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General Chat => Books & Comics => Topic started by: Frank on 21 November, 2016, 01:55:35 pm

Title: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 21 November, 2016, 01:55:35 pm
.
So many great nuggets of information are mentioned in passing round here, remembered only by a few and never seen again, I thought it would be a good idea to have one place to post information or artwork that didn't make the edit on the official history of 2000ad.

This is the detail that set me off on this train of thought; how could John Smith have been interviewed about the history of 2000ad without mentioning he almost became Tharg? *


reproduced with permission

(http://i.imgur.com/WJQciId.png?3)
(http://i.imgur.com/bInvRxg.png?3)


* I asked a follow up question, but I'm working on the assumption that Smith was offered the role following the departure of McKenzie. The Burton/McKenzie succession seemed an orderly one, and Smith says it was pre-internet - which rules out Tharg's Bishop/Diggle regeneration.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Colin YNWA on 21 November, 2016, 06:59:48 pm
Wow that's a fantastic tit-bit. Who knows where that would have taken the comic, but I wish I would visit the alternative reality where that did happen.

We'd only get 2000ad once in a blue moon. But by God when it came out it'd be fantastic!
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: GordonR on 21 November, 2016, 07:09:13 pm
Scavenging screen-grab scraps from people's FB pages.

Classy.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 21 November, 2016, 07:35:29 pm
Who knows where that would have taken the comic, but I wish I would visit the alternative reality where that did happen. We'd only get 2000ad once in a blue moon. But by God when it came out it'd be fantastic!

Ha! I'm not sure Smith would have tried to write every story himself - that was Alan McKenzie.

Be careful what you wish for. Steve said he talked to Smith about the role in 1986 - when MacManus was leaving to travel around the USA. If Smith had gone into editorial then, we might never have seen Tyranny Rex or Indigo Prime.

I'd have loved to see which direction traditional series would have taken under Smith - Rogue Trooper would surely have turned out much better - and whether nascent strips, like Zenith might have gone even more gonzo. Sean Phillips would have got a lot of work.

LINK FOR POSTERITY AND THOSE WHO DO THE FACEBOOK (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=235390536880695&id=100012292516860&comment_id=235408146878934&comment_tracking=%7B%22tn%22%3A%22R%22%7D)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Leigh S on 21 November, 2016, 08:54:28 pm
Interesting stuff...

Having a writer as editor makes sense in retrospect, but at that time how much writing had John Smith got under his belt - might have lost out a good few tales from John, at a time when they were more needed than most times!
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Hawkmumbler on 21 November, 2016, 09:51:56 pm
Scavenging screen-grab scraps from people's FB pages.

Classy.
Eeerrr, sorry Gordon but you DID see the bit in the post where McManus said he was cool with it? And, not to speak presumptuously, but I hardly think John Smith woult have umbrage with it either...

On the matter itself, blimey, what a view into the mouth if madness. Smith as manager?! The comic would be printed on technicolour card to induce trippy experiences.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 21 November, 2016, 10:07:18 pm
The comic would be printed on technicolour card to induce trippy experiences

Not far wrong! Smith got back (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=362719710743060&id=100010151010151&comment_id=362780780736953&notif_t=feed_comment&notif_id=1479758878036078) to say he would have turned it into a horror comic, rather than sci-fi - and predicted he'd have run it into the ground.

I reckon it would have been worth the ride - we know he would have had done a fantastic editing job on Chronos Carnival ...


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: ZenArcade on 21 November, 2016, 10:13:20 pm
An alternate years 1992 - 2000 prog....a la John Smith. Man the mind boggles. Z
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Tony Angelino on 21 November, 2016, 10:19:26 pm
I've only ever understood parts of John Smith's stories. Always found his stuff hard to follow. Can't imagine what he would have been like as an editor.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: dweezil2 on 21 November, 2016, 10:25:21 pm
"Free (ornamental) bong for every reader!"  :o
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: ZenArcade on 21 November, 2016, 10:25:34 pm
Well it wouldn't have been dull that's for sure. His work from 87 - 93 was in my opinion ground breaking and has seldom if ever been surpassed. Z
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Fungus on 22 November, 2016, 10:01:59 am
I've only ever understood parts of John Smith's stories. Always found his stuff hard to follow. Can't imagine what he would have been like as an editor.

Often skip his stuff.
Editorship seems - from memoirs and the like - to be a reasonably thankless and much tougher role than the younger me ever assumed. JS and his output don't say 'editor' to me. Although the history of Thargship is filled with randomness and odd turns...
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 22 November, 2016, 09:51:57 pm
So many great nuggets of information are mentioned in passing round here, remembered only by a few and never seen again, I thought it would be a good idea to have one place to post information or artwork that didn't make the edit on the official history of 2000ad.

This is exactly the kind of thing I had in mind when I typed those words. Thanks to Cal Hab for posting this on the Luke Kirby (https://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=43933.msg937259#msg937259) thread; much of the main post was in Thrillpower Overload, but the comments section features new information from McKenzie.

It was his recollections on the question of assigning copyright (and the legality of that famous cheque/docket system) that leapt off the page:


Quote
When Fleetway was first looking into selling the film rights to some of "its" intellectual properties, both Ridway and I were approached to sign an assignment of copyright which would "confirm" Fleetway's ownership of the Luke Kirby character.

(I refused but) because of the increasing desperation Fleetway were demonstrating (I'd been told by friends inside Fleetway that MD Frank Knau had sent round an email effectively blacklisting me for refusing to sign his document) I thought I'd better investigate the legal position.

As a member of the National Union of Journalists (still am!) I checked the situation with their legal department. Seems that, in a way, Fleetway was in part right. Legally, if not morally.

When I discussed the position with the NUJ legal department, they said that Fleetway might have a claim to the copyright in the published Luke Kirby stories in their existing form, but that to exploit the character further they would need at least my assignment of copyright.

However, they were also quite clear that the ownership of the characters rested with the original creator and that this would certainly apply to any use of the character in the future, as well as to retellings of the published stories in other formats, including screen or prose.

And of course, I couldn't consent to that.

Fleetway have also tried to assert that all freelance payment cheques were issued with a stamp on the back that said the undersigned relinquishes all claims to copyright and that the payee had to sign the back of the cheque in order to cash it. The NUJ pointed out to me that a cheque is a promise of payment and that no one can add conditions to that payment after the fact. No bank can enforce that condition and copyright extracted from creators on that basis will not hold up in court.

Copyright is always vested in the creator of an intellectual property until it is actively signed away by the creator. Fleetway's panicked attempts to get creators to sign "confirmations" that Fleetway was the copyright holder on 2000AD characters clearly points out that they knew the legal situation full well and were using the carrot of a tv or movie adaptation down the line (which of course didn't happen) to get creators to retrospectively relinquish their legal rights.

http://viciousimagery.blogspot.co.uk/2007/02/28-days-of-2000-ad-271-john-ridgway.html (http://viciousimagery.blogspot.co.uk/2007/02/28-days-of-2000-ad-271-john-ridgway.html)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 11 December, 2016, 08:52:25 pm
.
Thanks to the handsome and charismatic Roger Blake and Glyn Robinson-Byrne and their 2000ad Facebook Discussion Group (click to join (https://www.facebook.com/groups/2000adDiscussion/permalink/1544855875675611/)) we can add some footnotes to Steve MacManus's excellent Mighty One tome (still available in all good stores (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mighty-One-Inside-Nerve-Centre/dp/1781084750)).

An abridged version of Steve's generously detailed, warm and personable replies:


Quote
The visual reference that accompanied the script in which Anderson first appears (actually written for the Dredd dummy) [1] showed a woman in a black leather catsuit with a zip pulled halfway down, revealing an ample sized bosom.

In the Robo-Hunter series Play It Again, Sam, Ian Gibson drew Maggie Thatcher with a truly supersized Gerald Scarfe type nose – it was like Concorde. But I cravenly had the art team scratch it down a peg or two. And this nose was everywhere.

The Summer Special with art by Casanovas was so late I forced his agent to fly to Spain and back in a day to wrench the pages from his grasp. I had to – there was no other material to take its place as the special was a different size from the weekly.

My proudest moment was when the printed copies of the First Judge Dredd annual arrived in the office. This was my baby from cover to cover, although I misread the colour page allocation, which is why one of the stories is split.

I regret not saving Zenith for Crisis, commissioning that unfunny back page strip whose title escapes me (the one by Chris Stevens), and selling the Bisley Batman Promo Page for £250.00

Original art came back from the printer in a big parcel and we just chucked it in a corner of the office. Eventually, it was taken over to the fabled Fleetway archive library, where it was unpacked and stored. When the artists began to have their art returned, Robin Smith would package it up nicely for them.

In the beginning, all work was commissioned on a work for hire basis, attracting single payment based on a page rate. No further payments, no royalties, reprint fees, etc.

When it came to creating Crisis I lobbied for, and got, an improvement on these terms, which was enshrined in a contract given to each contributor to Crisis.

The copyright remained with Fleetway, but in addition to the page rate royalties kicked in on sales above certain figure. 50,000 copies sold I believe. In this sense the page rate became a non-returnable advance on any future royalties falling due.

In addition, we made provision for a payment to be made if the work was reprinted in the UK or syndicated to Europe and the world. if there was a graphic novel compilation the royalties would be paid on every copy sold – just like a book.

Finally, provision was made for creators to share in any audio/visual exploitation of the work, such as television, film and radio.

Above all, provision was made for creators to share in merchandise revenues. I think the merchandise split was 50% to the publisher and 50% split between the writer/creator and artist/creator. The syndication revenue to the contributors was 35% of net receipts. Reprint fees were around £10-15 per page.

