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Author Topic: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back  (Read 1958 times)

Frank

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #15 on: 17 August, 2017, 01:52:00 pm »
I'm thinking of another interpretation of that title and it's not particularly flattering. 

Tips doesn't frequent the Prog Review, so I'll take this one. Ouroboros? Ourobollocks, more like.

the conflicting opinions about Vega sums up the character perfectly

To be fair, you and I are in a minority; most folk love her and the story. I was going to say I've never seen Zootropolis because I don't have kids, then I remembered I spent last Sunday afternoon watching Frozen on BBC1.

I like show tunes, okay.



Bolt-01

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #16 on: 17 August, 2017, 02:14:15 pm »
Frank- Zootropolis is a really good film- well worth a watch.

I, Cosh

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #17 on: 17 August, 2017, 02:34:48 pm »
I'm thinking of another interpretation of that title and it's not particularly flattering. 
Tips doesn't frequent the Prog Review, so I'll take this one. Ouroboros? Ourobollocks, more like.
The title Ouroboros could very easily refer to the endless cycle of frenzied reactions of comics fans and the impossible demands placed on the writer of a beloved character.
"This Dredd's not right."
<writer adjusts approach slightly>
"Too many references to the past. Write something new!"
<writer invents new character>
"Wait a minute! Dredd never acted like this with any of the old characters. BAH"
<Writer bangs head repeatedly on desk>

All of which is to say that I agree with everybody else. Breezy, enjoyably told story but Dredd seems to be letting her get away with a bit too much. I have a vague memory of trying to read ER Eddison as a fantasy-obsessed teenager but found it very hard going and threw it aside in favour of Sherri Tepper.

Highlights of the Prog are the return of Hope - not much happens but does so very atmospherically - and the boil coming to a head in Grey Area. Good to hear the latter will be back again in 2050 (the Prog, not the year.)

Elsewhere, The Alienist ups its game considerably and even Greysuit manages an amusing narrative device, which I believe is the highest praise I've ever been able to give it.
We never really die.

Tjm86

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #18 on: 17 August, 2017, 02:57:45 pm »
Fair point.  I think it is easy at times to invest perhaps a little too much.  To be fair, 'breezy' is probably an appropriate description of the story, aided by Marshall's usual high quality art work.   Let's face it, we've still got a loooong way to go to reach the nadir of the Millar / Ennis season.  Personally the parallels with the film mentioned would have worked a whole lot better if they had been a bit more blatant, I would suggest.  Perhaps it was just accidental that Carrol wrote a 'drug factory hidden on a train' mystery.   

I, Cosh

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #19 on: 17 August, 2017, 03:09:27 pm »
Personally the parallels with the film mentioned would have worked a whole lot better if they had been a bit more blatant, I would suggest.  Perhaps it was just accidental that Carrol wrote a 'drug factory hidden on a train' mystery.
Not seen either of the films in question so the things it reminded me of were the Ghosts Pirates of the Subway from Morrison's Seven Soldiers (and, therefore, undoubtedly somewhere else before) and the mobile crack lab from this Jello Biafra/DOA classic: Around our nation's capital, there's a freeway eight lanes wide...

Now I can't tell who stole what from where, when!
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Tjm86

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #20 on: 17 August, 2017, 03:14:15 pm »
That sounds like something from a future shock.  Bit of Bellardinelli art and we're away.

Colin YNWA

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #21 on: 17 August, 2017, 03:47:44 pm »
Frank- Zootropolis is a really good film- well worth a watch.

Ahem.

Frank

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #22 on: 17 August, 2017, 04:01:41 pm »
The title Ouroboros could very easily refer to the endless cycle of frenzied reactions of comics fans and the impossible demands placed on the writer of a beloved character.

You have valid all over your face. I've come to realise that whatever problems I have with post-Wagner Dredd are just my discomfort with the concept of house characters in general.

I'm going to let Dredd go in the same way I have Terminator, Aliens, and Star Wars.



Dark Jimbo

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #23 on: 17 August, 2017, 04:09:49 pm »
I've come to realise that whatever problems I have with post-Wagner Dredd...

Increasingly I think of Day of Chaos as more or less 'The End' of my Dredd - Wagner's final flourish in the grand Rise and Fall of Mega-City One that he's been writing all these years. Then follows 'The Epilogue Years' - Trifecta, Titan/Enceladus, Dark Justice, Ladykiller, et al - a gradual wrapping-up and leave-taking of the secondary characters.

But who knows, in five years I might tell you I was talking rubbish.

Frank

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #24 on: 17 August, 2017, 05:02:26 pm »
Increasingly I think of Day of Chaos as more or less 'The End' of my Dredd - Wagner's final flourish in the grand Rise and Fall of Mega-City One that he's been writing all these years. Then follows 'The Epilogue Years' - Trifecta, Titan/Enceladus, Dark Justice, Ladykiller, et al - a gradual wrapping-up and leave-taking of the secondary characters.

That's very well expressed, and sums up my own feelings. If that final episode of Day Of Chaos had ended with Dredd going down with his city, it would have capped off the strip perfectly.*

No disrespect intended towards the publishers and fellow readers who aren't as desperately precious as myself - and are enjoying the work of the talented creators tasked with continuing the strip's odd afterlife - but that's my lot.


