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Spoilers => Prog => Topic started by: A.Cow on 27 January, 2018, 11:42:42 AM

Title: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: A.Cow on 27 January, 2018, 11:42:42 AM
The prog is going through a depressing dip at the moment.

Cover - Is that supposed to be a pun?  I'm not sure, because I don't have a clue what 'Bors' is.  Mind you, that's probably because I've pretty much given up on Brass Sun -- don't have a clue who half the characters are and care little for their fate.  So probably me just being a grouch.

Dredd - This seems to be really dragging its feet.  You could drop this week's first 5 pages and it wouldn't affect the storyline at all(!)  That's not good.  Michael Carroll is capable of so much better than this.

Bad Company - This has become so cartoon-like that I'm half expecting Dennis the Menace and Gnasher to turn up.  Maybe I'll try reading it in one go ... but it isn't grabbing me.

Savage - The only story that's actually moving along at a pace is a Pat Mills one?  Blimey.  Uncle Pat may be preaching (and getting yet another bloody 'sheeple' reference in) but this is the highlight of this week's prog for me.  And we all know it'll end with Bill using the phrase [spoiler]"I've got a thousand years of hate stored up"[/spoiler] at some point...

Brass Sun - Brass monkey bollocks more like.  I'm no fan of INJ Cubland's art and the meandering plots seems to have disappeared up its own rectum.

ABC Warriors - Old TV show Voyage To The Bottom Of The Sea had only two plots: (a) monster-of-the-week attacks sub; (b) crew-member gets hypnotised/replaced and tries to sabotage the sub.  ABC seems to be stuck flip-flapping between (a) group of ten-or-so adversaries need to be picked off, one-by-one, and (b) members start fighting each other.  It's all getting a bit tired and repetitive.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Eamonn Clarke on 27 January, 2018, 12:11:19 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/ZRBKeIz.jpg)
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: TordelBack on 27 January, 2018, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: A.Cow on 27 January, 2018, 11:42:42 AM
Cover - Is that supposed to be a pun?  I'm not sure, because I don't have a clue what 'Bors' is. 

Tordelsplaining: one of Arthur's knights (played by Terry Gilliam in MPatHG and Ray Winstone in the rubbish Keira Knightley one, for point of reference), here one of the Round-Table-themed android agents of Merlin,  the central antagonist in Brass Sun. His robo-head is a boar helmet,  although I don't think Sir Bors (or his same-named Dad) had anything to do with boars per Dr.

But yes, a pun.

Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Magnetica on 27 January, 2018, 05:12:11 PM
Yes pretty mediocre Prog this week.

A fairly by the numbers Dredd that I found lacking in excitement. Odd to see Dredd sitting in bed.

Two helpings of Uncle Pat's social and political commentary in Savage and ABC Warriors. At this point he seems to have dropped any attempt at doing it subtly. I wouldn't say it's getting tired. Still at least Savage moves the plot on and has some good ideas.

I also thought Bad Company has become cartoon like, which seems to me to be completely out of keeping with previous series. Anytime this stops is fine with me.

Brass Sun - yeah it's ok, but I would like to see it move to a an overall conclusion soon. And then get INJ Culbard back on Brink.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Woolly on 27 January, 2018, 07:32:51 PM
Well I thought the prog was great!

Dredd gives us more of his current situation, but this is no bad thing. Im enjoying the current ongoing series, and Paul Davidson's artwork is getting far more dynamic and exciting. Good stuff.

Bad Company looks eye-poppingly gorgeous, but I must confess I'm not actually reading it. Still, bloody lovely artwork.

Savage - confession time again: I've never got into Savage before, except the odd episodes that feature some form of ABC warriors. I've just read the last few issues based on this episode, and now can't wait for the Essential Collection to get to the Savage volumes so I can give it a go from the start. Patrick Goddard is just incredible on this.

Brass Sun - Just great stuff, INJ Culbard can do no wrong in my eyes. l do agree that a recap in regards to the characters would help, though.

ABC Warriors - Yet another confession: I've only ever really liked the Warriors when they're fighting each other, or getting the team back together, so this is really working for me. Looks blimmin' great too!