When the company decided to extend the deal to 2000 AD contributors, a whole new contract was written and it ran to several pages!

My role as Managing Editor of the 2000ad Group concerned hiring staff to work on the editorial team. In terms of creative input, I offered none. Richard and Alan commissioned 2000 AD’s content with design by Steve Cook. On the Megazine, Dave Bishop assembled a new creative crew, drawn from Scotland in the main and I applaud him for it.

I let both editorial teams get on with it! Later came Sonic and Red Dwarf and other titles following the merger with London Editions. To be fair, I don’t think there was much use in the role of Managing Editor, but what else could I do?

https://www.facebook.com/groups/2000adDiscussion/permalink/1544855875675611/


[1] Steve might be conflating the visual reference Wagner supplied to Bolland for Anderson's 2000ad debut appearance - in the very first Judge Death story - and her first solo strip - The Four Dark Judges - which was originally scheduled to appear in the aborted 1985 Dredd monthly.

Obviously, the only visual reference Brett Ewins would have needed for The Four Dark Judges was Bolland's previous strips.


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Leigh S on 11 December, 2016, 09:02:48 pm
.
Thanks to the handsome and charismatic Roger Blake and Glyn Robinson-Byrne and their 2000ad Facebook Discussion Group (click to join (https://www.facebook.com/groups/2000adDiscussion/permalink/1544855875675611/)) we can add some footnotes to Steve MacManus's excellent Mighty One tome (still available in all good stores (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mighty-One-Inside-Nerve-Centre/dp/1781084750)).

An abridged version of Steve's generously detailed, warm and personable replies:


Quote
The visual reference that accompanied the script in which Anderson first appears (actually written for the Dredd dummy) [1] showed a woman in a black leather catsuit with a zip pulled halfway down, revealing an ample sized bosom.



https://www.facebook.com/groups/2000adDiscussion/permalink/1544855875675611/


[1] Steve might be conflating the visual reference Wagner supplied to Bolland for Anderson's 2000ad debut appearance - in the very first Judge Death story - and her first solo strip - The Four Dark Judges - which was originally scheduled to appear in the aborted 1985 Dredd monthly.

Obviously, the only visual reference Brett Ewins would have needed for The Four Dark Judges was Bolland's previous strips.

From, erm... memory, that's it...very vague memory,  isn't there a panel in the Four  Dark Judges episode of Anderson doing up her uniform? So the error on Mac1 part might be the talk of it being her debut...
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 11 December, 2016, 09:08:39 pm

[1] Steve might be conflating the visual reference Wagner supplied to Bolland for Anderson's 2000ad debut appearance - in the very first Judge Death story - and her first solo strip - The Four Dark Judges - which was originally scheduled to appear in the aborted 1985 Dredd monthly.


Wasn't it originally fortnightly rather than monthly?




Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Leigh S on 11 December, 2016, 09:17:38 pm
.
Thanks to the handsome and charismatic Roger Blake and Glyn Robinson-Byrne and their 2000ad Facebook Discussion Group (click to join (https://www.facebook.com/groups/2000adDiscussion/permalink/1544855875675611/)) we can add some footnotes to Steve MacManus's excellent Mighty One tome (still available in all good stores (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mighty-One-Inside-Nerve-Centre/dp/1781084750)).

An abridged version of Steve's generously detailed, warm and personable replies:


Quote
The visual reference that accompanied the script in which Anderson first appears (actually written for the Dredd dummy) [1] showed a woman in a black leather catsuit with a zip pulled halfway down, revealing an ample sized bosom.



https://www.facebook.com/groups/2000adDiscussion/permalink/1544855875675611/


[1] Steve might be conflating the visual reference Wagner supplied to Bolland for Anderson's 2000ad debut appearance - in the very first Judge Death story - and her first solo strip - The Four Dark Judges - which was originally scheduled to appear in the aborted 1985 Dredd monthly.

Obviously, the only visual reference Brett Ewins would have needed for The Four Dark Judges was Bolland's previous strips.

From, erm... memory, that's it...very vague memory,  isn't there a panel in the Four  Dark Judges episode of Anderson doing up her uniform? So the error on Mac1 part might be the talk of it being her debut...

Actually, it is just a misreading I think - no error on Mac1s part:  When Anderson first appears in that strip, rather than her first appearance ever

(Page 2 bottom left, so near enough when she first appears)
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 11 December, 2016, 09:24:16 pm
[1] Steve might be conflating the visual reference Wagner supplied to Bolland for Anderson's 2000ad debut appearance - in the very first Judge Death story - and her first solo strip - The Four Dark Judges - which was originally scheduled to appear in the aborted 1985 Dredd monthly[/size].

Wasn't it originally fortnightly rather than monthly?

You're right; Thrillpower Overload, p.99. I was thinking of the proposed adult 2000ad spin-off, Zarjaz.


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 11 December, 2016, 09:25:54 pm
I was thinking of the proposed adult 2000ad spin-off, Zarjaz.

Sounds too close to Razzle or Jizz.

Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 11 December, 2016, 09:31:35 pm
I was thinking of the proposed adult 2000ad spin-off, Zarjaz.

Sounds too close to Razzle or Jizz.

They could have printed the visual reference for Anderson. In TPO, MacManus and Sanders are quoted as saying the fortnightly schedule and the price were among the reasons the Dredd comic was canned -

"Nobody's going to pay 35p for a comic!"


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 17 December, 2016, 07:12:15 pm
.
(http://i.imgur.com/XYJMIm8.png?1)


"WRITERS"

I initially thought that Strontium Dog image was from Rage, which would date the fantastic letterhead to just before the end of TB Grover's career, but the mention of Kaleb Daark places it before 1985.

According to Professor Google, Daark was a Wagner/Grant (and, presumably, Ewins) creation for Games Workshop. He only appeared in a couple of strips (http://www.solegends.com/citcomp3/citcomp3073-02.htm), due to a dispute over ownership of the character.

Fans of irony will want to cut out and keep the following quote:

Quote
Whoever arranged the deal didn’t think to make it clear that the work would be (Games Workshop) property – the author claimed ownership of the IP and GW had to abandon it. Clash of cultures really – in the games industry us poor games writers are used to this kind of thing – not so in the world of comics.

Rick Priestly, quoted by the Realm Of Chaos blog (http://realmofchaos80s.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/the-malignancy-of-malal-solving-mystery.html)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: TordelBack on 17 December, 2016, 11:32:03 pm
According to Professor Google, Daark was a Wagner/Grant (and, presumably, Ewins) creation for Games Workshop. He only appeared in a couple of strips (http://www.solegends.com/citcomp3/citcomp3073-02.htm), due to a dispute over ownership of the character.

If anyone was disputing ownership, it should have been Michael Moorcock!

These is great stuff, thanks Frank and Fatboy.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 22 December, 2016, 05:14:56 pm
Steve MacManus: The visual reference that accompanied the script in which Anderson first appears ... showed a woman in a black leather catsuit with a zip pulled halfway down, revealing an ample sized bosom.

Wagner says he never sent Bolland any reference for Anderson, and Steve MacManus (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=251193585300390&id=100012292516860&comment_id=251272888625793&notif_t=feed_comment&notif_id=1482417094990490) clarifies "(t)he image was a kind of 'mood board' for Brett Ewins, who was set to draw Anderson for the Dredd Fortnightly dummy. Because the dummy was going to be for an older audience, it seemed feasible to consider 'dialling up' the glamour. Whether we ever sent the image to Brett, I don't recall"

JOE SOAP's truffling regarding the continuation of the 2012 Dredd film on telly (https://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=43997.msg940400#msg940400) reminded me of his previous archaeology of the Dredd films that never were. The following concerns the 2 movie deal struck in the early years of the Rebellion era:


Quote
JUDGE DREDD: DREDD RECKONING

Mega-City One, 2070. After a lifetime on the streets, Judge Dredd has lost faith in the system.

Fearing the Department cannot afford to lose its figurehead, Chief Judge Silver frames Dredd and secretly replaces him with a corrupt clone, Kraken.

Unrequited love for Dredd leads Hershey to hijack and crash Dredd's prison shuttle on a strange, alien world, where they must help colonists fight sinister forces in the Wilderlands.

Dredd and Hershey return to Mega-City, One where Dredd must now face his most lethal foe. Himself.


JUDGE DREDD: POSSESSION

Dredd and Anderson team up to track down Judge Death, who wants to destroy the illegal mutant ghettoes of the ancient Under-City. Death possesses Anderson and Dredd is faced with the dilemma of terminating his companion.

The Chief Judge encases Death and Anderson in a transparent prison. Dredd learns that Cassandra is carrying a child and breaks the law by freeing Cassandra from suspended animation.

Now on the run, he and Cassandra escape into the Cursed Earth, where Death tries to take possession of Dredd. Can Dredd save the city and annihilate Judge Death once and for all?

https://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=43712.msg930384#msg930384


That didn't work out. Take two:


Quote
JUDGE DREDD: DREDD RECKONING

Mega-City One, 2087.  On rookie Dredd's first patrol of the city, his mentor,  Judge Callahan, is murdered by a group of Mega-City assassins, headed by Max Voltek.

Eighteen years later, a half animal half mechanical creature called The Phantom stalks the city. Dredd learns the Chief Judge is behind the Phantom, and is arrested and stripped of his status as a Judge.

Dredd goes on the run and forms an unlikely alliance with Max Voltek to fight the corruption at the highest level within the department


JUDGE DREDD: POSSESSION

To combat the depletion of healthy air, water, and food, a brilliant Mega-City professor has developed a device designed to rip a hole in time to access uncontaminated natural resources from the past, but it's stolen by a self-styled prophet, called Phobia.

