disappearance between Survival and the 1996 telemovie as being something simple, like she head-butted something explosive and then the Doctor was sad for five minutes and then got on with his day.
Quote from: Allah Akbark on 23 November, 2014, 04:48:44 PM
It also got rid of Bonnie Langford's ginger Bush and introduced Ace, so it clearly is far from the worst thing to happen to Who.
Did not say it was the worst thing to happen to Who, just the last time I was as disappointed.
I've half a mind to ban everyone on this thread as a lesson that you don't diss the Aldred...
Do it Mike!
McCoy and Aldred were the Who of my childhood. I totally adored Ace and she was definitely the reason I watched Who at that young age. McCoy was pretty cool as well.
Quote from: pictsy on 24 November, 2014, 01:42:53 PM
McCoy and Aldred were the Who of my childhood. I totally adored Ace and she was definitely the reason I watched Who at that young age. McCoy was pretty cool as well.
You. You can stay.
Quote from: pictsy on 24 November, 2014, 01:42:53 PM
McCoy and Aldred were the Who of my childhood. I totally adored Ace and she was definitely the reason I watched Who at that young age. McCoy was pretty cool as well.
Nail on head. I lived off replaying my vhs if Rememberance of the Daleks till it broke as a kid.
Heh. It took me years to realise the canon references though. Yetis in the underground and Nessie.
Quote from: pictsy on 24 November, 2014, 01:42:53 PM
McCoy and Aldred were the Who of my childhood. I totally adored Ace and she was definitely the reason I watched Who at that young age. McCoy was pretty cool as well.
Nice way to make a person feel old...
Who of my childhood was Pertwee and Manning.
I was a Baker boy :lol:
I was a Baker boy also, but Sophie Aldred was sexy as all hell. What is it about women and baseball bats?
Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 25 November, 2014, 07:01:53 AM
Quote from: pictsy on 24 November, 2014, 01:42:53 PM
McCoy and Aldred were the Who of my childhood. I totally adored Ace and she was definitely the reason I watched Who at that young age. McCoy was pretty cool as well.
Nice way to make a person feel old...
Who of my childhood was Pertwee and Manning.
The culturally open-minded Bernard Manning meeting aliens every week is a show I *would* watch.
Quote from: Fungus on 25 November, 2014, 09:58:43 AM
The culturally open-minded Bernard Manning meeting aliens every week is a show I *would* watch.
"A Sontaran, a Silurian and Ice Warrior walk into a bar..."
Cheers
Jim
Quote from: Fungus on 25 November, 2014, 09:58:43 AM
Quote from: Mattofthespurs on 25 November, 2014, 07:01:53 AM
Quote from: pictsy on 24 November, 2014, 01:42:53 PM
McCoy and Aldred were the Who of my childhood. I totally adored Ace and she was definitely the reason I watched Who at that young age. McCoy was pretty cool as well.
Nice way to make a person feel old...
Who of my childhood was Pertwee and Manning.
The culturally open-minded Bernard Manning meeting aliens every week is a show I *would* watch.
I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought that...
Well I actually thorougly enjoyed that episode
Nick Frost was a lot of fun :D
Yup, rather enjoyed that Christmas special - I loved how they referenced the films it was riffing and they even managed to answer the great question of how santa fits all the presents in the sleigh - [spoiler]it's bigger on the inside![/spoiler]:lol:
Naw. For the casual Whofan it was a bit of a lark - Frost was good fun.
For those in the know it was just pure MoffatTrolling.
OH YOU THOUGHT IT WAS GOING ONE WAY DID YOU?!
WELL I'LL SPOONFEED YOU THAT FOR HOURS THEN PULL THE RUG FROM YOU AREN'T I CLEVER??
NO?
WELL I THINK I AM AND ISN'T THAT THE POINT AFTER ALL.
Thought it was great, started poorly (until Clara is told to go get the specimen) but then it bashed along beautifully with a mix of sentimentality and action that was pretty top notch and reinforced the great sarky doctor persona. Perhaps the best Capaldi epsoide yet.
I didn't enjoy that at all. I found it too long and very dull, not even Frosty saved it. Disappointed.
Best Christmas special yet :)
Really enjoyed that one. Yup.
I am going to get more than three seasons of Capaldi, aren't I? Better do!
It was entertaining, but no more than that.
The Alien reference was funny, although the main steal was from Inception, with another scene lifted from The Time Traveller's Wife for old time's sake (Moffat's been to that particular well several times before).
On the plus side, Capaldi is such a great Doctor. I think it's intensely unlikely he'll stay beyond three seasons, so lets enjoy him whilst we have him.
