The Black Dog Thread

[JayzusB.Christ]

Well, I've just given yet another CBT therapist the heave-ho.  He was polite and respectful, yes, but something didn't quite click.  I realise empathy is hugely important and is a very difficult thing to master, but I finally realised that empathy for him was basically me expressing something that was bothering me, then him paraphrasing what I had said, and adding 'That must be very (insert relevant emotion) / I imagine that is (insert relevant emotion)'.  Essentially the communication version of '20. GOTO 10.'

I realised that yesterday's session was my last one when I expressed unhappiness that we were about 7 sessions in and I still didn't feel we had done any real work on the negative thoughts I had written down weeks ago. The response was, pretty much, 'Yes, I can see that you want to move on and get some more work done on your thoughts, and it's taken a long time.  That must be very annoying and frustrating.'   Just.. no. Enough is enough.

I'm part of an online group of non-professionals who treat each other with exactly the same methods as that therapist.  They're way better at it, and it's free.  So I'll stick with them in future, I think.

[The Legendary Shark]

I hope you find what you're looking for, JBC.

[Jade Falcon]

I think the experience I had with my counsellor is pretty much the same as JBC's, I just couldn't describe it very well.  I really wonder what is going on in the mental health side.  I mean what's the sense in seeing my GP if the mental health nurse is hopeless, I don't want pills which don't solve the problems and might react badly with the battery of medications that I'm on, and the counsellors for the area seem hopeless.

This might sound rather nasty and spiteful, but I get the impression that if you were a drug user that had a long criminal record and were pretty unrepentant you'd get a more sympathetic ear.  The latest thing I'm having problems with on top of the depression, or perhaps because of it is a really bad sleep pattern, yet I can predict the GP will suggest sleeping pills.

[JayzusB.Christ]

I think the experience I had with my counsellor is pretty much the same as JBC's, I just couldn't describe it very well.

I probably should point out that the counsellor I was talking about sent me a very respectful email when I told him I wasn't continuing with it.  A nice fella but he just wasn't the therapist for me - it might sound ridiculous but I like a bit of a laugh despite my dark periods and I found him to be very serious and stern.  I'm not the easiest therapist's client in the world either - I've had one guy literally grunt in frustration as I told him that what he was saying didn't make sense to me.

[Tjm86]

In all honesty these are fair points.  Sometimes it is hard to define what it is about a counsellor that makes it work or not.  Some ineffable quality that in some respects is totally unique.

Some of this is down to the therapist's particular approach / theoretical frame.  Quite often if a therapist is trained in CBT for instance then they can be quite procedural.  They see therapy as about 'reprogramming' almost and sometimes struggle to understand 'resistance' / difficulties.

The best therapists I've worked with tend to be more integrationist in their approaches.  They recognise the power and benefit of cognitive approaches but also the need to tackle issues from other perspectives.  So there may be a touch of psychoanalysis for instance when difficulties emerge.

Medication is also a massive mine-field.  Leaving aside the lead-in times as some like SSRI's take to start having an 'effect', some of the immediate effects are great fun!  In the short term they can actually spike anxiety, never mind the disruption to sleep. 

When you look into the development of most medications used in the treatment of mental health, a lot of them were originally developed for completely different purposes.  The discovery that they could aid treatment of mental health conditions was a 'happy accident' in some cases.

Personally I've been fortunate with my GP in that they often get a lot of these issues.  We've had to explore a number of options to get to a point where we've found ones that 'work' however imperfectly that might be.  They are also incredibly leery of sleeping pills because of the risks involved.  Then again, so am I.

I've found that the only real option when it comes to insomnia is to accept that I will sleep when I sleep.  If it's not happening then I don't fight it, just accept it and simply rest.  9 times out of 10 this results in my dropping off anyway now.  Once upon a time I would just get up and get on with stuff.  Got a lot of work done but when I crashed, boy did I crash!

Jade / JaybusB, I know it isn't much but just keep in mind that there are plenty of folks in these parts that can offer support of a limited kind.  Possibly because of the direct, personal experience many have had.  There will always be a supportive response when you (or anyone else for that matter) needs it.

[auxlen]

Every morning the black dog sits on my chest and I can't breathe. After a few hours, he shifts himself but I lose valuable time and risk the ire of my employer.

[The Legendary Shark]

Here's a blast from the past about my black dog nightmare,

I think I may have had two "sleep paralysis" experiences after reading this thread. Both of them centred around a monstrous black 'dog' thing with long shaggy fur, wet snarling teeth and burning red eyes.

It was the earlier mention of 'boundless kinetic energy' that struck a chord with me because that's a perfect description of how this thing moved - it seemed to be doing a "wall-of-death" around the room, halfway up the walls, at a phenomenal speed whilst also seeming to be everywhere at once. Curiously, its hideous, screaming face was *always* snarling directly at me and it was howling like a hurricane through a cathedral. The sheer unbridled motion of the thing seemed to be the force keeping me down and unable to breathe. The first time it happened was absolutely terrifying - I thought I'd died in my sleep and was being dragged to Hell!