All in all, the progs a cracker for me  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Andy Lambert on 27 January, 2018, 07:53:20 PM
Have to agree with Woolly there - it's all very well having jumping aboard progs, but if you're going to have ongoing chapters stretching out over years you're probably going to lose them again quick enough without some form of recap. That might be tedious for long-term readers, but they have the option to skip them.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Andy Lambert on 27 January, 2018, 07:56:11 PM
Quoteyou're probably going to lose them again

"Them" being new readers of course.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Big_Dave on 27 January, 2018, 08:11:20 PM
1st 2 eps of brass sun
were ALL recap/backstory

every1 says their name
& explain who they are/what they want
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: TordelBack on 27 January, 2018, 08:22:05 PM
Quote from: Woolly on 27 January, 2018, 07:32:51 PM
Brass Sun - Just great stuff, INJ Culbard can do no wrong in my eyes. l do agree that a recap in regards to the characters would help, though.

The first two-and-a-bit episodes were basically all recap.  (plus a blurb in the Nerve Centre, plus if you have the dosh,  a gigantic beautiful hardback collection).  I was getting very bored, up until the last few when things started moving forward again.

I really don't think Tharg can win here: either he's losing those of us who want everything set out again each time a story returns,  or boring those of us who don't.  Hipster Dad's perennial solution of much longer residencies seems like a solution,  but I imagine that'll piss off an equal amount of people.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: TordelBack on 27 January, 2018, 08:22:41 PM
Oops,  Big Dave beat me to it.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Andy Lambert on 27 January, 2018, 08:43:20 PM
I'm not just talking about Brass Sun here, but most long running stories. I get there's an intro in each prog's Nerve Centre but a brief paragraph isn't really enough.
As for buying graphic novels, etc to catch up - if you don't happen to have the dosh for gigantic beautiful collections, it seems like tough luck.
Rather than trying to add the recap within the story, a page (or even half a page) such as the one provided with the return of Grey Suit would certainly help, which long term readers can skip past. Of course this would affect the page count of some progs, so still not an ideal solution but surely better than alienating newcomers and boring the old guard...?
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Big_Dave on 27 January, 2018, 08:53:12 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABC_Warriors#Stories
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Savage#Savage
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: TordelBack on 27 January, 2018, 08:56:41 PM
If we're talking about a single text page, I have no issue with that (other than that jumping-on progs would probably lose a whole story), but it's always seemed to me that subtly recapping within the strip itself is a better approach.  Although apparently not in the case of Brass Sun!

I do however think that reprint collections have been a fact of the serial-comics readers life since the early 80s.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Colin YNWA on 27 January, 2018, 09:11:16 PM
Well the Prog always engenders mixed opinions but I can't remember a time when a step of strips has been quite so divisive and fostered such varied opinion. Not just at the extreme in the middle too all it not just marmite love or hate we have Meh thrown in as well.

Well I strongly lend towards to the its very good side. We had a peak a couple of weeks ago with 2064 being a damned, damned good Prog , well 2066 ain't too far off, all be it remastered with a mew track listing. Of course we start off with Dredd which is a strong story but the fish out of water storyline does read a little ... well weird... enjoying it though.

Bad Company I'm getting more and more comfortable with, as I put aside my concerns about the big themes and ideas I'm enjoying individual elements and episodes more and more and here Mac's return has real impact.

Savage is such a heavy dosh of villian pontificating, explaining his plot and motivation, developing an over elaborate way of disposing of the hero, it should be utter rot and cliche. Throw in some Uncle Pat smashing us over the head with meaning and 'truth' he's hit us over the head with a gazillion times already.I should hate this but I'm so invested in the story and characters that I'm in for all Unca Patty at his least subtle to the extreme I'm lovin' it... but Unkie Patsy please, remember when you said you hated it when writers talked down to their audience... well listen to your own words, could you tone it down and trust us to get it anyway!

Brass Sun, Gold comics more like, so few words, so much conveyed. Genius.

ABC Warriors Auntie Patricia is having such a laugh with this its impossible not be to pulled along on his wide ride. Glorious nonsense.

