Survival geeks get the cover as they should since its their final ever story. I know its not everyones cup of tea but I will miss this strip it was a nice constant fun thing to have around.
The order is back! this pleases me as a fan of kek-w and it did not disappoint i look foward to more of it after the all ages prog.
theres a future shock....i skipped it
Dredd ends happier than i was expecting it to colin will be pleased
Hershey ends book 1 and well certain people in recent threads kinda called it. kinda obvious in hindsight did simon draw the wrong eye covered to throw us off i wonder....
Quote from: The Monarch on 18 May, 2020, 05:52:43 PM
theres a future shock....i skipped it
I actually enjoyed this one.
(https://i.imgur.com/9DhGSfU.jpg)
Neil Goodge
All hail Tharg
All hail Tabs (editor of The Phoenix)
My gosh these two aren't missing a beat at the moment... well okay I have two grips this week but I got over them both as you'll see.
First Dredd is an absolutely spankingly good ending. and a [spoiler]happy[/spoiler] one at that. Such a joy... except... except... did they have to play the Dredd helmet thing so literally, as if its his 'neurosis' as opposed to a narrative device. I mean I don't think it ever been that before. That was well out of step...but BUT it worked wonderfully in the context of this story and was played so well...'Back-up requested' GOLD. So all in all I actually love that they did that, even if it makes not a jot of sense.
Secondly damnit why did they start The Order this week? I'd have copped a Future Shock. Or if they'd not wanted to double up on one off we could have slipped one on earlier and given us a double part ending on say Survival Geeks? To start it just to drop a break in next week for the all ages issue seems daft BUT it actually worked really well and felt like a nice prologue so you know what I actually love that they did that, even if it makes not a jot of sense to have done so.
Oh and The Orders back - WAYHEY!
If last weeks Future Shock was a 'what huh' is that it. This weeks I sat their all smug thinking well I seen this one coming a mile off. The twist then egged it up a notch from the obvious I saw AND then it dropped in a final twist I didn't see coming - smug idiot that I am! Great story well executed and am I the only one who sees Rian Hughes write large in the art there? Surely not and oh I do love Rian Hughes so this is an absolute triumph
Speaking TRIUMPH the ending to Hershey is just that, just superb AND that first page wow, just wow Simon Fraser underlying quite how special his art is by drawing an astonishing contrast between that he's doing and a classic of old. Just brilliant.
Oh and speaking of triumph Bolt01 did - he called it. Well done sir I feel such a dunce for not seeing it myself.
Of and speaking of triumph its 'End of Book 1' now no one ends something 'End of Book1' if they're not doing at least a 'Book 2' so WAYHEY!!!!!
And as if we haven't got enough of this triumph stuff Survival Geeks not only nails the landing Simone Biles its double twisting somersault - wow. How did you make me love you just as you were gone. Nailed it. Well done.
AND the cover of next weeks Prog will at least give some of even the hardest of naysayers something to love SURELY...
mind how are we not talking about that 'Thrills of the Future' I'd seen it on Faciebooks and thought its course a stir - let the stir begin...
...but before you do the stir sit back, reflect on this Prog, produced in the most insane world we have and just marvel at what ol' green bounce is up to.
I truly salute you sir and all who sail with you.
As someone who listens to the Thrillcast I'd heard the Future Shock already. It worked out pretty well and with some great first time art. A great prog all round. Happy for the Hershey moment! And fab knowing jokes in Dredd too. Suddenly wondering if the extra Regened issues are just a way to charge more for four progs throughout the year. They did say they sold well though! Thanks once again to the House Of Tharg for keeping the thrills flowing!
Quote from: The Monarch on 18 May, 2020, 05:52:43 PM
Hershey ends book 1 and well certain people in recent threads kinda called it. kinda obvious in hindsight did simon draw the wrong eye covered to throw us off i wonder....
Nope, a re-read confirms that it's deliberate. He starts the tale with two eyes. Then we see that his right eye is artificial; however, he loses the left eye when later attacked, so now has a patch over that instead.
Now I'm also left wondering if Rijkaard isn't just an undercover alias but actually his first name -- i.e. [spoiler]Rijkaard Frank[/spoiler]. Presumably a winking reference to Dutch footballer [spoiler]Frank Rijkaard[/spoiler]?
I think I'm going to miss the geeks, but I'm also glad they finished the series as they did.
As for Hershey - Smug!
Quote from: Bolt-01 on 19 May, 2020, 12:36:42 PM
As for Hershey - Smug!
Every right to be - it was quite the call!
Great cover for a great finale!
Looks like we could be in for some more monkey business from that block, nice mix of characters all ready for some monkey tales.
The order, read it and it felt like reading a single issue of Lion you find in Oxfam on a damp Wednesday afternoon.I
Future shock, not so shocking, but the final panel made me smile.
Hershey, a suitable ending and amazed that Bolt was spot on, well done that man!