The second time it happened was no less terrifying but in this instance I got mad and started howling back at the thing until it simply dissipated. I have the uncomfortable feeling that I might have been actually howling like an enraged gorilla when I woke up.

This was some time ago now and it hasn't been back.

I treated the black dog like a normal dog and overwhelmed it - like that bit in the Hulk film when Banner defeats his dad by saying something like, "You want my anger? Well take it! Take it all! Graaaah!" Maybe you could try that, or something similar.

[Rara Avis]

@Jade Falcon, you haven't updated in a while. I hope things have improved for you. You too Jaysus.

[Jade Falcon]

I got volunteer work in the local Hospice shop, but to be honest I'm not really enjoying it nearly as much as I did the bookshop as that was my specialty so to speak.

Financial worries are no longer a thing which is a big help but I'm still feeling pretty bad mentally.  My sleep patterns are still away to hell, I'm often not getting to sleep till anywhere between 4-6 in the morning and sleeping a good part of the day and I hate that.  I'm still essentially alone and at times feel like I'm going mad, but its no use at all going to my GP or asking for further help as the previous mental health didn't help at all.

[Rara Avis]

Good morning Jade, some small improvement on your circumstances here but overall still not in a great space. I'm very sorry to hear that. Like everyone else on this forum I have also struggled with depression at times in my life so you're not alone in what you're feeling even though you are alone generally in your life. I've been there too and found that ironically and to quote Marilyn Robinson that 'solitude is a great balm for loneliness'.  That worked for me but everyone is different. The other thing that worked and still works is exercise - how would you feel about joining a gym or taking up a sport, sorry if you have already written about this. For your sleep I read you don't want to take sleeping tablets but there are studies that show upping your magnesium intake can help you sleep better:

https://www.sleepfoundation.org/magnesium

Are you a part of any online groups ? It's not the same as real life but it could be a start.

Sorry again if I am being captain obvious here. I understand that life can sometimes be completely overwhelming; my mantra in these times 'one day at a time, one thing at a time'

I hope these words are some comfort to you; I'll be sure to check in on you again.

Please know that we are all rooting for you.

[Jade Falcon]

I'm not really a sports person, I never have been, I don't even have any interest in sports activities on the TV never mind participating.

As to sleeping pills, the main reason I don't want them is that I'm on so many pills already, 25-30 a day that there'd be a chance they might react and I just don't want to take the chance.  I've got tons of stuff to read, dvd's to watch, but sometimes I just don't feel like it.  The way I feel is that I'm 50 and I've had a totally wasted life with noone to share it with, no job, health issues both physical and mental and basically feel I'm the prime example of what the yanks would call a loser.  I've got material possessions but these don't make you happy in themselves.

[Tjm86]

TBH I think you're wise to be cautious about sleeping pills, Jade.  A responsible GP would be leery of prescribing them too and certainly not long term because of addiction issues.  As you say though, interaction with other medications is another reason to steer clear.

As for the way that you are feeling, it's far too easy to get into that mindset. I wonder if the priorities of our culture are at the back of this.  If you haven't had a world changing career, the right sort of family and all the right sort of possessions then somehow that makes you a failure ...

The thing is there is no easy way out of this rut.  People can come up with all the fancy words and phrases but sometimes it is just like water off a duck's back.  You don't want to hear it because it feels like complete and utter bollocks.

A lot of the talking therapies feel like cheap plasters that don't do a hell of a lot of good.  They talk about 'disconfirming thoughts' or reframing.  Sometimes it needs something more.  Unfortunately mental health support services are so overstretched with the new 'mental health awareness' that support comes way too late. 

It drives me nuts at times when I hear kids talking about 'being stressed' or 'depressed' when in truth they're often just over-reacting to a little bit of pressure or difficulty.  An awful lot of the time they haven't got a scooby what real mental health conditions are like.


Jade, I hope I'm able to phrase this correctly and get across what I mean.  You say that you feel like you've wasted your life and that you are a loser.  Those are legitimate feelings and you can give arguments in support of them.  That is not the same as saying that they are based on totally accurate interpretations. 

You mention mental and physical health issues.  These are monumental challenges individually never mind in combination.  Those of us that fight either of them find it overwhelming at times.  Fighting both at the same time?  Anyone would and does struggle with that.  It might be worth being a bit fairer on yourself, don't you think?

Your health issues make it difficult / borderline impossible to work yet you still do.  It might only be voluntary work at the moment but it is still something.  Especially given some of the crap that you put up with before.  Granted it is not where you would prefer to be but again you are pushing yourself.  There are so many others that just roll over in your position and give up completely. 