Fantastic stuff, not sure I can out up with its leaves of bonkies for long, but for the time as as long as this run of stories continues I'm happy... mind Tharg is slacking off somewhat, we get space for a back page add for the first time in a while!
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Woolly on 27 January, 2018, 09:33:34 PM
Quote from: Woolly on 27 January, 2018, 07:32:51 PM
l do agree that a recap in regards to the characters would help, though.

Just to elaborate, I'm OK with the plot more or less thanks to the aforementioned opening episodes, but could do with a reminder of just who everyone is, and why they're doing what they're doing.

For example - I just can't for the life of me remember why there's a blue meanie following Wren around, or exactly why Septimus is looking a bit rough.
Am I to assume it isn't important to the plot?
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Woolly on 27 January, 2018, 09:36:07 PM
Appreciate I'm not adding much here, just trying to justify my lack of memory I guess!
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Geoff on 28 January, 2018, 04:10:52 PM
The Dredd tale seems rather odd to me, can't quite put my finger on it...just doesn't sit right.  Although it is in keeping with Dredd's of late. More generally, over the last few years Dredd seems to have been stumbling from one beating to the next, generally getting captured, brutalised and beaten. Along the way his life is saved fairly regularly by minor characters. I appreciate he's getting on a bit, but he's presented more often as a liability than an asset to MC1 and barely able to look after himself without continual help from others. Anyone else feel this...? May just be me of course...
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: A.Cow on 28 January, 2018, 07:08:12 PM
Quote from: Geoff on 28 January, 2018, 04:10:52 PM
More generally, over the last few years Dredd seems to have been stumbling from one beating to the next, generally getting captured, brutalised and beaten. Along the way his life is saved fairly regularly by minor characters. I appreciate he's getting on a bit, but he's presented more often as a liability than an asset to MC1 and barely able to look after himself without continual help from others. Anyone else feel this...?

Yup, agree totally.  It seems that many of the 'newer' writers rely too much on New Character X's special ability resolving a situation; hence Dredd regularly gets sidelined in his own strip.

Personally I'd like to see a move away from forced epics -- back to a higher proportion of MC-1 based stories with an emphasis on imaginative crimes. 
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: 13school on 29 January, 2018, 09:54:08 AM
Quote from: A.Cow on 28 January, 2018, 07:08:12 PM

Personally I'd like to see a move away from forced epics -- back to a higher proportion of MC-1 based stories with an emphasis on imaginative crimes.

Couldn't agree more. But I assume that'd require Tharg to find a writer or two interested in telling that particular kind of story, whereas the current crop seem almost actively afraid to tell stories about Dredd simply fighting crime in MC-1.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Magnetica on 29 January, 2018, 01:22:33 PM
Quote from: A.Cow on 28 January, 2018, 07:08:12 PM
Personally I'd like to see a move away from forced epics -- back to a higher proportion of MC-1 based stories with an emphasis on imaginative crimes.

Yes that would be good. The problem is someone has to come up with an "imaginative" idea, and given the number of imaginative ones already used, it must get harder and harder to come up with new ones. As I understand it, back in the day they used the newspapers for inspiration and I guess the news today would prove some material but only so much and so you need straight action stories as well.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Proudhuff on 29 January, 2018, 01:48:02 PM
Sorry to say but I too felt it was a tired old prog this week... I couldn't follow Brass Sun action and Dredd left me cold...

Savage was like reading the Socialist Worker but with added foil hatness, while ABC and Bad Company just annoy me know...

I' go and join the grump corner shall I?
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: dweezil2 on 29 January, 2018, 02:17:15 PM
Quote from: Magnetica on 29 January, 2018, 01:22:33 PM
Quote from: A.Cow on 28 January, 2018, 07:08:12 PM
Personally I'd like to see a move away from forced epics -- back to a higher proportion of MC-1 based stories with an emphasis on imaginative crimes.

Yes that would be good. The problem is someone has to come up with an "imaginative" idea, and given the number of imaginative ones already used, it must get harder and harder to come up with new ones. As I understand it, back in the day they used the newspapers for inspiration and I guess the news today would prove some material but only so much and so you need straight action stories as well.

Yesterday's 2000ad stories is today's news is another problem!!!  :lol:
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Colin YNWA on 29 January, 2018, 09:06:41 PM
Quote from: Geoff on 28 January, 2018, 04:10:52 PM
The Dredd tale seems rather odd to me, can't quite put my finger on it...just doesn't sit right...

