Prog 2154 - Combat Shock!

[JayzusB.Christ]

I'm kind of glad that I have this forum to fill me in on bits that I've either forgotten or not understood.  I'd forgotten about the grandchildren remark, and indeed that Byke was possessed.

Really, really enjoying Guatemala. It has the potential to be a classic on the level of Mandroid or Sin City (the Dredd one, obviously, not the one that steered Frank Miller to becoming a lecherous old racist).

[Jim_Campbell]

none of this has been made explicit yet, so patience is in order!

Potentially spoilery speculation: [spoiler]My money is on Hershey having had a child the old-fashioned way and the 'other mother' reference is because she had the child adopted by someone in the (pre-robot takeover) safer environs of Guatemala, beyond the reach of those who might try to attack her as Chief Judge by targetting her child.

This would explain Dredd's uncharacteristically equivocal response to being propositioned. The realisation that everyone he respected or thought of as a friend (Fargo, Giant, now Hershey) thought the celibacy rule was bloody stupid and basically ignored it might give him pause, in the later stage of his life, to ponder a very different life that might have been his.[/spoiler]

And if any of that turns out to be correct, that's some heavyweight shit I certainly wasn't expecting from this story.

[Mikey]

Just called by to say how excellent I think the prog is right now.

Having Brink would be enough for me, but add in Hope, the current Dredd and by crikey it's hitting the very top. I'm enjoying Deadworld a lot and Defoe is going grand but they can't compete with that triumvir of Thrills.

Regarding Dredd - my jaw actually dropped a bit. And that would be my thoughts too Jim. Hard to not draw the inference from 'I can't do that'.

[Frank]

I assumed this mini-Hershey and CJ Hershey were clones of the same old lady (also called Hershey), but Wagner does love a bit of the old U-J, too.

If mini-Hershey was the product of a night of passion, I'm not sure why there'd be another lady (Hershey's age or older) in Guatemala.

Beeny says CJ Hershey was* also mini-Hershey's mother. I took that to mean in the clone-mother sense, but I suppose a naturally conceived mini-Hershey could have been left with a relative she thought of as her mother.





Either way, it's pretty exciting - when's the last time you can remember us all having one of these conversations, where we're so excited to find out what happens next we take to the internet to spout fan theories, like all those Youtubers who were convinced Rey=English=Kenobi?


MAIN CHARACTERS WHO TURNED OUT TO HAVE SECRET KIDS (Wagner)

Rico, Giant, Mean Angel, Fink Angel, Chopper (turned out not to be), Kimble (adopted)


CHARACTERS WHO TURNED OUT TO HAVE SECRET CLONES (Wagner)

Dredd, Owen Krysler, Sinfield


Can't mention secret clones without crediting The Internet's Ian Hollingsworth** who points out Megazine readers have already been treated to a story about Hershey's secret clone - Nurture, by Williams & Holden (Meg 339). I'd never read that story before.


* Actually, Beeny uses the present tense - "there is another woman called Hershey". Gentlemen, start your theories.

** Surely the supreme authority on all things 2000ad (including tat and editorial content)

[dweezil2]

Maybe she's Dredd and Hershey 's child!
The sly old dog!!!!

[radiator]

I'm betting clone - Beeny remarks something to the effect that she looks like she could be Hershey's double.

Intriguing - didn't see this development coming at all, but it does make Hershey's deathbed request of putting down the robot rebellion make a lot more sense given that there's clearly more going on here.

[radiator]

Although reading Jim's speculation makes me think he may be on to something...

[Frank]

Maybe she's Dredd and Hershey 's child! The sly old dog!!!!

Or maybe Dredd's "I can't do that" was a literal statement of the truth. Get your prostate checked, guys.

[dweezil2]

Maybe she's Dredd and Hershey 's child! The sly old dog!!!!

Or maybe Dredd's "I can't do that" was a literal statement of the truth. Get your prostate checked, guys.

Dredd doing an impotence commercial would be quite something!!!! 

"These days it's not just my daystick that stays hard or my lawgiver that fires straight and true!"

[Frank]

No ED for JD

[TordelBack]

I'd like to think this is simpler than we're making out - any scandal involving children would surely have come to light during one of the three Chief Judge elections she contested. The 'other Hershey' is either a twin sister, or Hershey herself is one of a number of clones (seems unlikely, I seem to recall reference to her parents), or a clone of Hershey started when she herself was still at the Academy.

By my reckoning Hershey was around 60 at the time of her death in 2141, having been a recent Academy graduate in 2102(?), during the Judge Child mission. We know that Justice Dept had taken samples of he DNA for cloning, as they did with many exemplary judges (and Sinfield) - she actually ends up executing one of her own clones grown from one such stolen sample in the Rob Williams story referenced in Franks post.

So let's say Elionara is early 30s at the very youngest, born around 2110, having kids around 2127-2129 (12-14). If she's the child of a Justice Dept Hershey clone (born 2090s) of Barbara Hershey, that clone would have to have been started while Barbs was still in the academy, accelerated, and possibly washed out of the Academy young (maybe a UJ pregnancy?). 

This all seems a bit too  unlikely: the simplest answer has to be that the 'other Hershey' is either a twin sister, or Hershey herself was one of a number of clones.

Or time travel. There's always time travel.

[Frank]

... the simplest answer has to be that the 'other Hershey' is either a twin sister, or Hershey herself was one of a number of clones

Star Wars fan reckons it's all about twins! When I said 'clone-mother' (above), I meant in the same sense that Dredd's Vienna's clone-father. Or maybe the sense that Rico and Dredd* could be described as Rico II's clone-fathers.

CJ Hershey could have been cloned from the old lady called Hershey, who gave natural birth to mini-Hershey (the Dredd>Vienna relationship)

Or they could all be clones (the Rico/Dredd>RicoII relationship) and Beeny only used the word mother to refer to the emotional relationship between mini-Hershey and the old, dead Hershey who raised her.

Regarding stuff we know about CJ Hershey's origins, the Admirable Hollingsworth dimly remembers something about a sister from one of those Megazine solo stories and the sequence below in From The Ashes (Meg 3.74)**





* and Fargo and Kraken

** Neither were by John Wagner, and we know how beholden he feels to developments originating with other authors.

[Frank]

CJ Hershey could have been cloned from the old lady called Hershey, who gave natural birth to mini-Hershey (the Dredd>Vienna relationship)

That doesn't work.

CJ Hershey and the old lady called Hershey (who gave natural birth to mini-Hershey) could have been cloned from the same source (the Dredd>Vienna relationship)


apologies for the double-post

[Tiplodocus]

Well I'm all up to date now and it's been a pretty good 4/5 for me in this run.

DREDD, BRINK and HOPE press all of my buttons all of the time, yet each is so different. DREDD is especially good at the moment - as the speculation above testifies. But let's shout Colin's art particularly for the emotional heft he gets into it.

I really don't like the art and storytelling in DEFOE. And i have problems with the storytelling in DEFOE (but some of the individual panels are brilliant).

[DrJomster]

What to add to the above? This is good proggage!

Hope Book One is on sale at the moment... I think I might have to pick up a copy. Largely driven off how well Book 2 is coming along.

As for Dredd and Brink, crikey blimey they're on good form. Defoe and Deadworld too are rather good.