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Author Topic: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain  (Read 4205 times)

Goosegash

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #15 on: 18 April, 2021, 12:14:31 PM »
It's more the fact that this was sold to us as being a satisfying finale to Slaine's adventures, rather than the opening story of a longer saga with a hasty wrap-up tacked onto the end - that's where the dissatisfaction comes in, I think.

The Corinthian

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #16 on: 18 April, 2021, 12:29:43 PM »
The Tharg of old would have just ended it halfway through then spent years promising everyone it would be back very soon.

Magnetica

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #17 on: 18 April, 2021, 01:10:40 PM »
It reminds me of the end of Inferno. After an ongoing story that had lasted months, editorial decided enough was enough and there was then a one episode wrap up. In this case, Pat has decided to not do any more, and we get a page and a half “wrap up” to a saga that’s been running for 40 odd years.  It’s nothing to do with thinking Pat’s earlier stuff was better (even though it was). It’s just that it doesn’t really bring anything to a conclusion.  I think Colin described it well....it leaves the reader to imagine further adventures for themselves, if they so wish.

Leigh S

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #18 on: 18 April, 2021, 01:18:20 PM »
I'm just waiting for the adventure of Kai MacSlaine - boy Druid!  :p


Art

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #19 on: 18 April, 2021, 02:00:47 PM »
Pretty sure Slaine will be back, but I don’t think anyone can begrudge him a nice long rest.

Goosegash

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #20 on: 19 April, 2021, 08:48:41 AM »
The Tharg of old would have just ended it halfway through then spent years promising everyone it would be back very soon.

Ha, I think I would've preferred that, just leave us wondering what might've been rather than risking the inevitable disappointment. To be honest I half-expected the final episode would just keep getting pushed further and further back in the schedules until everyone had forgotten about it.

broodblik

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #21 on: 20 April, 2021, 09:21:18 AM »
Since this prog features the "last" ever Slaine episode here is an article related to some of the Slaine covers over the years: https://comicscene.org/2021/04/17/slaine-cover-gallery-and-competition-as-character-ends-in-2000ad/
Old age is the Lord’s way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death’s in case we didn’t take the hint.

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Goosegash

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #22 on: 21 April, 2021, 12:32:19 AM »
Is that Ukko I spy on the cover?

A bit of a pointless cameo if he didn't even make the story, which finished in a rather odd fashion I'd say. I'm guessing this wasn't the planned ending as has been debated on here. Perhaps he was originally meant to die, go on to the Goddess etc. and it was changed to this ''sort of' ending.


If Slaine was supposed to die there was no hint of that throughout the rest of the story, which to be honest has been dramatically rather weak. The villains seemed to pose no credible threat to Slaine at any point, rendering the outcome of any battle between them totally moot. He defeats them all one by one and then just buggers off.

I think if Slaine does return with a new creative team, and it seems more than likely that it will at some point, I'd hope it would be a reboot rather than a continuation. Drop all the baggage of the last thirty-odd years and have him go back to being a wandering outcast again.

broodblik

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #23 on: 21 April, 2021, 03:52:40 AM »
A good prog.

Dredd – The plot now has direct us in a different direction. As the main question is what are our good folk at the SJS up too? Tom Foster’s art is still a delight to behold and Niemand’s script keeps us alert.

Thistlebone – The plot now starts to focus on one person past and present. The question remines for me how real is Thistlebone? hallucinations or entity?

Slaine – The question always is: how do you end a series that runs for almost 40 years? So here we are with potentially the last step in our cometh the hour cometh the axe man and last page gives us our answer, an open-ended ending. This leaves the door not closed but still slightly open for more possibilities in the future. As a whole this was not the greatest Slaine story and felt very much like a Book 1 and a start of a new arc. The stand-out of the series was the glorious art of Manco. He spends a lot of time on the finer details, and I would like to see his return to the prog. Here we go “So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish”

Chorus – I enjoyed this caper, and it does end with a nice surprise. The world that Peaty created is quite interesting and just maybe we can revisit it.

