How to make inking enjoyable...?

[House of Usher]

I thought it was kinda frowned upon in some circles

I don't know about that. I remember once upon a time DC ran a series of promotional features in their monthly titles showing what their artists did, and they were delighted to show fans what the same pencils looked like inked by three different Batman artists. Drawing was definitely a big part of what those inkers were shown to be doing.

[dyl]

If you're inking over loose pencils make sure you've got the structure right, eyes level, good solid poses, good indication of the major folds and creases on clothing on figures and all of your perspective sussed on backgrounds. Stuff like that is hard to get right in the inks especially if you're not that confident.

[radiator]

I tend to find that generally I'm really pleased with my pencils, but when it comes to ink them I somehow manage to suck all the detail, fun and sense of movement from them. Anyone else know where I'm coming from...?

Exactly how I often feel about my own work!

I've also completely given up on inking over my original pencils as I hold my pencil so hard and the lines are so heavy, the amount of erasing I need to do to get rid of them shreds the inks as well, ruining the picture even further! Also the amount of erasing I do during the drawing process kind of ruins the surface of the paper/board for inking.

It used to really piss me off as my friends and family would always prefer the original sketch to the finished piece! This frustrated me to the point where I stopped erasing my pencils and just scanned and coloured over the top - this actually achieves a quite nice effect, by keeping the energy of the original drawing....

Exhibit A: //http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs25/i/2008/168/f/0/Tribal_2_by_TomBerryArtist.jpg

At the moment I'm experimenting with photocopying my pencils as faintly as I can, then inking over the copies and erasing the faint lines in Photoshop with curves.

draw with your ink! don't just trace, the finished product will feel very dead, draw + add to the pencils.

Couldn't agree more... I'll also add that I never start inking 'cold'. It always, always takes me about an hour or two of doodling before I can warm up enough to draw anything - this applies to inking as well.

I think my own inking improved greatly when I stopped trying to ink in a really slick and minimalist way, and just got stuck in - not being too precious and taking more risks - you can always correct mistakes later on after all!

[SuperSurfer]

For what its worth, as an amateur, I really enjoy the inking stage – perhaps more than pencilling. Pencilling can be a bit of a trial to get things right, with lots of reworking to get things in the right place, get proportions correct etc (well, as correct as I can get them). Once the basics are there I enjoy working in the detail and I almost see inking as a continuation of this. I like seeing the drawing come to life with the inks. I don't really see it as two totally separate stages – one is a continuation of the other.

Perhaps don't work up your pencils so tightly. Maybe leave some of the final tightening up for the inking stage?

I'd suggest looking at some of the websites that show pencilled art alongside inked art to see how far pencillers take things.

I guess so many 2000AD artists have distinct inking styles which is one of the many reasons why I enjoy their art more than a lot of US comic art.

[Darren Stephens]

Agree with Jock. I do very loose pencils and add lots more details as I ink. It makes inking more exciting. You can see the work 'develop' in front of your eyes...like the slowest polaroid known to man!  

[Peter Wolf]

I dont know how to make the inking process more enjoyable .Learning curves are never that enjoyable but the more you do the easier it gets and you never stop learning so my advice is to stick some music on and shut up and get on with the work that needs to get done because you wont improve by asking someone else to do it for you or by shying away from it.Everytime you ink something you will improve by default.

You are adding an extra dimension to your work by inking.You shouldnt be just repeating it.Look at it that way.A lot of my work is boring like plastering a ceiling or sticking up plaster mouldings which repeat themselves 500 times by the time i have gone all the way round the ceiling in the  room.Concentrate and get into it and again music really helps.


I used to be scared of inking which is why everything i drew stayed in pencil to the point of it being finished.


I used to be terrible at pressing too hard with a pencil that left indented lines on the paper.Not any more though as i broke the habit which took some time.I draw on heavy art card instead of paper which if you dont press to hard and draw heavy lines on you can rub out as many times as you like without degrading the surface of the paper as the pencil leaves no trace.

Honestly if any of you dont use Photoshoppery and just use paper then draw and ink on heavy art card [i dont know what else to call it] as the ink just glides over it and you can get very very fine lines.Also only ink with Black Indian Ink .Theres 2 kinds :One with Shellac and one without.The shellac type is much better and has better obliterating qualities and it dries shiny on the paper.The Non shellac variety is not as good and doesnt have the same depth of colour especially when inking in large flat areas.A bit wishy washy although you can probably correct that with Photoshop.

