Is Johnny Alpha dead?

[Mark Taylor]

No doubt in my mind that Johnny died in the final solution, but I wouldn't mind too much if Wagner brought him back, because I'm pretty confident he'd do it right.

Character ressurection CAN work, if the writer gets it right. IMO it only tends to really work as a storytelling device if there are serious and permanent consequences for the character and the resultant stories which follow the ressurection. A ressurection which brings everything back to normal, business as usual as if the character never died will always come accross as a cop-out. A death-and-ressurection event which, on the other hand, is a genuine turning point for the character and alters them irrevocably in some manner can make for a great story.

I can't think of a good example from 2000AD but one that springs to mind is from the Lord of the Rings, where Gandalf's death and rebirth sees him return as Gandalf the White. Following his return he is more powerful but also carries a heavier burden of responsibility - so the lighter, more playful side of his character never really returns, even following the defeat of Sauron. In the final balance, he really seems to have lost more than he gained.

The apparent death and return of Aragorn which Peter Jackson inserted into the movie version is far less convincing. Although to an extent it appears to play into some of the decisions he makes later on it has no real permanent consequences for him. I've heard endless justifications as to why it was justified or even 'necessary' from a storytelling point of view, but I'm not convinced by any of them. The needs of the story could have been handled better in a different way. It still feels like a cheap and unnecessary plot device to me and stands out probably the one major flaw in what is otherwise a brilliant interpretation of one of the classic stories of all time.

[JOE SOAP]

Wagner doesn't even think of Strontium Dog and Dredd as the same continuity:

Continuity: no, don't see Dredd and Stront as the same.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/John-Wagner/22334044612?ref=search&sid=1093241813.3829091810..1

[Mark Taylor]

...I can't think of a good example from 2000AD...

Come to think of it, Dredd's near-death and subsequent return in "The Dead Man" leaves his viewpoint fundamentally and permanently altered, so that probably is a pretty decent example. (Duh!) It also demonstrates that Wagner knows how to handle this kind of thing.

[Mardroid]

Wagner doesn't even think of Strontium Dog and Dredd as the same continuity:

Continuity: no, don't see Dredd and Stront as the same.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/John-Wagner/22334044612?ref=search&sid=1093241813.3829091810..1

Hmm. I wonder about cross-over stories then. The version of Dredd or Alpha who appears in each others strip being a parallel universe counterpart to the version in the main strip? Or they used to be the same but no longer... I.e. Alpha's future was at one point a possible future of Dredd's world but subsequent events sent it on a different route. But, in a multiverse of possibilities... Alpha still exists out there...

Don't mind me, I find parallel universe stuff fascinating.

[Roger Godpleton]

I think the Ennis interpretation of Dredd vs Alpha sums up the difference between Ennis and Wagner. With Wagner it's a fair fight, Dredd is tougher but Alpha is craftier but with Ennis Dredd beats Alpha with one punch because Judge Dredd is so awesome and cool and he doesn't take any bullshit and I love to live vicariously through him because I fantasize about shooting people with guns and beating them with one punch.

[Jase]

Whatever happened to Wulf?!

[Mike Gloady]

I remembered a bit in Thrill Power Overload last time I read this thread (get  copy now if you havent, the paperback is stil avaiable) and went looking for it last night.

Wagner, essentially says that if something someone else has written is useful and doesn't hurt the character he'll run with it, but if it ISN'T then as far as he's concerned it didn't happen.  Now Alan Grant wrote The Final Solution and Wagner's on record as saying he thought it was a mistake.

Hmmmmmmm. 

[radiator]

Wulf was shot dead in The Ragnorak Job.

[HOO-HAA]

Wagner, essentially says that if something someone else has written is useful and doesn't hurt the character he'll run with it, but if it ISN'T then as far as he's concerned it didn't happen.

I think that's not going to satisfy the fans/ readers, though.

As a reader, I'm not too bothered by who has written a certain story - if it's in the mag, it's canonical (to use a fanboy word). To have that event ignored, therefore, for whatever reason (justifiable or otherwise) is going to leave me bemused.

It's a bit like the recent 'V' thing with the original mini-series writer, Kenneth Johnston. Now, the second mini-series, The Final Battle, wasn't written by Johnston, but it was still very cool (introducing genre fav, Ham Tyler). The TV series after that was pish-poor...

Johnston decided, however, to release a book - The Second Generation - which completely ignores anything past the original mini-series. Whilst I can understand why he might want to do that, as writer/ creator of the original concept/ show, as a fan, I'm left feeling iffy about ignoring all of the output post-Johnston. A better way forward, in my opinion, would be to acknowledge the Final Battle and TV series (shit though it was), setting his novel as a continuation of the story that had been already broadcast.

Basically what I'm saying is as a fan, I could care less of the politics of Johnston's situtation. I just want to be able to enjoy a story that has the integrity to acknowledge that 'what's done is done' - regardless of how the continuation writer decides how to deal with such...

[vzzbux]

Who was it that wrote the Dredd Rogue crossover? I quite enjoyed that one.







V

[JayzusB.Christ]

I think Gandalf's resurrection, as well as Dredd's in the Dead Man, are a very different kettle of literary fish - neither 'death' was ever supposed to be permanent, and in fact they never died anyway.
Regretful afterthought resurrections are different, as are DC / Marvel publicity-garnering fake deaths.
Johnny's would be the regretful afterthought one. Wagner does the right thing 99.99 percent of the time, but the resurrection of the Angel gang - jesus wept.

By the way John Wagner did the Rogue / Dredd one - yeah, it was good, wasn't it? Pity it was Friday and not the original but still a fine story.

[The Enigmatic Dr X]

Surely it's okay to say that it was a mistake killing him off and to bring him back? It's a hard one. I wouldn't want retconning to happen all the time, but at the same time I would like the "new" Wagner stuff to tie in to the continuity of the old.

[Mike Gloady]

The first of the new storylines aside (for obvious reasons), Wagner hasn't really done anything to contradict previous strontinuity.

[HOO-HAA]

I would like the "new" Wagner stuff to tie in to the continuity of the old.

For me, that would be key.

[Kev Levell]

Not sure I care a whole lot about continuity where Johnny Alpha is concerned - with all those tricky to use time-bombs going off all over the place you never know what could/can/have/will/may screw with continuity at any given/taken moment.

Plus, I'd like his future to be unwritten again.