Feral & Foe – Our finds has reached to next point in their adventure and needs a side quest to finish the main quest. Great story with great art.
Old age is the Lord’s way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death’s in case we didn’t take the hint.

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.

broodblik

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Old age is the Lord’s way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death’s in case we didn’t take the hint.

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.

IndigoPrime

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #25 on: 21 April, 2021, 08:48:26 AM »
So Sláine was really all the troublemakers in the world, all along? Is he Caroline Lucas?

I found this arc pretty weak. Sláine long ago ended up going very heavy on the talk and that continues. But he felt like a character in a videogame using a cheat mode. There was no sense of threat whatsoever. I wasn’t too keen on Chorus either.

The rest of the Prog was great. Yes, the SJS are awful, but they mostly always have been. Why they are tolerated at all in Justice Dept, I’ve no idea. Thistlebone is creepy and horrible. Feral & Foe continues to be great fun.

TordelBack

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #26 on: 21 April, 2021, 08:51:50 AM »
Sláine is a big deal for me, my favourite 2000AD strip of all (I may have mentioned this before), and I thought this last episode was full-on excellent. There was never any requirement for Sláine to die at the end, and while I regret that this may well be The End there is nothing in this splendid outing that disappoints. Pat has clearly been writing within the structure of a longer 6 to 8 book storyline, with this as a 5th part that more properly develops the family themes of Psychopomp and Archon, and Sláine's personal integration of his warring/despairing aspects, while leaving the Brutania plot hanging, albeit with a sketch for how it would resolve. The swathe of new characters in Slough Gorm,  Alban and Brutus' family, the lack of any resolution for Kai despite the obvious opening that Duban presents, the introduction of the Web of Weird itself, all points at a middle chapter rather than a finale.
BUT.
Given Pat's real-world reason for walking away, I would far rather see threads left hanging than quickly tied up - much better to leave Sláine fully in the midst of something, than cut him off (as I had feared this story might do).

The conclusion we do get is a good one - Sláine asserts the power of family and identity over destiny and conquest, he embraces the three strands of his origins and his personality: Roth the proud and boastful warrior distracted by sloth, self-pity and indulgence; Macha the precise and cunning warrior driven by passion and ambition; Duban, the iconoclast mystic drawing on something larger than himself. And he articulates the importance of resistance even though the battle can't be won.

It helps that Manco has delivered one of the most complete and breathtaking set of pages in the victory of a strip that is defined more than any other by its magnificently diverse art. Some quality lettering choices from Annie too.

So I'll take it. And I'll take any more that Pat chooses to give us.

Meanwhile, I may have griped about yet another internicine squabble in Dredd, but this is just a solid engaging story, backed by some truly outstanding character art from Foster. His Dredd is a true wonder, his Dutch angles and creation of 3D space exemplary, but brother do I hate his lawmasters! Don't get me wrong, they are a strong and deliberate design, but to me they look like a cross between a ride-on mower and a mini steamroller. Other than that clash with my tastes, it's just glorious stuff.

Thistlebone delights. In the first series the one-eyed fox ensnared me, switched my experience from observer to participant. Here it's the birdcage. The wicker birdcage. The oddly haphazard, misshapen wicker cage. Pure magic, run this strip every week for a year and I'll be happy.

Chorus and the Ring has a decent ending, Peaty certainly gives Collins lots of fun things to create on the page, and he does. Nice touch with chopping off the feet to separate the pontiff from his gravity boots/slippers. But would I like to see what happens next?  Maybe.

Feral & Foe has settled nicely into its slightly different more-knowing tone, helped along by a great character in the Necromancer. Can't beat a good quest to give a story a clear hook, and some walking songs never hurt. Very enjoyable.

TordelBack

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #27 on: 21 April, 2021, 08:56:10 AM »
-sigh- "Victory" = "History".

