The Political Thread

[Definitely Not Mister Pops]

Maybe with the potential of the DUP wagging the dog, Farron saw a storm brewing over their politics in religion religion in politics and didn't want to get caught up in the media deluge.

My mate described the DUP's current relationship with Britain quite well. It like someone who really fancies this person to the point of obsession, but when this person finally takes notice, they find their admirer to be utterly repulsive.

John Major thinks this ad-hoc coalition is a bad idea and that's coming from a man who had sex with Edwina Curry

[Modern Panther]

I think it's now clear that christianity is not compatible with Traditional British Values.  Some people aren't willing to properly integrate, to accept our way of life and respect the sovereignty of British law over biblical law.

[Tjm86]

Not sure if it is Traditional British Values so much as Modern British Values.  For a long time traditional values have had their roots in Biblical teachings, albeit selective.  For some people of faith, reconciling the teachings of that faith with the values of secular society present a significant challenge.  Christianity's biggest problem is perhaps best demonstrated by the episode of the West Wing in which President Bartlett rips into a fundamentalist Christian Talk Show host laying out all of the inconsistencies in her position interpreting the old testament, to whit that she chose to selectively privilege certain teachings whilst ignoring others.  It is this kind of hypocrisy that tends to alienate people. 

Similarly it is possible to understand the offence that is caused by saying that homosexuality is a sin.  This ignores the fact that it is attacking a constituent part of some people's make up / identity.  The lack of understanding and recognition of this further undermines any hope of achieving some sort of understanding.  There is a lot to be said for the separation of church and state.

[Tjm86]

Whilst making political capital out of the Tragedy of the Grenfell Fire is obscene, it is starting to look like a lot of skeletons are dropping out of closets.  Nice one from BoJo to ponder.Nice one from BoJo to ponder.

At the risk of mixing metaphors, I do wonder if things are going to look even worse for the government once the smoke clears.

[Keef Monkey]

Few things turn me off a politician more than hearing Cameron or May (just as a couple of examples) talking about 'christian values' or referring to Britain as a 'christian country', because in using that sort of language they're excluding many of the people (possibly the majority these days?) they're supposed to be speaking for and representing. Christianity doesn't have the monopoly on decency, and when politicians speak like it does it's insulting, and shows how massively out of touch they are.

Trump's inauguration speech, with all that 'ra ra ra christianity first' rhetoric was pretty vomit-inducing.

[sheridan]

I think it's now clear that christianity is not compatible with Traditional British Values.  Some people aren't willing to properly integrate, to accept our way of life and respect the sovereignty of British law over biblical law.

It'd be funny if it wasn't true (witness fundamentalist christians turfing out gay married couples or refusing to bake wedding cakes).

[TordelBack]

...referring to Britain as a 'christian country', because in using that sort of language they're excluding many of the people (possibly the majority these days?) they're supposed to be speaking for and representing.

In fairness to said politicians, they are serving as the parliament of an hereditary head of state who is un-coincidentally notional head of the Church of England: you can see how conflation might creep in. Even my own priest-ridden island doesn't go quite that far.

Christianity doesn't have the monopoly on decency...

This is the one that really gets my goat: there's a huge overtone of moral superiority - worse, exclusive ownership of inherent of decency -that almost automatically alienates.

[IndigoPrime]

It says everything about the Conservatives that when my MP retired, he 'came out'... as an atheist. He noted that had he done that before, his chances would have been slimmer, although he in hindsight regretted misleading the voters. Obviously.

[JayzusB.Christ]

...referring to Britain as a 'christian country', because in using that sort of language they're excluding many of the people (possibly the majority these days?) they're supposed to be speaking for and representing.

In fairness to said politicians, they are serving as the parliament of an hereditary head of state who is un-coincidentally notional head of the Church of England: you can see how conflation might creep in. Even my own priest-ridden island doesn't go quite that far.

Christianity doesn't have the monopoly on decency...

This is the one that really gets my goat: there's a huge overtone of moral superiority - worse, exclusive ownership of inherent of decency -that almost automatically alienates.

I remember reading a George Orwell book (The Road to Wigan Pier?) where he argued that socialism as an ideal was far more selfless than Christianity - the former (in theory) does benevolent acts for their own sake, while the latter always has the promise of a post-mortem reward that lasts forever.

I know history shows that neither of these ideas hold water entirely, just a bit of food for thought.

[Professor Bear]

Mutterings on social media about how senior LibDems have been having closed-doors meetings with senior Tories.  Tim Farron explicitly ruled out going back into coalition on his watch, so I guess this solves the great Did He Jump Or Was He Pushed? mystery.

[Jimmy Baker's Assistant]

Mutterings on social media about how senior LibDems have been having closed-doors meetings with senior Tories.  Tim Farron explicitly ruled out going back into coalition on his watch, so I guess this solves the great Did He Jump Or Was He Pushed? mystery.

I also saw this and I find it totally perplexing. The LibDems are not going to do any deals with the Tories.

[Tjm86]

I've got to ask.  Where has this been muttered?

[Jim_Campbell]

I've got to ask.  Where has this been muttered?

Westminster rumour mill, via Twitter. Now emphatically denied by LibDem press office.

So probably true, then...

[Tjm86]

To quote Blackadder:

"made a note in my diary on the way over.  Simply said, 'Bugger'"

[IndigoPrime]

Sounds unlikely but I'd rather see another Con/LD deal than con/DUP. But if the LDs are going to die on that hill, it'd better be for something worthwhile. At the very least, PR and EEA.