Defo agree with this, if not the rest. I've been trying to work out why and to be honest I think its they way Dredd seems to have resigned to his fate and accepted a roll I just don't think he would. He's about as indomitable a spirit in a comicsphere full of indomitabe characters, yet here he just seems so dominited.... I assume is the word if the other is imdomitable.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Magnetica on 29 January, 2018, 10:18:43 PM
You know what ...that's exactly it. No way would Dredd just let this stuff happen.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Geoff on 30 January, 2018, 08:34:19 PM
You've hit the nail on the head there Colin, does rather fit with Dredd not being so much of a 'doer' these days but more someone who has things done to him...
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: sheridan on 31 January, 2018, 12:20:58 AM
Quote from: TordelBack on 27 January, 2018, 12:49:31 PM
Quote from: A.Cow on 27 January, 2018, 11:42:42 AM
Cover - Is that supposed to be a pun?  I'm not sure, because I don't have a clue what 'Bors' is. 

Tordelsplaining: one of Arthur's knights (played by Terry Gilliam in MPatHG and Ray Winstone in the rubbish Keira Knightley one, for point of reference), here one of the Round-Table-themed android agents of Merlin,  the central antagonist in Brass Sun. His robo-head is a boar helmet,  although I don't think Sir Bors (or his same-named Dad) had anything to do with boars per Dr.

But yes, a pun.


Bors didn't appear in Boorman's Excalibur... so it isn't canon :-)
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: sheridan on 31 January, 2018, 12:21:54 AM
Quote from: Magnetica on 27 January, 2018, 05:12:11 PM
A fairly by the numbers Dredd that I found lacking in excitement. Odd to see Dredd sitting in bed.


Yes, he normally takes the regulatory ten.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: sheridan on 31 January, 2018, 12:24:34 AM
Quote from: Andy Lambert on 27 January, 2018, 07:53:20 PM
Have to agree with Woolly there - it's all very well having jumping aboard progs, but if you're going to have ongoing chapters stretching out over years you're probably going to lose them again quick enough without some form of recap. That might be tedious for long-term readers, but they have the option to skip them.


All us long-term readers are old enough we need a memory jog every now and then!  They're on your head!  I said, your glasses are on your head.  Would you like a nice mug of cocoa before you go to bed?
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: sheridan on 31 January, 2018, 12:37:21 AM
Quote from: Geoff on 30 January, 2018, 08:34:19 PM
You've hit the nail on the head there Colin, does rather fit with Dredd not being so much of a 'doer' these days but more someone who has things done to him...

Is there any difference to what's happening in this week's prog and what happened near the beginning of the Judge Child Quest with Filmore Faro?
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: A.Cow on 31 January, 2018, 04:04:25 AM
Quote from: sheridan on 31 January, 2018, 12:37:21 AM
Is there any difference to what's happening in this week's prog and what happened near the beginning of the Judge Child Quest with Filmore Faro?

Aside from Dredd taking charge of the situation, pretending to be a slave, escaping within 7 pages, being captured (this time for real), escaping within 3 pages, and a highly memorable bad guy (i.e. Faro)...?
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: TordelBack on 31 January, 2018, 11:24:06 AM
And don't forget that time he was beaten up and put to work in the fields by the residents of Fargoville (with sexy results). Think he'd killed his way out of that one within an episode.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: norton canes on 31 January, 2018, 12:17:11 PM
Just noticed, this run of strips is very much like those in the final ten progs of 2016 (bar the Christmas special): Dredd, Savage, another Mills story, a Milligan/Dayglo story.

Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Taryn Tailz on 31 January, 2018, 06:56:05 PM
While I don't actively dislike anything in the current line-up, I've felt this to be the single weakest line-up of strips in a very long time indeed. There is little to be excited about in the current run, though the occasionally strong single episode of a strip helps to pull the Prog along. I'm very eager to get to the next jumping-on prog however, which looks likes it's going to be a much stronger line-up of thrills according to the solicitations press (see below).

