Just general colouring discussion thread for tips and tricks on how to best pull this off.
We have the first colouring challenge running here (http://2000adonline.com/forum/index.php/topic,25749.0.html).
- Colouring in Photoshop (http://2000adonline.com/forum/index.php/topic,16439.0.html)
- Colouring Tutorial Link (http://2000adonline.com/forum/index.php/topic,11235.0.html)
You may also find some useful links in the tips and tutorials thread (http://2000adonline.com/forum/index.php/topic,25669.0.html).
All the links in the Colouring Tutorial thread are dead, Emp ...
You could find a lot worse place to start than pro colourist Mark Sweeney's extensive range of tutorials, real nuts & bolts stuff, that are available as PDF downloads from his website (http://www.mark-sweeney.com/Site-Pages/Tutorials/PDF-Tutorials.html).
Cheers!
Jim
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 05 August, 2009, 04:15:24 PM
All the links in the Colouring Tutorial thread are dead, Emp ...
The Internet is rubbish!!
Here is the new link to the D'Israeli colouring tips (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/lynnfo/educatio/colourin.html). You can also go via his main site (http://www.disraeli-demon.com/) and click "education". He is, of course, The Man and his advice is pretty clear and straightforward.
I've bumped this to hopefully stimulate a new discussion. It has become apparent that I spend longer colouring a page of comic art than I do pencilling and drawing it. Probably about twice as long. Surely this is backwards! I know this is probably down to my own style - I tend to build up several dense layers and then paint areas out to reveal the inks. This is time consuming but produces a satisfying result (usually).
But seeing as I'm taking the idea of 'going pro' a lot more serious lately and that I do actually enjoy the colouring process as much as any other aspect, I wondered if anyone fancied sharing or briefly describing their own process?
(and hopefully I'll then be able to speed up my own colouring!)
BTW - does anyone knwo if Chris Blythe ever posts on here, or has his own blog/site? I'd love to get an insight into his techniques. Those short video tutorials Disraeli posted were fantastic - if Chris produced something similar, I'd be a happy bunny sir.
I'm finding colouring very difficult I have to say. I tend to slap down a layer of whatever base colour is going on a secion and build up highlights and lowlights but I'm sure there's an easier way of figuring which colours should go where...... I end up treating it like a painting but I reckon there must be an easier, more intuitive method given the digital gear most of us are using.
The D'Israeli stuff is certainly handy though. Gives me some ideas.
D'Israeli's method is interesting but I'm not nearly precise enough with pencils for it to work well :)
If I've got a finished ink page I normally have about five layers underneath to mix colours in and one on top of the inks for lighting and other things I want to emphasise.
Within the five underneath, normally one is set aside for actual background tones, one for base colours (that end up as deep shadows and/or what I call 'second inks', two for main colour (one for Balance Adjusting if I start to second guess my initial colour ideas) and the fifth for detail.
This does involve a lot of sodding about but I prefer the painted look to things as opposed to the neat and tidy airbrushed look that most strips seem to have. Plus, across five layers you can afford to experiment without losing other aspects of the colour that you like. This process (in theory), saves the time you might lose when changing colour schemes mid-way through when you decide you're not keen on them anymore. It does occasionally go tits up, mind :)
Fester, I'm currently attempting a Mongrol piece so I'll be sure to give that a try as soon as I've got finished inks.
I've mentioned colour holds to Matt before and they are a very useful technique to use for fire, energy or atmospheric distance (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_perspective) effects (and it can just help the main figure "pop" more in a complex scene) - Jim uses a few in or latest FF.
Some links on that (note Sweeney also covers this (http://www.mark-sweeney.com/Site-Pages/Tutorials/PDF-Tutorials.html#UsingLayers)):
www.penciljack.com/forum/showthread.php?57023-Color-Holds-in-Photoshop
www.thecomicforums.com/forum2//index.php?showtopic=160841
Just using sparingly as some don't like them, although that might be back in the day with more primitive printing technology, from Steve Grant's favourite things in comics (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=24087) on Steranko's Nick Fury work (illustrated by this image (http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?disp=img&pid=1261001017)):
QuoteComics publishers and production staff, not to mention printers, have never been fond of color holds, the use of color as shapes without black lines to anchor them down. Jim Steranko, in his fitful run at Marvel, was a color hold pioneer, and the main proponent of op and pop art in comics art. (Which, given Roy Lichtenstein's series of recreated panels from war and romance comics as fine art, and works by other painters that either mimicked or incorporated comics, was a by then belated but necessary bringing it all back home.) By the time Steranko produced this sequence, the tossing around of "massive energy" was a mainstay cliché of superhero comics – but nobody ever visualized sheer energy better on a comics page.
