“Truth? You can't handle the truth!”

[JayzusB.Christ]

To be fair he did invent racism, apparently, after Mr T something something something, I don't remember

[Professor Bear]

And yet ironically he also invented black.

[The Legendary Shark]

Just been looking into his supposed "anti-gay" stance. It seems to stem from a summer 2012 article he wrote about the Boy Scouts of America movement being forced to change its policies due to political pressure. The article labours under the unfortunate title Is Obama Creating a Pro-Gay Boy Scouts of America? but doesn't seem anti-gay. What he seems to be saying is that private organisations have the right to implement any rules they want to without government or big business interference.

Maybe it is an old-fashioned view that some people feel uncomfortable having gay men in charge of groups of male children but I don't think that's rabidly anti-gay any more than not wanting a heterosexual man in charge of a group of female children is rabidly anti-straight. The commenters on the article take it as such, though, and the msm seems to have picked up on the whole "this-guy-said-something-a-bit-off-colour-so-let's-get-him" attitude and ran with it.

On his blog a couple of days later he wrote, ""Let me clarify what I meant by my article. I was not criticizing the gay community. What I tried to convey in my article is that no private organization operating within the bounds of the law should be forced to change its principles and traditions based on outside pressure.

"The Boy Scouts of America is over 100 years old. It has a set of traditions its members live by. They should be able to continue to live by traditions that have worked and served the organization well for a century."

Oh, and the original article appeared on a website called "Ammoland," which really doesn't bode well for anyone looking for well-reasoned and compassionate discourse.

[IndigoPrime]

What he seems to be saying is that private organisations have the right to implement any rules they want to without government or big business interference.

"You can't come into this restaurant, because we don't allow black people in here."

Maybe it is an old-fashioned view that some people feel uncomfortable having gay men in charge of groups of male children but I don't think that's rabidly anti-gay any more than not wanting a heterosexual man in charge of a group of female children is rabidly anti-straight.

I don't even know where to begin unpicking that, but I'd suggest a default stance that doesn't assume every adult caring for children intends to assault them, that gay men don't tend to assault young boys in their care, and nor to adult men tend to assault girls they're looking after.

I just... fucking hell. SETS FIRE TO FORUM

"The Boy Scouts of America is over 100 years old. It has a set of traditions its members live by. They should be able to continue to live by traditions that have worked and served the organization well for a century."

What if one of their traditions was no Jews? No gays is no better. It's that kind of thinking that results in the shitstorm happening in the US regarding laws specifically designed to demonise people who aren't white and straight.

[TordelBack]

Maybe it is an old-fashioned view that some people feel uncomfortable having gay men in charge of groups of male children but I don't think that's rabidly anti-gay any more than not wanting a heterosexual man in charge of a group of female children is rabidly anti-straight.

I think you're misusing the terms 'gay' and 'heterosexual' there, Sharky.  The one you're looking for is 'paedophile'.

I do agree however that Norris is just the visible tip of a religious iceberg, and within that setting is probably no worse than his peers.  He's also done a lot of good in many fields, by all accounts, so he's probably not a monster.  This doesn't mean his views shouldn't be challenged at every opportunity.   

[M.I.K.]

Reminds me of that old episode of South Park in which Big Gay Al is made to leave his position as scoutmaster, only to be replaced by a more traditionally masculine individual, who then turns out to be a paedophile.

[The Legendary Shark]

"You can't come into this restaurant, because we don't allow black people in here."

"You can't come into this toilet, it's for women only."

"You can't come into this club, it's for members only."

In a truly free world, private clubs can make any rules they want - so long as they don't harm other people. As something of a libertarian I do agree with this. If somebody wants to set up a "whites-only" restaurant, they can do so. They can set up a blacks-only, men-only, Jews-only, Christian-only, gay-only, Irish-only or whatever-only establishment they desire. Would I go to such a place? No. Would you? Probably not. It's distasteful, yes, of course it is - but that's the thing about freedom. Sometimes it's ugly.

I don't even know where to begin unpicking that, but I'd suggest a default stance that doesn't assume every adult caring for children intends to assault them, that gay men don't tend to assault young boys in their care, and nor to adult men tend to assault girls they're looking after.

I just... fucking hell. SETS FIRE TO FORUM

"The Boy Scouts of America is over 100 years old. It has a set of traditions its members live by. They should be able to continue to live by traditions that have worked and served the organization well for a century."

What if one of their traditions was no Jews? No gays is no better. It's that kind of thinking that results in the shitstorm happening in the US regarding laws specifically designed to demonise people who aren't white and straight.

As I said, it's an old-fashioned view. It's not a view I agree with and I'm certain there are a great many childrens' group leaders who are gay and act responsibly in every way. Just because someone's gay, that doesn't make them a predator. We have to remember, though, that this is a fairly modern attitude and that a great many people have still to assume it, especially in the U.S.

Jumping up and down, frothing at the mouth and setting fire to things is not the way forward. If I am expected to try and understand the position and attitude of gay people then isn't it incumbent upon me to try and understand the position and attitude of those less-enlightened people as well? How can attitudes be changed if they are not understood?

[The Legendary Shark]

I think you're misusing the terms 'gay' and 'heterosexual' there, Sharky.  The one you're looking for is 'paedophile'.

I did not want to conflate the two terms as if they are interchangeable. I was describing the old-fashioned attitude which does just that.

[Professor Bear]

There's definitely a problem in American conservatism with telling the difference between "gay" and "pedophile", but I don't think that's where Chuck's coming from.  If you look at his wider political activism, it paints a picture of someone who just doesn't want the concept of any sexual identity or activity presented within an educational setting, and a lot of parents feel the same way without being motivated by homphobia - they just think that sex ed is for them to teach their kids.

[The Legendary Shark]

I agree with that, Bear.

[The Legendary Shark]

So anyway, chemtrails and weather modification. Any takers?

[M.I.K.]

If anyone's intentionally trying to alter the weather up here, they're not doing a very good job of it, (unless they're going for the confusingly random mess we've always had anyway).

[ZenArcade]

In terms of aeroplane contrails, I seem to remember that when basically all flights in and out of the the North American Continent after 11/09/2001 the atmospheric temperatures dropped by 2-3 degrees centigrade as compared with the norm. Z

[The Legendary Shark]

If anyone's intentionally trying to alter the weather up here, they're not doing a very good job of it, (unless they're going for the confusingly random mess we've always had anyway).

One of the things Rosalind Peterson claims in her address to the UN link I posted is that one company is spraying iron dust into the air in order to increase algal blooms, thereby ramping up oxygen production. The business model for this madness is claimed to be that the company can then charge companies to offset their CO2 production - never mind the costly business of redesigning and refitting all your factories to be clean, just pay us and we'll make sure to produce enough oxygen to offset your pollution.

[Definitely Not Mister Pops]