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 25 December, 2014, 11:50:17 PM
Naw. For the casual Whofan it was a bit of a lark - Frost was good fun.
If everything you wrote after that sentence was humorous, then I apologise in advance, but if not then you need to put down the egg nog and step away from the Christmas copy of the Radio Times, because... just wow.
It's OK not to enjoy the show, it's OK to be critical of Moffat and I'm not suggesting otherwise. As a one-time Moffat apologist turned critic myself, I've found great swathes of every series of New Who to be
horribly disappointing, revelling in things that I consider to be weaknesses.
But you need to ask yourself if you're projecting, much? Moffat is secretly encoding Who episodes to piss of 'true' fans? Wow. If you enjoyed the episode then you're only a 'casual' fan, because the initiated know what Moffat is
really up to? Wow. You're taking your dislike of Moffat's writing and imagining that he's
doing it to piss you off?Wow.
Jim
It wasn't eggnog that made me that way Jim - just heavy amounts of festive cider. That caused me to type erratically and erroneously.
I just meant at a casual glance it does function tolerably but for anyone who's already fairly sick of it (like some o' those above and the folk I was watching it with) it's just another load of thievery and anticlimaxes. Inception/Time Traveller's Wife/Previous episodes of Doctor Who like Amy's Choice - mixed together and leading ultimately to nothing.
I'm not even sure I'd call myself a Whofan really - especially not a diehard one. It's certainly not my place to call anyone NOT a fan who enjoys it. You must forgive my bladdered typery as it was not there to offend anyone - it was just a meaningless bitter howl of further disappointment. At this point complaining about the quality of Who is like screaming at the rain for being wet. Utterly futile.
Frankly this might be it for me and Who - what's the point of watching something that only brings you misery?
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 26 December, 2014, 12:56:25 PM
Frankly this might be it for me and Who - what's the point of watching something that only brings you misery?
'Cos if everyone stops watching, it'll be axed again, and we'll have to wait decades for another reboot! ;) I'm sticking with it, through thick and thin.
I really enjoyed that episode. I didn't think too hard about it and just went with it. Fun!
Moff will have to stand down sooner rather than later. His tenure has surely run it's course and the constant critical reactions thrown his way must surely count for something...
Anyway, I enjoyed the first 3rd of the episode but then it was typical Moff Christmas fair after that. A little guff TBH.
This is the sort of show I should really love, but don't. For the past couple of years I've watched the christmas special to see if it's worth watching again. This wasn't the episode to pull me back in.
I like cheesy special effects and dopey rubber headed aliens. I like quirky characters and down to Earth people chucked together in weird sci-fi conceits. So why don't I like this show? Moffat take note, that is a proper mystery.
I quite enjoyed that, I had pretty low expectations after the last series and past Christmas specials but it was pretty entertaining.
My biggest gripe with it is that I won't be able to let my eight year old daughter see it, I'm sensing that we are on shaky ground with her belief in Santa as it is and I'd like to keep it going a little longer.
Quote from: Hawkmonger on 26 December, 2014, 01:31:15 PMthe constant critical reactions thrown his way must surely count for something...
Producer, criticism, a duck's back, and water. :D
If the BBC (and others) keep buying, he'll keep selling. It seems there's enough folk giving positive reviews, and enough money being made, that they can keep churning out shows from the same mould. I mean, look at 'the hangover' films....it's just the same film, repeated again and again, with the same jokes, but if that's what folk will pay to see, then you can bet your ass they'll happily keep making it.
Haven't seen the special....doubt I'll bother either, not overly keen on the sound of it.
Thought it was great fun.
Amazed at how negative, aggressive and cynical some of the carpers on this website are. Just fuck off.
Quote from: Richard on 26 December, 2014, 11:32:37 PM
Amazed at how negative, aggressive and cynical some of the carpers on this website are. Just fuck off.
How shall we fuck off o lord?
Like thus.
(https://i.imgur.com/KBNcZh.jpg)
Quote from: Richard on 26 December, 2014, 11:32:37 PM
Amazed at how negative, aggressive and cynical some of the carpers on this website are. Just fuck off.
Well now, I tryed to be positive about it, but it just didn't engage me. Do you know what I find really off-putting about this show? The way the fans try to make out like I have some sorta personality disorder just because I don't like it.
I fuckin'
tryedBUT, you know what else is off-putting? The way the detractors try to make out that people who enjoy it also have some sorta personality disorder.
I just don't get how a mediocre BBC show elicits such extreme reactions.
Quote from: Rog69 on 26 December, 2014, 10:38:36 PM.My biggest gripe with it is that I won't be able to let my eight year old daughter see it, I'm sensing that we are on shaky ground with her belief in Santa as it is and I'd like to keep it going a little longer.
