Doctor Who Series 11 Discussion

[Taryn Tailz]

If I complain hard enough about the writing then there's every chance I'll be the showrunner in thirty years time. It worked for Chibnall after all. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irIqTPQqgvQ

[Robin Low]

I liked the determination to free all the prisoners, I liked the weirdness of the Auchs (sp?) pair, I liked seeing Tim Shaw again,  I liked the development of Graham and Ryan's relationship,  I liked Graham's dilemma, I liked the captured miniaturised planets, I liked almost all of the Doctor's monlogues/dialogue. The action felt purposeful, and the story felt like it traded on what we'd seen of the characters over the series.

I'll add to all that the image of the ship/shrine/weapon hanging in the sky, Graham's honesty with the Doctor (nothing secretive or conniving), the captain who can actually hit what he aims at... and the old school fan in me was amused by being able to see the joins of the Perspex planet containers.

As usual the logic of the plot was incoherent, the villain caved far too easily, and Yaz had little or nothing to do. 

Yes to all that, too. Feeling a bit sorry for the actress who plays Yaz, as there's nothing wrong with her or the character. It's ironic that in the first episode the character was asking a colleague for more interesting things to do, saying she could do so much more... and yet the writers have given her so little.

That said, I hope they keep all three companions. A small group of characters is a bit more interesting.

This item in the BBC bit announcing no new series in 2019:

The series has been considered a ratings success, with viewing figures above those of the last two series when Peter Capaldi starred in the title role.

I'm glad to read that the ratings are apparently good, as it bodes better for the series' future... but dear god, I feel sorry for Capaldi. He was a great Doctor, poorly served by many of the stories... but some of those stories were much better than what this season had to offer.

Regards,

Robin

[Leigh S]

Is that the one where he scraped his knee?   

Something something Cybermen something?  If so I found that might have had soe nice sci-fi ideas (the space ship with variable time progression), the execution of those ideas was hideously convoluted and self referential - OK if you care about the (in my mind)  fake drama of Bill being a Cyberman who happens to not get turned into a cyberman and here is a bit of the spaceship where they are all yokels on the farm and on and on and I've switched off

These stories could do with a bit more about them, but we have by and large left "love saves people from being cybernised/resets the universe" behind, along with "ooooh who is the Doctor REALLY, oooohhh!" shenanigans, which could never have satisfactory endings (thank god for the cancellation before the Cartmel Masterplan revelations, or the cancellation before the McGann Half human stuck etc.)

What was Moffatt's series finale?  If we are talking about the one where he shat on the First Doctor from a great height, then I'm reckoning the Chibnall Era a resounding success in comparison.

That wasn't the series finale; that was the Christmas special which followed on from the end of the series finale. The series finale was 'The Doctor Falls'.

[Taryn Tailz]

Well, 'The Doctor Falls' was actually resolved by the Doctor blowing the Cybermen up, which isn't exactly saving the universe through the power of love. That was, of course, a legitimate gripe with the previous era (I don't deny that), but if we start debating that issue then we end up in what-about-ism territory, which ultimately never leads anywhere.

[Leigh S]

Having finally watched the finale, what a dull and pointless bit of TV that was.  Ironically, it felt very Pip and Jane Baker in it's effort to create entirely bland "aliens" talking in cliche and a plot that offered nothing palpable to grip onto and a weak and predictable'dilemma' for Graham that was only going to end one way (and as others have pointed out, killing him seems like a kindness in comparison to eternal stasis or slow starvation, whaever those pods were supposed to be! Still, at least no one called Hartnell a c***, so it's still a step up from Moffatt's last outing.

[Dandontdare]

it felt very Pip and Jane Baker

Hey, don't knock 'em, those are the guys who manged to get penis-headed aliens who shoot white stuff out of their japs eye into a children's show. Kudos!

Graham's dilemma was so obviously going that way that they didn't even bother writing any soul searching - it was just "I'm gonna kill you ... actually, I've changed my mind" - and taking him down was then so ridiculously easy, it negated any menace or threat.

