The Political Thread

[The Enigmatic Dr X]

Again, no. What you are talking about there is punishment. The common law says that murder is wrong and that's it. The punishment for transgressing that law is decided seperately by societies and their judicial systems and beliefs. Though the punishments may change, thou shalt not kill remains constant.

Sorry, I am trying to steer away from this thread. But this is plain wrong.

There are two sources of law: common law and legislation.

Common law has nothing to do with being "common" in the sense that it is either ubiquitious or fixed. Rather, it is the generic term for that part of the legal system which is derived from custom and practice. It is not a constant. It is an evolving body of law based on precedent - that is, cases heard by court. A judicial opinion based on the circumstances before it applies principles established by previous cases. In some ways, it is an endless finessing of circumstances but it is often possible to create entirely new principles or overturn old decisions. The decision of a higher court (ie on appeal) can overturn the decision of a lower court.

It is not inviolate, it is not fixed.

Legislation can supercede common law. It imposes the will of the people (in theory) as determined by an elected legistlature, which (in theory) operates as a check and balance on the will of an unelected judiciary.

[Richmond Clements]

Again, no. What you are talking about there is punishment. The common law says that murder is wrong and that's it. The punishment for transgressing that law is decided seperately by societies and their judicial systems and beliefs. Though the punishments may change, thou shalt not kill remains constant.

Sorry, I am trying to steer away from this thread. But this is plain wrong.

There are two sources of law: common law and legislation.

Common law has nothing to do with being "common" in the sense that it is either ubiquitious or fixed. Rather, it is the generic term for that part of the legal system which is derived from custom and practice. It is not a constant. It is an evolving body of law based on precedent - that is, cases heard by court. A judicial opinion based on the circumstances before it applies principles established by previous cases. In some ways, it is an endless finessing of circumstances but it is often possible to create entirely new principles or overturn old decisions. The decision of a higher court (ie on appeal) can overturn the decision of a lower court.

It is not inviolate, it is not fixed.

Legislation can supercede common law. It imposes the will of the people (in theory) as determined by an elected legistlature, which (in theory) operates as a check and balance on the will of an unelected judiciary.

Pfft! What do you know!? You're just an actual solicitor!
A guy on the internet says different!

[Banners]

So let's consider other political subjects – like how I can't take Chuka Umunna seriously because his name always makes me think of the theme tune from Chuggington.

Chukington, Chuka, Chuka, Chuka, Chuka, Chukkington...! etc.

[The Enigmatic Dr X]

Again, no. What you are talking about there is punishment. The common law says that murder is wrong and that's it. The punishment for transgressing that law is decided seperately by societies and their judicial systems and beliefs. Though the punishments may change, thou shalt not kill remains constant.

Sorry, I am trying to steer away from this thread. But this is plain wrong.

There are two sources of law: common law and legislation.

Common law has nothing to do with being "common" in the sense that it is either ubiquitious or fixed. Rather, it is the generic term for that part of the legal system which is derived from custom and practice. It is not a constant. It is an evolving body of law based on precedent - that is, cases heard by court. A judicial opinion based on the circumstances before it applies principles established by previous cases. In some ways, it is an endless finessing of circumstances but it is often possible to create entirely new principles or overturn old decisions. The decision of a higher court (ie on appeal) can overturn the decision of a lower court.

It is not inviolate, it is not fixed.

Legislation can supercede common law. It imposes the will of the people (in theory) as determined by an elected legistlature, which (in theory) operates as a check and balance on the will of an unelected judiciary.

Pfft! What do you know!? You're just an actual solicitor!
A guy on the internet says different!

All you really need is wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_law

[Professor Bear]

The SNP are apparently not going to allow the repeal of the Human Rights Act, and will be coordinating a vote in tandem with the Tories' own backbenchers - but it turns out they might not need to bother, as some armchair lawyers on Twitter pointed out that the UK government repealing the HRA would invalidate the terms of the Good Friday Agreement that had been agreed to in a referendum, so some wet liberal law types have taken the ball and ran with it.
It all sounds very anti-democratic to me, enforcing the will of the people.  How will we make slaves of the unemployed now?

[IndigoPrime]

There's a way around this. Federalism. Then you just remove these rights from the English while simultaneously screaming about ENGLISH VOTES FOR ENGLISH PEOPLE, drinking warm beer and jumping around with an English flag, while Gove literally bounces around with excitement at the prospect of hanging whoever doesn't 'earn' their human rights.

(I hear the Welsh have figured out how to get around HRA repeal too, note.)

[Professor Bear]

See now, you joke, but remember when the Scotch built that hospital that worked and the right wing press went apeshit calling it "Sturgeon's Death Star" and wailing that it was unfair that the Scotch got a new hospital when the English NHS was so fucked?  The people of England bought that argument.
I foresee the Mail and their ilk complaining that this was what Cameron was warning them about all along - the Scotch imposing their will on the English (the other way around being completely fine).

[JayzusB.Christ]

I'm not quite sure who you're talking about there.  Who are the 'Scotch'?  Scotch is a drink.  And eggs.  And broth.  And tape. 

[IndigoPrime]

Lesbian Seagull: The craziest front page was the one on the Mail, banging on about the HORROR OF SNP LABOUR OH NO DOOM, while the lead story was basically: "The NHS appears to be in the shit... for some reason".

Still, I 'look forward' to five years of the Tories still somehow blaming Labour for everything, and continuing to do so at the next election. I just hope the voters don't bloody well buy it next time.

[Professor Bear]

I look forward to the "extremism" Dave is trying to ban being legally defined as "strike action by unions" or "peaceful protests", as I think the sooner we go back to rioting as a nation, the sooner these times will pass.


JBC: Scotch is from Scotland, so it is called Scotch.  I think you will agree the science there is pretty airtight.

[Jim_Campbell]

An American friend of mine Tweeted with mild bemusement last Friday: "I think the UK just elected those guys from V for Vendetta."

I laughed.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'." — David Cameron

Today, not so much.

Jim

[M.I.K.]

This is doing the rounds on teh internetz...

https://www.change.org/p/the-uk-government-allow-the-north-of-england-to-secede-from-the-uk-and-join-scotland

Unlikely to ever happen, but it'd be flippin' hilarious if it did.

[Jock Savage]

https://www.change.org/p/the-uk-government-allow-the-north-of-england-to-secede-from-the-uk-and-join-scotland

Unlikely to ever happen, but it'd be flippin' hilarious if it did.

This is basically what's behind the idea of creating The Northern Powerhouse and devolving power to the regions.  Anywhere that doesn't vote Tory gets their own regional government to blame for everything.

[Dog Deever]

I'm not quite sure who you're talking about there.  Who are the 'Scotch'?  Scotch is a drink.  And eggs.  And broth.  And tape. 

And mist.
But definitely not 'people'.

[IndigoPrime]