Whats everyone reading?

[House of Usher]

Taken as another set of Old World myths, the Old Testament is great if horrible fun, perfectly full of gore, magic and spectacle for the Boy, although I did find myself skipping some of the vilest bits (even in the Kids' version it gets pretty rough).

A disappointing lack of monsters and human-animal hybrids, though.

[I, Cosh]

Taken as another set of Old World myths, the Old Testament is great if horrible fun, perfectly full of gore, magic and spectacle for the Boy, although I did find myself skipping some of the vilest bits (even in the Kids' version it gets pretty rough).

A disappointing lack of monsters and human-animal hybrids, though.

Leviathan and Behemoth not good enough for you?

[TordelBack]

Taken as another set of Old World myths, the Old Testament is great if horrible fun, perfectly full of gore, magic and spectacle for the Boy, although I did find myself skipping some of the vilest bits (even in the Kids' version it gets pretty rough).

A disappointing lack of monsters and human-animal hybrids, though.

My son's main objection so far has been on a point of continuity.  One of the earlier of the Plagues on Egypt is the death of all the livestock, which our version makes very clear amounts to every single animal.  A few plagues later (which seems like at most a few days, because God is plainly in a hurry here), and Yahweh is telling the Israelities to kill a lamb and do the lintel-daubing tango, and shortly thereafter every first-born creature, explicitly including cattle and sheep, is keeling over dead.  Where, my boy wanted to know, did they get the new animals.  I tried to rationalise this by saying that the Israelite's herds were spared originally (and their presence during the exodus suggests this), but why did the Egyptians allow their slaves to hang on to animals when all theirs were dead?

Again, I don't intend to be offensive to those who believe in the Abramic God, obviously there's a huge body of interpretation that accounts for all this within any given system of actual belief:  I'm just taking these as myths as presented in two specific kids' books.

As to Floyd's questions, well I was being a little cruel at Enid Blyton's expense.  As I believe is related earlier in the thread some of last year was given over to the Famous Five, which I devoured as a kid, and which my son also seemed to enjoy.  The first book is almost a perfect kids' novel, quite brilliant.  Subsequent volumes less so. The immorality I refer to is really in the way the children treat adults of a 'lower station': Julian in particular, who is all of 12, plays the Young Master like a complete shit, haughtily demanding service and issuing threats to anyone found within earshot of a kitchen.  Even the pets of the poor are fair game: Timmy mercilessly terrorises any mangy mongrel he comes across to the amusement of all.  Admittedly those who experience the worst treatment from their Youngers and Betters are Up To No Good, and the more obedient peasant class get away with a gentle patronising and an acknowledgement of their impaired intelligence, but it can still get pretty uncomfortable for the modern parent who's trying to instill respectful behaviour in their brood.

Granted it's not quite up there with deciding to kill everyone for the heinous crime of worshipping a golden calf, just one book after You've faithfully promised not to do exactly that ever again, and then being argued down by Moses to an even 3000 random executions 'cos Thou art so very merciful.

As to the contrastingly non-anthropomorphic nature of the God of the Pentateuch and subsequent books, I'm not so sure.  Obviously he hasn't got other gods to contest and/or rut with, being the One God and all that, even if he certainly seems deeply bothered by the possibility.  He shows up far more often than I remembered, and the two versions we've been reading differ on quite how many of his Away Missions are accomplished by His angels, and how many He does in person. There's certainly an awful lot of folk averting their eyes for fear of beholding Him for a god that supposedly stays upstairs all ineffable and suchlike. 

I hadn't remembered, for example, that there's a fourth figure in the furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego in Daniel that Nebuchadnezzar cannot bear to look upon.  An angel?   Or Yaweh in physical form?  I believe the orthodox interpretation is that it's Michael, but read as a myth, it looks an awful lot like the type of switcheroo that Loki, Hera and Zeus regularly get up to.  The DK version suggests at one point that the Pillar-of-flame-by-night/pillar-of-smoke-by-day is actually Jehovah, burning-bush stylee, which was news to me. 

I'm going from the Children's versions here, those being the myth versions we're using - I haven't the will or the heart to open the KJV or the New English that I see out of the corner of my eye, shelved there beside the Koran and the Book of Mormon.  For an atheist I seem to have a lot of bibles.

Of course in the sequel He really does go all Zeus and does some old-school mortal-impregnating, but at least Ennis got him off the hook on that one.  But we're trying to do this in order.

[House of Usher]

Leviathan and Behemoth not good enough for you?

