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Author Topic: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?  (Read 938 times)

Colin YNWA

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #15 on: 07 August, 2019, 09:17:17 pm »
There's a very strong case to be made (by which I of course mean a case I have made!) the advent of Dante and Sinister Dexter having regular slots, if not ever present, went a long way to stablising 2000ad after the nadir of the late 80s early to mid 90s. Having two, if not three bankers meant Tharg had the time and space to get the rest of his house in order and very quickly did.

The flipside is it a dangerous game to play as a big part of 2000ad's strenght is its variety and ability to surprise and mix things up. Get things too nailed down and as stated things will become stagnant.

So I'd head towards the view Jim is looking towards. Dredd is your solid foundation. Get a couple if regular, but still rotating strips in - easy to say hard to do as discussed already. There are a few we could nominate that exist... and well Sinister Dexter still has legs in this old chaps eye... but I suspect that wouldn't be popular. Then keep the rest moving along. In an ideal world maybe one of these would actually be a 30-40 episode single tale, though suspect that's not realistic anymore in the way of Meltdown Man or Return to Armegeddon.

I think that would be helped by other strips having a more defined path to a conclusion. So while we have a bedrock we do have  a load of other comics with long ongoing storylines with no end in sight, just queuing up for the next vacant slot. Books that last 5 or 6 series, even 10 or 12 as long as we have a sense of progression towards conclusion.

All of this of course take no consideration of how characters need to work these days. The challenge in creating these ideal stories and the way this might affect the after markets for materials in trades etc (though there are a number of long running strips that no longer have a trade 'programme' so that doesn't seem to be too important?).

Frank

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #16 on: 07 August, 2019, 09:22:56 pm »
... does 'Judge Dredd' itself still need to be one of them? Does it still need to appear in every issue? I know that for most, the answer is 'yes, of course, you fool' and it seems a commercial no-brainer to maintain its regular status, but would sales drop if Dredd only turned up occasionally? Personally, I'd no longer mind if, as per latter-days Strontium Dog, it only showed up when John Wagner had a new story he wanted to tell.

I think it would make the strip stronger, but if I was the incoming Tharg I'd probably keep that plan under my hat.



sheridan

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #17 on: 07 August, 2019, 09:25:00 pm »
I could see a year or Rogue doing pretty well - not just Rogue continuously though, but Venus Bluegenes, Tor Cyan, maybe even Fr1day (as long as it's closer to the Gibbons/Simpson version), The 86ers, Hunted, Jaegir and an entirely new series - something to keep Nu Earth and/or blue skin in the comic for a longer term.

sheridan

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #18 on: 07 August, 2019, 09:33:35 pm »
I wasn't a big fan of The Vigilant for two reasons - the first that it was trying to introduce too much in a compressed amount of space - a bit like the second or third Avengers film without having met any of the characters beforehand (not seen the latest, but the last one I saw I'd forgotten who half the characters in the first half hour were - even though I'd seen all the MCU films, in order, up to that point).  The other reason is I'm not a huge fan of superheroes in the first place.

Which brings me to my point - Rebellion now has a huge amount of IP - just about everything published in a century of British comics except for The Eagle, Phoenix and those that came out of Dundee *.  So, for those who know pre-2000AD comics better than me - is there anything in there that could be turned into a modern, shared-world ongoing series, either in 2000AD or outside of it?  Preferably something not centred around the second world war!

* In verifying it was actually Dundee, I found out that R D Low was co-creator of Oor Wullie and The Broons, and then went on to launch The Beano and The Dandy!
« Last Edit: 07 August, 2019, 09:36:43 pm by sheridan »

Frank

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #19 on: 07 August, 2019, 09:44:58 pm »

Faceache's a bit like Mystique from the X-Men.



PsychoGoatee

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #20 on: 07 August, 2019, 09:49:08 pm »
I didn't realize that all other 2000AD strips are creator owned these days. That's cool. How long has that been the case? Are things like Sinister Dexter or Nikolai Dante from the 90s creator owned? And are older ones like ABC Warriors or Slaine creator owned?

Not really. Tharg generally wants all rights to everything. 2000ad's run a handful of strips that were creator-owned and most of those were only retrospectively declared the property of their creators or something Wagner and/or Grant knocked up for another comic.

A few, like Tank Girl*, Realm Of The Damned, Demon Nic and American Reaper ran in the Megazine, rather than 2000ad, in a slot specifically reserved for creator-owned work (I assume, to fill space in the comic at a reduced rate).

This list doesn't include Terra-Meks, a Robusters spin-off that Pat Mills managed to get printed on his own terms:




* I think Tank Girl ran before the advent of the creator-slot, but saying that would have fucked up my syntax and, look see, I've acknowledged that misstatement of fact.

Thanks, good to know. I just watched the Future Shock doc, they mentioned the creator owned issue from back in the day, I didn't know the status these days.


