The Death Of Dredd

[dazza1008]

I've found this idea to be interesting, mainly because I don't believe John Wagner had predicted its success, therefore, hadn't thought it was a topic that would need to be dealt with. In order to keep with the series' unique aspects i.e. characters age in real-time, eventually Judge Dredd as a character would have to die, right?

I don't like the thought of that, either. 

Perhaps the series itself would continue via 'lost files' or something, but the question does remain, what possible storyline could do it justice? (no pun intended)

Anyway, what I wrote ISN'T a serious ending - it's a short story, and it's more tribute to the character with some speckles of dry wit thrown in. If you want to mention points for improvement, feel free - I'd like to know what you honestly think. 

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10484651/1/The-Death-Of-Dredd

But... how would you think this topic will be dealt with, or should be dealt with? Drama, action, disgrace, lack of confirmation of his death - all are themes that come to mind for me. What kind of ending would you want to see in the comic?

I mean, there is also this ending... (not drawn by myself)
http://www.deviantart.com/art/Gone-Fission-217239600

[radiator]

My hope* is that when John Wagner retires he will write 'the final episode of Judge Dredd', perhaps prog-length, or even just a regular six-pager - which would work in a manner very similar to that of Alan Moore's Superman story 'Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow?' - an 'imaginary tale' that signals the end of an era. Then we immediately push the reset button and carry on as normal the following week.

It would be drawn by Carlos, obvs.

*I like to believe that the script is already written, and will be published at the appropriate time (not that I actually want John Wagner to ever retire, of course!

[dazza1008]

an 'imaginary tale' that signals the end of an era. Then we immediately push the reset button and carry on as normal the following week.

Well, we want more Dredd. xD

But what you say- not that I blame you, but you don't want the death story to be canon in the sense that it affects anything else. How do you propose they get around the "ages in real-time" thing?

Personally, I think it would make more of an impact if it was a proper death, even though the series could continue with flash-backs, or through IDW. xD I think John Wagner's the one to make a statement. He's joked that it would be in his will.

[maryanddavid]

My hope* is that when John Wagner retires he will write 'the final episode of Judge Dredd', perhaps prog-length, or even just a regular six-pager - which would work in a manner very similar to that of Alan Moore's Superman story 'Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow?' - an 'imaginary tale' that signals the end of an era. Then we immediately push the reset button and carry on as normal the following week.

It would be drawn by Carlos, obvs.

*I like to believe that the script is already written, and will be published at the appropriate time (not that I actually want John Wagner to ever retire, of course!

LIKE!

[radiator]

But what you say- not that I blame you, but you don't want the death story to be canon in the sense that it affects anything else.

Well, like the aforementioned Superman story it would be 'canon' if you wanted it to be. Or you could take it as a 'what if?' kind of story.

How do you propose they get around the "ages in real-time" thing?

I don't see it as this pressing issue they need to address. Dredd's old - probably around 70, but John Wagner has already stated many times that in Dredd's universe lifespans are a lot longer thanks to medical advances, and he's already had at least one 're-juve' treatment (Dredd, not Wagner so far as I know) - with that kind of narrative hand-waving you could keep it going indefinitely.

What I don't want - and what will never happen - is something like Rico II taking over the mantle of 'Judge Dredd' because A) It's too obvious and fan-fictiony and B) Rico is not the same man as Dredd.

[dazza1008]

Well, like the aforementioned Superman story it would be 'canon' if you wanted it to be. Or you could take it as a 'what if?' kind of story.

You know, I'm trying to figure out John Wagner as a person, and I do think he likes to make a statement. My limited impression of him is that he'd want to make something definite. I like what you suggest, but it could be construed as wanting to cater to the audience, keep everyone happy, that kind of thing.

Then again, he did kill off Johnny Alpha, and is trying to recover from that - years later, Wagner said it was a mistake.

I don't see it as this pressing issue they need to address. Dredd's old - probably around 70, but John Wagner has already stated many times that in Dredd's universe lifespans are a lot longer thanks to medical advances, and he's already had at least one 're-juve' treatment (Dredd, not Wagner so far as I know) - with that kind of narrative hand-waving you could keep it going indefinitely.

From my point of view, the whole idea of the Dredd comic is to address real-life issues in a kind of satirical way - take something to an extreme to make a statement. If they did avoid the issue, it would be good for continuity, however, in today's society, older people arguably aren't given the respect they deserve. Considering John Wagner's aging himself, I wonder how he feels about it- being on the receiving end - and whether he would want to make a statement about it. Perhaps there's a way of tackling the issue as well as maintaining the possibility of continuing the comic, without resorting to a "what if" scenario.

