The Political Thread

[JayzusB.Christ]

if you're the type who will only vote if the guy who divorced Katy Perry via text message says you should, you were never going to vote.

Fair point.

[Dandontdare]

Brand attended a Narcotics Anonymous meeting that my friend goes to in Manchester - he didn't tell me what was said (they call it anonymous for a reason) but said he was very humble and genuine, really likeable - and this guy's a cynical manc with zero-tolerance for twats and phoneys. Shame his public persona is so fucking aggravating

[Rately]

The guy, face down on an airport floor, screaming that the cops were treating him "like a black man" sums his ilk up.

Disgusting people.

[JayzusB.Christ]

Brand attended a Narcotics Anonymous meeting that my friend goes to in Manchester - he didn't tell me what was said (they call it anonymous for a reason) but said he was very humble and genuine, really likeable - and this guy's a cynical manc with zero-tolerance for twats and phoneys. Shame his public persona is so fucking aggravating

He visited the prison in Leicester where my brother works.  My brother didn't meet him but the inmates seemed to get on with him. I saw him live once, before all the political stuff - he was a very good performer.  In true Irish style, the audio equipment failed for a few minutes, but he handled it very deftly - mainly by talking very loudly.

[Hawkmumbler]

Domestic neo-nazi terrorists getting deplatformed, accidently doxxed and slapped on a no-flight restriction is 'chefs kiss' so good.

[sheridan]

Parler - haven for those who believe in 'free speech' (generally far-right conspiracy theories, racism, death threats) has been pulled down - but before it went a bunch of hacktivists (and almost certainly also the FBI, CIA and other usual suspects) have managed to pull 99% of content from the site such as photos and videos with full date, time and location - down to degrees, minutes and seconds.  It's believed this is how the no-fly orders got put in to place so quickly at US airports...

details here.

[Funt Solo]

Also, am I being tin-foil-hattish to think that a BLM crowd would be crushed by the police a lot more violently than a crowd of gun-toting white supremacists were?

And I keep coming back to this question as new information comes out. Today, the BBC's live coverage has a piece about the (now former) Capitol Police Chief Steven Sund - he said that security officials hindered efforts to call in the National Guard, and that his request to have them on standby was denied by two superiors.

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Looks like the inauguration will either be deserted (as requested by DC Mayor Muriel Bowser) or one site of a country-wide armed insurrection (as feared by the FBI) - the much touted Boogaloo beloved of a certain stripe of gun fetishist (and other fascists).

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The black cop who led the white rioters up the stairs (the aptly named Eugene Goodman) is being cited as a hero for leading them away from the open Senate chamber, by repeatedly making himself the target.

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And I know we're all different sizes, but this Lilliput photo is just funny:

[JayzusB.Christ]

Looks like the inauguration will either be deserted (as requested by DC Mayor Muriel Bowser) or one site of a country-wide armed insurrection (as feared by the FBI) - the much touted Boogaloo beloved of a certain stripe of gun fetishist (and other fascists).

Well that is really, really scary.  I remember four years ago, feeling lots of anxiety about the future of the world - my fears were allayed somewhat by reading a bit more about it.  Congress was still there.  Moderate Republicans still existed.  He didn't have complete authority, and we might just get through it.  Four years later, we've got armed fucking fascist uprisings in America, full of racists who treat his word as divine.

[Funt Solo]

I would say, yes, it is really scary - because it's a rise in fascism, and these disparate groups are all working under the MAGA banner, have their own version of reality and are not opposed to the violent overthrow of - well, anyone that Trump labels as an enemy.

On the other hand, there is plenty to be hopeful about - the majority of the politicians here decry the fascism and it seems like the military are on the side of democracy. Once Biden is in place, he can enact policies which make life easier for working class Americans, which in turn will turn down the dial on the febrile atmosphere.

As soon as Trump is out of the White House, he no longer has federal agents (aka secret police) to do his bidding. I suppose then the wider issue is why there are so many federal agents available to any president - or to broaden it out further: why any president is given so many powers that (it is now apparent) are so easily abused.

I've been reading and watching a lot of musings on this particular rise in fascism, and one of the key points that was made is that fascism arises out of a liberal democracy. It's the very liberalism that we desire that leads to a lax approach to dissent and allows for a rise like this one: in which a demagogue becomes a King or Emperor for his adherents.

Hopefully, this will be a near miss - the high water mark that warns us not to be complacent.

[The Legendary Shark]

Plato thought that democracy inevitably leads to tyranny. Then again, he also thought aristocracy was the ideal.

[JayzusB.Christ]

Hopefully, this will be a near miss - the high water mark that warns us not to be complacent.

Fingers crossed.  A lot of what I'd thought were laws were simply traditions; ones that depended on normal people taking a bit of responsibility and with the assumption that some psychotic Caesar-with-a-dash-of-Caligula wouldn't start riding roughshod over everything and enjoying the mayhem in his wake.  I used to wonder how ancient Rome could go from a democracy to a dictatorship with the people's blessing, but it's a whole lot clearer to me now.

[sheridan]

On the bright side, the tendrils of US power and influence (which, let's face it, where usually abused) across the world have weakened considerably over the past four years.  In similar ways to the power and influence of the UK has, though for different reasons.

[Definitely Not Mister Pops]

On the bright side, the tendrils of US power and influence (which, let's face it, where usually abused) across the world have weakened considerably over the past four years.  In similar ways to the power and influence of the UK has, though for different reasons.

The UK's power and influence? The illusion of such resulted in the mess in which we find ourselves and the reasons are broadly similar, though not as extreme, as how the States got into a state. Succumbing to right-wing populism and weakening ties with hard won, but well established allies.

[Rately]

Domestic neo-nazi terrorists getting deplatformed, accidently doxxed and slapped on a no-flight restriction is 'chefs kiss' so good.

It is bloody brilliant.

Those who lob about snowflake as an insult are turning out to be the biggest snowflakes of all, especailly with calls for unity. Seriously? After the last four years of this horrible Presidency. The Democrats need to push for punishment of all those involved, including any member of the Republican party who questioned Bidens win.

Actions have consequences as a lot of them are about to find out, and that applies to the Politicians as well as the MAGA mob. The party of personal responsibility might be about to be put under serious criminal investigation for the actions of some of their most senior members, and with the FBI now tracking down people, phones, computers we are most likely going to be even more shocked when the whole truth of this awful affair comes out.

[IndigoPrime]

Lots of danger now. People arguing that democratic norms held firm in the US. They did not. The entire thing was on a knife-edge. A more organised coup attempt may well have succeeded. Trump isn't looking forward to a second term under martial law primarily because he wasn't organised. Things could have been a lot worse, and so Democrats and Republicans alike need to recognise that and ensure those responsible for this mess face consequences.

As for democracy as a whole, the US and UK has discovered that their systems are primarily reliant on good actors. For all the issues of a Thatcher or a Bush, they worked within existing systems and norms. Now, we face people installed through terrible voting systems who are out to destroy such systems and make it harder to take on the executive. That should be a grave worry for anyone who isn't a Republican or a Conservative. But, natch, Labour's now decided yet again that what it really needs to do to win is secure the vote of nationalists, broadly ignore everyone else (because they'll obviously vote Labour!) and still exist under the lunacy that Labour has any chance of a majority (rather than aiming for a future where it leads a progressive coalition).