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Prog 2220 Regened: Earth-Shattering

Started by Tjm86, 20 February, 2021, 04:43:13 PM

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Tjm86

Quote from: HeidTheBaw on 01 March, 2021, 05:20:41 PM
Yeah, this is anecdotal, but of the 5 people I know who read 2000ad religiously (myself included) the Regened prog is something we buy either as completionists or it's part of our subscription. None of us enjoy reading it.

Personal tastes and all that, but i try and approach each one with an open mind only to leave it with the same feeling each time. This is why I'm surprised that it's so popular on this forum.

For me personally it is the epitome of Tooth.  It is, after all, an anthology publication.  Any given week I can find myself feeling a little unimpressed by one strip or another but that is more by the standards of the prog.

I tend to come at the Regened prog in the spirit it is intended, as something experimental to grow the prog.  When we KOS's (Knackered Old Sods) pass on it would be nice to know that Tooth will still grow and evolve.
In many respects that is precisely what it has done down through the years.

A prog slog will bring a variety of era's, from the potentially juvenile early formative years, through the early 80's as Tooth found its voice, into the years of which less spake the better and then the renaissance of the early noughties.

For me there is a growing consistency to the Regened prog.  I'd still prefer it to be spun off as a special alongside the prog.  As you say, for some of us it will still get the support of the 'old guard'.  That said, Rebellion have picked this direction for now.

At the end of the day though we are an incredibly eclectic bunch.  Perhaps that explains the support for the Regened project?  Or more likely we're just a bunch of oddballs and it might be better to ignore us completely.

Funt Solo

++ A-Z ++  coma ++

Funt Solo

Quote from: Link Prime on 01 March, 2021, 12:16:02 PM
But c'mon - who could put their hand on their cholesterol clogged heart and say they actually want to read this stuff?

Moi.

All the complaining just comes across as curmudgeonly to me. The Regened progs are far and away much better than a lot of what's been printed in the prog over it's tenure. Erm ... The Grudge-Father, anyone?

Seems like the label "All Ages" has gotten some grumpy narcissists champing at the bit. "Call me a child, would you, sir? I've never been so insulted since a few moments ago when someone said excuse me on the elevator! Call me fat, would you, sir? I've never been so insulted since someone asked me enjoy a new idea only moment ago. Call me small-minded, would you, sir?"

Over and over again, for months. The ONLY benefit to stopping the Regened experiment would be to stop the endless complaints - but they'd just move onto how Pat should be running the comic etc. etc.



++ A-Z ++  coma ++

Magnetica

My eleven year old son picked up the Regened Prog without me prompting him. I think he got two thirds of the way through Cadet Dredd and didn't read any more.

I know it's not a statistically valid sample, but it doesn't bode well.

And I would have thought he was the target audience.

What he does like is Dogman, Captain Underpants, Alex Rider, Harry Potter, Star Wars, MCU, Lego Stars comics, Ultimate Spider-man etc.

Oh and I also gave him Spacewarp to read and he read about as much of that as well.

But he did like Sensitive Klegg (which contains a certain scene which makes it unsuitable for children IMO).

broodblik

I think about change many of us do not want change although we do not realize it our whole life is about change. We just do not realize changes since we grow into it rather than it just happens to materialise on our front doors. I will restate what I said on a previous occasion: I rather have 46 regular progs and 4 regen progs than no prog at all. Choosing not to like the regen and not reading it I believe you are going to lose out as well. I cannot wait for more Department K and Pandora Perfect (and now we can add Mayflies, Action Pact and Viva Forever to that list).
When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.

Old age is the Lord's way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death's in case we didn't take the hint.

The Corinthian

Quote from: Magnetica on 02 March, 2021, 12:16:59 AM
But he did like Sensitive Klegg (which contains a certain scene which makes it unsuitable for children IMO).

His poetry isn't that bad.

The Corinthian

I wonder how much of the animosity towards the Regened Progs is how they seem shoehorned into the weekly schedule. If a regular Prog is full of things that don't grab you that's not unexpected, that's how Tooth has been for years. If you're following a regular series and have to wait an extra week to find out what's going on with Durham Rex or if Slaine is ever going to do something interesting again to make way for a Prog full of things that don't grab you... that's still a First World Problem but a bit more understandably frustrating for regular readers.

So I also wonder how much better received Regened would be if it appeared in the natural gaps that appear as ongoing stories come to an end but before a big relaunch. I'm old enough to remember a time when Tharg used these to burn off Future Shocks, Fleisher scripts and other unloved material - remember Prog 699, the Bumper Chronos Carnival Special? - and even the most cynical among us would have to admit that a Regened Prog is far superior to these.

broodblik

I also think that scheduling the regen between series that are done and  dusted works much better than breaking up the flow of series. The regen's looks more like it was scheduling around quartets. There is between 7 and 12 weeks between regen issues.
When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.

Old age is the Lord's way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death's in case we didn't take the hint.

TordelBack

For me the flaw in many arguments (not necessarily here) is "kids don't read comics". Maybe they don't read weekly adventure/romance/humour comics bought from the newsagents like what we did, but comics are in the bestseller lists every week. Tell Dav Pilkey, Raina Telgemeier, Grace Ellis or Kohei Horikoshi that kids don't read comics, those folk shift truckloads.