17 Years Later: Psychics have been mysteriously disappearing. Dredd and Anderson confront Phobia, who summons Judge DEATH. Dredd traces the son of the device's inventor to the Cursed Earth, where they're attacked by an army of the undead, led by Fire and Mortis.

Dredd returns to discover Death has possessed Anderson. With hordes of zombies threatening to invade the city, Dredd manages to trap Anderson/Death in a plastic seal, but Phobia frees Death from his synthetic prison.

Dredd must follow Death into the Dead World through a vortex opened up by the device. Will Dredd find a way to out-duel Death in his very element? Judge Dredd's resilience in the face of the ultimate supernatural evil is the world's last hope.

https://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=43712.msg930391#msg930391


... and after that went South, another lot tried to get the ball rolling (https://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=43712.msg930373#msg930373), without any success.


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 22 December, 2016, 07:48:38 pm
In regards to the Shoreline deal, this is an interview with screenwriter Chris Donaldson published in Dreamwatch, April 2003 -


(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/shore%2010001%202_zpsyf9lxz3p.jpg) (http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/shore%2010003%201_zps7leapwji.jpg)
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: O Lucky Stevie! on 23 December, 2016, 06:44:17 am


Not far wrong! Smith got back (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=362719710743060&id=100010151010151&comment_id=362780780736953&notif_t=feed_comment&notif_id=1479758878036078) to say he would have turned it into a horror comic, rather than sci-fi - and predicted he'd have run it into the ground.


Isn't that what happened under Burton & McKenzie anyway>
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 28 December, 2016, 10:48:53 pm
.
Thanks to JOE SOAP, for the movie background, and to Stevie, for the Dorothy Parker impression.

You'll have to join the 2000ad Discussion Group (https://www.facebook.com/groups/2000adDiscussion/?ref=bookmarks) on Mark Zuckerberg's Harvard Facebook if you want to experience the full majesty of John Wagner expertly fielding questions he's been asked a thousand times before*, but I thought this snippet was worth sharing:


"The Chief Judge's Man started out as a story idea for DC. They didn't see the potential in it, but I did, and I wasn't going to throw the idea away"
John Wagner, 28 December 2016 (https://www.facebook.com/groups/2000adDiscussion/permalink/1561662993994899/)


I've just been rereading Armon Gill's adventures, trying to work out how the three published stories would break down into five or six issues of US format comics, in the same way you can see how Wagner, Burns and Frejo's The Exterminator (920-927) would have read as two issues of Dark Horse's Terminator title.

Presumably, the initial pitch was for a contemporary thriller, titled The President's Man, with Bill Clinton or GW Bush apparently directing a Gulf War or Bosnia vet to eliminate enemies of the state. I wonder if Gill was still part cockroach/part leopard?


* Oh, alright. Brit-Cit Babes was tedious to write, as was Manix in Eagle - he doesn't even remember writing Invasion 1984. Wagner had no control over which artists drew his strips in the early years of 2000ad. He thinks other writers did a decent job of following up Day Of Chaos, once they stopped adapting stories they'd written before Chaos Day. He'd like to write The Death Of Judge Dredd, but Tharg doesn't seem interested. Wagner's reply to what he thinks of the decision to rejuvenate Dredd was an arch "Rejuved? Whaaaaaaat?"
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 28 December, 2016, 11:21:58 pm
The Shoreline Judge Dredd deal had numerous writers working on different treatments and scripts; in 2002 American comic writer Mat Nastos was one of those writers - 10 years later he posted about his experience (http://www.matnastos.net/2012/09/my-adventures-with-judge-dredd/):

(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/Nastos%201_zps9kz70ejx.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/Nastos%202_zpsebyharqv.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/nastos%203_zpsgioz5z9h.jpg)
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: dweezil2 on 29 December, 2016, 02:42:09 am
Fascinating stuff Joe!

Thank Christ Statham didn't make the crossover from Shoreline to DNA Films-we certainly dodged a 'hi-Ex' there!  :o
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 29 December, 2016, 03:03:59 am


The 'hanging out with Van Damme' bit is a reference to a Rogue Trooper sizzle reel they were both working on.

Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: dweezil2 on 29 December, 2016, 11:07:52 am
Van Damme as Rogue Trooper?

Another lucky escape!  :)
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Steve Green on 29 December, 2016, 11:14:27 am
I *really* want a book of all these anecdotes with collected screenplays.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: dweezil2 on 29 December, 2016, 11:32:30 am
I *really* want a book of all these anecdotes with collected screenplays.

Oh drokk yeah!

'The Films Of 2000AD That Never where', I buy that book in a heartbeat!

Could fill a hefty volume by the sounds of it too!  :)
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 29 December, 2016, 07:53:07 pm
I *really* want a book of all these anecdotes with collected screenplays.

For official publication, rights-issues might be a headache. The studios still own that material and there's a possibility writers might have to be paid too.



Some of the names associated with the Shoreline era -

Christopher Donaldson (with Michael Bafaro)

Screenwriter
Shoreline Entertainment
2002 – 2004 (2 years)

Wrote the screenplay's for comic book adaptations for 'Judge Dredd 2:Possession and Judge Dredd 3: Dredd Reckoning.

As well worked on drafts for "Rogue Trooper.'
(https://www.linkedin.com/in/christopher-donaldson-00290416)


Alan Coulson

Screenwriter and director

Alan has been writing professionally for the screen for 10 years, working extensively in both the UK and the US. He wrote two new Judge Dredd movies for Morris Ruskin of Shoreline Entertainment, based on the 2000AD comic book character and has written novel adaptations and original screenplays for producers worldwide.
(http://www.bradgatefilms.co.uk/company/company.html)



Andrew Prendergast

Producer
Rebellion/2000AD
2003 – 2005 (2 years)
Established LA office for Rebellion’s video game, comic book and film divisions through international scholarship. Represented by ICM, packaged and sold television and feature film projects to studios and independent producers, including ‘Judge Dredd’ feature film for Fox
. (https://uk.linkedin.com/in/andrew-prendergast-37684610)

Andrew Prendergast ...directed music videos for various bands, has written several feature
films, including 'Judge Dredd: The Cursed Earth' for Rebellion in the UK
(http://trademediauk.com/Hydra/HYDRA%20Press%20Kit.pdf)  (I assume this is the "Dead Man" script he worked on with Mat Nastos)
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 29 December, 2016, 08:55:43 pm
Rewinding back to before the Shoreline era of 2001-2004 was Fleetway Film & Television 1996-1997 (for more background info see Thrill-Power Overload Chapter 18 (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Thrill-power-Overload-David-Bishop/dp/1905437226/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1483042947&sr=8-3&keywords=thrill-power) and the chapter entitled Aftermath in Steve MacManus' memoir The Mighty One: My Life Inside the Nerve Centre (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mighty-One-Inside-Nerve-Centre/dp/1781084750/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1483042866&sr=8-1&keywords=mighty+one)).

The brilliantly named Harley Cokeliss was the producer hired by Egmont/Fleetway to develop 2000AD characters into films and he gave an interview to co-founder of SFX magazine, MJ Simpson, about what they were at. I don't believe the interview was published at the time. (http://mjsimpson-films.blogspot.ie/2015/12/interview-harley-cokeliss.html)

(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/Cokeliss1a_zpslzktp4md.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/cokeliss%202b_zpsbkxsvysw.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/cokeliss3b_zpsjgidjold.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/cokeliss4b_zpsn3ej7jpo.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/cokeliss5b_zpsadj6zgyg.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/cokeliss%206b_zpszsyumsby.jpg)
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff248/burlearth/Cokeliss%204_zpsjwjrt0n0.jpg)
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Steve Green on 29 December, 2016, 09:10:28 pm
That's great, thanks!
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: dweezil2 on 29 December, 2016, 09:15:48 pm
These articles make me weep for what could of been!  :(

Although maybe we've been lucky in some regaards also!
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 13 January, 2017, 10:15:53 pm
.
Huge thanks to JOE SOAP for blowing his considerable load all over us. All I offer in return is a rare glimpse of elusive Cradlegrave and Indigo Prime art genius, Edmund Bagwell (http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=thrills&Comic=2000AD&Field=Artist&choice=edmundb) *, who's obviously just noticed Pete Milligan (left) and everyone else in the room is wearing the same flowery eighties shirt.

Image shared with permission of Shaky Kane (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10206891282395669&set=a.1061936523738.8717.1685711044&type=3)

(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/s480x480/15977790_10206891282395669_3245786636055011378_n.jpg?oh=6837b954a5c1da9733f66be9c180d963&oe=591F189D)


* nee Perryman and, in the context of Deadline, Anoniman
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 29 January, 2017, 11:52:04 am
.
Kevin Hall gets some specifics out of David Bishop. Full interview here (https://www.facebook.com/groups/blackhole2.0/permalink/1794287077503664/).


Quote
When I first donned the Rosette of Sirius on December 18th, 1995, our management had projected 2000AD would drop below the breakeven point. Once that happened, they would cancel the title.

When I took over at 2000AD, the editorial budget per issue was more than £500,000 a year. By the time I left, it had been slashed to £382,000 a year - essentially, the editorial budget was cut by a quarter between 1996 and 2000. Compare my first issue as editor, Prog 979, with my last, 1199.

Hundreds of thousands of pounds was also cut from the production budget in that time, but most readers and creators were unaware we were having to make do with so much less. Innovations I drove like making the page size a little narrower saved us tens of thousands.