If anything, the show affirmed Santa's existence, especially with that final shot.
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 27 December, 2014, 04:53:29 PM
If anything, the show affirmed Santa's existence, especially with that final shot.
Yup - for all that many of us (myself wholly included) may moan about Moffat, he's far too savvy a chap to produce a Xmas special aimed largely at a younger audience that goes out of its way to suggest Santa isn't real.
For my money, given the dire quality of recent Xmas specials, all I hoped was this one wouldn't be annoying or offensively bad - and it wasn't. It was actually quite entertaining. That'll do me. Was I the only one literally punching the air and cheering when it became clear [spoiler]Clara was sticking around? I was sure she was going: holding onto her for another series (I assume) is a massive bonus given how superb she's been with Capaldi. Best companion since...oooh... Tegan.[/spoiler]
Quote from: Greg M. on 27 December, 2014, 08:40:19 PM
Was I the only one literally punching the air and cheering when it became clear [spoiler]Clara was sticking around? I was sure she was going: holding onto her for another series (I assume) is a massive bonus given how superb she's been with Capaldi. Best companion since...oooh... Tegan.[/spoiler]
Not quite punching the air, but quite happy nevertheless.
[spoiler]Clara has been great this year[/spoiler], as has Capaldi.
I have bizarrely warmed to Clara. It must be the Capaldi effect - they seem to have more of a 'thing' than she and Matt Smith. Previously I couldn't wait to get rid of the pointy nosed freak, but now I find her proboscal dimensions quite charming.
Quote from: shaolin_monkey on 30 December, 2014, 12:28:11 PM
Previously I couldn't wait to get rid of the pointy nosed freak
Ha!
She's one of the most beautiful actresses on TV right now- distinctive schnozz and all.
I never cared for the character
at all, right up until Smiths departure, but she's been a breath of fresh air this year. I fully intend re-watching all of her episodes with Smith at some stage, this time without the eye-rolling / internal tutting every time she appears on screen.
Quote from: Link Prime on 30 December, 2014, 12:34:00 PM
I never cared for the character at all, right up until Smiths departure, but she's been a breath of fresh air this year.
I think this seems to be a common viewpoint - it's certainly mine. I think in the Smith-era Clara was a puzzle for the Doctor to solve, rather than a character in her own right, and as such, there wasn't much for Coleman to work with. With that out of the way, she has a chance to shine as an actual person. I also think she has a far more interesting and complicated relationship with the 12th Doctor, and much more chemistry with Capaldi.
Short version: great actress given better material = success.
As for distinctive noses - surely Clara's predecessor had the lengthiest hooter in companion history!
I also found Clara a lot better with Capaldi than Smith - that said, i'm not convinced brnging her back is a great idea - I'm reminded of the neat ending between Rose and 10 being overwritten by her return and the "final" rather creepy and inferior duplicate ending we got - I loved the lying to each other scene and it will be hard to top that when her time eventually comes again....
To provide a counter-view, although initially she was interesting, and went on to greatness in the anniversary special, I haven't liked Clara at all this season and I would have preferred her to leave.
The character just seemed to perform random actions as necessitated by the plot, and didn't seem to be the same person from the "Impossible Girl" arc.
I do like Jenna Coleman though. The problem is the writing. I have no view on her nose. It's just a nose.
I liked the Christmas one.
It had Santa and face huggers and was entirely unsuitably scary for children, yet was watched by mine with my wife's blessing. That, folks, is what Doctor Who is all about.
Amen brother.
I loved it.
And I am glad Clara is staying.
I somehow missed it on Christmas and watched it on BBC iplayter today.
I liked that a lot.
I also like Clara's nose a lot.
Quote from: Greg M. on 30 December, 2014, 12:40:55 PMI think in the Smith-era Clara was a puzzle for the Doctor to solve, rather than a character in her own right, and as such, there wasn't much for Coleman to work with.
Mm. It's interesting that when she's just being a person, she actually has room to be something more than a puzzle piece to manoeuvre into position. In fact, she's finally turned into something very rare in Moffat Who: a well-written female character.
It's highly amusing to see the tabloid response to Clara's return, all banging on about last-minute U-turns. Right. This all looked planned from the get-go, and Coleman was just keeping tight-lipped about her plans. Still, good to see she and Capaldi will both be back for another run, because a couple of bumps aside, I enjoyed this series a lot.
Love the .gif!
I don't think that anyone who dislikes an episode, and says so, must have a personality disorder. But I do wonder about someone who assumes that the writer must have deliberately written a bad episode in bad faith to spite the audience for some unfathomable reason.
I've always found the Xmas specials to be overly sentimental "guest star special" disappointments, but I loved this one. It was properly creepy, but with plenty of Santa-silliness to liven it up.
