Prog 1819: Dangerous Minds.

[IndigoPrime]

Also, it's hard to imagine where the series is going to go from here and I'm left wondering if we might see the actual death of Johnny Alpha before this story arc is over.

It does feel a bit like it's driven into a cul-de-sac, but it'd be a bit odd if Wagner just killed him off again.

[Link Prime]

it'd be a bit odd if Wagner just killed him off again.

Quite frankly, it'd be disgraceful.
This storyline has shat all over a lot of other work (by Grant, Ennis, Hogan and Abnett- all well written stories IMO) and the established continuity since 1990.
I wouldn't mind so much if this new series was mind-boggling good, but I can honestly say its not. Its tepid and mediocre at best. And I'd feel the same way if it was 1986.

I'm not having a go at Wagner (or Ezquerra), both of whom have provided some of the finest reading experiences in my life (and continue to Thrill, particularly with Dredd) but I genuinely get the impression that this series was commissioned to allow its creators have their final say with its main character- not due to the undeniable desire to tell one last great Johnny Alpha story.

For me, Johnny died in Prog 686.
And Tharg's integrity diminished ever so slightly in Prog 1689.

[Trout]

it'd be a bit odd if Wagner just killed him off again.

Quite frankly, it'd be disgraceful.
This storyline has shat all over a lot of other work (by Grant, Ennis, Hogan and Abnett- all well written stories IMO) and the established continuity since 1990.
I wouldn't mind so much if this new series was mind-boggling good, but I can honestly say its not. Its tepid and mediocre at best. And I'd feel the same way if it was 1986.

I'm not having a go at Wagner (or Ezquerra), both of whom have provided some of the finest reading experiences in my life (and continue to Thrill, particularly with Dredd) but I genuinely get the impression that this series was commissioned to allow its creators have their final say with its main character- not due to the undeniable desire to tell one last great Johnny Alpha story.

For me, Johnny died in Prog 686.
And Tharg's integrity diminished ever so slightly in Prog 1689.

There are so many things wrong with this post that I fear it will send the Earth spinning into the Sun. I particularly like the personal attacks and the conspiracy theory. Wow.

It's a shame that you're not enjoying the new Stront stuff but lots of people are. Much of the "established continuity" you refer to would need to improve vastly before it could be described as "tepid and mediocre". I'm enjoying the latest Strontium Dog story and I really hope that bizarre fan postings like this one do not discourage its creators from doing more.

[Link Prime]

Ah come on Trout, there's no personal attacks in that post- I love Wagner & Ezquerra's stuff about 99.9% of the time, with a slim margin of error.

I'll re-summarise my position- I personally liked 'The Final Solution' & Stontium Dogs more than any of the three 'Life & Death of Johnny Alpha' books.

Time will tell if there is more to the 'resurrection' story than is currently apparent, but from what I've read so far, I can't see that happening.
Everyones entitled to an opinion, and if other readers are enjoying this storyline, then Grud bless 'em.

[Mabs]

Normally i wait until i pick my copy up and then get an eyeful of the cover, but reading this thread i just couldn't resist and took a sneak peek of it in one of the online reviews. And boy - that shit looks good! 

[I, Cosh]

Liked the Dredd and cover art personally. The monster and mindscape were the highlight but the weird mouth reminded me of Siku. It would be great to see him back for that "best of Slaine artists" run someone mentioned recently.

Ampney C probably my favourite strip at the moment and, given that there's a new Stickleback story starting immediately after this finishes, I wonder if there's going to be some explicit crossing over. However, I always have these notions about Edginton's various stories and it's never happened yet.

[Trout]

Everyones entitled to an opinion, and if other readers are enjoying this storyline, then Grud bless 'em.

Fair enough.

[vzzbux]

I have a little inkling that Red Seas will merge or branch into the new Stickleback as well as Crucis.





V

[Goosegash]

it'd be a bit odd if Wagner just killed him off again.

Quite frankly, it'd be disgraceful.
This storyline has shat all over a lot of other work (by Grant, Ennis, Hogan and Abnett- all well written stories IMO) and the established continuity since 1990.
I wouldn't mind so much if this new series was mind-boggling good, but I can honestly say its not. Its tepid and mediocre at best. And I'd feel the same way if it was 1986.

I'm not having a go at Wagner (or Ezquerra), both of whom have provided some of the finest reading experiences in my life (and continue to Thrill, particularly with Dredd) but I genuinely get the impression that this series was commissioned to allow its creators have their final say with its main character- not due to the undeniable desire to tell one last great Johnny Alpha story.

For me, Johnny died in Prog 686.
And Tharg's integrity diminished ever so slightly in Prog 1689.

There are so many things wrong with this post that I fear it will send the Earth spinning into the Sun. I particularly like the personal attacks and the conspiracy theory. Wow.