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Richard on 29 January, 2017, 03:09:19 pm
That information makes me realise how under-appreciated Bishop was (/is?) as Tharg. We usually tend to remember the '90s as the comic's nadir, but actually he saved it.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Jim_Campbell on 29 January, 2017, 03:11:06 pm
That information makes me realise how under-appreciated Bishop was (/is?) as Tharg. We usually tend to remember the '90s as the comic's nadir, but actually he saved it.

If only some of us had been pointing this out for the last decade or so…
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: dweezil2 on 29 January, 2017, 05:35:37 pm
That information makes me realise how under-appreciated Bishop was (/is?) as Tharg. We usually tend to remember the '90s as the comic's nadir, but actually he saved it.

The 90's gets a free pass for The Pit and Zenith IV alone in my book.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Robin Low on 29 January, 2017, 06:49:27 pm
That information makes me realise how under-appreciated Bishop was (/is?) as Tharg. We usually tend to remember the '90s as the comic's nadir, but actually he saved it.

If only some of us had been pointing this out for the last decade or so…

Hell, even I've said it several times over the years, even though I didn't agree with one or two of his decisions.

Regards,

Robin
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 29 January, 2017, 07:40:43 pm
We usually tend to remember the '90s as the comic's nadir ...

Despite heroic rearguard actions against evil Danish capitalists (http://www.egmont.com/) - whose twisted ideology meant they viewed publishing as some kind of profit making exercise - most readers agree the comic was at its worst during the nineties.

Understanding why the comic was awful doesn't mean it wasn't awful.


* Maybe we can have an exciting discussion about whether Tharg's lowest ebb came before or after Bishop took over. He famously had to burn through strips stockpiled by various predecessors, so let's start at prog 1000 (http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=covers&page=progs&FirstProg=951&LastProg=1000&MaxProg=1997) - which Bishop identifies (in Thrillpower Overload) as the issue he sought to make his mark with material that was all Dave, all the time
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Greg M. on 29 January, 2017, 08:01:29 pm
Understanding why the comic was awful doesn't mean it wasn't awful.

Depends on your definition of awful - the lows were indeed largely as low as the prog's ever got, but the highs were (from my perspective) better than anything in the modern prog.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 29 January, 2017, 08:16:41 pm
... the lows were indeed largely as low as the prog's ever got, but the highs were (from my perspective) better than anything in the modern prog

That's interesting, Greg. What were your highpoints (July 1996 (http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=prog&page=profiles&choice=1000) - June 2000 (http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=prog&page=profiles&choice=1199))?


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Jim_Campbell on 29 January, 2017, 08:29:09 pm

Despite heroic rearguard actions against evil Danish capitalists (http://www.egmont.com/) - whose twisted ideology meant they viewed publishing as some kind of profit making exercise - most readers agree the comic was at its worst during the nineties.

Understanding why the comic was awful doesn't mean it wasn't awful.

Ahem. I've explained very clearly (http://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=44054.msg943770#msg943770) how Egmont's business model was at odds with 2000AD's all-original, all-new content philosophy. A good chunk of David B's tenure is open to heavy criticism, but I don't think his editorial stint ever plumbed the depths of McKenzie's cliquiest excesses.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Greg M. on 29 January, 2017, 08:34:18 pm
That's interesting, Greg. What were your highpoints (July 1996 (http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=prog&page=profiles&choice=1000) - June 2000 (http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=prog&page=profiles&choice=1199))?

Well, I meant for the 90s as a whole, but if you want to focus on that specific Bishop era (and fair enough), then the first 3 or so years of Nikolai Dante are a clear highpoint, as is Devlin Waugh: Chasing Herod / Reign of Frogs / Sirius Rising. In terms of Dredds - Death of a Legend,  Beyond the Call of Duty, The Scorpion Dance and Blood Cadets are the first ones that come to mind as superb Bishop-era stories.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 29 January, 2017, 08:46:55 pm
... the first 3 or so years of Nikolai Dante are a clear highpoint, as is Devlin Waugh: Chasing Herod / Reign of Frogs / Sirius Rising. In terms of Dredds - Death of a Legend,  Beyond the Call of Duty, The Scorpion Dance and Blood Cadets are the first ones that come to mind as superb Bishop-era stories.

I thought Blood Cadets was Rebellion-era, but you're right (1186).

The Devlin Waughs washed over me without leaving much of a memory. I like John Smith, so I should probably give them a reread in isolation, so their being sandwiched between episodes of Witchworld, Vector 13 and Mercy Heights doesn't affect my impression of them.

Thanks for the reply, Greg.


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Richard on 29 January, 2017, 11:21:27 pm
That Devlin Waugh series was some of Smith's finest work. It's brilliant. In fact I'm going to re-read it this week now.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: O Lucky Stevie! on 30 January, 2017, 12:47:13 am
zone=droid&page=thrills&Comic=2000AD&Field=Artist&choice=edmundb]Edmund Bagwell[/url] *, who's obviously just noticed Pete Milligan (left) and everyone else in the room is wearing the same flowery eighties shirt.


Was this before or after Bagwell posed  with a pair of sunnies for Duncan Fegredo as reference shots for Morrison’s Invisiblespoilerific reboot of Kid Eternity?
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 12 February, 2017, 11:52:32 am
Bagwell posed  with a pair of sunnies for Duncan Fegredo as reference shots for Morrison’s Invisiblespoilerific reboot of Kid Eternity

Never knew that, Stevie! Similarly, much of this was news to me - most notably, the information that Ian Gibson was the original artist on Third World War. I suppose Gibson's stock as artist of choice for mature reader stories centered on a female character was at a high, following Halo Jones.

Interesting in a more tabloid way is the information that the then-married Mills based Eve on someone who was more than just a friend. Mills used real life avatars for all the characters, tapping them for dialogue and to live action role play character reactions to story ideas, which often changed the direction of the strip.

Mills's experience with Dice Man must have informed these working methods and philosophy, and there's an interesting parallel to be drawn between that experiment in ceding control over story direction to the reader and the way Mills was increasingly allowing readers (and the stuff he was reading) shape his work.

Readers interested in Mills's trajectory as a writer will detect a tension here between his instincts as a storyteller (or entertainer) and his commitment to a theoretically informed practice, more concerned with fidelity to a particular ideology and (perceived) authenticity than fiction:


Quote
The case was put to me by quite a few 2000AD readers that criticising the authorities or the state through science fiction is a kind of disguise, and why not tell it like it really is? That interested me – I was almost stung by readers saying, look, tell it how it is, don’t wrap it up in science fiction bullshit.

I would never have taken the risk to do a story like Third World War if the editor Steve McManus hadn’t rung me up and said, ‘I’d like you to do something on the politics of food’, so I started to look into it. At first I thought, God is this going to be too dull to do anything?

I kept some sci fi elements, and there was criticism from some readers because of that; they felt like I was getting close to telling it like it is, but they wanted me to go further. I was like, well how do I do that and still tell an entertaining story?

Then as I dug deeper I started to become deeply disturbed by what I was finding out. I was going to pretty radical sources. There was a publisher called Pluto Press, who were publishing writers in the tradition of Noam Chomsky. It was quite a responsibility for me, and I thought God I better get this right.

One of the things I did was I looked at all my characters and wondered how I was going to get it right. So, every one of the principle characters was based on a real person. There’s nothing new about that, but they were based on someone that I knew very well, and had access to. So I would go to the person concerned and ask them, what would you do in this situation?

I don’t think this is how writers usually operate. I think usually – and this often works very well – characters are shards of the writer's own personality. But this was very different. In the case of Eve, I went to a particular young woman of that age, who had the right personality for the story.

She was a friend of mine. Let’s put it that way. And I said, what would you do in this situation? And she said I wouldn’t be able to deal with it and I’d probably take an overdose. The original artist who drew 3WW was Ian Gibson – he objected and pulled out of the project. He thought, and it’s totally understandable, that to have a main character who had contemplated or attempted suicide was negative for young people to read. I disagree with him, but I respect his views.

Those kind of things were coming into the story so naturally because I’d just go down the road to one of my friends and say, OK, you’re in this situation, what do you do? And often their responses would be quite unusual, particularly in the case of the character of Fin. To start with there were two guys it was based on but over time it became just one, I guess he was more vocal and had a more dominant personality.

So I’d say, OK, you’ve seen all these dead bodies, how do you react? Now my reaction would be horror; that’s a normal reaction. His was very different, he said, ‘oh I’d be interested in seeing what the cause of death was’ he was almost like a pathologist in his response. So I was really using this to build the stories, I’m told this is what Mike Leigh did with his TV dramas, he’d get his actors to adlib.

In my case they often ran a little off the rails, they didn’t go where I was guiding them, and I had to be faithful to my sources, so sometimes some of the things they would say could be quite scandalous, quite shocking. Readers would write in saying, ‘I really disagree with what your character Fin is saying, it’s quite appalling.’ And I’d say, he’s a character in a story; we’re not suggesting any of them should be moral icons.

Even Ivan the punk character was very much based on a real person – the punk was a still a punk when I was interviewing him, and at the time I remember Grant Morrisson saying ‘why has Pat Mills got a punk in the story, punk is dead’, and I was thinking, well it’s not in Colchester mate! It’s still going strong just down the road from me hahaha….

We covered the Nestle baby food scandal, and the advertising manager of our publisher sent a letter to the editor saying, ‘are you aware that Nestle are a major advertiser for our group?’ I did the story of the Mau Mau, and just what the British imperialists did in Kenya. The printers threatened not to publish that issue. These older guys had lived through Britain’s imperial history, and they objected to my viewpoint of the way the Brits dealt with the Mau Mau insurrection.

