The Political Thread

[The Legendary Shark]

I don't believe one needs permission to trade, fund worthy projects or live somewhere.

[JayzusB.Christ]

Try moving to Australia without a visa. What should be true and what is are two different things.

[The Legendary Shark]

I wonder if the Queen would need a visa? I wouldn't be surprised if she doesn't even need a passport, what with her being appointed by God and everything.

[JayzusB.Christ]

I agree completely, but YOU need a passport and trying to argue at customs that it's not fair won't get you residency. But in the EU, everyone can do it. 

[The Legendary Shark]

I don't need a passport, the people "above" me demand that I have one if I want to travel around their planet.

There are perfectly good administrative and organisational reasons why passports might be useful but I don't think they should be mandatory or require government permission to obtain. If private airlines or shipping companies want to require their passengers to have passports (maybe even private ones they issue themselves) then that's fine by me but they shouldn't be made to require them by government.

[Modern Panther]

Then you need one. 

You just don't want to need one. 

Or rather, you want to need as many as the wealthy people who run transport companies say you need, for whenever you need to use their services.

[JayzusB.Christ]

'I shouldn't need a passport.'
'But you do need one.'
'But I shouldn't.'
'But you do.'

Think I'll take a break from this particular argument and make myself a mojito.

[The Legendary Shark]

Fundamentally, I don't need one. It's a travel permit, that's all. Just because governments tell me I need one, that doesn't make it so. They need me to have one and they need me to believe it's impossible to travel without one - which it patently isn't (I looked it up - the Queen doesn't have one and she jets about all over the shop), geese travel thousands of miles every year without a shred of paperwork.

I know this is an academic argument at present but, in essence, passports are simply one aspect of the pervasive illusion of control. In reality, I am a natural, flesh and blood creature belonging to this planet and naturally free to roam. The Powers That Shouldn't Be, however, have reduced this right to the level of a mere privilege, to be granted, denied or withdrawn at their whim.

I also know that I'm not free to travel over imaginary lines on the map without imaginary permission because That's the Way Things Are, but That's the Way Things Are doesn't necessarily mean that The Way Things Are are right (or, of course, wrong).

[Professor Bear]

No passports?  So federalisation of the European Union, then?  You shouldn't have voted Leave, Sharky.

Incidentally, are there actually any Leavers still on the forum?  Or have they all been chased off by the lentil-munchers?

[JayzusB.Christ]

Seem to remember Old Tankie being a staunch Leaver, though I don't think he's been around lately.  Despite loathing his political opinions, I liked the guy.

[The Legendary Shark]

'I shouldn't need a passport.' 'But you do need one.' 'But I shouldn't.' 'But you do.' Think I'll take a break from this particular argument and make myself a mojito.

It's not about the passport, or the "need" for one, itself. It's about natural human rights and how some humans restrict and/or curtail the rights of other humans.  The passport is just an example of one of the many manifestations of this idea. You're right, though, I'd rather have a mojito than argue about it as well. Email me one over...

[Frank]

... passports are simply one aspect of the pervasive illusion of control. In reality, I am a natural, flesh and blood creature belonging to this planet and naturally free to roam. The Powers That Shouldn't Be, however, have reduced this right to the level of a mere privilege, to be granted, denied or withdrawn at their whim.

Do you have the natural, inalienable right to right to roam in Alton Towers?

[The Legendary Shark]

You shouldn't have voted Leave, Sharky.

I don't vote at all.

[JayzusB.Christ]

'I shouldn't need a passport.' 'But you do need one.' 'But I shouldn't.' 'But you do.' Think I'll take a break from this particular argument and make myself a mojito.

It's not about the passport, or the "need" for one, itself. It's about natural human rights and how some humans restrict and/or curtail the rights of other humans.  The passport is just an example of one of the many manifestations of this idea. You're right, though, I'd rather have a mojito than argue about it as well. Email me one over...

Get your 3d printer ready.

[M.I.K.]

geese travel thousands of miles every year without a shred of paperwork.

...but move into their territory when they don't want you to and they'll try to kill you (whatever you are), like most other species on the planet.