2000 AD Online Forum

Spoilers => Prog => Topic started by: McNulty on 20 January, 2018, 02:12:48 pm

Title: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: McNulty on 20 January, 2018, 02:12:48 pm
Dredd: a nice Segway from the previous story to this new one of Dredd in slavery. This story reintroduces a previous character from an older story and brings out some new ones. It will be interesting to see how these new potential plot threads play out. I am especially interested in the red haired character Nuala.

ABC Warriors: I know that the warriors are being set against each other to discredit them and their mission but it is still exciting to see them fight one on one again. Not since the time when Blackblood/Joe Pineapples, Mek-Quake/Mongrol and Hammerstein/Dreadlock have we seen this happen and then it was stopped before it could get really good. Let's see how this plays out.

Brass Sun: I'm still finding this more difficult to get into. Perhaps it's because it was so long since the last instalment.

Savage: This weeks episode has lots of foreshadowing that bridges Savage to the ABC Warriors storyline. Once again the war has been declared a lie, with the established reasons behind it being revealed to be a cover for those really behind it - just like in Bad Company, the V.C.s and pretty much every war story in 2000AD that has been retconned from it's original run. Did we really need to be told that there are more than one way to see a war? We know that the reasons behind wars starting are not black and white.

And speaking of Bad Company...I'm still having trouble that the likes of Thrax and Mad Tommy are alive in this story. I can just about get on board with Flytrap but when I read this I am still wondering if it will be revealed what is happening here. With Bad Company it was presented that Kano and his men were misfits who come together to fight he Krool in their own mad way while the other earther soldiers were more like normal people. But now it seems that no one got out of Ararat without physiological or physical damage. Even on Ararat there were hints that Bad Company were not the only lunatic squads out there - we had the Skull Posse and those poor souls that the Krool had experimented on but in this series it looks like everyone were seriously screwed up.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Eamonn Clarke on 20 January, 2018, 02:16:54 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/4L32fIh.jpg)

Chris Weston
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Proudhuff on 20 January, 2018, 02:18:10 pm
ha, the poor bloody postmen and wimmin who have to deliver that under current conditions  :lol:
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: McNulty on 20 January, 2018, 04:23:01 pm
The weather's nae too bad up here at the moment. Still, I dae appreciate getting ma 2000AD.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: A.Cow on 20 January, 2018, 09:33:32 pm
Savage: This weeks episode has lots of foreshadowing that bridges Savage to the ABC Warriors storyline.

I can't shake the feeling that this is all going to end up with Bill Savage's mind being transferred to a very specific Hammerstein Mk.III ... or, more likely, a FRED sewage droid ....
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Colin YNWA on 20 January, 2018, 09:55:33 pm
Savage: This weeks episode has lots of foreshadowing that bridges Savage to the ABC Warriors storyline.

I can't shake the feeling that this is all going to end up with Bill Savage's mind being transferred to a very specific Hammerstein Mk.III ... or, more likely, a FRED sewage droid ....

Well the sewage droid does have a cockney accent after all!

Anyway back to poor old Porg 2065. I feel sorry for Prog 2065. I mean after last weeks tour-de-force in Prog 2064 and the wonder that was Meg 392 its got a heck of a job on its hands keepin' up the pace.

Damnit it gives it a good fist and does its damnest, its a fine Prog, just not quite able to sustain that level alas. On most fronts too.

Dredd starts us off nicely as we jump forward to a very good set up Prog and them again to a very exciting bit of Extreme Fishing that would have that fella from Soldier Soldier wishing that he was still with that other fella from Soldier Soldier in a warm TOTP studio. Oh and I love the way Carroll gets around the Dredd keeping on his helmet thing too. Good start, but it is just set up after last weeks fantastic conclusion.

ABC Warriors does a good job of showing how much fun a 'talking heads' episode can be, sometimes you are well reminded that Uncle Pat doesn't half know his craft.

Brass Sun well its just knocked it out the park last week and it would seem so poor bugger than to catch at 'it' field it, run all the way back just to have it knocked out the park again this week. Supreme.

Savage well yes it does play with the old recon vibe and just with the talking heads in ABC Warriors Uncle Pat shows us how to take an old dog and teach it new tricks, its recon done really well. Love the use of the Volganaya (and I'm guessing Ekranonplan but I don't remember that as clearly).