As a child, I remember being told that the Mau Mau were the most evil people on earth, that they were savages, and I really wanted to reject that conditioning. If you’re told lies as a child about something, it probably sticks, you want to throw it out and say, this isn’t the truth, here is the truth. I guess I had my own personal agenda there as well.

The reaction to black issues from our readership – and it’s hard to pin this down, because no one’s going to come out and admit it – but there was a negative reaction from our ‘politically correct’ readership. They weren’t that comfortable with black issues being dealt with. They might argue that they didn’t like the way we dealt with them, I’d disagree

The editor Steve McManus’s view was that there was just a negative reaction to featuring black characters so heavily in the comic. I was quite naïve thinking all that stuff had disappeared at the end of the 60s. Right up to Crisis, readers were quite uncomfortable with the heavy emphasis on black characters, and I think it probably contributed to the decline of 3WW as a story in the comic.

http://www.theransomnote.com/culture/pulp-cult/crisis-pat-mills-remembering-the-uk-comic-that-changed-the-game/


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: TordelBack on 12 February, 2017, 01:24:04 pm
That is absolutely fascinating. Just when you think you might have Mills figured out there's more to know: what an amazing creator. Makes me itch for a well-annotated 3WW collection.

(Not sure I necessarily agree with your reading of the 'real' Eve relationship, but you can certainly interpret it that way.)
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 17 February, 2017, 07:49:19 pm

Colin MacNeil originally planned to paint America 2: Fading Of The Light:


(http://i.imgur.com/WKh8n7U.png?1)


... and the redrawn page 2, as it appeared in Megazine 3.20:


(http://i.imgur.com/iUWvJbX.png?1)


MacNeil explains what happened in Megazine 227:


(http://i.imgur.com/DTb7UEB.jpg?1)


Our younger selves discuss the above pages (https://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=41873.0), early nineties colouring, and Fading Of The Light in general


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 19 February, 2017, 09:33:54 pm

"When we did that Low Life with Overdrive, the shark guy, I looked up great white sharks on the internet. It turns out there are now danger holidays you can go on where they put you in a shark cage and drop meat in, and there's 10 billion photographs of sharks going (hilarious mime of shark trying to eat something bigger than its head).

I realised when you get enough of them from different angles, it's like they've got different expressions. So I literally harvested about 100 shark faces off the internet and categorised them by expression. And then for every panel where the shark guy needed a particular expression, I'd go to the reference thing, pull it out, and trace it off.

That's why the shark guy looks so good, because every one of them is taken from a real shark. But the weird side effect of that is that the angle that each of those panels is taken from is determined entirely by what angle the shark head is from. So it's working backwards from reference in the weirdest way possible, but it worked really well."


Matt Brooker (D'Israeli), 40 Years Of Thrillpower, 11/02/2017 (http://[/right)



(http://i.imgur.com/I88RoTn.png?2)


Mrs D'Israeli arrives home to find her husband researching his latest project: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnOCLPbBUBY


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 19 February, 2017, 09:54:55 pm

It would have helped if I'd included the link to the 2000ad panel in that last post:  (LINK) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgK6_G6BYZY&feature=youtu.be&t=45m48s)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 26 February, 2017, 06:38:03 pm

This is the Al Ewing Trifecta interview where he floats the idea of Giant as a replacement for Dredd, rather than Rico. I found the link in the Tour Of Duty (http://dreddreviews.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/tour-of-duty-backlash.html) episode of Douglas Wolk's superb Dredd Reckoning blog, but the original SFX interview has fallen off the end of the internet.

Grud bless the good folks of The Wayback Machine (https://archive.org/donate/) for preserving things other sites delete to save server space:



BLOG Judge Dredd Writer Al Ewing on 2000AD’s Surprising Crossover (https://web.archive.org/web/20121208013705/http://www.sfx.co.uk/2012/12/05/blog-judge-dredd-writer-al-ewing-on-2000ads-surprising-crossover)  Steven Ellis at 11:23am December 5 2012


SFX: With the recent “The Cold Deck/Trifecta” cross-over story in 2000AD, which brought together Dreddworld stories Judge Dredd, The Simping Detective and Low Life, fans of the comic are singing your praises. How do you feel the story has turned out?

Al Ewing: “It’s turned out well! Considering the level of ambition in terms of the job we set ourselves, I feel we’ve done ourselves and 2000AD proud. The readership has been incredibly positive from the start, even before they twigged that it was a crossover – and that’s something I’m very proud of, that we managed to keep everyone in the dark and made Prog 1807 a genuine surprise for the readers.”

Where did the idea come from? Who was the driving force behind it all?

“I think it was Si Spurrier who originally had the idea of him, me and Rob Williams getting together to co-write something. At the time, that was going to be an Image miniseries, but that idea ended up coming to nothing when all three of us got busy in our own lives. Last year, Si and Rob came to me with the idea to revive the project as a Dreddworld crossover – I think even at that early stage Si was talking about a single-story issue of 2000AD featuring all the characters. So really, it’s Si and Rob you should be thanking.”

I don’t think there’s been a cross-over event quite like this before. Was there a moment when you all thought you were a bit mad trying to pull it off?

“Hundreds of moments. It’s like doing a jigsaw where all three of us have slightly different sets, and we’re trying to make a coherent picture with them. The fact that we made something that’s as coherent as it is, is testament to Si and Rob’s skill as writers and my extreme flukiness. I don’t know if we’ll ever do it again – not for a while, anyway. If we do, in a year or five, we’ll go in with a better understanding of just how much work is involved.”

“Originally, Bachmann was just someone for Dredd to bounce off, so the second half of that story could take place in real time, a month after the first half. And then it turned out that she was very popular, so I felt that I needed to finish her story quickly, so she wasn’t just another Dredd villain simmering in the background for years and years, which was why I pushed for her to be the Big Bad of ‘Trifecta’. It was literally me saying, ‘I have a villain going spare, can we use her?’

“As it turns out, while this is the end of her story, it might not be the end of the Black Ops story. So maybe we will have to team up again soon.”

With three writers, four artists and several plot threads to intertwine, how difficult was the story to coordinate?

“It was tough. Before we even started work, we went for several plotting/drinking sessions to work out what we wanted to do. We all had our own ideas and themes we wanted to explore – I wanted to use Bachmann and Maitland and have Dredd get beat up; Rob had an idea for Frank getting involved in corporate shenanigans on the moon; Si had ideas for a Church Of Simpology. So we all came in wanting things, and we worked out how we could all have our cakes and eat them. Then we ate them.”

During the story, especially your part of it, there were a lot of mentions of Dredd and Mega-City One’s past. Judge Dredd is unique in having a very consistent linear history. Would you say this helps or hinders you when you write the character?

“I think because of the nature of the reveal in the final episode – out today – we had to make the past a constant theme, to have it constantly reaching back to the present. I don’t think that was something we decided, it’s just something that happened subconsciously. It’s nice to have 35 years of history to refer to – plus another 20 years or so we can invent – but lean too hard on it and it becomes a crutch. I feel like I’ve pushed the past of Dredd as far as I can for the moment, and it’s time to start looking forward again.”

How do you feel about the fans talk about you being John Wagner’s natural successor on Dredd?

“Enormously flattered, obviously, and also a little bit scared. I don’t think I’ve done right by Dredd over the past year, in that I’ve been distracted by other things. From next year, I’m going to try and spend a lot more time with the character, and really get a lot of stories under my belt. Do my bit to earn all this praise.”

With “Day of Chaos”, “The Cold Deck”/“Trifecta” and the two Dredd films – the big 3D one and Minty – all happening this year, it really has been a great time for Dredd in his 35th year, where do you see the character going from here?

“Well, he’s getting older. More to the point, he’s starting to realise his own fallibility. He’s made mistakes, and he’s making them now. He’s starting to see that his judgement hasn’t been 100% correct 100% of the time, and the big question ahead is how he’s going to deal with that, when the evidence of his failures – Chaos Day, his strained relationship with Hershey – is staring him in the face. And eventually, someone’s going to have to address Fargo’s last words and what they mean for Mega-City One.”

Do you have specific plans for Dredd storylines in the future?

“I need to wrap up Deller and The Organisation, at least in the short term. I really want to do something with Giant – he’s Dredd’s successor, except he’s human in a way Dredd isn’t. He’s not a clone, he grew up with a family. While evidence of Dredd’s ‘father’s’ humanity is suppressed by Justice Dept, Giant is living evidence that his Dad had off-regulation emotions. So there’s a wealth of story potential there.

I want to do some politics – bring back the thread of Gerhardt Crane, the political writer who keeps popping up. See what his reaction to the reduced Mega-City is, and whether his ideas take root in any official places.

“Annnnnnnd… I want to experiment with things like narrative collapse. Real In-The-Abyss stuff – someone mentioned the Black Lodge recently on the boards and it’s got me thinking.”

Dredd’s getting on a bit, he’s over 70 now… How would you feel about killing him off and replacing him with Rico or Dolman?

“Reader reaction seems quite positive to that. There were a few people who actually assumed we were doing that when we had him shot up at the end of ‘The Cold Deck’ – the Snake? Snake? Snaaaaake! moment. (Of course, that moment is always followed by ‘Continue?’, as Metal Gear Solid players should have worked out.)

“I don’t have permission to kill Dredd. Yet. If we do decide to kill him, it won’t be something we’d do lightly, I can guarantee. As for what happens after that… I’ve always been in favour of doing a ‘Taggart’ and continuing the Dredd strip without Judge Dredd in it. No need for Rico or Dolman to disrupt their routine. Giant’s the natural successor, anyway.”