Geeks great fun and great art, good to see the return of Thargnotes
Fine progage, all Hail TMO!
I rarely post on the prog review thread, unless it's exceptionally great, or....
Dredd aside, this for me was a shockingly bad prog.
Can someone tell me what's going on in The Order? I've bought the prog for 40 years! What the hell IS this??
Hershey: what was the point? Was it worth reversing her brilliant death scene? Is it worth getting rid of a forty something reader, Tharg? I'm genuinely getting fed up with this nonsense. Where's the innovation? The FUN?
Survival Geeks: I have NO idea which characters are the ones we've followed all this time. What happened? Who won? Why the fu*k should I care?
Up the game, Tharg. This was shit. Disappointing shit. I'm genuinely upset. I LOVE 2000AD, but this is worse than the 90's nadir....
I know everyone deserves their opinion but worse than mark millars robohunter? the reboot rogue trooper post war machine? Fleishers Harlem heroes? PARAsites?
I agree everyone has a right to their own option but I would also feel disappointed when I only like 1 out of 5 stories.
Quote from: DrRocka on 20 May, 2020, 04:34:38 AM
Survival Geeks: I have NO idea which characters are the ones we've followed all this time. What happened? Who won? Why the fu*k should I care?
Agree totally on
Survival Geeks and
The Order.
Hershey is a mixed bag for me. Featuring a 'meh' plot, it would have been far better to set this before her (heartbreaking) death; however, it's now clear that this is the first step in a long-term plan, so I'm willing to give it some rope. IMHO Simon Fraser's artwork has been a masterclass in action sequences, using old annual two-colour styling really well.
However, I understand the general frustration. Those three stories are all 'style over substance'. It's a little unfair to compare it to the '90s nadir, which was no style, no substance (and misproportioned muscles).
Quote from: DrRocka on 20 May, 2020, 04:34:38 AM
Survival Geeks: I have NO idea which characters are the ones we've followed all this time. What happened?
Apart from the 4 main characters, only 5 others survived the contest. The 3 female characters of the gender swapped group, so easy to spot, and two from the griefer group. The griefer group have a manic look on their face and griefer Clive has a different coloured t-shirt on.
As for The Order I'll try to read some back progs this week and come up with a summary!
The Order accordingly Tharg's Never Centre:
Throughout history, mankind has been under threat of extermination by the Wyrms, creatures from another plane that systematically break into our reality. Defending humanity are the men and women of THE ORDER, a secret band of warriors that have fought the entities across the centuries. But the Wyrms have fractured time, and a new chronology has been created, one in which Francis Bacon has access to future tech...
Follow this link as well:
https://britishcomics.fandom.com/wiki/The_Order (https://britishcomics.fandom.com/wiki/The_Order)
My thoughts on the prog:
Very much enjoyed the whole Chimsky's Law tale although agreed with what has already been said about the helmet debacle. Given the choice between enforcing the law and keeping on his helmet, Dredd would unhesitatingly choose the law.
I've enjoyed this Survival Geeks much more than previous, in particular the stunning art. I was unsure at the end, though how they were now able to return to their home dimension. I thought they were lost and couldn't get back? This is probably something I've missed or misunderstood though.
I'm pumped to see The Order back, although Tharg could do with a synopsis like he did with Indigo Prime a while back. I love Kek W's work but one thing he never does is try for any "this is where we are currently in the story" exposition: if you don't consult the back progs it won't make any sense. This is true of Deadworld and Indigo Prime too. Dan Abnett has similarly complex stories but still manages to give new readers an entry point, so it can be done.
The future shock was decent, referencing current phone technologies but still with an old-school Future Shock flavour to it.
Hershey - the end seemed a little rushed. However I tend to feel that way about a good 80% of 2000 AD stories, so that may just be me. I like long endings like the Return of the King movie! I loved the throw back to the Judge Child story where Dredd meets Hershey for the first time - I only read that recently so the scene was still fresh in my head.
Exciting that in two weeks' time we have 3 new stories starting and I don't think there's been any mention of what they are now that the Diamond Solicits previews have stopped.
Rebellion have put of the solicitations. I'll spoiler tag them incase you want it to stay a surprise. Mind one of them I don't think we know anything about so that one will be.
[spoiler]Incredible SF action from the Eisner-nominated UK anthology! A brand-new line-up of stories start in Prog 2184, the ideal point to jump onboard – the apocalypse is approaching and Judge Dredd is offered aid from an unexpected quarter in "End of Days";
teenage bounty hunter Tee and her gran are back in the deep-space adventure "Full Tilt Boogie";
the shadow-agents are hunting down members of The Order in "Land of the Free";
the oddball cop caper "Nakka of the S.T.A.R.S";
Celtic warrior Slaine returns for the first book of the "Dragontamer" saga, "The Web of Weird"![/quote][/spoiler]
Arh sorry messed up my spoiler tag there and 'Modify' gone too soon - have reported it...
