Sorry to go on but I read this from another site.
Sidious want to use train Anakin as his apprentice in episode 3, right?
So why does he let Dooku chain Anakin to that pole to be eaten by the monsters?
He would be killed! No apprentice then for Sid!
As I say the plot is meaningless.
Lucas can't write a logical plot.
Argue that.
scojo
Obviously the apprenticeship isnt decided. He still has Dooku afterall. Remeber what yoda says? Only two there are, a master and an apprentice. Dooku has yet to kick the bucket.
Anyway what kind of shit sith lord would let himself be eaten by something out of monsters inc.?
1/ Did Sidious have designs on Anakin from this early on?
2/ Presumably - if Anakin could be defeated by dinosauresque monster then he wouldn't make a very useful Sith. Trial by fire situation.
You see fool most of the people most of the time, but never all of the people all of the time....
Hee hee
Still ILM are pretty hot.
scojo
I would imagine that something as simple as Sidious hasn't told Dooku that he wants to keep Anakin alive. Or maybe Dooku simply didn't realise who Anakin was.
In the original Star Wars, Darth Vader is trying to blow up Luke in his X-WING because he doesn't realise who he is. In Empire, he's trying to capture him.
There are a lot of other reasons why the film is not as good as it could have been (OK, I thought it sucked but I don't want to start a big "No, it rocked" debate) but you do seem to have changed your opinion quite quickly between threads.
But in the earlier scene Palpatin (I assume he is Sid) says to Any:
"You will become a great jedi."
It's obvious Sid/Pal want to train him.
After all, this is what happens in Ep 3!
No come on, just admit it - EP 1 and 2 are poorly constructed. They really are. Amazing visuals pull in the punters. The story, well no ILM computer can write a decent one!
scojo
1) See my last post!
2) Oh come on. Trial by fire! Dukoo wanted Anakin dead. And as Dukoo is in league with Sidious, you'd think Sid would say, "kill the others but spare Anakin. After all he is going to become the greatest jedi of them all."
Asuming that Sid is Pal.
Maybe George hasn't decided yet!
scojo
If Yoda is correct (and he usually is) then there are only ever two Sith. Sidious wouldn't say, "Oh, Dakoo don't kill Anakin - I want to replace you with him."
And how is the Count's name spelt anyway?
No I really liked it. Honest. I just like arguing with people who claim Lucas wrote this great masterplan plot so Palpatine can become all powerful.
Okay folks, cards on table time. This is what George should have done.
SCOJO'S EPISODE 1
Palpatine is a corrupt senator and jedi. No one knows he is a jedi though. His crimes are discovered and he escapes with some followers. One is Darth Maul.
We then show the dawn of the dark side of the force. We cut out all this Pal may be Sid may be or may not be Sid lark! Pal abandons his old ways and becomes Sid all the time. We know he is the emperor to be.
Clear, simple storytelling.
Sid plans to strike back at the senate which he hates, so plans to create the death star. However he needs some mineral energy source from the planer Naboo. Uses the trade federation as the means to attack it. Want to kill Amidala.
Then the rest of the story is similar to the original version.
we find Anakin, blahblah blah.
There we are. It took me 5 minutes to write that idea.
Simple storytelling.
scojo
Forgive my typos folks!
scojo
But in Return of the Jedi, Sidious tells Luke to strike his crippled father down.
Evidently the Sith chose new apprentices who supercede the old, Sidious wants to push Anakin as far as he will go, then he will instruct Anakin to kill Dooku - a trial by fire if you will. SIdious will be left with an even stronger apprentice, and Anakin will likely never know that Dooku was serving Sidious.
There.
Ok folks another thing.
1 and 2 episodes are built on what I call 'chance' narrative. By that I mean things seem to happen by chance and are then seen by Sidious as "all is going to plan!"
Take the final battle on that planet. Now if George was as clever as he and others think, he would have made Sidious orchestrate that final clone battle. But he didn't. It was Obi Wan investigating. If he had never found that dart on Coruscant the whole investigation would never have taken place. Sidious didn't plan on that female assassin getting captured by Obi and Anni. Shye was supposed to ecape.