It sounds like you have a lot of love for Judge Giant; do you have some clear ideas about what you’d do with the character given the chance?

Just explore the human side of him, make him the POV character for some stories, give him some meaty cases to work on. Bring out the sides to his character that make him different from Dredd, put them on display, round him out a little; re-establish him as the successor. Not that I have anything against Rico, but I prefer Rico as his own man rather than Dredd-In-Waiting.”

You also managed to use PSU’s Judge Roffman, a fan favourite character, back during “The Cold Deck”. Along with several other Dredd characters his fate after the last big Dredd epic “Day of Chaos” was a little uncertain for a while, are there any other similar “fate uncertain” characters you’d like to involve in future stories other than Giant?

“Well, at some point I have to decide whether Bennett lived or died. I don’t want to get into a situation where everyone who ever worked with Dredd survived – that’s just unrealistic – but at the same time, the guy who I named Bennett after has helped me move house several times, so I feel like Bennett should probably survive!”

There seemed to be a bit of a lag between the end of the “Day Of Chaos” and the stories following. It felt a little like other Dredd writers didn’t know just how far John Wagner was going to go. Is there anything to this? Were you all up to date or was there a little bit of running to catch up and some quick rewrites to add continuity when you realised the state Wagner had left Mega-City One in?

“A bit of both. We were sent a memo that told us exactly how bad it was going to get, but I personally still got caught on the hop slightly when I rewrote the stories I had waiting to run. I didn’t realise it’d be that bad, is all I can say. I’ll be saying the same thing when the superhurricanes come and civilisation collapses – ‘I got the memo, but I didn’t think it’d be that bad’.

“Anyway, ‘Day of Chaos’ turned out to be the best thing that could’ve happened to ‘Trifecta’. For instance, we’d been scrabbling about trying to think of ways to have all the double-dealing happen under PSU’s nose – suddenly they were all but destroyed, problem solved. Suddenly Bachmann had a proper reason to do her evil plan – it was a reaction to Chaos Day and the power vacuum that created. Those Dredd/Hershey scenes wouldn’t have been nearly as interesting with Dredd/Francisco. And so on. Once we’d digested the memo, we realised just how many opportunities there were in the new set-up to make our crossover really work. It added so much to it – I think we all owe John a vote of thanks for destroying the Meg as thoroughly as he did!”

You’ve done quite a lot of varied work for 2000AD; from Tharg’s Future Shocks and Terror Tales through to Damnation Station and Judge Dredd. Are you a big fan of the single episode short story or do you prefer more meaty longer arcs when you write?

“I’m a huge fan of the done-in-one, and Wagner’s right up there as one of the masters of the form as far as I’m concerned – up there with Eisner and Kurtzman. I’d like to get a few of them in myself, in amongst the long-form pieces I need to get done. I still have a lot of fondness for some of my early Future Shocks, and I don’t want that skill to atrophy, assuming it hasn’t already.”

You and Henry Flint seem to work together quite a lot, with Zombo and Dredd. How would you describe that partnership?

“Fruitful. We work well together – we tend to add to each other’s ideas, so that’s good. And Henry always surprises me with his layouts, in a good way. He lets me have my head, but he doesn’t just sit back; he’s always full of amazing ideas to throw into anything I’m working on with him. He really blows me away with his Dredd stuff – it’s absolutely fantastic, really grim, crunchy, hard-boiled stuff. It astounds me that he’s not in more demand in the States, but their loss is our gain.”

Who do you think draws the definitive Dredd?

“I’d say Henry. Other than that – Carlos Ezquerra is pretty hard to beat, particularly around ‘Brothers Of The Blood’. Ditto Cam Kennedy, Colin McNeil, obviously Mike McMahon… but my personal choice, excluding Henry, is Ron Smith, who defined the character for me as a kid. His Dredd had a lot of humour to it, a kind of arch quality – he was full of very subtle wisecracks. There was some beautiful caricaturing work in everyone’s faces. I particularly remember his newspaper strips with Wagner – these tiny little half or quarter-page bursts, just one joke, perfectly told. I doubt anyone else could have done those.”

You’ve also written several books in the Pax Britannia series for Abaddon, as well as others. Could you tell us the differences, if any, in your approach to writing novels when compared to comic stories?

“Writing novels is a thousand times harder. It’s just brutal, like pulling out your own teeth and burying them. You’ve caught me at a bad time for this question because I’m just in the closing stages of another one, for Solaris, which is about some fairly high concepts. Once I’ve written them, I usually leave them on a shelf for six months before I’m moved to pick them up again, at which point I’m pleasantly surprised by myself. I suspect that’s true of all writers – you never like your stuff immediately, it has to grow on you.”

You and Henry Flint have worked together on the bat’s-arse crazy zombie secret agent series Zombo. He’s had four outings – if you include the 2010 Christmas Prog appearance – so far. Will there be more from the character in the future?

Yes, yes. At least another trade, which will bring us up to six series. When it comes time to plot Series Six, we’ll have to ask ourselves if we want to do more or if it’s time for a breather – if we feel there’s more in it, we can go to eight or ten or twelve or what-have-you until we’ve had enough, but it’s not a series that’s plotted out to the end, like Nikolai Dante. I have a rough idea of one of the end conditions, but you’ll have to wait and see what that is.”

Regarding the second series of Zombo, what made you decide to try to write a musical zombie comic book story?

“Well, the zombie bit was in place, and the music bit just sort of happened when we brought in the Rat Pack, which we had to do because it was a casino heist story originally. Except it went off the rails a bit. That tends to be how Zombo comes together – we’ll have an idea, it’ll get slightly skewed between plot and script and then it’s out there.”

You’ve also recently had success with Zaucer Of Zilk. Will we be seeing more of Zaucer and his madcap world?

“It’s possible. I think both me and Brendan have some ideas for a sequel, but on the other hand it’s nice to just have something sitting there in and of itself. We’ll see how we feel.”

Is there anything else you have on the horizon? Any upcoming work you’d like to tell people about?

“Bits and pieces – that new novel, The Fictional Man, which is exploring some fun territory, in a world where cloned fictions are alive and walking the streets of Hollywood. Damnation Station is coming around for a second (and final) series. Jennifer Blood remains ongoing, with the fourth arc just getting started. And of course, next spring brings fresh Zombo.

“Plus all the projects I can’t tell you about…”
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Steve Green on 26 February, 2017, 07:08:45 pm
The talk of Black Ops has reminded me - Si Spurrier's Domino(?) character is still floating around isn't she?

I wonder if they ever thought about using her in Trifecta?
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 03 March, 2017, 06:20:49 pm
The talk of Black Ops has reminded me - Si Spurrier's Domino(?) character is still floating around isn't she?

If she was coming back, Michael Carroll would have retconned her as a Sector Zero sleeper.

A reminder of simpler times, when Buttonman could have bought a full page of 2000ad, and had as many letters printed as he wanted, for the price of a new kitchen:


(http://i.imgur.com/H9FchI8.png?1)

The Guardian, 03/03/2017 (https://www.theguardian.com/books/gallery/2017/mar/03/2000ad-turns-40-your-photos-and-stories?CMP=share_btn_fb)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: I, Cosh on 04 March, 2017, 07:23:42 am
The talk of Black Ops has reminded me - Si Spurrier's Domino(?) character is still floating around isn't she?

I wonder if they ever thought about using her in Trifecta?
She was mentioned as the source of the Intel in the last Rob Williams story.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Steve Green on 04 March, 2017, 08:33:25 am
I missed that, thanks.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 04 March, 2017, 09:35:02 am
The talk of Black Ops has reminded me - Si Spurrier's Domino(?) character is still floating around isn't she? I wonder if they ever thought about using her in Trifecta?

She was mentioned as the source of the Intel in the last Rob Williams story.


All hail The Cosh:


(http://i.imgur.com/TY2FUDm.png?2)

Get Sin (2001), by Williams, Hairsine & Kitson


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 05 March, 2017, 11:04:22 am

I draw tiny diagrams, chopping the page up in different ways. You subdivide it into panels then draw stick figures in each one to represent the characters and where the action's going to be. I try to draw a page every 2 days, so a 5 page 2000ad episode takes 2 weeks.

The name came from mucking around with my friend, John, in History class. I don't know why we found the name D'Israeli so funny, but we did, and for some reason it stuck. John grew up to be a bank manager and I just never grew up at all.


Matt Brooker, bbc.co.uk, 05/03/2017 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38095143)


(http://i.imgur.com/iBLMYzu.png?1)

(http://i.imgur.com/OUQArGS.png?1)

(http://i.imgur.com/xITWzOb.png?1)


Cheers to JOE SOAP for the link (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38095143).


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 06 March, 2017, 07:26:27 pm

From the Telegraph Sunday Magazine, 1983. Thanks to Supersurfer for the scans:


(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/12819302_226858750995824_8324202274891128851_o.jpg?oh=a10498127742e71d89fd0047f4c0bea5&oe=5931BC7D)

(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/12809616_226858744329158_4646630597480503075_n.jpg?oh=7e58720b5e690b6540db2f30975d7989&oe=59327CFA)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 07 March, 2017, 11:22:55 pm

(http://i.imgur.com/OmJVkH6.png?3)


1159 featured variant covers. According to Barney (http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=prog&page=profiles&choice=1159): "Not enough (Homeworld) CD-ROMs were produced, so an alternative edition featuring a Mazeworld cover by Arthur Ranson but without the free gift was also printed"

Thanks to Mark Everton.


