Prometheus

[HdE]

It's confusing and the plot didn't make sense? How is it a good movie then..? Surely these are the most basic elements of cinematic storytelling, and this movie failed on both counts miserably!

Hang on... I didn't find it at all confusing or hard to follow... so... what does that..? I don't even..?

[Mardroid]

It's confusing and the plot didn't make sense? How is it a good movie then..? Surely these are the most basic elements of cinematic storytelling, and this movie failed on both counts miserably!

Hang on... I didn't find it at all confusing or hard to follow... so... what does that..? I don't even..?

Yeah. The plot is pretty straight forward. We didn't get all the answers certainly, [spoiler]i.e. why did the Engineers turn against humanity, but since Rapace's character (I forget her name) wanted to backtrack to the Engineers' world to ask them that very question, it's obviously an answer they're leaving for later.[/spoiler]

I was also uncertain as to why [spoiler]David infected that guy, but I suspect it was simply scientific curiosity coupled with his inhuman, and therefore inhumane lack of conscience. That and The Company in the alien films are renowned for their interest in exploiting bio-weapons and I don't see this pre-cursor company is any different in that respect. I wonder if David was ahead in guessing what the Engineer's canisters were all about.[/spoiler]

I guess there were a couple of other things that puzzled me during the film, but by the end, they made sense. Which is the whole point, answers shouldn't be spelt out straight away! And if people are still wondering what that [spoiler]Alien hold/cannisters and hence, the beasties were all about[/spoiler], The Captain (ironically one of the least scientific members of the team) states it quite clearly near the end.

Don't get me wrong. It could have been a lot better, and it was a little disjointed, (and it certainly could have been original.  [spoiler]I mean, who didn't see the awoken Engineer's reaction to the crew from a mile off?[/spoiler] But it largely sense.

[Richmond Clements]

Yeah. The plot is pretty straight forward. We didn't get all the answers certainly

I'm genuinely curious as to which answers you think we DID get? Because I can't think of any.

The example you use of David's behaviour is a prime example of how bad this movie is. You can see no reason for it because there is not one. It does no make sense, no matter which way you look at it.

The Captain (ironically one of the least scientific members of the team) states it quite clearly near the end.

I'm assuming you mean his claim that it is a [spoiler]military research base[/spoiler]? What I'd like to know is [spoiler]how did he know this? Where could he have possibly got this information? And if it is true, then why did the aliens have drawings in caves pointing to a secret base and not their home planet? [/spoiler]

[Professor Bear]

So if I understand correctly, this was a finished script before it came to Scott, and yet the writer is telling us about day-long ear-benders from the director about what he wanted to do with the story?  Yeah, I can't imagine why this came out somewhat scattershot...

[Apestrife]

The example you use of David's behaviour is a prime example of how bad this movie is. You can see no reason for it because there is not one. It does no make sense, no matter which way you look at it.

I'm assuming you mean his claim that it is a [spoiler]military research base[/spoiler]? What I'd like to know is [spoiler]how did he know this? Where could he have possibly got this information? And if it is true, then why did the aliens have drawings in caves pointing to a secret base and not their home planet? [/spoiler]

I don't think this will make you any happier about the film but, here's my take.

You remember David talking to [spoiler]Peter Weyland? When Meredith asked David what Peter said to him, he replied: "Try harder.". The reason behind this was that the engineers where dead, and they needed something, so David tried out the black goo to see if it lead somewhere.:[/spoiler]

And it wasn't stated where they got the information from. Do you for example know where they got it in the first Alien film?

I think the lack of answers to some of things in the film is one of it's strengths. Mostly because Shaw is a beliver in the christian God, and to do that she loves something that the bible states as something you should fear, something that creates and something that destroys.
And I think that's an interesting perspective, which I also think becomes more powerful since you as a film goer is left with the same questions as Shaw.

[JOE SOAP]

So if I understand correctly, this was a finished script before it came to Scott, and yet the writer is telling us about day-long ear-benders from the director about what he wanted to do with the story?  Yeah, I can't imagine why this came out somewhat scattershot...

