The Political Thread

[Hawkmumbler]

I never got that impression. Indeed most media sources infer that they can't move to city environments, even then, most cities in TWN's are often in even worse states than rural areas. Arid desertification doesn't exactly allow for easy life style and lack of resources (as apposed to apathy towards donations, neutral companies such as Red Cross are working flat out to provide what they can, but it's an impossible task).

[NapalmKev]

Not a lack of resources, I think, but a misallocation of resources.

And I wasn't claiming that you were blaming densely populated countries for famine but, when one watches "news" reports on this or similar topics there is always a strong inference that these people are starving because they insist on living in harsh environments or refuse to move to a city and that they are listless victims just sat around waiting for hand-outs. I don't know, maybe it's just me that sees that.

I agree entirely!

[JayzusB.Christ]

I think my main concern with law abiding anarchy is the main reason why capitalism is currently inescapable, it's a key point I bring up frequently. There are just to many people to allow a superior system to be imposed. 7 billion people, with cultures and political ideologies many of us wont even have heard of.  For a more socialist system to be introduced the world population would have to be much lower, and who here has the right to say who lives and die's?

Fair point; as I said though for me anarchism is an ideal to strive towards even if it never happens.  I just find it impossible to support any political system that upholds the current economic status quo, which supports (or even consists of) a mad dash to strip the world of resources at any costs, until there's nothing left.  Which ultimately is an unworkable system in itself, in that it might well kill us all before too long.

[The Legendary Shark]

It is possible that, if I can figure out how to make it work and if anyone's interested, I will be playing the unedited recording of Monday's bailiff adventure in the Yap Shop tonight.
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Click my banner image below for details of how to sign up for the (free) PalTalk chat site.

[TordelBack]

You only took into account the western world, ignoring third world nations that don't have access to birth control or sex education. That is where the population is booming, as you can see below, populations in Niger and Tanzania alone are increasing at rates upwards of 7%.

Increasing yes, but really only because people are living longer.  Birth rates worldwide are trending dramatically downwards (e.g. Bangladesh's birthrate has fallen from 7 per woman to just 2.2 in the past 40 years, while life expectancy has increased from 50 to 70), 'peak child' actually occurred over a decade ago, and by 2100 the global population will have reached its likely maximum of 11 billion (3 out of those 4 new billions being in Africa).  We know this will happen, in one sense it's already happened, and we need to make it work.  However the resource consumption of those billions is tiny compared to that consumed by a mere billion westerners.

Endless focus on population growth in poor countries has become a version of middle-class slut-shaming. Resource distribution and consumption rates in the north are what matter now.

[ZenArcade]

Living a collectively more moderate lifestyle is better for societies for example the population of the UK had very high levels of health during WW2 (rationing etc). As a society we don't need half the crap we pine after, it's almost as if we've become a society of addicts. We pine for things which at most will give only very limited short term gratification. The really sad thing is that this is being pushed at people as a panacea. How the f**k did we let extreme capitalism creep up on us and turn us into consumption units in a grotesque world destroying machine?

[The Legendary Shark]

It happened because we weren't vigilant.

[Ancient Otter]

Many would cite Somalia as an example of the evils of anarchy, but there is a difference between the greed-based anarchy that Mogadishu has sunk into, and a co-operative anarchy based on respect for the Common Law that Sharky mentioned earlier.

I never heard anyone mention Anarchism and Somalia mentioned together...as far I understood Anarchist political ideology has nothing to the situation there. Correct me if I'm wrong (I usually am).

[JayzusB.Christ]

Many would cite Somalia as an example of the evils of anarchy, but there is a difference between the greed-based anarchy that Mogadishu has sunk into, and a co-operative anarchy based on respect for the Common Law that Sharky mentioned earlier.

I never heard anyone mention Anarchism and Somalia mentioned together...as far I understood Anarchist political ideology has nothing to the situation there. Correct me if I'm wrong (I usually am).

I'm even wronger.  A quick look at Wikipedia tells me Mogadishu was until 2011 a lawless zone under fluctuating control of rival militias until government troops began to take control of it.   

[JayzusB.Christ]

Living a collectively more moderate lifestyle is better for societies for example the population of the UK had very high levels of health during WW2 (rationing etc). As a society we don't need half the crap we pine after, it's almost as if we've become a society of addicts. We pine for things which at most will give only very limited short term gratification. The really sad thing is that this is being pushed at people as a panacea. How the f**k did we let extreme capitalism creep up on us and turn us into consumption units in a grotesque world destroying machine?

'Scuse the double post, but I just noticed this and I fully agree with it.  I don't have anything against making money in an honest and ethical way; this is the system we're stuck in in and we can't just go and live in a field.

I remember listening to a psychology-based podcast, where it was posited (after a lot of research) that money can indeed make people happy; as long as it's spent on experiences rather than things.  Really, we don't need half the shite we have.  The same podcast also offered the theory that giving away money makes us happier than keeping it; and I've seen it supported in other sources since.

I think the best we can do is to try our best to see extreme commercialism as the insidious brainworm that it is and extract ourselves from it. 

[Proudhuff]

Many would cite Somalia as an example of the evils of anarchy, but there is a difference between the greed-based anarchy that Mogadishu has sunk into, and a co-operative anarchy based on respect for the Common Law that Sharky mentioned earlier.

I never heard anyone mention Anarchism and Somalia mentioned together...as far I understood Anarchist political ideology has nothing to the situation there. Correct me if I'm wrong (I usually am).

I'm even wronger.  A quick look at Wikipedia tells me Mogadishu was until 2011 a lawless zone under fluctuating control of rival militias until government troops began to take control of it.

fluctuating control of rival militias : that's yer raw capitalism right there, nothing to do with anarchy

[The Legendary Shark]

It's not capitalism that's the problem - capitalism is a reasonably good system when applied correctly.
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The problem is that we don't have proper capitalism, what we suffer is crony-capitalism and corporatism, which is inevitably inducing a fascist environment. (Recall what Mussolini said about fascism being more properly called corporatism.)
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Fascism may be a strong word to use but the system presently hints and demonstrates that only the wealthy or "offcials"i are entitled to enjoy any personal power or freedom. This is not, I think, an entirely conscious mindset.
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Take, for example, the council manager currently on my case. He earns, at a guesstimate, around £1,000 a week and works for the council at a fairly high level. Although I'm quite reasonably certain that this man would never dream of describing himself as a fascist, his attitude is one of superiority. He believes that his rights and opinions supersede the rights and opinions of anyone 'below' him in the social order.
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Start paying for local government and services properly, with publically created money, and this attitude would most likely evaporate fairly quickly. Proper public money would lead to proper public capitalism, fewer fascist officials, better public services and a better society for everyone - rich and poor.
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I don't really mind being 'poor', I'm not the type to hanker after the newest geegaw or upgraded thingummyjig, but I don't want to die of it or be demonized because my income is below a certain arbitrary level decided by 'richer' people than I.
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[The Legendary Shark]

Latest: I had a word with our local Bobby, who kindly telephoned the council manager who's been bothering my mother and advised him to stop it.
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There's a phone call that'll brighten his day...
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[Theblazeuk]

Go on lad

[JayzusB.Christ]

Latest: I had a word with our local Bobby, who kindly telephoned the council manager who's been bothering my mother and advised him to stop it.
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There's a phone call that'll brighten his day...
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Nice work, fella!  Hopefully it'll be a bit of a wake-up call for the twat when he realises the Old Bill are on the side of, well, not intimidating elderly women.