Bristol Board is fine if your work doesnt have lots of  fine detail but it doesnt work for what i do.

The heavy art card is very cheap as it is sold in very large sheets that you can cut up to whatever size you want.It costs about 2 quid a sheet.

Inking with brushes is much more enjoyable than using pens etc.I had so many  flat and lifeless disasters [cue intense self loathing and feelings of inadequacy] with pens i gave up with them.You can get a lot more fluidity with brushes as it is easier to draw as it were with brushes.

Otherwise what do i know ? as i have only just started.

[Hoagy]

Get very stoned and work by a stop watch. You would not believe how rewarding it can be. Be prepared to discontinue any flourishing relationship though. Apparently, according to them, dope smoking is a leisurely activity. F**k no!

[Queen Firey-Bou]

I've been wrestling with this stuff too, taking time out from comic projects until i feel happier with lines,  I hate the notion of drawing things twice, don't do tight pencils, kill things when trying to do crisp ink lines... so am veering towards a scribbled painted approach, just sketchy pencils & then get horsed in with brush ( or photoshop )... just got a pentel brush pen tho which is joy to behold & may again change things..also a water brush pen which i look forward to playing with. The work thats currently inspiring me most is very loose European illustration work, and a lot of kids books at the mo have really loose rough lined illos.

we'll see.... I like PJ's idea of working the two at same time.

[Peter Wolf]

"just got a pentel brush pen tho which is joy to behold & may again change things."

Can anyone tell me any more about Pentel brush pens ?

They are for sale in the art shop for 12 quid .Just wondering if they are worth it and curious what they can do that a paintbrush cant ?

Any good for fine detailed work or are they better for painting in broad strokes ?

Any advice is much appreciated.

[Jim_Campbell]

Can I absolutely and unreservedly recommend the DC Comics Guide to Inking by Klaus Janson, which I've just finished reading.

It's interesting that there are a number of comments in the reviews where people are complaining that this isn't a 'how-to', that it doesn't tell you which number Windsor & Newton brush to use to ink brunette hair, but that rather misses the point.

Janson's book is about thinking like an inker, about what an inker does. I have to say that it's credit to DC that they had this book authored by one of their most distinctive inkers, rather than a slicker one (or, some might say, a more faithful inker).

The book is an excellent read, and one of the most interesting things is the way that it uses enlarged panels by various inkers. If -- like me -- you're a horrendously hesitant inker, it's fascinating to see the work of top-level inkers focussed on to this degree, to see all the little ticks and quirks.

I'll admit that the horrendously over-inked entry I've just posted in the competition probably isn't the best advert for what I've just written, but it was reading Janson's book that helped me drift off into a little Zen place and just start to feel the rhythm of the strokes and the linework.

I'd also thoroughly recommend going digital, if you haven't already -- that way you can create your basic illustration as pencils, or digitally, but leave things like the shading to do at the 'inking' stage knowing that you can put the shading on a separate layer to the main linework and just discard the shading and start again. It makes you much bolder, and hesitancy is death to good inking.

(On top of that, there are a couple of genuine advantages over traditional inking if it's something you're not massively comfortable with ... you can't smudge digital inks with your hand, and you can change brush/pen size instantly without ever releasing your grip on the pen itself, which makes the whole process feel much more fluid and, ironically, more natural.)

I'm currently rather enjoying inking in Manga Studio Debut, whose pen and brush tools seem to do what I want much more than Photoshop does, and which delivers better performance than Illustrator, which tends to slow down when confronted with hundreds of brush strokes that are all individual, editable items.  MS Debut sacrifices a number of features over the EX version -- I'm not sure what they are, but all the inking tools are there and the Debut version has one real benefit: it's only £30.

As for Janson's book ... it may be the best £13 I've spent this year.

Cheers!

Jim

[Adrian Bamforth]

I find that using a lightbox to ink means you can switch off the box at intervals and you can see the 'finished' inks with bo pencil lines. That way you get the benefit of instant gratification, as well as not having to rub out precious pencils. By keeping the lines safe on another sheet you can also just relax more, and experiment in the knowledge that you can just re-ink any bits you don't like.

However, the down side is you have to slump over a desk while I prefer to draw in as relaxed position possible (I get extremely exhausted drawing and need to find any way possible to 'pace' myself and reduce the stress) - so I might try getting some 'blue line' photocopies made of the pencils and inking straight over tham.