The storylines for Judge Dredd, Bad Company, Brass Sun, Savage and ABC Warriors all wrap up in Progs 2071-2072, leaving the decks clear for an all-new line-up to start in the bumper, 48-page Prog 2073 – Dredd crosses paths once more with the terrifying Judge Pin in 'Fit for Purpose' by Rob Williams and Chris Weston; vampire bounty hunter Durham Red takes on a case to reunite mother and son in 'Born Bad' by Alec Worley and Ben Willsher; Nort war-crimes investigator Atalia Jaegir returns to the hellworld that is Nu Earth in 'In the Realm of Pyrrhus' by Gordon Rennie and Simon Coleby; Psi-Judge Anderson must face a new threat rising from the Undercity in 'Undertow' by Emma Beeby and David Roach; and history is being reshaped in 'The New World', the fourth series of the time- and dimension-jumping thriller The Order by Kek-W and John Burns!
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: sheridan on 31 January, 2018, 07:44:57 PM
I feel like I'm alone in both liking the prog now and looking forward to the next jumping on prog.  (still waiting for the promised-in-a-thrillcast explanation of how BC are all magically alive though)>
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Magnetica on 01 February, 2018, 12:30:32 AM
I'm still waiting for that too, but I have long since given up expecting it to be anything sensible.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: norton canes on 01 February, 2018, 09:38:29 AM
In lieu of a review of this week's prog...

Quote from: Taryn Tailz on 31 January, 2018, 06:56:05 PM
While I don't actively dislike anything in the current line-up, I've felt this to be the single weakest line-up of strips in a very long time indeed. There is little to be excited about in the current run, though the occasionally strong single episode of a strip helps to pull the Prog along. I'm very eager to get to the next jumping-on prog however, which looks likes it's going to be a much stronger line-up of thrills

This.

Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: ZenArcade on 01 February, 2018, 05:23:16 PM
I assume Bors hunt is a reference to the physicist Nils Bors.  Z
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Tjm86 on 01 February, 2018, 06:14:00 PM
Quote from: norton canes on 01 February, 2018, 09:38:29 AM
In lieu of a review of this week's prog...

Quote from: Taryn Tailz on 31 January, 2018, 06:56:05 PM
While I don't actively dislike anything in the current line-up, I've felt this to be the single weakest line-up of strips in a very long time indeed. There is little to be excited about in the current run, though the occasionally strong single episode of a strip helps to pull the Prog along. I'm very eager to get to the next jumping-on prog however, which looks likes it's going to be a much stronger line-up of thrills

This.

What makes it particularly hard to stomach is that the meg is currently firing on all cylinders, particularly with the new MovieWorld Death with Flint on art duties.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Jacqusie on 02 February, 2018, 12:01:52 AM
Quote from: Geoff on 28 January, 2018, 04:10:52 PM
The Dredd tale seems rather odd to me, can't quite put my finger on it...just doesn't sit right.  Although it is in keeping with Dredd's of late. More generally, over the last few years Dredd seems to have been stumbling from one beating to the next, generally getting captured, brutalised and beaten. Along the way his life is saved fairly regularly by minor characters. I appreciate he's getting on a bit, but he's presented more often as a liability than an asset to MC1


I just don't think Michael Carrol gets Dredd. His scripts are all over the place & when it comes to Dredd and supporting characters, they are behaving in very odd ways. Take Hershey in that Texas mess, she was portrayed as a lame duck and she really isn't. Dredd's getting on a bit sure, but he's still Dredd and a damn a good Judge.

It's stuff like this that's making me wonder if I too have out grown the prog after 30 years. I'm not enjoying the fragmented nature of Carrolls stories and the way Dredd's been allowed to go. I miss the world building Wagner did so well, including some great supporting characters in Dredd's world, that we just don't get any more... it's a real shame...
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: BPP on 02 February, 2018, 01:01:33 AM
Quote from: Jacqusie on 02 February, 2018, 12:01:52 AM

I just don't think Michael Carrol gets Dredd. His scripts are all over the place & when it comes to Dredd and supporting characters, they are behaving in very odd ways. Take Hershey in that Texas mess, she was portrayed as a lame duck and she really isn't. Dredd's getting on a bit sure, but he's still Dredd and a damn a good Judge.