I also found this link while nosing around which gives more "old school" tips (including the use of vellum):
www.hoboes.com/pub/Comics/Comics%20as%20a%20Career/Rob%20Davis/Colorists%20Part%201
Also there is a book
Hi-Fi Color For Comics (http://www.hificolorforcomics.com/): Digital Techniques for Professional Results:
www.amazon.co.uk/Hi-Fi-Color-Comics-Techniques-Professional/dp/1581809921/
It gets great reviews:
www.amazon.com/Hi-Fi-Color-Comics-Techniques-Professional/dp/1581809921
One of my links above is from the forum dedicated to the book so if you need help with anything they have there (or want to take it further) that'd be a good start:
www.thecomicforums.com/forum2//index.php?showforum=207
Quote from: Emperor on 03 March, 2010, 05:41:55 PM
Jim uses a few in or latest FF.
FWIW, that was a rather interesting learning experience -- I thought I was inking that page for colour (using very little hatching or feathering) but I still horrendously over-inked it and then had to waste quite a lot of time turning about 2/3 of the inks into colour holds.
Had I been a better artist, or at least planning ahead more, I would have either used less black and trusted the colours to do more, or more black and tried to go for a much more watercolour-y, wash style of colouring.
Cheers!
Jim
Yeah, but the finished result was awesome!
Thanks for the links all, I've never really been able to color well yet, and I've been lucky enought to have other great folks work over my stuff. (like jamie Grant, Radiator and shortly....MGB!)
That said, its on the radar screen to tackle soon, so I'll be sure to put some of these links to work. Please keep them coming!
Quote from: Emperor on 03 March, 2010, 05:41:55 PM
Also there is a book Hi-Fi Color For Comics (http://www.hificolorforcomics.com/): Digital Techniques for Professional Results:
www.amazon.co.uk/Hi-Fi-Color-Comics-Techniques-Professional/dp/1581809921/
It gets great reviews:
www.amazon.com/Hi-Fi-Color-Comics-Techniques-Professional/dp/1581809921
I will say of the above that it tells you how to produce coloured artwork in a very specific, US-centric style using the 'cut and grad' style, where you create a selection with the lasso tool (cutting parts of it out with the minus lasso if necessary) and then filling it with gradients of varying opacities. This isn't a brilliant example, but you can sort of see what I mean here (http://classicalcomics.com/images/samples/greatexpectations/GreatExp016.jpg).
That said, the sections on trapping and flatting techniques are worth the asking price alone.
Cheers!
Jim
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 03 March, 2010, 11:25:45 PM
Quote from: Emperor on 03 March, 2010, 05:41:55 PM
Also there is a book Hi-Fi Color For Comics (http://www.hificolorforcomics.com/): Digital Techniques for Professional Results:
www.amazon.co.uk/Hi-Fi-Color-Comics-Techniques-Professional/dp/1581809921/
It gets great reviews:
www.amazon.com/Hi-Fi-Color-Comics-Techniques-Professional/dp/1581809921
I will say of the above that it tells you how to produce coloured artwork in a very specific, US-centric style using the 'cut and grad' style, where you create a selection with the lasso tool (cutting parts of it out with the minus lasso if necessary) and then filling it with gradients of varying opacities. This isn't a brilliant example, but you can sort of see what I mean here (http://classicalcomics.com/images/samples/greatexpectations/GreatExp016.jpg).
Yes I was meaning to point out that there work is fairly mainstream comic book work:
http://comicbookdb.com/creator.php?ID=971
So, while top-notch, some of the techniques might not suit your style (and might give it a more... uniform, standardised feel) but if you take what you need and adapt what you can then it might be useful.
I've stumbled on some incredibly useful stuff here (http://coloring.deviantart.com/gallery/#Tutorials), mainly about colouring linework.
Cheers!
Jim
Quote from: mygrimmbrother on 03 March, 2010, 10:26:16 PM
Yeah, but the finished result was awesome!
Aww, shucks! It was the dragons that made it ...
