Last movie watched...

[TordelBack]

Picard has become darker and broodier...

Picard was always dark and broody,  but he was also a rational and measured Starfleet officer, and quite able to deal with the Borg on two previous post-Locutus occasions without turning psychotic - poor Ensign Lynch!  FC wants to be a sequel to BoBW,  but wants us to forget that there were 4 years of TV since then.  And I don't deny that Picard stuck up for his frequently-delinquent android officer,  but they were never pals - FC wants them to be Kirk and Spock. Beverley,  Deanna, Riker, Guinan and of course Wesley and Geordi were all more involved with Data on a regular basis.  Less so Woof.

And that's just Picard.  Riker is about the only guy that stays in character,  and he directed the thing! (Well maybe Barclay too).

[Professor Bear]

I remember thinking when I first watched Emissary that he was being a bit of an arsehole about the whole Locutus thing, and certainly lacked any humility about what he'd done to Sisko's family.  In retrospect, FC writer Ron Moore might have been deferring to the version of Picard that appeared on DS9, the Trek show into which Moore had the most input, but even allowing for that, Emissary Picard was still just kinda huffy, tbh, and it just comes off as one of Sir Pat's off days.

On the subject of "in order of quality" lists, someone on That There Twitter posted a list of the Star Wars films and his followers argued whether or not the guy was a misogynist because he'd put Force Awakens and Last Jedi at the bottom - he'd listed them in the order they'd come out.

[Tiplodocus]

I actually like First Contact because, for a while, it was the least "Star Trek" Star Trek thing around. Actually showing an epic story on epic scale with full on action scenes.

(I like Tale of Two Cities best as well. Dickens least Dickensian book).

I took the Picard going mental to be born of the fact that at that point in the movie, he has lost to the Borg. All his efforts for nothing. He's pretty rational and measured when he takes command of fleet to destroy the Borg cube.

And as for going to rescue Data, by that point I think it's more what Data represents, he is no longer willing to sacrifice any of the crew to achieve his goal.

Plus there's a scene where Data gets a 12 certificate blow job.

The rest of the TNG films do make Jean Luc more Die Hard than Picard though. But still retain enough elements for me.

[The Legendary Shark]

We're sailing close to needing a dedicated Star Trek thread, methinks...

[TordelBack]

I took the Picard going mental to be born of the fact that at that point in the movie, he has lost to the Borg. All his efforts for nothing.

This is sort-of my objection - Picard never reacted to defeat by losing his principles: and plenty have tried to break him before.  He gets angry, but he doesn't go no-surrender, full-on tommy-gunning members of his own crew. I know Lily lampshades the whole thing quite nicely, but I still don't know who this even-balder John McClane fellow is.  But then I don't know who the guy at the end of Generations is either.  At least I recognise him again in Insurrection.

Griping aside, First Contact is a well-made enjoyable film, with plenty of laughs and some really solid spectacle. Plus the titular event is about as cool as it could have been.  I've just cooled a lot from my one-time position of thinking it the best thing since sliced gagh.

[NapalmKev]

I thought Picard lost the plot because he could actually hear the Borg inside his head. He even blasts out some tunes to block their voices. Another thing could be that his single minded determination to destroy them is a counter-point to their single minded determination to assimilate the Human race. Or I could be reading far too much into it. Anyway, good film and one of my favourite in the series.

In other Trek news I have Star Trek Beyond waiting to be watched. I picked it up for a fiver in the newsagent. Been putting this off because I'm not a fan of the other two for reasons I won't drone on about, suffice to say I think they're awful for the most part. More details available on request.

The Motion Picture is also one of my faves despite the Brown and Cream 70's style uniforms. Throw in the political machinations in Undiscovered Country and you have a good Top three, IMO. All the other films have their good and, sometimes, excessively bad but they are all worth a watch.

Cheers

[Professor Bear]

I'd still rate it below a lot of the other Treks, but Beyond is up there as one of the fun ones, and of the three reboot movies, is the only one that has its heart in the right place - possibly to the point that Pine's Kirk feels too much like the original and we never got to see a satisfying transition from one to the other.
Mainly, Beyond was pretty great for me because I hated Into Darkness so much, as it works as a direct riposte to the shallowness of NuTrek up until that point by having Kirk figuratively and then literally battle a confused mess of a character that has nothing once you take away revenge as their motivation.  There's some meta stuff going on there, and while I did find some of it cringe-y, it wasn't cringe-y in the uncomfortable boob-grabbing/underwear-oogling way the previous movies were.

[Tiplodocus]

Not just a defeat in a battle though. He has utterly and completely lost all of humanity and the Federation. Everything he loves and holds dear. I don't  recall anything on that scale before. That's why I thought it worked.

[TordelBack]

Mainly, Beyond was pretty great for me because I hated Into Darkness so much, as it works as a direct riposte to the shallowness of NuTrek up until that point by having Kirk figuratively and then literally battle a confused mess of a character that has nothing once you take away revenge as their motivation. 

Yep,  I think that nails my feelings too.  Beyond also scores points with me because tries to recapture that feeling of Trek being in the far future: [spoiler]Krall and the Franklin dating from the birth of the Federation a century earlier, and the insanely Culture-ish Yorktown pushes Starfleet into new territory even for jaded 2018 eyes[/spoiler].

As to Tips' thoughts on Picard in FC: that's a very fair reading,  but I think we'll have to ATD there. For me it still feels like Picard is manouvered into being a veiny action hero to serve the story they want to tell.

[Greg M.]

For me it still feels like Picard is manouvered into being a veiny action hero to serve the story they want to tell.

Would I be right in remembering that some of that manouvering was done by Patrick Stewart himself, who relished the opportunity to do Die Hard Picard? (For the record, I think it's a competent enough film, but doesn't feel particularly Trek to me. Mind you, controversially, I'd say more or less the same thing about Wrath of Khan.)

[The Legendary Shark]

WoK feels close to the episode Balance of Terror to me - one of my all time favourites.

[Greg M.]

I think WoK is a good film in its own right, but it's so unrelentingly nasty, in a manner that, to me, seems too much for Star Trek. Dead bodies everywhere, Scotty's burnt-up nephew and that really upsetting bit when irradiated Spock walks into the glass. Grim.

[Hawkmumbler]

Breaking away from the Trek Talk Hour to cover some more of what Bolt-01, much to my delight, described as 'weird stuff' at Thought Bubble...

Black Sabbath aka The Mask of Satan dir. Mario Bava (1960)

One of the most influential of Gothic horrors, coming on the heals of Hammers Renaissance in the genre. A retelling of the Viy mythology of Russian folk lore, as a witch and her vampire cohorts are burnt at the stake for witchcraft and arise 200 years later. Moody, atmospheric, and delightfuly macabre, a must watch for horror aficionados.

La Bete aka The Beast dir. Walerian Borowczyk (1975)

Where to begin....it's a late entry into the French new wave....it's a deconstruction of the Beauty and the Beast tale.....it's considered the most sexually explicit none pornographic movie ever made, almost all of it highly taboo....it's not for everyone, but I loved the shit out of it. Sordid, highly critical of the Church, disturbing as shit. Great stuff for seasoned cinema hounds, but probably not recommended easily...

[Hawkmumbler]

Bugger it, Black SUNDAY not SABBATH. Thats an unrelated later Bava movie, starring Boris Karloff as a crypt keeper type character.

[The Legendary Shark]

Star Trek V: The Final Insult.



That is all.