No, not really. What does either of them actually do? Are they involved in any spectacular battles? Both of them have the special power of being gigantic, and Leviathan can breathe fire, but each seems merely to be pointed at and observed rather than playing an active part in any story.

Even the sea snakes which eat Laocoon's children in the Iliad play a more developed role in proceedings than that.

[Satanist]

Just finished Snuff by Chuck Palahniuk. Porn actress whos passed it decides to end her career by fucking 600 men in one day. Its told from the point of view of Mr 72, 137 & 600. Ones a failed TV star, ones an aged porn star and the other might just be the kid she gave up for adoption.

Funny & short but not his best. Cant really recommend it truth be told.

[Trout]

The Devotion of Suspect X, I mentioned it previously on this thread, turned into a little gem.  More a police procedural than a gripping thriller, as we knew exactly who the killer was at the start.  The genius of the book lay in its ability to pull the carpet out from under the feet of the reader with twists and turns, especially towards the end.  Well worth the read and it is pretty short.  Is all Japanese fiction like this?       

I just started this the other day. I'm not sure if it's my sort of thing, but I'll stick with it. Thanks for mentioning it!

Its exceptionally slow at the start and Im not sure if the author does characters as such.  Compared with the tome like Game of Thrones where characters get a real chance to breath and grow, this is a claustrophobic tightly plotted book, but its really worth sticking with to the end.  The last couple of paragraphs are very clever and rather suprising.   

In retrospect it might actually be better as a film or TV show.  With Characters more recognisable and stand out...
(I think there is a film)

Exceptionally slow? Oh yes. I was 80% of the way through it (Kindle gives the percentage) before it sped up. It took me weeks to read the first 80%, and less than two hours to read the rest.

What a cracking ending, though.

- Trout

[Mikey]

The Children's Illustrated Bible

The Children's Bible we had was a replica of a Gutenburg and featured an illustration by Aubrey Beardsley - his Salome one. Good!

I'm reading REAMDE by Neal Stephenson, only 300 pages in so in common with some of his other works, it's only really starting. It's got ex Spetznaz security men, Russian gangsters, Hackers, ranch men, guns,Chinese teenagers, Islamists, Special Forces, discussions on language structure, coding and a MMORPG...well, it is a Neal Stephenson novel. Reviews I read were lukewarm, but it's cracking along at a good pace and it's made me smile on occasion. The characters are a bit off his shelf, it's true, but he's weaving a good, convincing and fun yarn. I don't expect a head spin but so far I'd recommend it.


M.

[The Prodigal]

The Children's Illustrated Bible - actually two of them, the Hamlyn version from the late 70's, and the Noughties DK version.  The wife and I are atheists of long sad conviction, but I've been feeling guilty about the huge lacuna in my kids' education that is the whole sweep of Judaeo-Christian myth. 

We've read several versions of the Greek myths, Roman myths, two versions of the 1,001 Nights, D'Aulaire's fabulous version of the Norse myths (highly recommended), British legends, Irish myths, and many of them multiple times. We've visited important 'real world' locations featured in many of those myths and proto-hostories, and acted out key scenes.  What we haven't ever read are Bible stories.  Closest we got was Narnia.

So I initially borrowed the Hamlyn volume from a religious friend, and having worked through as far as Numbers, and jumped forward to Daniel & Co, I figured it was proving enjoyable enough to get our own more modern copy.  Taken as another set of Old World myths, the Old Testament is great if horrible fun, perfectly full of gore, magic and spectacle for the Boy, although I did find myself skipping some of the vilest bits (even in the Kids' version it gets pretty rough).  He's liking it fine, with Exodus and the Plagues on Egypt a particular favourite.  The Hamlyn illos are better paintings, but there are far more in the DK one.  We haven't made it to the New Testament yet, which looks decidely boring compared to the genocides and burning cities of the earlier stuff. 

What really strikes me, who as a formerly highly religious spode who actually took extra Bible classes as a teenager, is the contrast between the adventures of Jehovah/Yahweh and those of the gods and powers of other myth cycles.   I mean no disrespect to those who hold these stories as divine Truth, but I'm approaching them as myths, and in the context of myth Jehovah comes across as a colossal prick.  Where the Bible differs is that his rampant dickery goes completely unpunished - in any other body of myth, a god who carries on like God does would get their arse handed to them.  Having watched (for example) the Norse gods uttelry destroyed because they couldn't keep their promises or uphold the rules of hospitality, or the Titans brought down because of the way they treated their kids, it's very odd to see Jehovah throwing hissy fits and scattering his toys about the Holy Land, and reaping nothing more than obedience from his abused worshippers.  I'd go so far as to say He sets a very bad example. 

