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Author Topic: HBO Watchmen  (Read 3779 times)

JayzusB.Christ

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #15 on: 21 July, 2019, 10:09:12 pm »
Especially V for Viennetta
“Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest”

Frank

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #16 on: 21 July, 2019, 10:35:38 pm »
Especially V for Viennetta

You're thinking of Rory McConeville. You know him; did that comic with Francesco Francavanilla.



radiator

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #17 on: 25 July, 2019, 10:55:29 pm »
Quote
Lindelof: "(Alan Moore has) made it very clear that he doesn’t want to have any association or affiliation with Watchmen ongoing and that we not use his name to get people to watch it, which I want to respect....... I do feel like the spirit of Alan Moore is a punk rock spirit, a rebellious spirit, and that if you would tell Alan Moore, a teenage Moore in ’85 or ’86, ‘You’re not allowed to do this because Superman’s creator or Swamp Thing’s creator doesn’t want you to do it,’ he would say, ‘F— you, I’m doing it anyway.’ So I’m channeling the spirit of Alan Moore to tell Alan Moore, ‘F— you, I’m doing it anyway.’"

Not sure if we have a cringe/puke emoji, so this'll have to do  :-[

Aside from the fact that Moore was in his 30s in 1984, I think it's a pretty big misunderstanding/mischaracterisation of his work - I mean maybe you could say that about his LOEG stuff, but as far as I know Moore has always been very respectful towards other creators (his 'f you' attitude being mostly reserved for corporations like DC) and I know for a fact that Len Wein was hugely enthusiastic and complimentary of Moore's pretty drastic take on Swamp Thing.

https://ew.com/tv/2019/07/24/damon-lindelof-watchmen-hbo-series-alan-moore-tca-2019/

TordelBack

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #18 on: 25 July, 2019, 11:59:08 pm »
Wow, every bit the ignorant dickhead his CV of deeply disappointing point-missing would suggest.

Dandontdare

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #19 on: 26 July, 2019, 09:06:08 am »
Quote
Lindelof: "(Alan Moore has) made it very clear that he doesn’t want to have any association or affiliation with Watchmen ongoing and that we not use his name to get people to watch it, which I want to respect....... I do feel like the spirit of Alan Moore is a punk rock spirit, a rebellious spirit, and that if you would tell Alan Moore, a teenage Moore in ’85 or ’86, ‘You’re not allowed to do this because Superman’s creator or Swamp Thing’s creator doesn’t want you to do it,’ he would say, ‘F— you, I’m doing it anyway.’ So I’m channeling the spirit of Alan Moore to tell Alan Moore, ‘F— you, I’m doing it anyway.’"

Highlighted for emphasis - that respecting his wishes is going well....

TordelBack

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #20 on: 26 July, 2019, 11:04:19 am »
Further:

Quote
(Alan Moore has) made it very clear that he doesn’t want to have any association or affiliation with Watchmen ongoing...

Isn't the exact opposite the truth?  Moore has always wanted Watchmen returned to himself and Gibbons*, as would have happened if DC had honoured the wishes of the creators that made them millions, and boosted the reputation and longevity of their entire industry, rather than the wording of an outdated contract.

Amazing, really: in a burning world ruled by amoral asinine assholes, Lindelof still has the power to anger me.



*Although how his would have played out in terms of screen adaptations when they drove an even bigger  lorry full of cash up to Dave's door is another matter.
« Last Edit: 26 July, 2019, 11:07:27 am by TordelBack »

radiator

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #21 on: 26 July, 2019, 04:52:10 pm »
Should say, I don't have any strong feelings either way regarding Lindelof - I was never really into Lost and haven't seen The Leftovers (which is apparently very good). I've seen Prometheus, but I think Ridley Scott is primarily responsible for that particular dumpster fire.

But yeah, that quote in isolation really makes him sound like a bit of a dick.

Mardroid

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #22 on: 30 July, 2019, 07:07:16 pm »
I followed the link, and actually, out of isolation, the comments don't come across quite as harsh. He says nicer stuff about Moore elsewhere.

I'm in two minds about an extension, but this comment seems promising:

Quote
Lindelof did promise, however, that the original source material isn’t being retconned or rewritten in his HBO version. “We reexplore the past but it’s canon,” he says. “Everything that happened in those 12 issues could not be messed with. We were married to it. There is no rebooting it.”