Rebellion trying to carve out some territory in that market, while trying it back into their heaps of existing IP and current sales model, just makes sense. Whether the ultimate goal is a field-tested standalone comic, a pre-funded source of material for individual collections, or a broadening of the offering of the weekly (as with FTB), or all three, I think it's worthwhile.

I don't like everything about Regened, but I like a lot of it - you could certainly make a damn good comic out of the strips I have enjoyed, and I find I look forward to a slew of novelty every few months. I'm not a subber or a completionist and I still pick them up.

I don't buy the argument that a two-week break in regular stories is detrimental to 2000AD as a whole: we're comics readers FFS, we regularly put up with years between issues.  As I've said before, I think that co-ordinating Regeneds with jumping-on progs is probably a bad idea, as that really does represent a break in reading, becoming a jumping-off point.



BPP

It's perfectly okay not to like a comic without having formers tell you you are disingenuous or curmudgeonly.

If I'd known it was harmless I would have killed it myself.

http://futureshockd.wordpress.com/

http://twitter.com/#!/FutureShockd

IndigoPrime

Heh—good point about breaks in comics. I mean: Saga.

As for kids not reading comics, that's of course bollocks. Graphic novels and manga are doing well. But traditional comics aren't, in terms of publication numbers—although it was nice to see The Beano's ABC up this year, despite COVID. (Reportedly, subscriptions are way up.)

Being a parent of a youngling, I still think a lot of the issues with comics come down to awareness. I'm an older parent of a 6yo, given that I'm in my 40s. I grew up at the tail end of the comics for boys boom—and by then comics for girls had largely vanished. So for me, comics were a natural thing—part of life. Someone in their 30s just wouldn't have had the same experience. Someone in their 20s might not care for that at all. Now add to that societal dislike for comics as a whole, some teachers arguing they are not proper reading (FFS) and comics being reframed as 'Marvel' and you have big problems.

I'm not sure what the solution is, or even if there is one. I do occasionally try and put the word out there on social media when I find something good or as an occasional reminder about the existence of properties. Recently, The Phoenix was doing SIX issues for a quid. Why wouldn't you at least TRY that for your child? (Heck, even as an adult, that'd be worth it for Jamie Smart's stuff and Squid Bits.) Similarly, The Beano is £1.50 a week when you go for a direct debit. I realise not everyone can afford that, but many can—and it's way better value than bags full of yet more plastic shite. But it's getting people to find this stuff and realise it's quality reading matter that's the problem.

In a sense, perhaps Regened commercially works now because it's part of the existing run and can therefore be handed on to children, rather than something you'd have to seek out.

TordelBack

Quote from: BPP on 02 March, 2021, 10:22:50 AM
It's perfectly okay not to like a comic without having formers tell you you are disingenuous or curmudgeonly.

This is also true.

Barrington Boots

Quote from: BPP on 02 March, 2021, 10:22:50 AM
It's perfectly okay not to like a comic without having formers tell you you are disingenuous or curmudgeonly.

This. A lot of the objections to these issues have been reasonably made - I certainly haven't seen the sort of vitriol that's on other platforms here - so I'm not overjoyed at some of the generalisations chucked about at those who aren't enjoying the Regened stuff.

For what it's worth Regened did make me consider my subscription vs buying issues individually, but decided it's still worthwhile. I'd rather have a continued prog than no prog and if this is what it takes for that then so be it.
What's more of an issue to me is how divisive this has been to the fanbase tbh.
You're a dark horse, Boots.

MumboJimbo

Quote from: BPP on 02 March, 2021, 10:22:50 AM
It's perfectly okay not to like a comic without having formers tell you you are disingenuous or curmudgeonly.

...or a grumpy narcissist. If people don't like the Regened progs, then they should be able to express that here (as long as it's constructive and not personal attacks on the creators). Seems to be a lot more ad hominems and cod psychology being directed at them than vice versa. You can be open to change in general but dislike a specific change, you know.

Anyway, as I've said above I've gradually become open to the idea but still have some concerns over the execution of a few of the scripts. I'm sure Rebellion anticipated that this would be controversial step, and so a bit of discussion here seems a good way to tackle that and see if there's any consensus about what is or isn't working. I do think you should at least give them a read, though, if you want people to take your point of view seriously. There has definitely been an evolution over the 6(?) issues, in particular a move to fewer and longer strips which has helped, in my opinion. So it's worth trying the latest issues even if you didn't like the early ones.

I can't for the life of me see what's so exciting about Department K or Pandora Perfect, and I'm not looking forward to them joining the regular prog to be honest. I'd prefer to keep the Regened and non-Regened stuff separate myself. We could end up with a prog like the early 90s where is trying to please all ages. And before you say, "that's what "All Ages" means, duh", it kind of doesn't really these day, it means one age notch below Young Adult. What I mean is when we had stuff like Firekind next to Fleischer Rogue Trooper - probably not a huge intersection of people who enjoyed both. And history could repeat itself with Department K being in the same prog as the Fall of Deadworld. 

broodblik

Quote from: MumboJimbo on 02 March, 2021, 12:11:10 PM
I'd prefer to keep the Regened and non-Regened stuff separate myself.

That is also a valid point. If you look at something like Full Tilt Boogie which transitioned to the regular prog and it worked. I can see that Mayflies will also work in the current prog.
When I die, I want to die like my grandfather who died peacefully in his sleep. Not screaming like all the passengers in his car.

Old age is the Lord's way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death's in case we didn't take the hint.