What I'm trying to say is there is no logical cause and effect. Sure Sidious wants to get the senate and the confederate fighting as it were, and become more powerful, but if you watch the film again, he doesn't orchestrate it! Obi wan and chance does!
Now you see why Lucas' writing is poor?
scojo
Lucas' writing isn't exactly what you'd call a hard target.
I don't think anyone will disagree that he can't write.
I think all that people are pointing out is that you may have missed the odd explaination for events in YOUR comments.
Don't sweat it.
I just thought I'd post it again with the typos and dodgy grammar removed!
Ok folks another thing.
1 and 2 episodes are built on what I call 'chance' narrative. By that I mean things seem to happen by chance and are then seen by Sidious as "all is going to plan!"
Take the final battle on that planet. Now if George was as clever as he and others think, he would have made Sidious orchestrate that final clone battle. But he didn't. It was Obi Wan investigating. If he had never found that dart on Coruscant the whole investigation would never have taken place. Sidious didn't plan on that female assassin getting captured by Obi and Anni. She was supposed to escape.
What I'm trying to say is there is no logical cause and effect. Sure Sidious wants to get the senate and the confederate fighting as it were, and become more powerful, but if you watch the film again, he doesn't orchestrate it! Obi wan and chance do!
Now you see why Lucas' writing is poor?
scojo
Mr Tips,
To be honest it's that other dumb lot on the google group who think Lucas is some genius with his act structure.
They will never accept that it's deeply flawed.
I havn't seen episodes 4,5, and 6 for quite a while but I'm sure they were fairly simple.
STAR WARS 3
Death star plans found, finding death star, attack on it and then blowing it up.
STAR WARS 4
Then Empire find rebels on Horst (is that the name) rebels flee, Luke trains to become Jedi, Han Solo frozen for Jabba the hut on Cloud City, and discovery Luke is Vader's son.
STAR WARS 6
Rescue Han and attack on the new death star. Vader and Sidius killed. THE END.
Simple. Compare those storylines to the new ones. Man something happened to George. He must have read a few Politics books since 1983, cos he sure has lost the plot completely.
The new films are Ilm's really. I think somewhere along the way, George found cgi to be his new religion.
Oh well... still that final battle is a truly amaaaaaaaaazing!
scojo
IT"S A FUCKING KIDS FILM. GET A GRIP & GROW UP!!!!!!!!!!!!
Problem is- we know too much and too little.
Can't be bothered to explain myself.
remember, if Palpatine is Sidius, why can't the jedi feel this disturbance in the force, they felt, Darth Maul, Dooku, etc. I think we will find out in eps 3 that Palpantine is a clone of Sidius, without the force!
BTW Scojo, you talk about the ILM stuff, did you see it on a digital projection or just boring old film!
I got to see it on digital, and wasn't at all impressed with the quality of the blue screen work, eg Yoda looked SO 'animated' and I don't mean that in a good way.
Dominic
Balls. Sidious IS Palpatine: He's the same bleeding actor, for Christ's sake. He's even the same actor in Episodes 4-6.
Anyway, enjoyable enough film, but not great: dodgy dialogue and mushy love scenes made it not a patch on Lord of the Rings in the fantasy blockbuster stakes.
I will speak no more on Star Wars.
What I am saying is that palpantine may be a clone of Darth Sideous, but without the force, so he can keep a low profile, and as soon as he can, Sid will get rid of the clone palpantine, and walk away with the empire!
Smell: They only noticed Darth Maul when he attacked Qui Gon. Then they were like "Ahhh! The Sith have risen again!" They did say that the Sith must have found a way to hide their presence.
Why do all you losers on this post debate a childrens film so seriously? It is meant to be escapist for fuxake. Have a word with yourselves..
Yeah - who would take a childrens film so seriously! Next thing you know we'll all be having debates about whether some comic character should have been killed off by a giant flying space monster in order to save his fellow mutant friends.
Blummin' riddiculas!