Cheers!
Jim
I use my own technique. I create a layer of flats, then build up the highlights and shadows for each element with a quite complex arrangement of curves and adjustment layers, using masks to 'paint' with.
It's not the quickest way of working, but it allows me to create my images in a meticulous way that gives me complete control of the colours at all times, and I usually tweak or balance all of the colours three of four times during the colouring process. I can completely change the colour of any single element at any time, and can easily edit the shading or highlights if they've gone too far.
For more cartoony style stuff, I use a similar technique, but use paths instead of the lasso tool to make the 'cuts' - again, as it allows for much more control.
I'll always 'finish' an image or page of artwork with a layer of grain and/or paper texture to get rid of colour banding and draw all the elements together - also looks a lot nicer when printed.
Thought this might be of interest:
http://comicscomicsmag.com/2008/08/comics-color-article-from-cc-2_26.html
kuler from adobe is a colour scheme community which I quite like: http://kuler.adobe.com/
British comics creator Mike Bunt (http://www.comicspace.com/mike_bunt/) is looking for someone to colour his Zuda entry:
QuoteApril 12th, 2010 5:37 AM
Colour Artist needed!
Hey I'm working on a comic I intend to try and get on Zuda Comics. I'm looking for a Colour Artist to colour my work.
The inked pages are here: http://www.comicspace.com/mike_bunt/comics.php?action=gallery&comic_id
=27893
If anybodies interested please private message me for more info!
Thanks,
Mike
http://www.comicspace.com/mike_bunt/bulletins.php?action=read&id=46086
A few colouring bits and bobs I ran across:
Breaking up planes & drawing attention to important elements (the bit about darkening the foreground plane to throw focus on other figures is a great one - I know Jim used it to good effect in the first page he coloured for Fractal Friction):
http://www.dave-co.com/gutterzombie/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11966#p113593
Artist's resources from Tony Moore (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Moore_(artist)) - pencils for inkers and inks for colourists:
http://tonymooreillustration.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=792
http://www.guidetooilpainting.com/colorMatch.html
For oil painting but gives a pretty clear indication of what to do if your looking for a specific colour and a larger colour wheel than the usual six colours.Good general painting info as well.
This link:
Quote from: Emperor on 12 April, 2010, 05:38:49 PM
http://www.dave-co.com/gutterzombie/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11966#p113593
... is quality stuff. If you have any real interest in learning colouring, Gutterzombie is hosted by Dave McCaig and has regular input from Laura Martin, arguably the top two colourists in the US industry. Stepping down from there, you still can't spit on that forum with out hitting a top rank artist or colourist.
Cheers
Jim
Frazer Irving on colouring. Also available as a PDF
http://www.imaginefx.com/02287754330184954282/colouring-comic-art-3-of-3.html (http://www.imaginefx.com/02287754330184954282/colouring-comic-art-3-of-3.html)
I've put the related links in this series on the main Creative Common thread
http://www.2000adonline.com/forum/index.php/topic,25669.msg516512.html#new
I mostly stay inside the lines
Quote from: Proudhuff on 28 May, 2010, 06:42:04 PM
I mostly stay inside the lines
That took nine months!
This place is going to the dogs...
for the nine months I carried you, no charge.
I got a bit of colourist quizzing in:
http://www.bleedingcool.com/forums/showthread.php?18460-Post-Modern-Mythologies-by-Eric-M-Esquivel-8-Colour-Me-Curious&p=89216#post89216
Seems he often livestreams colouring demos and has videos of previous colouring demos online, which could be useful:
www.livestream.com/chrissummers
You can learn a fantastic amount just by looking over the shoulder of a professional at work. Thanks to Livestream, you can:
John Rauch (http://www.livestream.com/johnrauch?utm_source=lslibrary&utm_medium=ui-channel-text)
(Who appears to use the pencil tool for a lot of his flatting -- something most books and tutorials on digital colouring will tell you is a no-no.)
Nei Ruffino (http://www.livestream.com/fingerpaintingwithnei)
(From whom I've already learned that a lot of what looks like subtle gradient work is actually achieved using the outside edge of a massive brush ...)
More as I turn 'em up.
Cheers!
