The Political Thread

[COMMANDO FORCES]

I see savers in Cyprus are going mad and trying to withdraw all their money. European Union at its very best

[Frank]

I see savers in Cyprus are going mad and trying to withdraw all their money. European Union at its very best

Giving someone with €100 in their bank account €6.75 of shares in the equivalent of RBS (i) seems like a better way of dealing with politicians' financial mismanagement than forcing disabled folk out of their homes (ii) or stopping their benefits entirely (iii), John. The real target of that policy is Russian mafia money, and it's a manoeuvre intended to cajole Vlad and his pals into extending a loan they can easily afford. For some crazy reason, the Cypriot authorities imagine the Russian underworld has some influence over the Kremlin ...

(i) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21814325

(ii) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21572238

(iii) http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/atos-scandal-benefits-bosses-admit-1344278

[TordelBack]

...Or, say, imposing a property tax on people who can't sell their houses despite being unable to pay their mortgages, and taking the payment out of their benefits if they are out of work.  This (drastic) measure at least only targets those who have savings.

[Old Tankie]

At least the British people elected the politicians who are supposedly throwing disabled people out of their houses and stopping their benefits (although I must say that I'm disabled and I haven't been thrown out of my home nor had my benefits stopped).  Did the Cypriot people elect the Troika or has this been imposed upon them by their EU rulers?

Right, TB, let's just smash the prudent people, you know, the ones that worked hard and saved a few quid, instead of getting into debt that they can't repay.  There's no easy answer to any of this but to continue hitting savers and decimating pension funds by printing money is the road to nowhere.

[Professor Bear]

The main thing is to take money from poor people and give it to rich people.  That'll get us back on track.

[Richmond Clements]

Right, TB, let's just smash the prudent people, you know, the ones that worked hard and saved a few quid, instead of getting into debt that they can't repay. 

Plenty of people out there working hard and not able to save. I've certainly never had that luxury. Most of us are running just to stand still.

Bear puts it best though:

The main thing is to take money from poor people and give it to rich people.  That'll get us back on track.

[TordelBack]

NM

[Frank]

At least the British people elected the politicians who are supposedly throwing disabled people out of their houses and stopping their benefits (although I must say that I'm disabled and I haven't been thrown out of my home nor had my benefits stopped).  Did the Cypriot people elect the Troika or has this been imposed upon them by their EU rulers?

Right, TB, let's just smash the prudent people, you know, the ones that worked hard and saved a few quid, instead of getting into debt that they can't repay.  There's no easy answer to any of this but to continue hitting savers and decimating pension funds by printing money is the road to nowhere.

Cyprus has a population of just over a million people, Tankie. Even if savings rates in an impoverished nation like Cyprus were similar to that of the relatively prosperous UK, converting 6.75% of their savings into shares in their bank wouldn't account for even a tiny fraction of the €10 billion required by the bailout. As the BBC report linked to above makes clear, it's the immense sums held in Cypriot banks by Russian gangsters which the 10% levy on accounts containing over €100,000 is targeting.

The intention is to convince the cash-rich Russian government to extend the terms of a loan, or Russian 'investors' will have a tenth of their capital invested in the Cypriot economy anyway. You're talking about a general point of principle, the Cypriot government is engaging in realpolitik.

[Zarjazzer]

And the gangsters will I'm sure just sit still and take it. The way the British public does over rewards for bankers yet cuts in defence,  etc.

Oh no they won't. Hope those Cypriot politicians have got good body armour. They're probably going to need it.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/cyprus-politicians-decide-bailout-demands-061611987--finance.html#DdVwBCN

They've put the vote back perhaps Mr Putin's on the line...

[Frank]

I see savers in Cyprus are going mad and trying to withdraw all their money. European Union at its very best

John, your original point was that the EU always seems to find a way to fuck up even the simplest thing, and I'd have to agree that this is now a prime example. Half a dozen states have had bank bail-outs now, and there's no difference between what's happening in Cyprus and us all having to pay the same amount of tax for reduced public services - but the way both the EU and the Cypriot authorities have handled this has been an omishambles.

[TordelBack]

Half a dozen states have had bank bail-outs now, and there's no difference between what's happening in Cyprus and us all having to pay the same amount of tax for reduced public services - but the way both the EU and the Cypriot authorities have handled this has been an omishambles.

Yeah.

Other than being distinctly more egalitarian and up-front than what's happening in Ireland for example, there is little difference in the substance of what's being done in Cyprus.  The manner, the execution and the implications however... sweet cheeses, what a mess.  One can only hope that this does constitute a key move in the machiavellian master plan of the self-serving financial uberelite, because the only alternative is that, yet again, the conductor's taking the fares but there's no-one at the wheel.

[Old Tankie]

Weren't our European masters telling us, only a few weeks ago, that the problems were sorted, yea, of course they were.  The Euro is ultimately doomed, the EU elite just won't admit it.  Lots more pain to come before someone finally pulls the plug, that could take another fifty years, though.  But, heh, the EU has "kept the peace in Europe."

[Dandontdare]

Weren't our European masters telling us, only a few weeks ago, that the problems were sorted

No, I don't think anyone said that.

[JayzusB.Christ]

Don't mean to derail the debate here, but I found this rather hilarious.

http://metro.co.uk/2013/03/18/conservative-mp-gavin-barwell-in-date-arab-girls-twitter-gaffe-3546925/

[Old Tankie]

Weren't our European masters telling us, only a few weeks ago, that the problems were sorted

No, I don't think anyone said that.

"I think we can say that the existential threat against the euro has essentially been overcome" said European commission president Jose Manuel Barroso. 

Ref:  The Guardian Monday, 7th January 2013.