Is there an actual reason we can't edit posts in the Review threads, even in a very limited window?  It is QUITE annoying, so I'd like to imagine there's a strong justification somewhere.

Barrington Boots

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #28 on: 21 April, 2021, 10:07:17 AM »
I've had the prog since Saturday and it was such a pleasure to be able to read it in bed instead of between jobs at work on a Monday or Tuesday, so full marks to everything.
More objectively, good prog but not brilliant.

Dredd – The inclusion of the evil SJS has made this less interesting than I hoped when it started, but it feels churlish to moan about that: this is a really engaging story with really tremendous art. If there's a late twist or not, there's nothing but sympathy for Asher with everything stacked against him and right now you're rooting for him to survive, although his prospects look bleak as hell.

Thistlebone – With the hinted at backstory starting to unfold (and it's not what we thought happened on the camping trip) I'm glad Tordel also picked up on the birdcage as that's what jumped out at me this episode: surely it's a callback to the bird in the cage-built-in-a-badger and it's sinister and starkly out of place in the setting. Is it real and is something very sinister going on here, or is Seema nuts?

Slaine – Where to stand on this? I've not been invested in Slaine since Brutania Chronciles went off the rails following it's brilliant start, and I've felt the strip was long in decline. This series has overall done nothing for me: despite the art being absolutely incredible it's just not been interesting, with super Slaine seemingly bereft of much personality (apart from one very nicely done episode midway through) killing everything with no effort whatsoever. I didn't want the strip to end, just to be more engaging: here it just sort of finishes but I think this is a decent finish for it as if he'd died it would, quite frankly, have been rubbish. There's been so much buildup and some mild bad feeling over the whole affair and I'm mainly just glad it's done and hopefully it'll all be for the better. Truly Fantastic art though and I hope we see Manco again.

Chorus – Overall this I think was a decent little tale. As mentioned before I loved the designs and artwork but the story was slight and the characters likewise.

Feral & Foe – Can only echo what I said last week, this is brilliant but it's verging on being too self-referential to the genre for me, here with the reference to the side quest... in the first series for example the joke around the tank was very nicely done, with a couple of references to tanks dropped before the reveal that this was basically a WoW / videogame reference and it felt clever. Here the meta jokes are more obvious, more quickfire and it's starting to drift into pure parody: I liked it better when it was still full of comedy and violence, but with knowing winks at fantasy conventions instead. That aside it's still a great strip, funny and looks incredible and it's the first thing I read every week.
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norton canes

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Re: Prog 2228 - The Slayer & The Slain
« Reply #29 on: 22 April, 2021, 01:53:27 PM »
Great cover. Took me a moment to realize it's not ink but the contents of his nose that Ukko is dribbling into Slaine's face.

'A Penitent Man' rattles along absorbingly. Love the economic crispness of the Niemand droid's prose, and Foster's artwork shines again, particularly the SJS agent left in an undignified pose with their foot caught in a ceiling strap. And does Lester's design owe something to the Power Tower maintenance droids in Father Earth? Thistlebone is definitely starting to flourish and I find myself looking forward to the increasingly bizarre images Simon Davis has cooked up for the final panel. Feral & Foe was as enjoyable a read as ever, and though Chorus and the Ring didn't really have me hooked, I've read verse.

I think that's everything, isn't it?

Oh yeah, almost forgot Slaine, LOL! I wonder what revisions were made to this final episode in the end? Just the addition of the final page? It would be nice to find out one day. Interesting decision to give it an open ending, particularly given Tharg's pointed claim that it's only the end of the 'latest' instalment. Maybe the behind-the-scenes fracas will eventually simmer down and... hmm, perhaps not. Anyway I'm surprised no-one's mentioned Jock's sensational Star-Scan, which more than the delayed denouement actually made me feel a little sad that everyone's favourite warped warrior has graced the prog for the last time.