Scott didn't go through two writers for no reason, just not the right reason.

[Eric Plumrose]

Shaw is a beliver in the christian God . . .

. . . Yet, as a Christian, she didn't seem at all bothered or perturbed that her whole belief system was at best . . . wrong.

[Richmond Clements]

And I think that's an interesting perspective, which I also think becomes more powerful since you as a film goer is left with the same questions as Shaw.

Not unless her question was "Why did I just waste two hours of my life on this?"

Do you for example know where they got it in the first Alien film?

Sorry, I don't get what you're saying. Are you saying that they are on the planet at the behest of The Company? If so, this doesn't make sense either, as they land on a different planet than the one in Prometheus.

[Apestrife]

Shaw is a beliver in the christian God . . .

. . . Yet, as a Christian, she didn't seem at all bothered or perturbed that her whole belief system was at best . . . wrong.

Well, not many christians seems to bother at all that science often seem like it doesn't have anything to do with any god. But that's not the point I think, I believe that to be that she's a seeker, believing in god for her could both be since her father was a priest or just a way of think that someone or something created humans. God or not, she wants to know why we where to be.
Which a lot people seems to want to know.

Me myself, I think/hope we're glorified monkeys.

[radiator]

It's not so much that the film is hard to follow or we don't get answers for things - its more that the explanations we do get are fucking stupid.

Like the incident mentioned above. Yeah, I get that Weyland told David to infect Holloway. But WHY? It doesn't make any sense. If they wanted to see the effects of the goo, they would have at least tested in a controlled environment. it could have been some sort of bacteria that could have killed them all in seconds for all they knew.

What was Weyland trying to achieve by doing this? I thought he was interested in eternal life, not weapons research. Why do all the characters in this film behave like they have the intellects of toddlers?

The Company schemes in Alien and Aliens made sense. Burke's ploy in Aliens was hare-brained, desperate and destined to fail. But that made sense because the character was a grasping little creep who let greed override common sense.

There is a huge difference between deliberately leaving things ambiguous and doing so as a last resort to cover up shoddy writing.

If you say 'they'll explain it in the sequel', then sorry, but you've been conned. You're a mug.

I just don't get how people are willing to overlook so much that is fundamentally wrong with this movie.

[Mardroid]

Yeah. The plot is pretty straight forward. We didn't get all the answers certainly

I'm genuinely curious as to which answers you think we DID get? Because I can't think of any.

1. We confirmed that the scientists hypothesis (or is it theory, I get those two mixed up?) that [spoiler]The Engineers created humanity[/spoiler] is correct. [spoiler]In fact not only did they make us, they made us from themselves.[/spoiler]

2.  [spoiler]They seem to have followed a similar self destructive path to humanity. The crew (at least Rapace's character, her husband, Weyland and David - I think the other crew had other motivations) went in search of their creators (indirect creators in David's case) , hoping to get answers, and their creators turned out to be as destructive and gullible as humanity itself. And they used their advanced biotechnological expertise to create weapons. (In the end that's what those various critters and bio-agents are.) We're regular chips off the extraterrestrial old block. It gives a possible reason for our own destructive leanings.[/spoiler]

3. [spoiler]They are indeed advanced bioengineers, who have created lots of strange creatures, and from that little bit at the end I think it's fair to say they created the Aliens of the Alien franchise, or likely will do. (I guess this is linked in some ways to point 2.)[/spoiler]

4. [spoiler]I think the lack of other answers could well be an answer in itself. Maybe the only answers humanity will get will be from within rather than without.[/spoiler]

The example you use of David's behaviour is a prime example of how bad this movie is. You can see no reason for it because there is not one. It does no make sense, no matter which way you look at it.

It's not spelt out, certainly. [spoiler]I think the fact he is an amoral scientist pretty much covers it though. He treated members of his own crew as guinea pigs. "Try harder" said Wayland. David did just that.[/spoiler]


5.

