The Political Thread

[Jim_Campbell]

Hmmm.

From the Wee Blue Book:

"The UK government claims that an independent Scotland would have to sign up to Schengen, which would in turn require border posts to be set up between Scotland and England to comply with the Agreement's rules and to protect the rUK against mass illegal immigration through Scotland.

There are all sorts of complex and technical reasons why none of this would be the case, but again the common-sense analysis is the simplest and clearest."

However...

New EU member states do not sign the Schengen Agreement as such; instead, they are bound to implement the Schengen rules as part of the pre-existing body of EU law, which every new entrant is required to accept. (Supported here.)

(Note that I firmly believe that "Scotland's aging population means independence wouldn't work without an influx of tens of thousands of working/breeding age foreigners every single year" applies just as much to England and I utterly condemn that political expedience and moral cowardice of mainstream British politicians of all stripes for failing to make a forceful case for the economic benefits of immigration.)

Cheers

Jim

[8-Ball]

In unrelated news, Channel Four's Paul Mason is currently taking pelters on social media for suggesting that discussion of technicalities and policy fly over the heads of ordinary people.

I saw that as well. If I hadn't paid a lot for my fancy Samsung telly I would have chucked it out my front window in disgust.

[Spikes]

I know there is still a bit to go before voting starts, but Scotland is leaving, isnt it...

[IAMTHESYSTEM]

Yes more than likely.

[Stan]

Just build a secret wall like the South Koreans did. With maybe secret machine gun nests. If you don't admit it's there it doesn't exist.

[8-Ball]

I know there is still a bit to go before voting starts, but Scotland is leaving, isnt it...

I was amused to see that the Three Amigos (Cameron, Clegg and Milliband) are coming up here on Wednesday, I suppose they might as well have one last look around. However, we Scots do have a habit of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory so we might just surprise you.

[Steve Green]

Cameron's getting the train.

[Frank]

we Scots do have a habit of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory

If the returning officer is from Costa Rica, we're fucked.

[Fungus]

I did hear that sensational news about the 'Yes' vote grabbing a small lead. I like to think it'll be the kind of sensational 'lead' that Kinnock's Labour enjoyed ('93?) and means not quite so much when people's standard of living is threatened and that big X in a wee box seems like a very big step...

(Yes, I know nationalists will argue that Scotland is wealthy; wealthier than the UK, etc...).

[Ghost MacRoth]

You don't necessarily need to be a nationalist to argue the case for independence.

[Grugz]

I had a friendly conversation with two guys at work today in which they told me they were voting YES and that the first thing they wanted Salmond to do was to get rid of immigrants. Informing them that officially stated SNP policy is the direct opposite (and that Scotland's aging population means independence wouldn't work without an influx of tens of thousands of working/breeding age foreigners every single year) didn't phase them at all.

In unrelated news, Channel Four's Paul Mason is currently taking pelters on social media for suggesting that discussion of technicalities and policy fly over the heads of ordinary people.

I'm assuming they're reffering to the English folk living and working there? aren't those folks entitled to vote as well? and are the Scottish folk living in England getting kicked out or all migrating north?

as for borders they already have hadrians wall,might need a spruce up though.

[The Legendary Shark]

Is this the start of the Irn-Bru Curtain?

[Frank]

I had a friendly conversation with two guys at work today in which they told me they were voting YES and that the first thing they wanted Salmond to do was to get rid of immigrants.

I'm assuming they're reffering to the English folk living and working there? aren't those folks entitled to vote as well?

No they weren't. Everyone living in Scotland is eligible to vote in the referendum, whether they were born here or not.

[Jim_Campbell]

No they weren't. Everyone living in Scotland is eligible to vote in the referendum, whether they were born here or not.

Tricky things, those facts...

Cheers!

Jim

[GordonR]

I only realised today, there's going to be a closed border between Scotland and England isn't there.

Salmond says his target for an increase in net migration is 24,000 a year. The UK are zealously cutting net migration. The only way those two policies work is if the border is closed.

The Republic of Ireland's had an open border with the UK for 90 years, even through the Troubles. And - unlike Scotland - them leaving the Union was negotiated partly through armed insurrection rather than a democratic ballot.

But, yes, Jimmy, Scotland will have a closed border. Because, y'know....fear, intimidation and scare tactics work on the naive and uninformed.