It's stuff like this that's making me wonder if I too have out grown the prog after 30 years. I'm not enjoying the fragmented nature of Carrolls stories and the way Dredd's been allowed to go. I miss the world building Wagner did so well, including some great supporting characters in Dredd's world, that we just don't get any more... it's a real shame...

It's not you, it's Carroll. He's been dire for Dredd with dull epics and constantly badly using classic characters and back story or adding in his own tired 'orishness all over the place. I appreciate he has a lot of goodwill from his tenure on these boards but every week his name is on a Dredd credit it's another dull week. Take the current story - the horned baddie is dull, the fish-man lackey is dull, another dull feisty independent (Irish) lady is on board, the dialogue is dull. Zero humour, zero character, dull action, zero interest.

Let Carroll create his own series for 2000ad and see if he has anything beyond fanboy knowledge of Dredd because after many years on Dredd his writing offers very little.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Dandontdare on 02 February, 2018, 09:55:15 AM
I gotta disagree - I'm enjoying this latest Dredd stories and I think Carroll "gets" modern Dredd perfectly. You can't keep writing stories about action-hero Dredd leaping off H-wagons in a sparkling world-ruling city - Dredd's 70 odd years old and his city has been crippled by Chaos day - Carroll writes stories that reflect this. hence the need for additional characters to do some of the action stuff but Dredd's presence looms over everything, he can still handle himself in a scrap and his dialogue is always spot on. Ditto for Every Empire falls - I didn't think Hershey was portrayed as a lame duck, she's in charge of a crippled city and had hard choices to make. There's a bit where the Brit cit judge says something like "don't make the mistake of thinking of her as  politician, she's a street judge - and if she knew Dredd was alive, she'd ditch the badge of office and come gunning for us" (paraphrased as i don't have it to hand).
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Colin YNWA on 02 February, 2018, 12:36:01 PM
Quote from: Dandontdare on 02 February, 2018, 09:55:15 AM
I gotta disagree - I'm enjoying this latest Dredd stories and I think Carroll "gets" modern Dredd perfectly. You can't keep writing stories about action-hero Dredd leaping off H-wagons in a sparkling world-ruling city - Dredd's 70 odd years old and his city has been crippled by Chaos day - Carroll writes stories that reflect this. hence the need for additional characters to do some of the action stuff but Dredd's presence looms over everything, he can still handle himself in a scrap and his dialogue is always spot on. Ditto for Every Empire falls - I didn't think Hershey was portrayed as a lame duck, she's in charge of a crippled city and had hard choices to make. There's a bit where the Brit cit judge says something like "don't make the mistake of thinking of her as  politician, she's a street judge - and if she knew Dredd was alive, she'd ditch the badge of office and come gunning for us" (paraphrased as i don't have it to hand).

Yeah I've not got much to add to this and have said here before on a number of occasions that I'm a big fan if Carroll's Dredd, some of his shorter stories have been quite brilliant examinations of Dredd.

I really enjoyed Every Empire Falls and think it was a very fresh way to present an epic. The latest isn't quite as good but has some real high moments and I'll work with the current section and see how it all plays out quite happily.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: norton canes on 02 February, 2018, 02:43:27 PM
Have to say, I loved Carroll's 'Deep in the Heart' and 'Ouroboros' from last year.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Proudhuff on 02 February, 2018, 04:04:46 PM
Quote from: Colin YNWA on 02 February, 2018, 12:36:01 PM
Quote from: Dandontdare on 02 February, 2018, 09:55:15 AM
I gotta disagree - I'm enjoying this latest Dredd stories and I think Carroll "gets" modern Dredd perfectly. You can't keep writing stories about action-hero Dredd leaping off H-wagons in a sparkling world-ruling city - Dredd's 70 odd years old and his city has been crippled by Chaos day - Carroll writes stories that reflect this. hence the need for additional characters to do some of the action stuff but Dredd's presence looms over everything, he can still handle himself in a scrap and his dialogue is always spot on. Ditto for Every Empire falls - I didn't think Hershey was portrayed as a lame duck, she's in charge of a crippled city and had hard choices to make. There's a bit where the Brit cit judge says something like "don't make the mistake of thinking of her as  politician, she's a street judge - and if she knew Dredd was alive, she'd ditch the badge of office and come gunning for us" (paraphrased as i don't have it to hand).