Chibnall did manage to wrong foot me for the first time though - usually his denouements are so predictable but I was wrong about the nature of the crystal maguffins - I thought they contained all the remaining Ux.

[Colin YNWA]

Can I be the first to say 'Starborn Thing'...

[IndigoPrime]

Hah! I thought the same. Still, mostly a good one, which I wasn’t expecting from Chibnall.

[Leigh S]

You can!


Hmmm... the ultimate problem is that Chibnall is...not very good a writer.  I prefer his approach (dropping the "mythos" building/teasing of Moffatt for example) as it feels more traditionally Who, but damn that was clunkier than the scrapyard Dalek plotwise.

Destroyed by convenient oven/microwave combo?  Most childlike/signposted/bizarre resolution ever? (see what I did there?). Like a Mark Millar villain, the Dalek shrugs off bullets and tanks, but can be melted by some microwave gubbins?

[pauljholden]

Convenient? That poor man had been pointlessly carrying a microwave oven with him all day.

Thought it was weirdly less than the sum of it’s parts, liked the new use of the dalek but I’d actually have preferred it if it was an all new foe (I mean, for me, the “Oh it’s a dalek” just made me go “Oh it’s always daleks”)

The Dalek was pretty disappointing looking when it turned up in full dalek-armour
The resolution was rubbish (esp the let’s just run around a bit and creep up on it? - are daleks only good with frontal assaults or something)

Also: it felt like a recycled bone kickers script, which annoyed me because i’d Rather have new bone kickers...

[Leigh S]

That's true - it must have been pretty inconvenient for him to bring it along wiht him on the day he is trying to make up with his son, when all the shops are going to be closed, but just took it along on the offchance he might go to a cafe where he could sell precisely one of them?  I'm not sure if it is more asinine than insane, but it's certainly both!  And that is BEFORE it gets to melt a Dalek (I'm glossing over how Medieval Allies burnt it to death with sticksof wood)

Convenient? That poor man had been pointlessly carrying a microwave oven with him all day.

Thought it was weirdly less than the sum of it’s parts, liked the new use of the dalek but I’d actually have preferred it if it was an all new foe (I mean, for me, the “Oh it’s a dalek” just made me go “Oh it’s always daleks”)

The Dalek was pretty disappointing looking when it turned up in full dalek-armour
The resolution was rubbish (esp the let’s just run around a bit and creep up on it? - are daleks only good with frontal assaults or something)

Also: it felt like a recycled bone kickers script, which annoyed me because i’d Rather have new bone kickers...

[Leigh S]

I completely agree with you PJ in regards it would have been vastly superior if it wasnt a Dalek - all the clunky stuff stemmed from having to reconstruct, then find a way to destruct, the Dalek casing.  Make the creature some other Starborn Thing (TM Colin)  and you could have cleared all that cludge out and had a plot that held up to a cursory prod

[Mattofthespurs]

My mum says never say anything unless you can say something nice.

The nicest thing I can say about that episode, and the series in general, is it is fucking awful.

And that's the nicest thing I can think of.

Hideous.

[JamesC]

I could pick holes in that episode all night long but, most importantly for me, it was fun and entertaining.
I loved the look of the spare-part dalek and thought it was nice they found something new to do with them.
I’d say this was far better than the Xmas episodes ever were.

[Colin YNWA]

I actually thought that was pretty good. It certainly wasn't without its problems... targeted vaccum and other gubbins but overall very enjoyable and again the kids loved it.

I think it was best when the Dalek was Starborn thingesque it was pretty chilling and was doing something fresh and and interesting. Still gotta sell those toys and I thought junkyard Dalek was pretty cool. Really didn't need the second ending could have found a way to use the combined time and ideas to make one good ending if you ask me.

Still over all a success all be it one with an absolutely unnecessary movie trailer voice over at the end!