Bad Company you know what it might not have quite come together for me yet but taken on its own merits I really enjoyed that episode. Particularly the last page, which indeed is once again the last page on the prog, as in the very last page, the back cover showing how much Tharg is cramming in for us these day, anyway yeah the last page which provides such wonderful old school visuals in glorious modern techni-colour.

So yeah while this Prog ain't quite as good as its nearest neighbours, absolute credit to it for staying at the races!
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Batman's Superior Cousin on 20 January, 2018, 10:05:22 pm
Savage: This weeks episode has lots of foreshadowing that bridges Savage to the ABC Warriors storyline.

I can't shake the feeling that this is all going to end up with Bill Savage's mind being transferred to a very specific Hammerstein Mk.III ... or, more likely, a FRED sewage droid ....

Anyway back to poor old Porg 2065. I feel sorry for Prog 2065. I mean after last weeks tour-de-force in Prog 2064 and the wonder that was Meg 392 its got a heck of a job on its hands keepin' up the pace.

Star Wars on your brain at the moment?
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Andy Lambert on 20 January, 2018, 10:35:06 pm
Sadly, I'm not into this current line-up of stories. Apart from Judge Dredd, I'm finding everything else to be a bit... meh. Even The ABC Warriors isn't grabbing me much. I realise I missed out a lot during my many years away from 2000 AD so there's likely to be a lot that doesn't make sense to me, but having caught up on The Mek Files, I found the earlier stuff to be much more engaging.
This is only my second exposure to Brass Sun so again, I've missed a lot of important stuff which may be why it's only just keeping my interest,
I'm no fan of Bad Company and Savage and have stopped reading them altogether.

After the recent Indigo Prime, Outlier, etc, I'm struggling to stick with the Prog, and if it wasn't for Judge Dredd, I'd have probably stopped buying again by now.

Sorry for sounding so downbeat - just wanted to express how I've been feeling about the prog lately.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Richard on 21 January, 2018, 12:36:33 am
When you're tired of 2000AD, you're tired of life.

I think this week we may have been given the answer to why Thrax and the others are still alive -- it isn't really them, they're just imposters, only more convincing than the guy who admits he's an imposter.

I don't think there's anything of Bill Savage in either of Hammerstein's or Ro-Jaws's personalities. But I do enjoy the links between the two series.

I liked the bit when the guy in Dredd got his head squished.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: A.Cow on 21 January, 2018, 01:30:15 am
Love the use of the Volganaya (and I'm guessing Ekranonplan but I don't remember that as clearly).

Loved that Volgnaya reference, too.  Brought back memories of Kevin O'Neill's artwork from those old Ro-Busters "memoir" stories.

Ekranoplan might sound familiar because it's the name of a real Russian "plane" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lun-class_ekranoplan).
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: WhizzBang on 21 January, 2018, 08:44:35 am
Sadly, I'm not into this current line-up of stories. Apart from Judge Dredd, I'm finding everything else to be a bit... meh. Even The ABC Warriors isn't grabbing me much. I realise I missed out a lot during my many years away from 2000 AD so there's likely to be a lot that doesn't make sense to me, but having caught up on The Mek Files, I found the earlier stuff to be much more engaging.
This is only my second exposure to Brass Sun so again, I've missed a lot of important stuff which may be why it's only just keeping my interest,
I'm no fan of Bad Company and Savage and have stopped reading them altogether.

After the recent Indigo Prime, Outlier, etc, I'm struggling to stick with the Prog, and if it wasn't for Judge Dredd, I'd have probably stopped buying again by now.

Sorry for sounding so downbeat - just wanted to express how I've been feeling about the prog lately.

I have got a lot of sympathy for this. I returned to 2000AD in 2016 and have sometimes found myself at a loss as to what is happening in a strip. Dredd works because we are all familiar with the basic premis and most stories are short enough to catch from the beginning but other stuff is often very long and quite confusing to readers who weren't there from the beginning. I think it is okay to have one or two strips like this but if the whole prog is this way, as Andy is finding, then it is difficult.

One way around this is to look into the collections. I am able to enjoy Brass Sun as I downloaded the free digital version of the first part which I enjoyed enough to make me by the digital collection 'The Wheel Of Worlds'.  A Megazine sub is also useful for collecting together earlier strips in the 'floppy's.