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 12 March, 2017, 09:56:06 pm

Old interview with Jim Murray, containing some interesting background to Die Laughing and Holocaust 12. Try reading it in Nigel Tufnel's voice ...


Quote
By Benjamin Dickson

When did you first get into Judge Dredd?

I first saw Dredd ages and ages ago, at school I think, but I never really got into them until Judgement on Gotham came out. I thought "Wow, this is what you can do with comics these days!" And then I saw Slaine and stuff, and obviously then I got into Bisley.

It’s often been said that you’re just a Bisley clone.

Well, yeah, it’s a fair comment, because he has been a big influence. But…I think in my defense, I don’t actually copy anything he’s done at all. It’s basically… If you look at it like this, Bisley and Frezzeta taught me how to paint. But I mean, it’s just a style thing really.

I think the problem is that Bisley was the first person who used fully painted artwork.

Exactly, so any other artist who’s going to come along and do fully painted artwork is going to get labeled as such. So it’s not something you can get away from, really. But I have utmost respect for his stuff though, I think he’s absolutely brilliant.

There are a lot of other influences in your work – any particular British Comics?

Erm… I don’t know really. British artists, maybe. I really like artists like Trevor Hairsine and Frank Quitely, they’re great, they can really draw. And obviously Jason Brashill… I mean, Jason’s another one who paints stuff who could be called a Bisley clone, but his stuff’s so unique…

He has been called a Bisley clone.

Yeah, well I just think that’s rubbish, his stuff’s totally, totally different.

You worked with him on Die Laughing, of course, painting Glenn Fabry’s stuff. What did you think of Glenn’s stuff?

Well, he can certainly paint, that’s for sure. He’s a very good artist. Again, his work’s totally different. It’s all nicely referenced stuff, all quite realistic, and to my mind, not really suited to comics. More to covers, and stuff like that. So, erm… Yeah, I really like it though.

What did he actually send you to paint over?

He gave us rough biro sketches. Very rough. He just biroed out panel layouts, and we just painted them up from that. Which I think he’d forgive me for saying was quite a job at the time, to decipher what he’d done!

So from page 36 onwards, it was pretty much all you and Jason.

Well, no, I mean we tried to keep it true to how he drew it, because he’s definitely got a style of drawing that’s all his own. But there’s no way we could spend the time that he takes, the effort he takes to paint each panel.

The 2000ad editors must have got pissed off with him taking about a year to paint each page.

[laughs] Well yeah, it took… I don’t know, I think he took about 5 years to finish it.

They said that he started it immediately after Judgement on Gotham, as the follow-up. So Glenn took the entire span of your career to do 36 pages, and you illustrated the second half of the follow-up to the comic that got you into comics in the first place!

Yeah, it’s bizarre if you think about it! I’ve never actually looked at it like that before!

I remember you did Holocaust 12 - that was the first story where I really noticed you.

That was the first painted story I did, but looking back on it, there’s only a couple of pages that I actually liked in it. But you know, it was a learning process. It’s difficult to say really, but I think I got the Batman/Dredd book on the back of that, so that was a result, definitely, but I don’t really think it was that impressive. But I was very pleased with the way Die Laughing came out.

Have you ever been censored?

DC sent a few pages back, when I’d gone slightly too gory. And I’d also shown too much of Bruce Wayne, so to speak. But my argument was that I was trying to redress the balance, because I’ve drawn a few semi-naked women, so I thought maybe I should draw a semi-naked man. But DC are a bit prudish about that kind of thing. I don’t know, I might have gone over the top.

Are you sexually aroused by the women you paint?

No! [laughs] I think they’re all slightly too muscly for me! But then again, it’s mainly been Catwoman in this recent one, and the way I’ve drawn her, she is kind of butch.

What about Anderson? You had some nice pictures of her in Die Laughing.

That’s true. They did censor that though! If you notice, I think the page before last, there’s a bizarre word bubble where she’s sitting up in bed, and the bubble is covering her arse! But yeah, she’s nice! Actually she is one of the only bits of reference I used in the book. She’s the model that Steve Sampson uses for Anderson. If you look at his Anderson, you’ll see it’s the same girl.

So who is she?

Well, if you cut this bit out of the interview … [snip] … so it’s a bit of a sensitive topic.

http://homepage.eircom.net/~okku/scifi/j_murray.htm
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 18 March, 2017, 10:23:38 am

"Chief Judge Oswin wasn’t blonde in the original script: she was brunette, but making her blonde helped to differentiate her from Hershey"


(http://i.imgur.com/0z7Bjrt.jpg?2)


"Because of her, I received my first ever piece of hate mail, in which I was told to 'keep my opinions to myself.' It’s a shame that the sender lacked the guts to use his real e-mail address because there is a fascinating debate there, I think: should a writer be held accountable for the opinions of his or her characters?"

Michael Carroll, Forbidden Planet Blog (http://ht.ly/O2Et309XBW4)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 19 March, 2017, 08:24:31 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/1HJOUaH.png?3)


Ace art droid Alex Ronald owns the original page from which this panel is taken (Blockmania episode 5, prog 240, by Wagner, Grant & Smith). He reports that Tippex and black ink have been applied to remove the handles and wire of the garotte Orlok's hands were originally clutching.

The censorship is even more obvious in the colour spread of the following episode, where Citizen Lorien Speck (http://i.imgur.com/kHQj5m2.jpg) is seen writhing in agony for no apparent reason, then lying in a pool of his own ... grey?


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 03 August, 2017, 05:10:10 pm

In case anyone missed it, here's a link to the resourceful JOE SOAP (https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=44637.msg963797#msg963797) sharing some of his treasure trove of the obscure and arcane. This time concerning Kev O'Neill's abortive, creator owned, proto-Marshal Law project, John Pain.

As SOAP points out, this is exactly the kind of lost gold Rebellion should be collecting via the Treasury Of British Comics, ideally in a Kev O'Neill artist edition.

O'Neill told Chris Thompson (http://popculturehound.net/episode-209-in-a-league-of-his-own-with-kevin-oneill/) he's a pack rat, who has held onto most of his original art, so there's every chance he still owns these glorious pages (from my favourite period of his work). Filed under THINGS 2000AD CREATORS DID TO ESCAPE THE SHITTY WORKING PRACTISES OF IPC :


(https://i.imgur.com/IK2l2th_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=high)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 03 August, 2017, 11:41:45 pm
There was also a proposed one-shot for Marshal Law supporting character Suicida to be published by BlackBall – which, at the time, was the intended venue for the future of Marshal Law alongside John Pain!

I don't believe this one got scripted and drawn before BlackBall imploded.

(http://i.imgur.com/82EcY2I.jpg)

Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: maryanddavid on 04 August, 2017, 12:19:22 am
What BlackBall was that in Joe? Great image, not sure Suicida would sustain 32 pages though!
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 04 August, 2017, 12:29:25 am


It appeared in PREVIEWS Vol. IV No. 5, May 1994.



Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: maryanddavid on 04 August, 2017, 12:32:54 am
Ta.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 17 September, 2017, 11:07:18 am

IN ORBIT EVERY SATURDAY, MONDAY, AND WEDNESDAY

Most issues of the galaxy's greatest comic bear cover text claiming to go into orbit on a specific day of the week. Why that specific day of the week, why does that day of the week change over the years, and what does it mean anyway?

The vacillation started early; the first six issues claimed to go into orbit every Saturday, but on the seventh prog the Godfather, Pat Mlls, rested and gave himself the weekend off. Maybe writing/rewriting every story in the comic was getting on top of him

Exhibiting  a concern with the numerological significance of 7 that would thrill both Mills and his fictional avatar, Deadlock, most progs from 7 to 777 announced they went into orbit on a Monday, which sounds much more dreary and bore no relation to when the comic actually hit the shops.

A dodgy Greg Staples cover announced that prog 778 (11 Apr 1992) was once again a roller skating jam that went on sale on Saturday. Bringing the launch forward was possible only because most of the comic was now written either by Alan McKenzie or someone sitting at the next desk.

Like McKenzie's own mayfly tenure in the editor's chair, this second Saturday era wasn't to last. Prog 1000 dropped the pretence that the comic was in orbit, probably because Dave Bishop is a boring bastard (who tried to get rid of Tharg too).

Bishop describes prog 1000 as the issue he chose to stamp his identity on the comic, and these changes signalled that 2000ad was growing with the audience. It was now aimed at the discerning, more mature reader, who thought aliens landed in Roswell and watched Star Trek TNG.

Prog 1234 saw the return of both the 'in orbit' box (Wednesday) and Steve Cook's eighties logo, because the comic had been bought out by two brothers who were fans in the eighties and Andy Diggle was explicitly trying to remind readers of the good old days, reviving the original Rogue Trooper and the VCs, and running strips about cockney geezers and gladiators in space arenas.

Why Wednesday? Because that's when the comic goes on sale in newsagents. Why was it previously Saturday or Monday? The best guess anyone here can make is that they were instructions to retailers, telling them how long to leave an issue on display and when to order new stock.

So the old Saturday/Monday box was for the benefit of the publisher and stockists, Wednesday is mostly a nostalgia trip for middle aged readers (who were always confused by the Monday thing)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: AlexF on 22 September, 2017, 02:17:15 pm
These days, people who subscribe to the comic get it through their letterbox on Saturdays; the shops start stocking it from the following Wednesday, and people like me, with a digital subscription, can download it from the internet on that day, too.