Jim
Coloring a graphic novel, 8 part tutorial passed on by a member of the Wednesday chat room who shall remain anonymous (until I remember who it was):
www.remindblog.com/2010/06/16/coloring-a-graphic-novel-part-1/
Quote from: Emperor on 12 August, 2010, 08:44:31 PM
Coloring a graphic novel, 8 part tutorial passed on by a member of the Wednesday chat room who shall remain anonymous (until I remember who it was):
Jason Brubaker's a real talent, and reMIND is going to be great book. I very nearly ended up lettering it, but the project is quite personal to Jason he wanted to do it himself if he could, so I ended up sending him a copy of my lettering guide and talked him through a few things, and I think he's made a pretty good job of the pages I've seen.
Cheers!
Jim
Two videos of Jamie Grant's colouring, even if he doesn't recommend anyone colour that way:
www.tcj.com/superhero/craft-of-comics-jamie-grant-part-1-of-2/
www.tcj.com/superhero/craft-of-comics-jamie-grant-part-2-of-2/
Also, starting around 12 minutes in on the second video is a Alex Ronald/Ross mention, in the same breath.
Nice videos but I couldn't follo how he sets up his files. Seems like his flatting technique is a real timesaver but I don't have a clue how he is converting the images to a jag free bitmap. Any ideas?
Interesting interview with Dave Stewart (of Hellboy & BPRD fame):
http://www.comicsalliance.com/2010/09/28/dave-stewart-interview-coloring/
When I started to take the idea of being a colourist more seriously a few years ago it was taking me 4 days to do each page. I was creating insanely complicated paths, masks and layer blends for every element of every frame. At the moment it probably takes me an average of 6 hours a page, depending on complexity. There isn't a lot of money in colouring so I would probably need to get that down to 3 hours a page for it to be practical for me to start pitching for work, not least because of the expected turnaround time. The work I have taken on so far has been creator owned so the deadlines are generally longer.
Just thought this might be of interest, I stumbled across Alex Petretich's blog. He is effectively a droid, but not one that gets a credit in the prog - he has done flats for Dave Stewart's Dredd and Dylan Teague too. He has posted examples of the Dredd colouring here:
http://flatened.blogspot.com/2010/08/judge-dredd.html
That last example fits in with this step-by-step posted by the Dylbot:
http://dylansdrawingboard.blogspot.com/2010/06/another-page-step-by-step.html
If you are interested in that angle he has a lot of other examples on his blog.
I want a flatter!
CFM - A flatter what? Tummy? Me too :(
Steve - just read your last post - I'd say it currently takes me about a couple of days to colour a page, and like you I'm desperate to speed things up. I also find that, sometimes I struggle to recreate the same look and feel from page to page, which I suspect has something to do with the many textures I use and play about with, paint into and alter their opacitu and layer modes to achieve something that interests me. Matt Timson explained to that you've just got to be disciplined, which makes perfect sense, but then my stuff can often feel mechanical and lifeless. Tis a fine balancing act, and no mistake.
I have exactly the same problem with textures and layering, what works on one image creates nothing but a mess on another. Layering and texturing is more Voodoo then science! One of the things that really slows me down is how much thought I put into the colours I use. If I'm doing a few pages using the same colour scheme things tend to speed up as I have normally made most of the big choices on the first page of the sequence.
I think speed tends to come with familiarity; you end up with colours and textures that you can go to without re-inventing the wheel every time.
Using images to create texture can be difficult to maintain and keep consistant over many pages. As mentioned by Steve building a familiar library that you can always use helps. I also recommend reading up on all the layer blend modes that are used in 2d programs. This understanding of how the blend modes interact with pixels below them will give you greater control over what you are doing.
Hello,
Just about to start colouring in PS CS5, got a couple of questions if any one can help.
Is it better to work straight in CMYK, or RGB then convert to CMYK?
Which CMYK profile is best suited for comic book reproduction? In PS CS5 it gives you loads of options, which one do you use?
Thanks,
Mark.
I work in RGB (Adobe 1998) for all Photoshop stuff I do, then convert to CMYK later on (I use the Iso Coated V2 profile).
You can work in CMYK preview mode (Apple/Ctrl+Y) while in RGB, that should help you to not go massively out of gamut.
Hey,
Thanks for the reply Radiator!
Cheers
MC
Being fairly new to colouring and photoshop malarkey, is it better to colour in RGB then change to CMYK? I generally do everything in CMYK and then change it to RGB if it going up on the tinterweb!
