The Political Thread

[The Prodigal]

They have invested billions of euros in the Norn Iron peace and reconciliation sector.

I spent most of my slice on comics.

[Definitely Not Mister Pops]

If it weren't for all Brussels and Westminster's money, Norn Irn would be a third world country

[The Prodigal]

If it weren't for all Brussels and Westminster's money, Norn Irn would be a third world country

More to the point I'd have no comics Joe.

[JOE SOAP]

If it weren't for all Brussels and Westminster's money, Norn Irn would be a third world country

You mean part of the Republic?

You have a point.

But at least you'd have the comfort knowing that all your tax money would be spent making your road-signs as gaeilge.

[Frank]

So Yugoslavia wasn't on mainland Europe then??

I've often thought the same when commentators made that claim, Tankie. While agreeing with your geography, Yugoslavia and the many nations into which it splintered following the collapse of the Soviet Bloc weren't members of the EU at the time they degenerated into civil war and genocide. I'm sure Jim didn't intend to argue that the self-evident emolient effects of greater economic and social integration extended beyond the political borders of the signatories of the Treaty of Rome.

[JOE SOAP]

More to the point I'd have no comics Joe.

Let's have a WAR! It'll boost the economy.

[Dandontdare]

Also Dan, I see that that book isn't even out until 2014 and from that small article I look forward to reading what comes up, time will tell. Please buy the book and then tell me all the facts. I will wait with baited breath!

Fair do's. I began googling stuff, but then just couldn't be arsed doing a proper job of it. I know in my soul that they're evil twatbaskets, but I'm never going to convince you.

[Frank]

I must say that I'm amazed that people who are for Scotland wanting independence, want to be controlled by Europe, funny that!

Most Scots are phlegmatic concerning the EU because we've been sending our elected representatives to a parliament in another country for over 300 years. When folk discuss a federal Europe they most often point toward the USA as a model, but the United Kingdom (especially after devolution) seems to provide a better paradigm.

You're right that the decidedly fuzzy (dis)connection between voters and their MEP's (and the lack of accountability this encourages) means the wee buggers need a closer eye kept on them to avoid corruption, but we've just been through a similar experience with our own domestic governing class. That's not a valid argument for abandoning UK parliamentary democracy or the Union, and it's not much reason for giving up on the European project either..

It's naive to imagine that, without the EU, decisions that directly affect your life wouldn't be taken in other countries by people who don't care what you think anyway. Some mechanism has to be in place to allow us to influence that decision making process; the fact that the European Parliament doesn't do so is more of an argument in favour of reform and greater participation than a retreat into splendid isolation.

[Definitely Not Mister Pops]

... I know in my soul that they're evil twatbaskets...

Of course they are, they're policians

[Definitely Not Mister Pops]

*POLITICIANS

ARRRRGGGHHH

[JOE SOAP]

If you don't trust cunts over here why trust cunts over there?

[M.I.K.]

Never trust a pelican.

[Definitely Not Mister Pops]

Never trust a pelican.

Their bills are bigger than they look

[Jim_Campbell]

I'm sure Jim didn't intend to argue that the self-evident emolient effects of greater economic and social integration extended beyond the political borders of the signatories of the Treaty of Rome.

Well, yes. I would have thought my explicit reference to the peace being an effect of trade, political and diplomatic ties would have made it quite clear that I wasn't referring to countries not subject to those effects.

I think the fact that the collapse of a large and hostile empire that had ranged along thousands of miles of border, and that empire's subsequent regression into disparate nation states along various historic borders, resulted in only one civil war of any significance is fairly remarkable.

Rather than disproving the point about European integration (note that I am describing this as a process of which the EU is a manifestation, not arguing that the EU is the necessary or best means of achieving that process) it would seem to me that the only significant conflict in the wider European geographical area took place in a nation/s not subject to those ties of integration suggests the reverse.

Cheers

Jim

[TordelBack]

...phlegmatic...

Europe has gone disastrously wrong in failing to implement a law mandating the use of this word at least once a day.  Mmmmmm, phlegmatic....