I also long ago banned any kind of volatile substances for inking, to help reduce stress, effort and smudges. I can't be done with waiting for the ink to dry all the time (a decision I made when Chris Weston told me he just uses regular Edding pens). If I want brush-lines I use a (Pentel) brushpen. If I want to fill a black space I use markers. Furthermore, because I currently light-box my pencils I use glossy paper (and have done since I had the revelation that the blank inside cover of the paper pads is farr better for inking on than the paper itself) for zero bleed, clear deliniation between black and white, and an ultra-smooth surface which it literally less effort to move your brush around on.

Hope that helps.

[Kerrin]

It's amazing what a perishable skill drawing is.

I'm just getting back into drawing again really and inking isn't something I used to give much thought to. Not any more though and I've been trying to kind of make it up as I go along. Pretty unsuccessfully so far unfortunately, so I've also invested in the DC guide (it's great) and a couple of other references/manuals to help me along. I could really do with investing in some decent equipment. Having said that I found a three pack of fineliners by Papermate in conjunction with Rotring at Tescos the other day, 0.3, 0.5 and 0.7 waterproof ink for £4.89. They've got a nice 'feel' as well. A desk would be a real luxury at the moment.

I think I may follow Radiators advice and do a couple of light pencil sketches, photocopy them and then just have a go with a few different techniques. It's very difficult not to get too precious with your art and I think I probably just need to loosen up on the inkwork.

I'm also trying to get my head round the possibilties available with digital art and that's pretty good fun as well.

Fully agree with Bou about the brush pens, I got one a while back and they encourage a really nice, loose drawing style, but can also be used for detail. I think I found the best price by just googling 'Pentel brushpen', it was definitely less than £12.

Thanks to all for being so generous with some excellent advice.

[Peter Wolf]

"I use glossy paper (and have done since I had the revelation that the blank inside cover of the paper pads is farr better for inking on than the paper itself) for zero bleed, clear deliniation between black and white, and an ultra-smooth surface which it literally less effort to move your brush around on."

I am doing exactly the same thing.

Also if you smudge the ink on the surface of this kind paper it dries on the surface and i have found that you can actually scrape it back off the surface with the edge of a very sharp scalpel blade without even ruining the surface of the paper if you are very careful.This only works with shellac based black indian ink as shellac is brittle when it has set.It dries fast as well.

I used to to take inking for granted until i tried it myself.Its almost like a science.For some inexplicable reason i used to take it for granted and not analyse it as i more into looking at what was on the page rather than studying how it was actually drawn and inked.I never stopped to think about what exactly it was that i liked about a particular artist.I just liked it.

Not anymore thanks to threads here and trying it for myself.

I will never look at the art in the same way again.

Thanks for the the book recommendation as i am trying to understand shading and shadow etc so it becomes second nature so it might help which like you say is thinking like an inker.

Everything becomes second nature if you do enough of it.

The brush is just a tool that you have to learn to use.

I spent hours with different brushes trying to get brush strokes that are like long thin straight points.Feathering.I got there in the end after trying all different brushes.I realised in the end it was as much the way that you hold the brush and draw it across the surface to get the result you want.

[uncle fester]

I'd just like to say a big Thanks to everyone who's contributed their opinion on this, I really appreaciate it. Lots of positives to take away, and a few pitfalls avoided.

I sometimes find myself wondering if I'm going mad as I don't know anyone socially who has any appreciation for what we try to achieve with things like pens, paper, tablets and art software, and as such, this forum is the only place I can really ask! The general look I get when I say "Drawing comics is a passion of mine" is a blank one! Thanks again to all - and keep the advice coming.

Fester

PS Peter, never thought of glossy paper, will experiment.

Kerrin, I also found those Rotring / Papermate pens on Tuesday - what a find! They also come in 0.1 - 0.8 inclusive.

Jim, I do use digital for some inking and all colours. I'd heard of Managa Studio as I think Dave Gibbons did a video on it on imaginefx, but I didn't realise it was that cheap - where did you get it? I'll look for that book too.

Adrian, I built my own lightbox but try to keep the sesssions with that to a minimum as it hurts my head after a while...

[Peter Wolf]

The paper or heavy art card is doublesided by the way or at least the kind i use is.Its not glossy either as the surface is dead flat but its like a semi matt or satin finish.Also its quite a hard surface that is harder to leave lines in if you press too hard with a pencil.