It feels a little like there is a banked fire inside you if that makes sense?  You know that you have more to give but working around some of the issues makes it difficult to figure out how to do so.  Yet you keep on pushing through it.  You've had a crap time but you've picked yourself up and tried a different tack.  Again, that is a massive difference to how some others would handle it.

Personally I think you've done amazingly all things considered.  You've managed to find alternative voluntary work, managed to get finances stabilised, taking a sensible approach to medication, keeping in touch here, ... These might seem small things to some folks but I think it is fair to say that a lot of us around here can actually appreciate the magnitude of these achievements.

In the meantime take care of yourself as best you can and please, check in here regularly.

[Rara Avis]

I'm not really a sports person, I never have been, I don't even have any interest in sports activities on the TV never mind participating.

You don't have to play a sport exactly - walking and running are solo activities. It's the act itself that's beneficial. If you have a gym nearby they may do classes (spinning or boxercise) which could provide the social outlet you are looking for. It's worth considering for the benefits because truthfully probably no one likes working out - the best feeling is when it's done.

As TJM has pointed out you're far more resilient that you give yourself credit for.

It seems part of the issue is that you had vision for your future and life has not turned out how you expected.  You are now trying to reconcile the life you wanted with the life you have and it is a bitter pill to swallow. There's nothing wrong with you for being alone; it's just the way it works out for some people me included. I went through what you're going through and now that I'm on the other end I'm happy being by myself and just doing my own thing.

[Jade Falcon]

TBH I think you're wise to be cautious about sleeping pills, Jade.  A responsible GP would be leery of prescribing them too and certainly not long term because of addiction issues.  As you say though, interaction with other medications is another reason to steer clear.

Well I'm on, Ramipril (two doses), Epixipan, Epilim, Metaformin, Dixogin, Bisoprolol, Furosemide, Omeprazole and Co-Codomol.  All that together doesn't help matters.  As well as being on Gaviscon for digestion issues as and when needed.

Regarding job goals, it wasn't as if I was overly ambitious.  When I was in my teens my big thing was that I wanted to join the RAF, but epilepsy put paid to that.  I used to have a friend who was always into applying for management and supervisory style roles, I wasn't the Arnold Rimmer type who wanted to go up the ziggurat lickety split so to say.  I would have been happy with a fairly modest life, but the whole thing about being alone has really recently hit me and its something that has, without trying to be dramatic consumed me.

I find that walking alone for example just makes me dwell on things even more if that makes sense.

I'm still bitter at the way that b**ch at Oxfam wouldn't have me back.  I took time off because I was feeling really bad emotionally and she says I have walked out twice which is a lie.  She says she has records which can be faked, meanwhile she is downright incompetent and abrasive.  The constant hopeless feelings really do get bad.  For instance with the 2000ad collection I had a pile of them sitting unread because I just couldn't find the interest to read them. 

The house is a mess and despite trying to clear it up its futile as I just feel off and wonder what the point is anyway.

[Tjm86]

I'm still bitter at the way that b**ch at Oxfam wouldn't have me back.  I took time off because I was feeling really bad emotionally and she says I have walked out twice which is a lie. 

I can seriously relate to that Jade.  I'm out of work myself at the moment.  I took redundancy after a colleague made an allegation against me that left me on suspension for months.  When it was finally sorted out I had to try and get back into things with her totally excluding me from anything. 

In the end it got to the point where it just wasn't worth trying and when they pulled the 'we have to make someone redundant' stunt I figured I'd take it.  It wasn't just a case of management not being willing to deal with it to my mind.

Considering what the last employer did as well I decided it just wasn't worth the hassle of sticking with that line of work any longer.  Having faced a series of malicious allegations, verbal abuse by the head, head of department stealing books, abuse from students and parents and being sealed up in a board room to face 'disciplinary discussions' this time round was certainly milder but I just cannot be bothered with that anymore. 

So feeling bitter and resentful about someone making allegations is something that I can certainly sympathise with.  The thing is though, I've come to the point where actually the only person this is hurting is me.  So I'm trying to let it go which is not easy at all.

I'm still conflicted about deciding to give up on a career that I've spent nearly 20 years on but if it is going to kill me then f*** it.  The redundancy is giving me a few months breathing space so I'm using it.  Some days I don't want to get out of bed.  Quite often if I do get out I get midway through the day and the meds send me back.  I swing from feeling a total failure to being fairly stoic about what is happening.  Quite often I find at the moment that I just have to force my way through.  Just get on with it even though it feels pointless. 

I've secured a job with the ONS but I'm waiting on vetting at the moment and praying that the medical doesn't screw it up for me.  Then again I'm also terrified about actually starting over again and f***ing up again.

I don't think that there are any easy answers.  Anyone who tries to sell you on that is a con artist in my book.  I do think that Rara has a point though about taking one day at a time.  Also worth remembering that there are folks that are here for you if you need it.  I think most of us are just as screwed up although Sharkey has to win the prize for blowing himself up!

Take care pal.