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Red Dwarf XII

Started by Greg M., 13 October, 2017, 05:57:57 PM

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Greg M.

"Playing soft rock? That's never the right thing to do!"

The Boys from the Dwarf return in 'Cured', an episode which has all the strengths and all the flaws of the series XI episodes - not too surprising, given XI and XII were all shot at the same time.  On the plus side - feels like classic Dwarf, Cat is up-front and centre, and Lister jamming with you-know-who is going to be hard to forget. On the other hand, it starts to unravel in the later stages and has one of show's now-patented super-abrupt endings. (Feels like it needs a closing speech from Lister on the subject of evil, in the manner of his closing monologue in 'Justice'.)

Still great fun though, and on balance more plus than minus - I liked it better than XI's opener.

von Boom

It was a good opener. Hitler if fucking metal?! \m/ When Hitler threw the devil horns I was eating and choked I was laughing so hard. The Happy Wanderer section was priceless.

I think this could be a very, very good series.

Adrian Bamforth

Would have preferred it if they had said:

"Why haven't they reconstructed Hitler?"
"Too soon."

sheridan

Quote from: von Boom on 13 October, 2017, 06:08:51 PM
It was a good opener. Hitler if fucking metal?! \m/ When Hitler threw the devil horns I was eating and choked I was laughing so hard. The Happy Wanderer section was priceless.

I think this could be a very, very good series.

He reminded me of Hitler from Preacher...

CrazyFoxMachine

Quote from: Greg M. on 13 October, 2017, 05:57:57 PM
On the other hand, it starts to unravel in the later stages and has one of show's now-patented super-abrupt endings.

Good consensus generally I'd agree with it - still ambling along pleasantly with enough laughs and inventiveness to keep it from being depressing but yeah, again the major issue tends to be structuring. Cured was a solid enough episode but rather predictable. [spoiler]We figured it was the scientist who was evil from when he first appeared.[/spoiler]

I must say though - we did manage to watch the second one already and it's genuinely a belter! [spoiler]Surprisingly had a solid ending scene as well![/spoiler]

von Boom

Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 15 October, 2017, 11:46:49 AM
Quote from: Greg M. on 13 October, 2017, 05:57:57 PM
On the other hand, it starts to unravel in the later stages and has one of show's now-patented super-abrupt endings.

Good consensus generally I'd agree with it - still ambling along pleasantly with enough laughs and inventiveness to keep it from being depressing but yeah, again the major issue tends to be structuring. Cured was a solid enough episode but rather predictable. [spoiler]We figured it was the scientist who was evil from when he first appeared.[/spoiler]

I must say though - we did manage to watch the second one already and it's genuinely a belter! [spoiler]Surprisingly had a solid ending scene as well![/spoiler]

The second episode starts really strong and stays there pretty much. Really enjoyable.

Jimmy Baker's Assistant

Agree that the first two episodes of XII were both pretty good.

So far this series seems to be stronger than XI, which I found to be a bit too much like a greatest hits remix album.

James Stacey

Enjoyed the first ep more than the xi series. I'd like them to explore more the concept that 3 million years have passed rather than always be a 2x00C ship/research base but I understand budget and ascetic are against them there. It was a core concept of the first season and has been largely forgotten since then :) My only gripe is [spoiler]Why must every episode have a ship/base that has been there for millions of years suddenly be destroyed within hours of the small rouge one appearing? [/spoiler] If there are some knowing nods to it or it becomes an episode plot point, all good. Otherwise its a lazy motivator (which wasn't even needed in the last episode for any good reason).
Loads of fun though, really glad its still kicking ass all these years later.

Greg M.

Not sure what to make of 'Siliconia'. (Yes, I waited a week to watch it.) I thought it started brilliantly - the opening set of gags featuring Kryten being harassed were great, particularly the bit with Lister, which was the comedy highlight of the episode. As it went on, I felt that (yet again) too much was being crammed in - but you certainly can't fault Doug Naylor for ambition. However, I didn't like [spoiler]the Deus Ex Machina ending at all, however good the sfx were.[/spoiler] Interesting that Craig Charles - the best actor in the programme - made least impact as a mechanoid. Maybe acting through that outfit requires a broader style such as that employed by Chris and Danny.

And as for the continuity call-backs - that must be the most any episode's ever indulged in. Lister's spaceborne guitar makes this kind of a sequel to 'Fathers and Suns' (why didn't he just borrow one of Hitler's guitars from the last episode?), but we had fan-pleasing references to Kryten's ability to lie, The Om Song and even a brief "Smee-hee!"

Overall? Not quite there, but a noble attempt, and with enough to recommend it. I suspect the back-end of this series is going to turn out to be the best, as that's where the Rimmer-centric episodes seem to be lurking.

Dark Jimbo

Aye, an awful lot to like but a fair few bits that didn't quite work.

Loved all the continuity callbacks, and the episode looked fantastic - but so much about the mechanoids (and Siliconia especially) were just not explained properly. Best thing about it for me was (small surprise) Rimmer's story; finding peace and contentment in servitude was a fascinating way to take the character, but it was a subplot that went absolutely nowhere. Still, a success overall. Think I prefer Series XI to XII so far, though...
@jamesfeistdraws

Greg M.

Quote from: Dark Jimbo on 20 October, 2017, 11:56:40 AM
Best thing about it for me was (small surprise) Rimmer's story

Agreed - Rimmer's been well-served by the Dave era. We've gotten a lot of insight into different facets of his character, as well as a fair bit of development. (Series X's 'The Beginning' remains the high point of contemporary Dwarf.)

von Boom

[spoiler]7.6 mm thinner, 10 grams lighter, and that cool matte finish (so cool)[/spoiler]. That was one of the highlights for me.

JamesC

I loved the 'left turn only' stuff.
Chris Barrie's Kryten impression was brilliant.
The MILF's support group was hilarious and I was greatly amused by the whole 'beret and shades' look.

Keef Monkey

Yeah, the left turn gag got the biggest laugh in our living room too. Was another okay episode, interesting to see some comments that it's an improvement on series XI, because we found that to be really top drawer vintage Dwarf right from the get-go, and while I'm enjoying this season a lot it isn't hitting the mark for me yet the way XI did.

Still decent Dwarf though, still enjoying it and still think it's great that it's still going and isn't bad.

Greg M.

Just realised I missed one of the cleverest continuity callbacks of all - [spoiler]Rimmer's childhood desire to be a carefree fish is a reference to his "I am a fish!" Astro-navigation exam attempt, mentioned in the very first episode of Red Dwarf, hinting that, subconsciously, he doesn't really want to be an officer at all. [/spoiler]That's a great bit of writing from Naylor.