It's a shame that you're not enjoying the new Stront stuff but lots of people are. Much of the "established continuity" you refer to would need to improve vastly before it could be described as "tepid and mediocre". I'm enjoying the latest Strontium Dog story and I really hope that bizarre fan postings like this one do not discourage its creators from doing more.

I have to agree with Link Prime on this one, and I don't think it's a particularly bizarre opinion to say you're not enjoying where this series is heading. For me, almost all the post-death Alpha stories have had a feeling of "Yeah, but...so what?" about them, and this one doesn't really seem any different. It's the same feeling I get with all the Slaine stories after the Books Of Invasions, I don't feel as if there's any need for these stories to be told, as the character's journey was already over and done.

Even if you don't like how it eventually went down, Johnny's death was a genuinely iconic moment in the history of 2000AD, and I honestly think it's a shame that Wagner, a writer who I hugely respect, felt the need to undo it just to prove a point.

[Trout]

I honestly think it's a shame that Wagner, a writer who I hugely respect, felt the need to undo it just to prove a point.

What are you basing this on?

[Hawkmumbler]

I have a little inkling that Red Seas will merge or branch into the new Stickleback as well as Crucis.





V

IF this is the case, with this and Trifecta then it appeares 2000AD is capitalising on it's increasing sale's in the US for crossover events. Speculations caps on, either way i'm just happy to keep reading Crucis. I adore this series.

[Leigh S]

When we had Stront flashbacks, all we got were "these stories have no dramatic weight" criticisms, on the (to me weird) belief that knowing the character can't die removes any tension from the narrative.   

I'm not too sure about Life and Death - I suspect the loooong time tis taken to et ot this stage hasnt worked in its favour - if this had been blasted out over 7 months, we'd have not had as much time for nagging doubts about where it all is headed to have taken root. 

In some ways, you could argue its the worst of both worlds - it simultaneously confirms The Final Solution as (mostly) canon, while kicking the few 'nads it had off it.   It brings back a character called Johnny Alpha, but as we are constantly reminded, he is a man who now can count as part of his continuity a 10 year stretch underground (and a ghosty in his head too!).   Now Stront has a higher fantasy element than most 2000AD strips, but to have that conceit at the heart of who he is now is either a very bold move, or one that hasnt been thought through.  I have faith that this Wagner knows where this will leave the character, and maybe this will not only be a brilliant addition, but also a cunning comment on the strip's treatment.... but its all taking so long, that even I'm starting to wobble - a new Mutant war, with no surrender is a very very strong position to place Alpha on one hand.  On the other it's a retread and a dead end - what will Alpha be after having yet another game changing barney with the norms?   

Which is a long winded say of saying, I am enjoying new Stront and despite my misgivings trying to keep the faith; but I found the flashbacks more interesting in fleshing out the Alpha we knew - the Alpha we have here is a different proposition and a difficult one to see where he will end up long term... if anywhere other than back 6 feet under.   It would be a bit like if after Murd resurected Dredd in the Judge Child he had remained a zombie with a tiny Sagbelly sitting on his shoulder -  a bold move, but makes the character and world a bit different to what went before....

[radiator]

When we had Stront flashbacks, all we got were "these stories have no dramatic weight" criticisms, on the (to me weird) belief that knowing the character can't die removes any tension from the narrative.

Well, no. You're deliberately misunderstanding. We pretty much know that in the vast majority of serialised stories the lead character isn't going to die, the thing with flashback stories is that we know the eventual fates of pretty much all the characters and how everything will turn out in the end, and this is why there's no dramatic tension. Flashbacks are fine for a while, but long term they're totally limited in the sort of stories they can be used to tell. At it's height, Stront always felt like one long ongoing story, there were real stakes, epic stories that shook things up. Most of the flashbacks felt a bit like treading water, excercises in nostalgia that were catering only to the most hardcore fans who want everything to be just like they remember from when they were kids - which is to me hardly exciting.

[DW2012]

At the moment I think Savage and Ampney Crucis are the highlights.  I've kind of stopped caring about the red seas (although have to admire the longevity of the story).

[Pete Wells]

Yeah, I loved the Dredd but thought exactly the same as Lee, why not just [spoiler]shoot the perp?[/spoiler] Was Dredd giving him enough time to reconsider? That would explain the last line which otherwise seemed a bit random. The art was cool though, particularly the frigging huuuuuge monster!

As for the rest, I'm loving Savage. Goddard is amazing and Pat has done a great job of ramping up the tension. I'm really rather worried for Old Bill...

Ampney has been really cool, but then, so have all of his earlier adventures.

Red Seas upped its game a bit this week and was all the better for it. I'm guessing that the end of this is going to tie in with Stickleback and Ampney. I've said for a while I think [spoiler]Stickleback is Jack Dancer...[/spoiler]

Stront - After a slow start this has become excruciatingly tense, how could I ever have doubted my beloved Wagner? Again, this has a sense of finality about it, could this see the end of Johnny once and for all?