Anyway, these are good stories, beautifully illustrated.  Shame about the morality, but at least it's better than we encountered in the later Famous Five books.

.   

Great post and an interesting take. I am a God-botherer though often a "pilgrim septic with doubt" and at odds with the sub culture that often goes with it If you want an interesting interpretation of that Old Testament material including the "problem stuff" often ignored by the sweet smiling have a look at authors like Gregory Boyd or Philip Yancey. They are refreshingly honest and not into some propoganda angle.

[TordelBack]

... have a look at authors like Gregory Boyd or Philip Yancey.

Might do that - Yancey's hair alone is fascinating!  Actually I'm also currently reading Saving Darwin by Karl Giberson, which is an interesting and well-written, if so far unsuccessful, attempt to reconcile evolution through natural selection with Christianity (well, the CoE at least). 

Incidentally, my son (almost 6) today announced he believed in 'the Christian god' (having abandoned his previous faith in Zeus).  When asked what prompted this conversion, he cited the Plagues on Egypt [Old Testament stick] and the Resurrection [New Testament carrot].  That's probably useful marketing information for some evangelist somewhere.

Had an interesting discussion about Isaac versus Ishmael too, which suggests the Koran (which I own but have only ever read third-party outlines of) should be next. Anyone tried it?  Are there any good simplified versions?

[the 'artist' formerly known as Slips]

The Devotion of Suspect X, I mentioned it previously on this thread, turned into a little gem.  More a police procedural than a gripping thriller, as we knew exactly who the killer was at the start.  The genius of the book lay in its ability to pull the carpet out from under the feet of the reader with twists and turns, especially towards the end.  Well worth the read and it is pretty short.  Is all Japanese fiction like this?       

I just started this the other day. I'm not sure if it's my sort of thing, but I'll stick with it. Thanks for mentioning it!

Its exceptionally slow at the start and Im not sure if the author does characters as such.  Compared with the tome like Game of Thrones where characters get a real chance to breath and grow, this is a claustrophobic tightly plotted book, but its really worth sticking with to the end.  The last couple of paragraphs are very clever and rather suprising.   

In retrospect it might actually be better as a film or TV show.  With Characters more recognisable and stand out...
(I think there is a film)

Exceptionally slow? Oh yes. I was 80% of the way through it (Kindle gives the percentage) before it sped up. It took me weeks to read the first 80%, and less than two hours to read the rest.

What a cracking ending, though.

- Trout

I think that the ending more than makes up for the plodding procedural it is.  I probably read it quicker than you.  Its chapters fitted rather well on a train journey, so I go through it a lot quicker. 

Ive just finished She's Never Coming Back by Hans Koppel, another Nordic Thriller which reads like an exploitation film.  Theres some clever stuff in it, like the disection of the mind of the kidnapper and the Kidnapped but a lot of gratious sex as well.  Trying for the thirds time to read Priestess of the White but its not very good and slow.  Actually its shit   

I may need to continue my great Dune reread next week! 

[Wils]

This cat's currently reading...



Shaft Among the Jews next!

[Mikey]

Do you dig it?

M.

[klute]

I've nearly reached the end of Homer's Odyssey it's a fine read though in some place's long winded.

Maybe it's just me but i wish the main character Odysseus would stop pussy footing about [spoiler]and kill the "suitors" what a bunch of cunts[/spoiler]

next i have a choice of either the Illiad, Dante's Divine Comedy or Plato the last days of Socrates.......

Not sure which one to start with though really i should have read the Illiad before the Odyssey and suggestions on which to start with of the above three???

[TordelBack]

Not sure which one to start with though really i should have read the Illiad before the Odyssey and suggestions on which to start with of the above three???

Iliad!  Iliad!  S'quite brilliant, if lacking the completeness of the Odyssey.  I love the Fagles translation, having struggled unhappily through the Chapman as a callow youth. 

Speaking of classics, I've just started in on 20th Century Boys by Naoki Urasawa.  Only have the first volume at present, but it is amazingly compelling stuff and I suspect will be pestering the library until they've got the lot  This is (confession) the first Manga I've ever really enjoyed.  It's also the first time I've read a right-to-left translation, and after a few pages it works fine.

[Roger Godpleton]

The Wasp Factory, which is good, but I probably would have gotten a lot more out of it as a teenager.