On the plus side for the prog, I have found Sinister Dexter is friendlier since it is generally short, violent comedy with a distinctive cast. It does give the impression that there is a bigger back story (is there a reason why Dexter's eyes are white and he has a FONY tattoo?) but this doesn't get in the way of me understanding what is going on in these strips.

The Thargs 3Thrillers are also more often hits than misses for me, and there have been many thrills that I have been able to catch in their entirety now that I am a subscriber.

Bring back Stronium Dog!
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: The Adventurer on 21 January, 2018, 05:40:46 pm
Bring back Stronium Dog!

(https://imageshack.com/a/img922/7206/cqwZjD.jpg)
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: IndigoPrime on 21 January, 2018, 07:35:55 pm
I am able to enjoy Brass Sun as I downloaded the free digital version of the first part which I enjoyed enough to make me by the digital collection 'The Wheel Of Worlds'
For those who like physical tomes, the Brass Sun hardcover is a beautiful thing, too.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Magnetica on 21 January, 2018, 07:39:23 pm
I had been losing the plot with the Prog lately and so re-read all the stories from the Xmas Prog onwards. Now they all make perfect sense.

The stand out for me of the current run is Savage which is head and shoulders above everything else.

Next up is ABC Warriors . But I can’t help thinking there is a lot of truth in the line that their glory days are long over. Still it’s lovely to look at. I do wish they would move on from the whole Mars story line which seems to have been going on for years if not decades.

I wasn’t expecting Dredd to start a whole new arc. The “ghosts” of East Meg One” story line doesn’t feel done to me. So I guess we are now in the third part of an epic, but the parts so far feel disjointed to me. I have just re-read Tour of Duty - now that was how to do a multi part epic than hangs together (a few ropey Cursed Earth stories from the Megazine notwithstanding.)

Brass Sun seems to have gone all Camelot 3000. Which isn’t necessarily a good thing.

I think I have worked out another reason why I’m not well disposed to this run of Bad Company - Brett Ewins black and white artwork was just so distinctive and I just think colour doesn’t suit it.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Richard on 21 January, 2018, 08:27:58 pm
Quote
The “ghosts” of East Meg One” story line doesn’t feel done to me.
They killed all the ghosts. It feels done to me.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Tombo on 21 January, 2018, 08:56:41 pm
(is there a reason why Dexter's eyes are white and he has a FONY tattoo?)

He's had a device called a "Headcase" installed which beams TV shows and movies directly into his brain.  The original "Sony" version got fried by an EMP pulse so he had a bootleg version fitted (hence Fony/phony).
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Magnetica on 22 January, 2018, 03:45:08 pm
Ok let’s re-phrase that...given these ghosts have been there for over 30 years, the resolution seemed all too quick. Just blow the field generator up (or whatever it was called). The point is the narrative moved on very quickly and I would have liked a bit more reflection on it. But I guess that isn’t Dredd’s way. As he demonstrated when he nuked East Meg One in the first place.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Proudhuff on 23 January, 2018, 06:03:30 pm
If you are struggling with the Prog just now, pick up the Meg is cooking with gas!

That's a great cover , but I'm missing The art work and story telling of one of 2ks finest on Dredd.

Brass Sun is the only other thing I'm paying attention to just now, Skipped Hulk smash robots, Savage only just holds my interest would love him to get his Brexit/UKip world shattered, but no goona happen...
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Trout on 24 January, 2018, 02:18:02 am
Yeah, me too. I like the Dredd story and I'm still into Brass Sun. I'm following Bad Company fairly well and I'm OK with it, but the other two stories are nit my thing. Nice art on Savage.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: DrRocka on 24 January, 2018, 03:44:29 pm
Only Dredd keeping me buying the prog right now. Haven’t a clue who the two robots are that talk their way through an episode of ABC Warriors, Savage’s magic robot retconning is downright embarrassing, Brass Sun’s a level of Meh I’ve not encountered since I last listened to radio 2, and whoever commissioned Bad Company must be out of their mind, despite the wonderful Rufus on art duty.