[/quote]What I don't want - and what will never happen - is something like Rico II taking over the mantle of 'Judge Dredd' because A) It's too obvious and fan-fictiony and B) Rico is not the same man as Dredd.
[/quote]
Agree! xD

[JOE SOAP]

Then again, he did kill off Johnny Alpha, and is trying to recover from that - years later, Wagner said it was a mistake.

It was Alan Grant who killed off Johnny Alpha; this was after he and John Wagner went solo and split their characters between them.

[dazza1008]

Then again, he did kill off Johnny Alpha, and is trying to recover from that - years later, Wagner said it was a mistake.

It was Alan Grant who killed off Johnny Alpha; this was after he and John Wagner went solo and split their characters between them.

Oh was it? My mistake, thanks.

[Frank]

I've found this idea to be interesting, mainly because I don't believe John Wagner had predicted its success, therefore, hadn't thought it was a topic that would need to be dealt with

Wagner has said he has an idea of how to write such a story which he believes he could do in such a way that it wouldn't "hurt the character" (presumably meaning that stories featuring the original version of the character could continue to be published). I imagine that involves the kind of flash forward/hypothetical story scenario described by radiator above, and hopefully not Fog On The Eerie-style time travel and alternative timeline shenanigans.

On a side note, Wagner's a bit vague concerning the part he played in killing John Alpha. He says he must have agreed to it but can't remember doing so, while Alan Grant remembers Wagner wanting to off Alpha much earlier, having grown bored of the strip while their writing partnership was still active. Once they left 2000ad to write for Toxic and US comics, both saw killing Alpha as necessary to prevent other writers ruining the character. Looking at what happened to Dredd, Robohunter, and Strontium Dogs in the nineties, you can see their point.

Wagner won't be allowed to kill Dredd when he hangs up his word processor, but I'm sure Rebellion are aware of the publicity and revenue which the final Dredd story by the character's creator (creators, hopefully) would generate.

[Bubba Zebill]

After all the ways the character has cheated death something simple would be good, perhaps just slipping away while monitoring traffic. But it could also be a mini-epic set further in to the future. Like Beowolf, a final heroic act of a very old warrior. I don't like replacing him with another clone but if you clone body parts and replace enough of them, at what point does Dredd become someone else anyway? Spirits, like the dark judges, are real and can be captured in the Dredd universe. Perhaps Psi division could capture Dredd in spirit and using dark judges technology (that they left behind after freeing Death and Anderson from Boing) put his spirit in another young clone. But that dodges the epic arc. I guess you can't have it both ways, then again, it's a multi-dimensional universe so I guess you can.

To really kill Dredd give him back to whoever wrote all that terrible stuff in the 90's, the Egyptians and all that tripe. It killed him for me. Now, I'm delighted to say he's re-born, the whole prog is so very good now. So that would be my question, how to keep it this alive, this good..and worth living on, a prog worth reading.

[Skullmo]

I like the idea of a low key death, but I think I would be ultimately disappointed by that. The big heroic gesture is what is needed - giving his life for the city he loves.

[JOE SOAP]

Once they left 2000ad to write for Toxic and US comics, both saw killing Alpha as necessary to prevent other writers ruining the character. Looking at what happened to Dredd, Robohunter, and Strontium Dogs in the nineties, you can see their point.

Wagner won't be allowed to kill Dredd when he hangs up his word processor, but I'm sure Rebellion are aware of the publicity and revenue which the final Dredd story by the character's creator (creators, hopefully) would generate.

Amazingly; editorial/management allowed Alpha to be offed which says either they didn't care becuase Alpha is not Dredd or a certain degree of artistic autonomy was allowed, or both.



This thread is a bit déjà vu :

http://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php/topic,35801.msg672051.html#msg672051


http://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php/topic,38000.30.html

[Pyroxian]

Amazingly; editorial/management allowed Alpha to be offed which says either they didn't care becuase Alpha is not Dredd or a certain degree of artistic autonomy was allowed, or both.

I always got the feeling it was a bit of a "two-fingers-up" at the US comics habit of killing off characters and bringing them back constantly...

[Skullmo]

Amazingly; editorial/management allowed Alpha to be offed which says either they didn't care becuase Alpha is not Dredd or a certain degree of artistic autonomy was allowed, or both.

I always got the feeling it was a bit of a "two-fingers-up" at the US comics habit of killing off characters and bringing them back constantly...

Editorial at the time did make some funny decisions, I think Tharg may have been raving too hard.

[Frank]

This thread is a bit déjà vu :

http://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php/topic,38000.30.html

Ah, there it is. Cheers:

Would John ever kill the character? "Alex Garland suggested I should write the 'Death of Dredd' story and leave it with my will," says John. "But I might write it before though. I might talk to [editorial] about it and see if I can convince them to let me kill him. Whether or not I want to...I don't know. But if he does die, it should be me that writes it. I think I could do it so that it didn't hurt the character. But that would be my worry."