Spoilers - Harry Potter and the Order of the Pheonix

[Pete Wells]

Went to see this last night and thoroughly enjoyed it.

I've not read the books so the films are always a nice treat for me, especially as I don't have to get bogged down worrying about all the bits from the book that have to be omitted. as big fans of the books, it drives Mrs Pete and Mini Pete crazy (who will be referred to as Michelle and Jordan from now on 'cos I always feel wierd caling them Mrs and Mini!)

Back on topic, the film was really cool. Very dark and scary in places with, as you would expect, superb special effects and good performances from just about everyone. I particularly enjoyed Helena Bonham Carter who was wonderfully deranged and hammy. I would have liked to see more of her. I also really appreciate the Britishness of the films - Back off Hollywood!

My only minor problem - note the SPOILER word in the title - was the death of Sirius. I'm pretty certain this is a big thing in the Harry Potter world and would have expected more to have been made about their relationship throughout the film, the actual death itself and the aftermath. When it happened I wasn't particularly bothered.

Still, a cracking film and it really has peaked my interest as to how it all will end.

[TordelBack]

I particularly enjoyed Helena Bonham Carter who was wonderfully deranged and hammy.

Don't worry, she'll be back!

Glad to hear its a good flick, but the mammoth book would certainly have had to be butchered to squeeze it down to a reasonable length.  I'm assuming from the trailers that the Grawp (Hagrid's brother) subplot was excised?  Looking forward to seeing this soon!

I'm not surprised to hear that Sirius' death is played down - it's sort of that way in the book too - you get the feeling that you should care more about their relationship, but they don't really seem to have one, other than Harry's constant longing to talk to Sirius, and Sirius' rather critical comparisons of Harry to his father.

There's more substantial emotional repercussions in the following book, but don't expect to see those in the next film either, as they get overshadowed pretty fast...

[radiator]

Went to see it last night also. I thought they did a great job with what was a hugely overlong and average book. Easily the joint best with number 3.
Grawp is still there - but only for a couple of minutes screentime. The bit with him in the book was interminable - and contributed very little to the plot. In the film he's totally unconvincing, really poor cgi work.

The end battle is great, finally we get to see what the wizards are capable of!

Its been a few years since the book so can someone remind me: what is the purpose of the prophesy? Why does Voldemort want it?
And what is the portal thing that Sirius falls into? It wasn't explained at all, and did it actually serve a purpose plot-wise?

[The Monarch]

Spoilers for the book (and I guess the film too)

The contents of the prophecy was unknown to voldemort because his spy (see book 6 or film 6 for that) didn't overhear the whole conversation contained in it.

 either Harry or Voldemort must die at the hand of the other, for neither can live while the other survives. He also reveals that due to the date of birth of the boy in the prophecy, it is possible that Neville Longbottom or Harry Potter could have been "the boy who lived," and therefore the child who was referred to in the prophecy. However, because Voldemort chose to attack Harry, Harry had ended up being marked as the one who would bring down the Dark Lord.. However voldemort never knew all the facts of this which is why he went after it

The death chamber in the book was a room where the department of mystery wizards were studying death in. The portal sirius fell into was the place everyone goes to when they die thus he is dead (though in the book he was hit by a stun spell and not by the killing spell when he fell in)

[VampiraJen]

who's sirius again?  is he the werewolf godfather from the third one?

i'm trying to talk my supervisor into opening the box with the new books early when they come so that we can know how it ends before everyone else.

[Misanthrope]

It was Gary Oldman's character. He turned into a black dog.

[Eric Plumrose]

It starts off well enough (although I doubt any swings like that still exist in Surrey) but it's rather pedestrian thereafter as bugger all happens.

All that manly hugging with Sirius gave me the impession that Harry is his godfather's catamite. And the death scene, as mentioned already, has very little impact probably 'cos it looks like a poor imitation of Gandalf's demise in Fellowship. Likewise, Industrial Shite and Magic has been delving into its archives (namely Return of the Jedi) for Harry's face-off with Lord Voldemort.

Harry's possession at the end is pretty wrenching, though.

[TordelBack]

...it looks like a poor imitation of Gandalf's demise in Fellowship. Likewise, Industrial Shite and Magic has been delving into its archives (namely Return of the Jedi) for Harry's face-off with Lord Voldemort.

SPOILERS FOLLOW...





My thoughts exactly, which is a pity since both scenes in the book have the potential for terrific visuals.  In the book, Dumbledore animates the big golden statues of centaurs, gioblins etc. that they fight beside to block Voldemort's attacks, which could have given the scene a nice (and original) Harryhausen look, rather than a rehash of Revenge of the Sith.  And a live Sirius just toppling through the veil without fanfare would have emphasised the randomness, finality and incomprehensibility of death that the book conveys far better than his on-screen death and his slow-mo Assumption.

I actually though they did a great job squeezing a sprawling book (which is probably my favourite of the series) into a digestible package, and the decision to spend time on a few of the key character scenes (Harry, Ron and Hermione's chat after he snogs Cho; Luna's missing possessions; Sirius' family tree) was very well judged, even at the expense of the 'Weasley is our king!" subplot.  