So yeah... just Dredd and my 40 year history with the prog keeping me buying it right now. I’ve always found Pat Mill’s recent trend of having two people talking for entire episodes to be anything but “thrillpower”. PLEASE Tharg, don’t commit every strip in the prog to 10 or so episodes in future, especially if two are by the same author. A couple of months of this pile of bollix is enough to put a fella off his subscription.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: James Stacey on 24 January, 2018, 03:48:15 pm
If you are struggling with the Prog just now, pick up the Meg is cooking with gas!
Polar opposite innit. Everything in the meg this month is exciting.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Mardroid on 24 January, 2018, 05:56:31 pm
Im quite enjoying all the prog so far with the exception of Bad Company, and that's mainly me being a bit puzzled as to what's going on.

I think ABC warriors is perhaps the weakest story wise (all the robots are now fighting each other, and while I understand its likely orchestrated by the G-Men or their nosferatu boss, I have either missed or forgotten how. Suddenly Mongrol is crazy and smushing people. Suddenly Deadlock is sacrificing kids (or was that an illusion). Suddenly Steelhorn has gone martian terrorist. Okay he's had the Mars/Medusa affiliation for a while, bit point is, it all happens at once? And yet I'm enjoying the big robots having a go at each other.

I loved this artists rendering of the current gen ABC Warriors in Savage by the way. And the 1000 year stare (or whatever its called) provides an interesting reason for the ABC warriors tech being developed so close to our own time period. Although I'm still not clear what the stare thing actually is, apart from a way to see the future. I can't remember if it was explained.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Magnetica on 24 January, 2018, 06:45:14 pm
Im quite enjoying all the prog so far with the exception of Bad Company, and that's mainly me being a bit puzzled as to what's going on.

I think ABC warriors is perhaps the weakest story wise .... Suddenly Steelhorn has gone martian terrorist. Okay he's had the Mars/Medusa affiliation for a while..

Steelhorn has had that affiliation since the Third Element (The Tripods story). I can't remember what Prog that was but it pre-dates the Clint Langley era so it was years ago.

I'm still not clear what the stare thing actually is, apart from a way to see the future. I can't remember if it was explained.


I know it can be hard to remember...because it was explained last week. If it had been in 1979 I sure you would recall it no problem.

Anyway it is a drug that makes an hour seem to last a hundred years.  The Volgs (and the allies) then got  a load of leading scientists together, like Stephen Hawking Graham Foster to use this "stretched time" to invent all sorts of advanced technology - like ABC Warriors (as explained in this week's Prog).

Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Richard on 24 January, 2018, 07:05:04 pm
Deadlock has always done things like sacrifice kids to Khaos or whatever. No change there.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Modern Panther on 24 January, 2018, 09:27:13 pm
Quote
I’ve always found Pat Mill’s recent trend of having two people talking for entire episodes to be anything but “thrillpower”.

How else will we understand that evil billionaires secretly run the world and that everything we think we know is a lie, unless its explained us twice a week, every week?!

The Meg is looking great right now, though.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: norton canes on 25 January, 2018, 10:46:52 am
As someone else who's only recently returned to the prog after a long absence, I'm another one who would prefer more strips that don't require knowledge of stories from 10, 20 or even 40 years ago.

Having said that... it was kind of satisfying to see the ABC Warriors finally mentioned in a Savage strip - I mean, that's where the time line is going, so why not? Although I didn't get the reference to (quoting form memory) 'mental time travel'?

The way Dredd is meandering through a series of shot interlinked Sov stories is a bit strange but good in the sense that it keeps things ticking over. Are we supposed to recognise 'Maul'?

ABC Warriors - another installment of 'adversaries discuss opposing philosophies', I had my fill of this in the last run of Slaine 

Brass Sun - I feel like I should be enjoying this more than I actually am. At least it's an epic story that's written as an epic story, not an epic story that's epic by dint of the fact that it references decades-old continuity. Still, it's not quite clicking... will persevere though.

Bad Company - contrary to most, I reckon the scripting is OK but the art is letting it down. RD put in some sterling work on Counterfeit Girl but despite the similarities to Brett Ewins I don't think it's working well here.


Mainly though, I do think Tharg has to have a serious think about running so many long-form, continuity-dependent stories.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Pyroxian on 25 January, 2018, 11:01:16 am
Although I didn't get the reference to (quoting form memory) 'mental time travel'?