I don’t think this has really been tried in the prog since Sin/Dex and Nikolai Dante

I've said it before, but these two benefited enormously from their semi-permanent status. I didn't like Sinister / Dexter at all, till fairly far into its tenure, but it was there every week, I read it, and it eventually grew on me. I'd even argue that it needs to be a regular fixture to work properly as a series - its current sporadic schedule doesn't serve it well.

That said - even if I'm in favour of residencies for certain stories, does 'Judge Dredd' itself still need to be one of them? Does it still need to appear in every issue? I know that for most, the answer is 'yes, of course, you fool' and it seems a commercial no-brainer to maintain its regular status, but would sales drop if Dredd only turned up occasionally? Personally, I'd no longer mind if, as per latter-days Strontium Dog, it only showed up when John Wagner had a new story he wanted to tell.

While I'm fine with them skipping a few if they are having trouble getting a quality story ready, having a good Dredd every week should be doable. Some writers handle several monthly comics, and we have a few great writers doing Dredd. Organizing that and keeping the quality going I think is something special, it's creatively cool to have that as an ongoing thing. I agree on the respect and kudos for John Wagner though.
« Last Edit: 07 August, 2019, 09:50:40 pm by PsychoGoatee »

IndigoPrime

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #21 on: 07 August, 2019, 10:42:06 pm »
So, for those who know pre-2000AD comics better than me - is there anything in there that could be turned into a modern, shared-world ongoing series, either in 2000AD or outside of it?  Preferably something not centred around the second world war!
I’d say there’s a boatload of stuff that could be mined from those old comics, but last I heard from Tharg on the podcast, he wasn’t keen on crossing the streams.

Magnetica

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #22 on: 08 August, 2019, 07:27:49 am »
I’m keen on the idea of having strips with long runs or at least minimising the length of time between series. When you get long gaps it is hard to keep up with what is going on. It should not be necessary to dig out the back Progs to follow what is going on - it’s meant to be fun after all. I have seen comments previously saying that is due to the availability of creators but surely there is an element of creators losing interest- I can think of at least one writer who has multiple uncompleted series- why not just finished each one before moving on to the next?

Funt Solo

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #23 on: 08 August, 2019, 08:17:28 am »
Dante, towards the end, did a summary episode to bring us up to speed: I’d love to see that or a “previously on...” page for any thrill that’s seen a year or longer absence.

It really is poor storytelling to assume we just remember everything. I speak for the middle-aged Squaxx.
fate amenable to change

IndigoPrime

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #24 on: 08 August, 2019, 09:39:37 am »
In a sense, this is why I wonder about things like The Vigilant. It’s almost comical to see my two issues stating August 2018 and August 2019 as the dates. My old brain has enough of a hard time remembering Meg stories month to month, let alone when there’s a year-long gap.

CalHab

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #25 on: 08 August, 2019, 09:42:22 am »
The Vigilant would have made more sense as a limited series to test the waters.

wedgeski

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #26 on: 08 August, 2019, 10:09:49 am »
Let me say for the record that 2000AD without weekly Dredd would make for a less exciting Saturday morning, for this Squaxx at least. I can't say how much of that is due to its consistently high quality in the last couple of years. If it started to decline, I might change my mind, and be more on board with the "let's wait until we have decent writers and artists lined up" school of thought.

I'd be open to a new weekly regular, but none of the current stable seems to fit the bill. In the meantime, I am *hugely* enjoying long-running series like Brink.

Magnetica

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #27 on: 08 August, 2019, 12:25:45 pm »
In a sense, this is why I wonder about things like The Vigilant. It’s almost comical to see my two issues stating August 2018 and August 2019 as the dates. My old brain has enough of a hard time remembering Meg stories month to month, let alone when there’s a year-long gap.

Totally. My plan is to re-read the first one then read the new one. But I shouldn’t have to  :|

IndigoPrime

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #28 on: 08 August, 2019, 12:37:46 pm »
Likewise. My copy arrived yesterday, and I dug out its predecessor. I’m half tempted to grab the special that the universe originated in too.

Jim_Campbell

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Re: Does 2000 AD need another 'Judge Dredd'?
« Reply #29 on: 08 August, 2019, 12:53:35 pm »
I could see a year or Rogue doing pretty well - not just Rogue continuously though, but Venus Bluegenes, Tor Cyan, maybe even Fr1day (as long as it's closer to the Gibbons/Simpson version), The 86ers, Hunted, Jaegir and an entirely new series - something to keep Nu Earth and/or blue skin in the comic for a longer term.

I really quite like this idea, with the caveat that I don't think it's a good idea to go re-muddying those continuity waters with Tor Cyan/Friday variant versions.

Nu Earth is well-defined enough to support multiple writers in the same 'universe' but not so locked down that everyone ends up basically writing the same story. A rolling 'Tales of Nu Earth' spot with Rogue occasionally guest-starring in stories focussed on other characters and a few stories each year where the blue guy takes centre stage would raise the profile of the IP but avoid the core problem, which is that Rogue himself isn't terrribly interesting.
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