Nick Frost was great, and even I'll admit that Clara is less annoying than she used to be, mainly due to her interplay with Capaldi over this season. . I think Capaldi's the best doctor for ages, he really captures that he's alien and not like us and actually rather dangerous.
If that means lower viewing figures amongst the kiddies, then fuck 'em; if it means less merch sold then so be it - but I'm not naive enough to think that if they thought they could reverse this trend with another twentyish shouty best-mate doctor, they'd go there in a flash.
And I really can't fathom all those people who clearly don't like the show. but continue to watch it just so they can point out how shit it is on the internet - just don't watch!
Quote from: Dandontdare on 31 December, 2014, 08:04:11 PM
I've always found the Xmas specials to be overly sentimental "guest star special" disappointments, but I loved this one. It was properly creepy, but with plenty of Santa-silliness to liven it up.
I was thinking about this the other day - how long have they been doing xmas specials for Doctor Who? I don't recall ever seeing any classic who Christmas themed episodes, or perhaps I am just forgetting?
I don't remember any - I think the first one in the reboot was the one just after David Tennant appeared.
Tennant's first episode was the first one.
I suppose there's sort-of one from the classic era: The Feast of Steven, one of the wiped episodes from The Daleks' Masterplan in the Hartnell era. But yes, the first modern one is the first Tennant one.
Quote from: Greg M. on 31 December, 2014, 08:56:27 PM
I suppose there's sort-of one from the classic era: The Feast of Steven, one of the wiped episodes from The Daleks' Masterplan in the Hartnell era. But yes, the first modern one is the first Tennant one.
Good call - the episode where Hartnell looked into the camera and wished the viewers a Happy Christmas!
Hartnell did it too?? I didn't realise that An Adventure In Space And Time was doing a tip of the hat with that one!
The Feast of Steven has to be one of the best puns the series has ever pulled as well. Took me years to realize. :lol:
Wow, I did not know about the Feast of Steven. A shame that it has been lost and after a bit of googling it doesn't sound like it has much chance of being found if it was never copied to film. :(
And here, for posterity - is the brilliant David Bradley recreating the Christmas bit :D
(http://24.media.tumblr.com/e3deb9076bb978b0f4f47baa97c958b2/tumblr_my7rj87UVM1ssuoa0o1_500.gif)
(http://www.comicsbulletin.com/main/sites/default/files/reviews/images/1112/doctorwho12f.jpeg)
Hnngh. Cross. Bar. 'I's.
Gah.
Jim
Yes, it's good the way that letterer has used all upper case.
They've spelt incidentally wrongly as well.
Quote from: M.I.K. on 01 January, 2015, 07:56:09 PM
They've spelt incidentally wrongly as well.
That's obviously deliberate just to piss people off
Quote from: King Pops on 01 January, 2015, 08:44:09 PM
Quote from: M.I.K. on 01 January, 2015, 07:56:09 PM
They've spelt incidentally wrongly as well.
That's obviously deliberate just to piss people off
Bloody Moffat.
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 01 January, 2015, 04:08:49 PM
And here, for posterity - is the brilliant David Bradley recreating the Christmas bit :D
(http://24.media.tumblr.com/e3deb9076bb978b0f4f47baa97c958b2/tumblr_my7rj87UVM1ssuoa0o1_500.gif)
I've only just realised - David Bradley plays the ageing vampire hunter in The Strain too! I knew I recognised him when I saw him swinging his silver cane about, but couldn't think where from.
Quote from: shaolin_monkey on 02 January, 2015, 01:01:12 PM
I've only just realised - David Bradley plays the ageing vampire hunter in The Strain too! I knew I recognised him when I saw him swinging his silver cane about, but couldn't think where from.
He's the splendidly despicable Walder Frey in Game of Thrones, too.
Cheers
Jim
David Bradly should be given the elixir of life so we can enjoy his unique blend of grumpy yet loveable old fart for all eternity. Him and Maggie Smith.
Quote from: Richmond Clements on 31 December, 2014, 08:58:42 PM
Quote from: Greg M. on 31 December, 2014, 08:56:27 PM
I suppose there's sort-of one from the classic era: The Feast of Steven, one of the wiped episodes from The Daleks' Masterplan in the Hartnell era. But yes, the first modern one is the first Tennant one.
Good call - the episode where Hartnell looked into the camera and wished the viewers a Happy Christmas!
What's most disorienting is that that soundbite was used at the start of the BBC's 'Merry Christmas' trailer this year - a snatch of dialogue from a 49 year old program that is also missing...
That episode was never telerecorded, which makes it officially the
most missingest missing episode.