As I understand it, The Thousand Yard Stare is a technique whereby a  person's mind operates at a faster speed than everything else - hence in an actual year, a scientist gets about a thousand years of 'thinking' time - hence coming up with ideas that would normally not be seen for millenia.

It's a pretty cool idea IMO, and explains that rapid technology jump from Invasion to the ABC Warriors / Volgan war.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: JamesC on 25 January, 2018, 11:48:04 am
I'm really enjoying the prog at the moment. The Dredd story feels fresh and exciting, Bad Company is a bit bonkers but enjoyable, I love the ABC Warriors and am a big fan of Clint Langley and Savage is going great guns - I love the idea of the 'mental time travel'. I'm skipping Brass Sun but everything else is great.

Also, the East Meg guy on the front cover has a Volgan emblem on his jacket.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Big_Dave on 25 January, 2018, 01:19:18 pm
The Thousand Yard Stare is a technique whereby a  person's mind operates at a faster speed than everything else - hence in an actual year, a scientist gets about a thousand years of 'thinking' time - hence coming up with ideas that would normally not be seen for millenia.

It's a pretty cool idea IMO, and explains that rapid technology jump from Invasion to the ABC Warriors / Volgan war.


is that how sciencev works
just having a long think

cant speed up experiments
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: The Adventurer on 25 January, 2018, 06:39:20 pm

cant speed up experiments
Indeed.

I would make more sense if they were just receiving technology from the future to reverse engineer, perhaps from Torquemada himself. Or even still use a drug induced psychological state, and the technology is being beamed back in time into the minds of people on the drug.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: sheridan on 25 January, 2018, 06:59:46 pm
I would make more sense if they were just receiving technology from the future to reverse engineer, perhaps from Torquemada himself. Or even still use a drug induced psychological state, and the technology is being beamed back in time into the minds of people on the drug.


That wouldn't help - the siege engines from Nemesis Book III were built in the 'lost age of science' - Torque's people had no better idea of how they would have worked than those from pre-ABC days.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: sheridan on 25 January, 2018, 07:01:44 pm
Quote
I’ve always found Pat Mill’s recent trend of having two people talking for entire episodes to be anything but “thrillpower”.

How else will we understand that evil billionaires secretly run the world and that everything we think we know is a lie, unless its explained us twice a week, every week?!


What, the 42 billionaires who own as much as the poorest half of the world's population? (https://www.bbc.com/pidgin/tori-42785489)...
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: sheridan on 25 January, 2018, 07:02:36 pm
Quote
I’ve always found Pat Mill’s recent trend of having two people talking for entire episodes to be anything but “thrillpower”.

How else will we understand that evil billionaires secretly run the world and that everything we think we know is a lie, unless its explained us twice a week, every week?!


What, the 42 billionaires who own as much as the poorest half of the world's population? (https://www.bbc.com/pidgin/tori-42785489)...


p.s. 'pidgin' version of BBC website?  I had no idea!
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Magnetica on 25 January, 2018, 07:10:54 pm
They are doing thought experiments and in those terms I think it does make sense.

Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: TordelBack on 28 January, 2018, 06:15:33 pm
I don't really dislike anything in this prog, but other than Brass Sun (which is exciting and gorgeous) there isn't much that excites me either. That's probably slightly worse than a negative reaction, really.

ABC Warriors and Bad Company look magnificent and I'm happy they're here so I can look at them, but the stories do little or nothing for me.  Savage is also purdy, but here I'm at least somewhat interested in what's going on.  Dredd is still passive-Dredd-gets-beaten-up and new-female/Irish-sidekick-does-all-the-talking, and it just flows right over me.  Dredd-out-of-water really only works for me if the places Dredd visits are interesting, or interesting things happen to him there, and we've just spent months going from an ore-processing station to the Sov version of the Cursed Earth to a hidden ice-fishing station... it's not exactly Sauron Valley, Lesser Lingo, or even Enceladus, is it? 

So overall, the most dreaded verdict of all is delivered: meh.
Title: Re: Prog 2065 - Snow Escape
Post by: Tiplodocus on 29 January, 2018, 12:22:55 am
Similar for me at the moment. Love the diversity in script and art and enjoying the stories but not dying for next installment and it might get to Friday before I think "Oh, I forgot to download the prog."