* ... and made Dredd something special in the world of four colour characters who go on forever.

Greg M.

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #25 on: 17 August, 2017, 06:04:03 pm »
That's very well expressed, and sums up my own feelings. If that final episode of Day Of Chaos had ended with Dredd going down with his city, it would have capped off the strip perfectly.

I'm pretty much with you guys on this one. I've said before that the logical follow-on to Day of Chaos seems, to me, to be a massive overhaul and effective dismantling of the judges in their current form - an end of an era that could indeed be symbolised by Joe's passing. However, that's totally incompatible with the future of Dredd as a house character, wherein the illusion of change, Marvel-style, may be all that awaits.

TordelBack

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #26 on: 17 August, 2017, 11:30:12 pm »
That's very well expressed, and sums up my own feelings. If that final episode of Day Of Chaos had ended with Dredd going down with his city, it would have capped off the strip perfectly.

I'm pretty much with you guys on this one. I've said before that the logical follow-on to Day of Chaos seems, to me, to be a massive overhaul and effective dismantling of the judges in their current form - an end of an era that could indeed be symbolised by Joe's passing. However, that's totally incompatible with the future of Dredd as a house character, wherein the illusion of change, Marvel-style, may be all that awaits.

Agree with the lot of you. It is impossible for me to read DoC (which I did again just last week) and not think that it's the end of the status quo, and the start of a whole new era for the scraps of  MC-1 that survive. An era which never came.

IndigoPrime

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #27 on: 18 August, 2017, 10:00:13 am »
Prog 2044 showed up today. How bizarre. I usually get the Prog on a Saturday (perhaps 80% of the time). Very, very rarely, the Friday before, and sometimes the Monday afterwards. The odd Prog has slipped to Tuesday, and a handful to Wednesday. I've never had one as late as Friday before. Hotshots to the Royal Mail, please.

As for DoC, it feels almost like the opposite of the Apocalypse War. Whereas that epic very obviously impacted on Mega-City One for years, it often seems like business as usual with DoC, when the city should be on its knees. Perhaps that doesn't make for the stories the writers want to write. In hindsight, it's a pity they didn't edit the Wagner figures – hack back MC1 by a third, give it a bloody nose, and make it known it wasn't invincible.

Leigh S

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #28 on: 18 August, 2017, 10:11:28 am »
They have had chances though - I thought every Empire Falls would ahve been greatly improved by Dredd not blowing everyone up, but merely driving Oswin(?) back to teas City leaving an uneasy sense of "until next time", as per the Pirates of the Black Atlantic ending.

Wagner has the Mechanismo storyline dangling, and it would be a perfect way to post script an "end" to Dredd - he is still stubbornly refusing to accept the City is lost as it was - Hershey knows better - bang flash wallop, bobs your uncle and Wagner could do what Wagner does best by wrongfooting us all the way to a powerful conclusion.


jabish

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Re: Prog 2044 - The Magic is back
« Reply #29 on: 18 August, 2017, 01:07:16 pm »
Agree with the lot of you. It is impossible for me to read DoC (which I did again just last week) and not think that it's the end of the status quo, and the start of a whole new era for the scraps of  MC-1 that survive. An era which never came.

Absolutely agree too. I just read DoC myself again and it's a stunning piece of work and really feels like John Wagner is handing the other writers of the strip a whole new ball park to play in. He had already dropped a bombshell with Fargo's last words and here was an opportunity to really examine what would happen to that system if a city was decimated. As Wagner said in an interview when asked what to expect from the next Dredd epic: 'Another writer'. He knew he was going to be stepping back and so he set up a situation for others which was ripe for interesting new stories. Unfortunately I don't think they took the ball and ran with it properly. Recently Dredd has been one of the weaker strips in the prog. Some of the one offs have been nice but I'm done with secret ninjas and multiple hanging plotlines and sorry I know some people liked it but I thought Ouroboros was very weak. Harvey on the other hand was terrific and while it did leave a hanging plotline it was a really satisfying story in and of itself. The Judge Pin story recently was good but felt like the first two parts of a 6-part story. Can we not just have the 6-part story? Dredd now as a strip with so many writers all with different takes and ongoing stories needs a firmer hand editorially. A showrunner if you will. 2000ad has prided itself over the years on creative freedom but in this case it's leading to something which is unsatisfying and a bit frustrating at times.

But with all that said we're about to get a new John Wagner and Dan Cornwell Dredd strip next week so that's something to look forward to big time. Rok of The Reds was one of the most enjoyable comics I've read in ages. People ask why something like that wasn’t in the prog, but why would John, Alan and Dan create a new character for 2000ad which they would own none of the copyright to? Is that why we are seeing more revivals of old characters and original creators being replaced on strips they are synonymous with? Possibly. Only tharg knows.

Otherwise Grey Area is just great, Hope is nice change in genre for 2000ad, The Alienist is more interesting this time round, Greysuit I'll enjoy later (with Pat Mills stories I save them and read em in one go as I find they always read better that way), delighted that they've started doing recap pages for some returning strips that's so much better for new readers, bravo, and we've seen some stunning art in the prog recently too. Still worth my subscription? Of course. Its just if Dredd is their flagship strip it needs more focus.

Just my two pence

JB