TordelBack

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #23 on: 30 July, 2019, 07:32:44 pm »
Not sure I can agree there Mardroid- saying he respects Moore's work but not Moore's claim of ownership of the work, and throwing in a "f*ck off Alan", with the explanation that thats what Alan would do, is pretty despicable. He's just a rude hack with no ideas of his own.

Mardroid

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #24 on: 30 July, 2019, 08:14:04 pm »
I don't disagree he went too far. Emphasis on the word 'quite', in my comment.

Greg M.

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #25 on: 30 July, 2019, 08:34:48 pm »
I have no idea who this show is aimed at. Though I deplored the existence of the Before Watchmen comics, I could see the target audience: people who wanted Watchmen fan fiction but who didn’t respect Alan Moore. While I deplore the existence of the Doomsday Clock comics, again, I understand the audience: people who want to see a Watchmen / DCU mash-up, and who don’t respect Alan Moore. But who’s this for? People who liked Watchmen well enough to want a sequel, but didn’t understand Watchmen well enough to know that it needs no sequel, and who hate Alan Moore?

Jimmy Baker's Assistant

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #26 on: 30 July, 2019, 08:49:42 pm »
I fear this is a show for people who know the name Watchmen but don't really know what it was about or why it was good. Which is a lot of people.

It's also a show for people who hate Alan Moore, but I think there's far fewer of those. Probably less than a million.

Frank

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #27 on: 30 July, 2019, 09:01:56 pm »
Though I deplored the existence of the Before Watchmen comics, I could see the target audience: people who wanted Watchmen fan fiction but who didn’t respect Alan Moore.

Funny and true.

Unlike everyone else, I thought - removed from any context other than contemporary US telly - the trailer looked it'd make for a quite good TV show.

Thankfully, I've never enjoyed a single thing Lindyhop has been involved with, so I realise it's almost certainly dreadful.



radiator

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #28 on: 30 July, 2019, 10:04:38 pm »
I have no idea who this show is aimed at. Though I deplored the existence of the Before Watchmen comics, I could see the target audience: people who wanted Watchmen fan fiction but who didn’t respect Alan Moore. While I deplore the existence of the Doomsday Clock comics, again, I understand the audience: people who want to see a Watchmen / DCU mash-up, and who don’t respect Alan Moore. But who’s this for? People who liked Watchmen well enough to want a sequel, but didn’t understand Watchmen well enough to know that it needs no sequel, and who hate Alan Moore?

My thought exactly.

Is this a sequel to the comics? Or the film? How is it going to appeal to people unfamiliar with one and not the other? Or neither? How do you square the Star Wars sequel problem of continuing a story that is essentially finished, many decades later, and in which almost all of its most visually distinct and iconic characters are long dead?

Not to put Watchmen on an unreachable pedestal or anything - I simply don't think it really lends itself to the prequel or sequel treatment - it's such a self-contained and singular product of it's time, and so closely tied to the visions of its original creators. To treat it like any other superhero property, merely source material to exploit and adapt across other media seems to miss the point in a pretty major way. To me it's like making The Shawshank Redemption 2, about Andy Dufresne and Red's adventures outside prison. Much as I like those characters, I don't want to see that. Their story is fundamentally over.

If you really want to adapt an Alan Moore comic into a TV series, you have plenty of better, more open-ended options than - Swamp Thing could have been amazing in the right hands, Halo Jones would be incredible, as would Top 10.

Apparently the show deals a lot with race and policing - prime subject matter for a TV drama for sure, but what does that have to do with Watchmen? And is that really a suitable topic for a show that features superhuman beings living on Mars?

To be honest nothing about this trailer says 'Watchmen' to me apart from the glimpses of familiar iconography (which seem a little incongruous). Take those out and it could be literally any show.
« Last Edit: 30 July, 2019, 10:08:01 pm by radiator »

shaolin_monkey

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Re: HBO Watchmen
« Reply #29 on: 31 July, 2019, 01:45:26 am »
Jeez - just caught up with this. What an appalling cash-in.

Alan Moore must be digging his own grave so he can then spin in it.