Yeah I've not got much to add to this and have said here before on a number of occasions that I'm a big fan if Carroll's Dredd, some of his shorter stories have been quite brilliant examinations of Dredd.

I really enjoyed Every Empire Falls and think it was a very fresh way to present an epic. The latest isn't quite as good but has some real high moments and I'll work with the current section and see how it all plays out quite happily.

I'll put my name to this ^^^ too.
I think he gets the modern Dredd and knows how to tell a great tale.
Just thinking this current story is a bit off, but its a first misstep I can think of the Car-Roll droid making.
Course Old Stoney Face could be planning something...
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Tjm86 on 02 February, 2018, 07:27:39 PM
I find with Carroll that it is always a job to know where he is going to land it.  Quite often he can start off with a strong story but lose the ending and it just feels 'meh'.  By the same token, mid story it can feel like a bit of a slog and then he finds a way to pull something decent out of the bag at the last moment.  It's that lack of consistency that tends to frustrate me.  Watching this space and hoping for the best.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: TordelBack on 02 February, 2018, 08:52:55 PM
Quote from: Proudhuff on 02 February, 2018, 04:04:46 PM
I think he gets the modern Dredd and knows how to tell a great tale.
Just thinking this current story is a bit off...

QFT

I don't think Mike gets it right all the time,  and he does have a tendency to hand centre stage to new supporting characters,  but he's so far ahead of many non-Wagners that I'm more than happy to overlook the odd dud.  Up there in the Top 5 for me.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: DrJomster on 02 February, 2018, 10:45:39 PM
Just read the Prog...

Then digested this thread...

I can see why it's generating discussion.

So in a nutshell...

ABC Warriors win the Prog for me. I do wish the current sale extended to digital. *sighs*
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Trout on 03 February, 2018, 01:56:59 AM
I'm enjoying this Dredd story, and Brass Sun is a treat every week.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: TordelBack on 03 February, 2018, 04:26:03 PM
Dredd improves for me his week,  although I don't think Davidson,  Blythe and snow'n'ice are a particularly successful mix.
Brass Sun remains my top thrill by some margin. Despite exploding cyborgs and Arthurian robots it feels almost like  TinTin this week, which is a Good Thing.

Savage and ABC Warriors are both individually fine*, but together there's just too much sophomoric wittering. One story I can happily accept as a bit of heavy-handed revisionism or broad social commentary,  but two feels like being stuck behind two know-it-all students on the last bus home.

And then we come to Bad Company.  Even though it's more glorious to the eye every week,  I've sadly come to the conclusion that I don't give two shakes about the story. Mac didn't lose his arm on Ararat, it was on that planet they recruited Sheeva. We may be learning (again) about the nature of truth,  by at the same time, why should I care about what happens to any of these amnesiac imposters,  running around a planet that blew up?


*Although again I'd note that characters like Joe,  Gottlieb and Ro-Jaws have lost their formerly distinctive voices.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Greg M. on 03 February, 2018, 05:24:44 PM
Quote from: TordelBack on 03 February, 2018, 04:26:03 PM
We may be learning (again) about the nature of truth,  by at the same time, why should I care about what happens to any of these amnesiac imposters,  running around a planet that blew up?

It would be good to think that this is all some kind of meta-commentary on the vagaries of war, and since it's Milligan - my favourite comics writer ever, I should note - it's impossible to rule out entirely. However, I wonder if the truth is much more prosaic: he's just not that good at remembering his own continuity.  I seem to recall a key character's surname changing between issues of X-Statix, for instance, and there's also the well-known issue with De Racine's poisonous / non-poisonous blood. Obviously Thrax being alive is a deliberate choice, and I suspect we will get a proper explanation of that one eventually.
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: Big_Dave on 03 February, 2018, 05:57:16 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/qeNaPez.png?2)
Title: Re: Prog 2066 - Bors Hunt!
Post by: paddykafka on 09 February, 2018, 01:38:27 PM
 Obviously Thrax being alive is a deliberate choice, and I suspect we will get a proper explanation of that one eventually.

Danny Franks wakes up, sees Thrax coming out of the shower and realises that everything that happened before was just a dream...