The Ministry and the Dept. of Mysteries were brilliantly visualised, and the DA meetings had a great "putting on a show" feel.  In general it was a brilliant piece of work right up to Christmas and the attack on Ron's Dad, and then it seemed to drfit a bit.  I did wonder how much sense it would make to anyone who hadn't read the book...

There were some scenes I'd loved to have seen on screen, just because I think they had really strong visuals, but obviously you have to cut your cloth:

- Hagrid and McGonagle fighting the Death Eaters on the lawn at night, while the kids watch from the the Astronomy Tower during their Astronomy OWL Practicals.  Possibly my favourite scene in the book.

- The swamp that the Weasley Twins create in the corrdior.

- The Brain Room!  Fying tentacled brains attack Ron!  Who could resist!

[the shutdown man]

I actually quite liked this film, I'm not usually a Potter fan, but this was the first of the films that didn't feel like it was spending too much time thinking about setting up the next film, rather than its own story, which is the main problem I've had with the first four films.


Spoilers, obviously:

I agree with the whole Sirius death scene though; I had heard he was going to die, so I was more or less expecting it, but then it happens and there's about ten seconds of screen time before Harry acknowledges it, and I was just thinking "Wait, was that it? Is he actually dead?" My mate, who has actually read the books had to explain to me afterwards that it was a combination of an unforgivable spell and that white veil thingy......???


Still though, I liked the Voldemort-Dumbledore battle.

[TordelBack]

 Hagrid and McGonagle fighting the Death Eaters on the lawn at night..

Just noticed this... these were, of course Men from the Ministry, not Death Eaters, or at least, not just Death Eaters.

[opaque]

- The swamp that the Weasley Twins create in the corrdior.

- The Brain Room! Fying tentacled brains attack Ron! Who could resist!

YES! Someone who thinks the same as I do.
It would have taken no more than 10 seconds to show the swamp in the corridor outside the exam room.
The kids should have encountered the brains and actually be fighting not hiding at that rooms battle scene.

Also I was very disapointed that in the final battle between Dumbledore and Vodlemort we didn't have the statues coming to life and we did have all the floo networks spitting out people, we had a small handful, it was supposed to show incontrovertable proof to many people that the dark lord was back.

Things they do keep in but can't be arsed to do a decent job with. I don't know.

[Adrian Bamforth]

"I did wonder how much sense it would make to anyone who hadn't read the book..."

Not much! But then this film is almost the opposite to the last one, spending so long being spooky Grange Hill that by the time anything exciting happens it's just a relief, even if like me you don't know what's going on.

The information is probably all there but I think the longer the story goes on the magic doesn't really have the same effect as when it was all new and you could see the contrast with the real world. Whn you're completely immersed in the magic world it just doesn't seem too much fun any more, especially when Rowling can make magic whatever she wants it to be at any time and make any plot twist she likes (the pets are really people!). The most interesting thing about the film was the whole issue of should you teach kids to learn theories to pass exams, or give them more practical life lessons. I didn't actually know what the prophesy was or why it was in a big room of crystal balls, which all seemed to happen rather quickly. Perhaps I shouldn't have gone to the matinee.

[Robin Low]

It's the first of the films I thought was actually a bit of a mess. I had problems with the first one because even though it remained true the story so much was left out it felt neutered somehow. The fourth one was annoying because it really mucked about with a fairly well-constructed plot, although I thought it would probably work fine for folks with no knowledge of the book. Order of the Phoenix, however, felt simply gutted. What's more, some of it was very badly done. For example, the courtroom scene in the film is vague and wishy-washy, and it's hard to see why Harry would be aquitted. In the book, Dumbledore actually proves Harry's innocence with well-reasoned facts. I was also annoyed by how twitchy and nervous Dumbledore was in the film - he's simply not like that in the book.

Mind you, the films have always been spot on with casting and design from the start - I always imagine the films when I read the books now.

Regards

Robin

[TordelBack]

I was also annoyed by how twitchy and nervous Dumbledore was in the film - he's simply not like that in the book.

Ah, I dunno Robin.  Aside from Gambon being a marvellously twitchy actor at the best of times, Dumbledore does spend almost the entire book driving Harry nuts by relentlessly avoiding looking at him through various contortions, and (as usual) hiding what's going on from him - that might equate visually to a nervous demeanour.  

Actually, the Potter movie thst most annoyed me is the best one - Prisoner of Azkaban.  It's an almost perfect adaptation of the book, until the last five minutes when it leaves out one sentence that would make sense of the whole
plot - all the people that suddenly can turn into animals, the ludicrously useful map, the shape of Harry's patronus, the relationship of all the new characters.  It's just nuts - just give Lupin 10 seconds more screen time and he can completely explain a clever and well-told story - as it is, the whole film seems to be a series of unexplained twists and heaped coincidences.  I'm no writer (duh), but this short insert into Lupins farewell scene seems to cover it:

"It was us that made that map, Harry - Sirius, James, Wormtail and I, we were Padfoot, Prongs, Wormtail and Moony.  They were all animaguses: James could turn into a stag, Sirius a dog, Wormtail a Rat, and me, well, I was a werewolf, a curse rather than a gift - but it was a connection that made us all good friends."