Am I doing anything wrong or is it down to personal preference?
I work in CMYK when it's going to be printed in CMYK, the print profile depends on what print profile the printers use as far as I am aware. I would only colour in RGB if I was working on graphics for the internet as RGB is set up for monitors and not printing. Converting RGB to CMYK can produce unpredictable results.
Cheers Steve. :D
I bought myself HiFi Color for Comics at the start of the year , really good book about colouring with photoshop.
filip
Jordie Bellaire (http://www.comicbookdb.com/creator.php?ID=32063) looking for a temporary colouring assistant/flatter, paid work that could get your foot in the door over the Pond:
QuoteTEMPORARY COLOR ASSISTANT/FLATTER NEEDED. TO START IMMEDIATELY.
Can be based anywhere as long as availability, communication and schedule are kept.
This is a paid position that will help you learn the business and the professional production of comics. It will mainly focus on coloring and preparing files for print. This would be helpful for anyone who wants to professionally produce a colored comic. I will also be available for anything you'd be interested in comics wise, whether or not it is critiques, private one on one tutorials or even asking artist/inker Declan Shalvey (Venom, Thunderbolts, 28 Days Later) some questions here and there.
Availability is important, internet connection is a must, photoshop skills are required. If interested please e-mail me at whoajordie@gmail.com.
http://jordiecolorsthings.tumblr.com/post/28702852006/temporary-color-assistant-flatter-needed-to-start
iFanboy has been hosting a series of portfolio reviews (http://ifanboy.com/articles/introducing-tweetfolio-reviews-with-bon-alimagno/) by Bon Alimagno, a former talent coordinator for Marvel. The latest one is looking at a colourist's portfolio. (http://ifanboy.com/articles/tweetfolio-reviews-1-5-erick-arciniega-coloring/)
I still use photoshop 7 for me flatting is a time waster. I find its better to spend time on how the colours blend with the lineart and dont fight against it. Check your tones by switching to greyscale every so often and play with warm and cool tones for a more interesting field of depth. I learned a lot from Tony Avina who coloured some of my work in the past he has some good tutorials on you tube. When im not on my phone ill try linking them. He uses a flatter saying all that lol.
Quote from: Reddragonuk on 17 August, 2012, 01:31:50 PM
I still use photoshop 7 for me flatting is a time waster. I find its better to spend time on how the colours blend with the lineart and dont fight against it.
Colouring for fun? Do whatever works for you. Considering colouring professionally for print? Learn to do it the 'official' way. One of the main purposes of flatting is to produce continuous areas of colour that butt up against each other if you hide the linework, otherwise you run the risk of white 'halos' appearing at the edges of the linework wherever there's mis-registration.
There's a lot of technical stuff about ink limits and trapping that you need to know for paying gigs so, if that's something that's an ambition, even a distant one, then it's better to get into good habits now, rather than have to unlearn bad ones the first time you get a paid job.
Cheers
Jim
I used a flatter once as I was butting up to a deadline... felt a bit dirty for some reason but it certainly gives you an idea of what an artist wants. I've been a flatter for other people (MY RATES ARE VERY REASONABLE) - I find it the most tedious but rewarding part of the process really. Figuring out all the colours is the tricky part and SHADING IS LIKE ICING.
Quote from: CrazyFoxMachine on 17 August, 2012, 03:32:13 PM
Figuring out all the colours is the tricky part and SHADING IS LIKE ICING.
Also worth mentioning that if you're flatting for a pro colourist, they don't care what colours you use for the flats -- they'll change them regardless. All they're interested in is being able to make quick, clean selections of different parts of the artwork.
Cheers
Jim
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 17 August, 2012, 03:45:12 PM
they don't care what colours you use for the flats -- they'll change them regardless.
This is true - the one major flatting project I did however half the colours had already been done so I only thought it courteous to use the same ones rather than (when I hired a flatter) he just did y'know, easy-to-pick-out neons for everything and it took me ages changing all the colours back. It's kind of why I'm really happy to do it myself because as palette choice is half the process anyway.
Hi Jim not for fun for digital publication. I did colour covers and you may well be right in fact you probably are about the flatting but because I zoomed in tight with it I didnt suffer too badly with breaks. Now on your advice I would probably flat noe for future print publication if that is a side effect.
Im sure ots been mentioned before bit Gutterzombie is a fantastic resource for colouring.