Given the way that some internet connections rely on satellites, I suppose it is fair to suggest the each new Prog is, somewhat literally, in orbit every Wednesday...
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: glassstanley on 28 September, 2017, 07:57:56 am
The only exception to subs copies arriving on a Saturday is when there’s a strip I’m really looking forward to reading. Then it’s a Monday. If I’m really, really keen to read it, it will arrive on a Tuesday.

The post Christmas prog has often reached subscribers soon after the Christmas prog.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 18 October, 2017, 05:28:31 pm

FROM THE DESK OF CHARLES LIPPINCOTT

Charles M Lippincott went to film school with Spielberg and Lucas, and his first job was as an assistant to Hitchcock on Family Plot. Lucas hired him to wrangle publicity and stoke anticipation in the fan community for Star Wars, a role he reprised for Ridley Scott's Alien.

While in London for Alien, Lippincott picked up 2000ad and was so taken by Judge Dredd he bought the feature film adaptation rights from IPC. After a period working for Dino De Laurentis, on projects such as Conan and Flash Gordon, Lippincott began work on what would become the 1995 Judge Dredd movie:


'So Howard Chaykin, of the Marvel Star Wars comics fame, went to Hollywood and got involved in doing stuff other than comics. A multi-talented guy, Howard not only draws, he also writes stuff like AMERICAN FLAGG, which I understand has just been greenlit for production.

So we're doing Judge Dredd. This is in the early days. Howard comes in for a meeting with this friend of his. They sit down, and then Howard proceeds to pitch this story idea for Judge Dredd. He really gets into it. He gets wound up and tells this great story. It's really great. It's got everything. Action. Good vs evil. Great characters, the whole works, with a great story arc

As is our habit, rather than discussing the pitch with him and his buddy, we wait until the meeting is over to see how we all feel. Eureka! We have a consensus. We all agree Howard gave a great pitch, capturing the essence of Judge Dredd in the exact kind of movie we want to make.

We decide to jump on it. We let Howard and his buddy know we love it, and want to work out a deal. Send us a synopsis or treatment, and we'll start the paperwork. Well, a few days go by, and we haven't heard from Howard.

So I have to track Howard down and ask him, "What's the deal?" Turned out Howard was stoned when he did the pitch. He did it off the top of his head,and couldn't remember what he said. Which was too bad, because it was really a great pitch'.



Follow Charles on Facebook or his blog, From The Desk Of Charles Lippincott. (http://From The Desk Of Charles Lippincott.)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: JOE SOAP on 18 October, 2017, 09:31:34 pm
'Judge Dredd as The Lone Ranger' is an old yarn but it's a good 'un.

(https://i.imgur.com/PWw6CBR.jpg)

Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 18 October, 2017, 09:46:24 pm

Dredd's the opposite of the Lone Ranger. He's like a plumber. A very violent plumber.


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 27 October, 2017, 08:47:33 pm

TILTING AT PAT MILLS

What we're finding with Millsverse, printing things like Dave Kendall's Psycho Killer (from Toxic) and Carlos Ezquerra's Judge Dredd and 2000ad Colouring Book, is that you can have print on demand for full colour books. So the days when you were in hock to a publisher are completely gone.

People think they need to get a publishing deal, then they discover that the advance isn't enough to live on and the marketing you'd expect them to do is your responsibility - you're expected to run the social media campaign. If we're going to take back control, we have to develop those skills.

In the case of Psycho Killer, we arranged distribution ourselves, and the advance orders were higher than Accident Man, which is printed by Titan (and has been adapted into a film starring Scott Adkins, out in January). So a major publisher is holding us back.

I met Carlos and he told me Rebellion didn't have the capacity put the book out on his behalf, so had given him their blessing to publish it himself. There's lots of things to learn; for example, we discovered that if we called it an adult colouring book, the tax man would want a chunk of it.

I revealed in my book (Be Pure, Be Vigilant, Behave) that I hadn't had a pay rise in twenty years, and surprise-surprise, my page rate shot up significantly and I got a message from Rebellion saying it was 'long overdue' - with which I heartily agree.

Various creators got in touch to say they'd had similar experiences to me. In one case I asked if it was okay if I mentioned what happened to them in a future edition and they said no. This was something that happened around twenty years ago; that's how down trodden creators have become.

Freelancers today are isolated individuals, & hence down trodden. John Wagner, Alan Grant and myself were all members of the NUJ. Nobody in their right mind would touch DR & Quinch or Halo Jones, and there's a sorry history of other creators taking over my strips and proving a disaster.

Would anyone want to follow Dan Abnett on Sinister Dexter, or any of Gordon Rennie's various occult series? If these or my strips are so important to the survival of the comic, the way to do that is the French model, where the original creators receive a share of the profits.

Because I feel ill served by previous publishers of 2000ad, I've made it so damn difficult for any hungry hack to follow me on ABC Warriors or Sláine. I've deliberately blocked the usual routes hacks take reviving a series - if you're so bloody talented, go create your own characters!

There's a slow process of killing me softly; Greysuit, Visible Man - one by one, my characters are falling. Colin MacNeil did one series of Defoe and didn't want to continue; Matt has been looking for a successor since the Spring, but it's fallen by the wayside.

I have to find artists and arrange samples myself, but I no longer enjoy the influence I once did. SMS has said he'd be interested in working on Misty material, which Keith Richardson seems receptive to, but Fay Dalton is doing pulp covers for Titan.

I learned just today that Rebellion have no plans to reprint Finn in 2018 or the foreseeable future , although they will reprint it at some point. They assure me there's no agenda to this; other strips, including some from Valiant and Lion, have priority.

Provided Clint Langley gives his approval, we'd like to publish American Reaper through the Millsverse imprint, and the success of Be Pure means we're looking at whether a book looking more closely at Sláine, Marshal Law, or girls comics could do the same.

Simon Bisley assures me he's working on our Joe Pineapples solo story, but if we had a better rights deal he'd have finished it long ago. He's doing it as a labour of love, so every time someone offers him better money to work on a film or something, it gets put to one side.

I can't remember the last time Rebellion asked me to create a new character, because they know I'll ask for a better deal. That's why it's a challenge getting fresh ideas and creators into the comic, and new ideas & characters are what used to have film people interested in adapting strips.

The pay and rights situation is why creators don't give 2000ad their best new ideas. That's why you have so many old strips coming back, but there's only so long you can run on empty. The days when creators were knocking on 2000ad's door are gone, and sooner or later the well of people who grew up wanting to work on the comic will run dry.

With regard to Simon Roy's recent Dredd strip and Ben Willsher's ghost cover, I have sympathy with artists cutting corners, because they're paid so poorly. I can tell from some artist's work that they're depressed; in some cases, they're subsidising 2000ad's low page rates.

Fay Dalton's already building a name for herself in advertising and with Titan; there's going to come a day when creators like her are no longer even walking through the door.



The rest of the interview's light hearted and entertaining; I've just excerpted the doom laden sections because I'm a miserable sod. Listen to the unabridged version of this Patchat, including Mills's thoughts on the Misty Special, HERE (https://player.fm/series/everything-comes-back-to-2000ad/ecbt2000ad-ep346-an-interview-with-pat-mills)


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Tiplodocus on 30 October, 2017, 09:57:12 am
Just a suggestion/some feedback but (given most people are fans of the work itself and not too bothered* about the behind the scenes stuff) wouldn't it be better to extract the light hearted and fun bits of the interview? And then add a post script that says "Pat also expands on issues he has experienced with rebellion and the state of the comics industry in general and that makes for an I interesting read; follow this link"


* that's not to say creator's rights is not an important issue. Is there somewhere we could actively assist them in their campaigning?
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 27 May, 2018, 12:22:45 pm

Doula, Michael Carroll, celebrates his nation's landmark decision regarding hatching and despatching by memorialising the embryonic titles that didn't make it to full term and were harmlessly reabsorbed into the rich uterine wall of IPC/Fleetway.

The Rusty Staples blog brings you The Eaglution Of British Comics

https://michaelowencarroll.wordpress.com/2018/05/26/eaglution-of-british-comics-part-1/


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Richard on 27 May, 2018, 05:04:48 pm
My favourite bit is "it's possibly there might be some mistakes."
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 27 May, 2018, 05:27:02 pm
My favourite bit is "it's possibly there might be some mistakes."

Arf!  Carroll's very funny and self-aware.

While I'm using Tharg's virtual real estate to create an easily searchable place to dump stuff that I'd otherwise be unable to find when I dimly remember it three years from now, here's Carroll's most popular blog-post ever; an authoritative and entertaining list of the longest running British comics of all time:

NUMBER SEVEN WILL ASTONISH YOU!!!  https://michaelowencarroll.wordpress.com/2018/05/09/the-british-comics-top-11-longevity-chart/


Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Richard on 27 May, 2018, 08:37:31 pm
Thanks for posting that, I really enjoyed reading that one. And thank you MC, just in case you read this.
Title: Re: Thrillpower Overload: the missing chapters
Post by: Frank on 17 June, 2018, 08:06:27 am

(https://i.imgur.com/tUjMTnH.png?4)



Carlos Ezquerra's Johnny Alpha is the most passive-aggressive act in British comics.

Anyone who's ever tried to draw Johnny Alpha's helmet soon realises the only solution is to copy a Carlos drawing. Copy it *exactly*.

Then you realise the way you've drawn Alpha, which looked alright before, looks stupid with the Carlos helmet on his head. So you copy the way Carlos draws Alpha. Copy it *exactly*.

Then you realise the whole thing doesn't work unless it's inked the way Carlos does it. So you copy it *exactly*.

You soon realise it's quicker, easier and cheaper just to pay Ezquerra to draw the fucking thing himself.


* Then you realise you have to put a Viking in there, too, and try not to make that look stupid.