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Author Topic: Real life accidents on film/tv sets  (Read 1902 times)

Funt Solo

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Re: Real life accidents on film/tv sets
« Reply #75 on: 01 December, 2021, 06:49:17 PM »
Rust: US Police to search arms supplier over fatal film shooting - some suggestion here of negligence in the supply chain - live ammo mixed up with dummy rounds.
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The Enigmatic Dr X

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Re: Real life accidents on film/tv sets
« Reply #76 on: 01 December, 2021, 08:53:06 PM »
The armourer must take some blame. Whoever let the gun be used for target practice should take some blame.

Also the armourer.

Quote
"I was told it was safe," does not allow you to abdicate responsibility in other situations.

It most certainly does when the person telling you bears legal responsibility for ensuring that safety.

The Health & Safety officer signing off on scaffolding, as I mentioned before. If you're not a scaffolder, and you paid an appropriately skilled scaffolder to put the thing up, then got a H&S officer to confirm it's safe, how is it conceivably your fault if it falls down and kills someone…?

"My doctor told me it was safe to give my child these tablets," as another example. Turns out they weren't safe. How were you supposed to know? You're not qualified to make that judgement, which is why you defer to the expertise of someone with a legal responsibility to make it on your behalf.

I get you in all that regard, and I am not trying to be an arse, and I see your points. My retort is "but it was a gun."

I suppose that's the nub of the issue. If you can check something, shouldn't you? You can't check a prescription or scaffolding.

I don't feel that strongly about it. Not enough to prolong this debate. But I do feel that Sharky is trying to make that point - "but it was a gun" - and is maybe being shot down too fiercely, maybe because of other arguments.

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Richard

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Re: Real life accidents on film/tv sets
« Reply #77 on: 01 December, 2021, 09:20:28 PM »
How do you check a round to see if it's live or a blank?

Jim_Campbell

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Re: Real life accidents on film/tv sets
« Reply #78 on: 01 December, 2021, 09:26:02 PM »
I don't feel that strongly about it. Not enough to prolong this debate. But I do feel that Sharky is trying to make that point - "but it was a gun" - and is maybe being shot down too fiercely, maybe because of other arguments.

As Sheridan notes upthread — it was not meant to be an unloaded gun, it was meant to be a gun loaded with blank cartridges instead of live ammunition. That means rounds in the clip/cylinder even if the weapon was safe.

Are you suggesting that an actor should remove rounds from a firearm handed to them in order to inspect them and make sure they’re blanks…? Squeeze a couple off into a nearby wall, just to be sure? This is patently ludicrous.
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Funt Solo

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Re: Real life accidents on film/tv sets
« Reply #79 on: 01 December, 2021, 10:45:37 PM »
How do you check a round to see if it's live or a blank?

Normally, like this:



But with revolvers, you can see the bullets in the chamber, so where the camera would see that, you use dummy rounds instead of blanks - blanks have no tips (but do have propellant), dummy rounds have tips (but no propellant).

So, in the case of dummy rounds, they pretty much look just like a live round, except their primer (the base of the bullet) is dimpled, and they make a rattling sound when you shake them.

All of this leads us back to the armorer, who should have ensured that the round in the gun was either not in the gun (if it wasn't called for in that scene) or that it was a dummy round (by checking the dimple and the rattle).

My sidelines guess is that she looked at the box she'd been given that said "dummy rounds" on the side and figured it was all good to go.

---

Baldwin's now saying he didn't pull the trigger, either - that the gun just fired.

---

I agree with X that things got a bit fierce towards Shark and there was a bit of a pile on. Sorry, Shark.
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Jim_Campbell

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Re: Real life accidents on film/tv sets
« Reply #80 on: 01 December, 2021, 10:54:10 PM »
I agree with X that things got a bit fierce towards Shark and there was a bit of a pile on. Sorry, Shark.

I would respectfully suggest that if Shark didn't wade in with ludicrous strawmen, such as suggesting that anyone in the discussion had said "to hell with the victim", then responses might have been more temperate.
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milstar

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Re: Real life accidents on film/tv sets
« Reply #81 on: Today at 12:04:13 AM »
The gun that Alec tragically used is the same one used for shooting practice several hours ago (crews call it plimping, me thinks), for shooting beer cans in the spare time. Someone messed up when loading the weapon. Prop fellas, the armourer...whoever it is, wields the most responsibility. If you are not up to your job, get the fuck out. Then again, this was maybe a disaster waiting to hapšen, since they hired non union local crew (after firing the unioners).

I see Dwayne Johnson advocates for the use of airsoft guns lmao. Take it away, big guy.
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Funt Solo

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Re: Real life accidents on film/tv sets
« Reply #82 on: Today at 12:19:03 AM »
I agree with X that things got a bit fierce towards Shark and there was a bit of a pile on. Sorry, Shark.

I would respectfully suggest that if Shark didn't wade in with ludicrous strawmen, such as suggesting that anyone in the discussion had said "to hell with the victim", then responses might have been more temperate.

Well, without wanting to start an argument with you, it had been quite heated before that point, with some F-bombs strewn around. Anyway, I agree with X’s general sentiment and it doesn’t cost me much to apologize. I mostly started to feel bad for Shark when he got droid-shamed, tbh.

Edit - I realized just after posting that you’re a droid as well, Jim. Still feels like new information in this old head.
« Last Edit: Today at 12:24:05 AM by Funt Solo »
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