The Captain (ironically one of the least scientific members of the team) states it quite clearly near the end.

I'm assuming you mean his claim that it is a [spoiler]military research base[/spoiler]? What I'd like to know is [spoiler]how did he know this? [/spoiler][/quote]

I'll admit, that was a bit of a jump, but not too big of one. [spoiler]The word 'Engineers' was used from the beginning and seemed to be backed up by Rapace's discovery when comparing human and Engineer DNA. The Engineers had a cargo hold full of canisters containing nasty things. And there were strong indications from Holograms and and exploding Engineer's head that they were destroyed by the contents of their own cannisters.

Of course just having the cannisters does not indicate that they created the critters on the ship, but when you take all that together, and couple that with the fact that the ship formed part of a rather permanent building structure, the leap is not a big one.[/spoiler]

There should have been stronger indicators though, like [spoiler]David decoding a scientific log, for example.[/spoiler]

[spoiler]And if it is true, then why did the aliens have drawings in caves pointing to a secret base and not their home planet? [/spoiler]

Two logical reasons I can think of, and I accept this is speculation on my part, which may back up your reasoning of lack of answers within the film itself.

1. [spoiler]If you wanted to check up on your creations, what better place than at a scientific outpost? [/spoiler]

2.  [spoiler]If you knew there was a good chance that your creations would be extremely advanced by the time they decided to drop in, would you give them the coordinates of your home planet? For all you know there ideas of gaining answers might involve pointing great big nukes at you and demanding your technology. (And it doesn't follow that the Engineers would always be a match for humanity. Humanity might have made a major spurt in their weapons tech and the Engineers might gone through a long stagnant period in innovation. I'm not saying that's what actually happend, mind, I'm just speculating on future scenareos that may have gone through the heads of the Engineer cave painters.[/spoiler]

EDIT- Apologies, I see some of the stuff I mentioned was covered by stuff posted by other people in the interim. That's what I get for being long winded in my posts.

[Apestrife]

And I think that's an interesting perspective, which I also think becomes more powerful since you as a film goer is left with the same questions as Shaw.

Not unless her question was "Why did I just waste two hours of my life on this?"

Do you for example know where they got it in the first Alien film?

Sorry, I don't get what you're saying. Are you saying that they are on the planet at the behest of The Company? If so, this doesn't make sense either, as they land on a different planet than the one in Prometheus.

Ha, you almost got -me- a point there

No. I know it's two entirely different planets, different companies and that it's 30years between the films in the universe. I just pointed out that the first alien film gives every detail either, and for me that doesn't matter if I'm not entirely in the loop on how or why they found the aliens. [spoiler]Weyland says that he brought Shaw and her boyfriend with them because they where believers. I don't think they made a break in discovering the planet, they where just "a crew" as the one in alien, to hide what really was going on. [/spoiler]

But then. It's been a while since I saw it. And the memory of it has cooled down a bit thanks to that Dark Knight Rises has it's premier in just a week. I could have another take/opinion about it if/when I watch Prometheus again.

[Richmond Clements]

Honestly - if you need to do the intellectual back-flips you're doing right now to justify the movie, then it is not a good movie.
As I said: it'll be on the same list as Battlefield Earth sooner rather than later.

[Roger Godpleton]

THIS MOVIE CAME OUT A WHOLE MONTH AGO. STOP TALKING ABOUT IT.


PROMETHEUS IS OVER.

[radiator]

Honestly - if you need to do the intellectual back-flips you're doing right now to justify the movie, then it is not a good movie.
As I said: it'll be on the same list as Battlefield Earth sooner rather than later.

Couldn't agree more. The apologists would have you believe that 'Blade Runner and Alien got bad reviews on release because they went over critic's heads, it's the same for Prometheus, it'll be recognised for the classic it is in years to come'

I think completely the opposite - once the hype dies down, a lot of people are finally going to open their eyes to what a Phantom Menace-esque load of nonsense it is.