Forgive me, Mighty One. Last night was spent drinking heavily with a fellow ne'er do well.
I just wasn't that keen on this week's prog.
It has been a MASSIVE beacon of hope in these testing times for me. I genuinely look forward to it every Tuesday around midnight. Thanks for continuing to produce it.
I have been having a Back Prog Marathon, and spent some time yesterday reading through the Space Girls/BLAIR1 era.
I would like the jury to consider this before condemning me, m'lud.
Blimey. Those Rigellian Hotshots are effective!
Quote from: DrRocka on 20 May, 2020, 11:37:39 AM
Forgive me, Mighty One. Last night was spent drinking heavily with a fellow ne'er do well.
I just wasn't that keen on this week's prog.
It has been a MASSIVE beacon of hope in these testing times for me. I genuinely look forward to it every Tuesday around midnight. Thanks for continuing to produce it.
I have been having a Back Prog Marathon, and spent some time yesterday reading through the Space Girls/BLAIR1 era.
I would like the jury to consider this before condemning me, m'lud.
Hey Rocka, it's fine to have whatever opinion you have on the prog, good or bad, I think. We all take in things differently. I'm sure Tharg and his droids are old and ugly enough to take criticism! Not that they're reading this anyway!
Quote from: MumboJimbo on 20 May, 2020, 11:57:26 AM
... I'm sure Tharg and his droids are old and ugly enough to take criticism! Not that they're reading this anyway!
Well you better hope they are. Ugly indeed Leigh - comics most beautiful man - Gallagher will not be pleased!
Ah, but Leigh Gallagher was not involved with this prog - unless he's secretly Kenneth Niemand ;)
Btw, thanks for the info Colin about what comes next! I've been a regular reader for nearly 2 years now and finally Slaine returns! Although he did have one-off in a special prog recently I think. I read the Ultimate Collection Book of Invasions Book 2 recently and loved it. "Will there be any wet business, sir?" :lol:
Quote from: DrRocka on 20 May, 2020, 11:37:39 AM
Forgive me, Mighty One. Last night was spent drinking heavily with a fellow ne'er do well.
I just wasn't that keen on this week's prog.
It has been a MASSIVE beacon of hope in these testing times for me. I genuinely look forward to it every Tuesday around midnight. Thanks for continuing to produce it.
I have been having a Back Prog Marathon, and spent some time yesterday reading through the Space Girls/BLAIR1 era.
I would like the jury to consider this before condemning me, m'lud.
Having been responsible for co-creating Space Girls, I offer heartfelt apologies for that mis-step. FWIW, the strip only ran five episodes and 30 pages, so the error was short-lived. If nothing else, it certainly got a reaction...
By the way, has anybody noticed the little Easter egg in the prog during the lockdown - Damage Report - Journal of the Plague Years? If you haven't yet, I won't spoil the fun...
Awesome reference-packed cover, and a satisfying if slightly downbeat Survival Geeks finale. Seems sort of odd that Girl Rufus stayed dead (or a replacement wasn't co-opted), leaving them a Cosmic Trio after all the Quartets that we've seen. And did I miss what happened to the ladies' robo-Howard-equivalent?
I've enjoyed SG greatly since about the third story, it's consistently given Googe magnificent things to draw magnificently and has never once been less than fun, and I'm sorry to see it go. Get Googe on something else immediately please, Tharg
As to Dredd, oh it does seem a pity that (in my opinion) Niemand made his first Dredd mischaracterisation in any kind in a good end to such a great story. As others have said, Dredd would take his helmet off in a heartbeat, any neurosis rests entirely with the readers: as a solution the sticky goop could have meant he was unable to get his hands free having done so, and we'd have the same result but with some traditional face-hiding sleight of hand from PJ and a mis-calculation from Chimpsky, evening out his 'victory' over Dredd. But look, this was an uplifting an enjoyable story with characters I look forward to seeing again, and absolutely terrific art throughout.
The Future Shock was nothing earth-shatteringly new but it was very neatly told across 4 pages and quite exquisitely drawn, and I very much liked the little kicker on the end. Nice, high expectations now for Johnson and Henley.
The Order is always welcome in my prog, and this looks sumptuously insane, or insanely sumptuous, who knows. I consider myself a big fab, but even I've lost track of which Ritterstahl is which and where! Re-read time! There is one clunker of a line though, "your sister... MARIE ANTOINETTE" is up there with Pratchett's ironic "As you know, your father, the King of Lancre...". Still, any strip with Revolutionary Republic dive-bombers attacking the Holy Roman Empire gets all sorts of free passes from me.
I'd look away now, true believers: the end of this 'Book' (groan) of Hershey was the worst kind of nonsense ("For you see, oh villain we don't really know anything about, I too secretly have Magic Enceladus Powers, and my Magic Enceladus Powers are bigger and bluer than yours, zzzzaaapppp"), all drawn in the most beautiful way. Even The Twist was only good in as far as it rescued a beloved character from a pointless off-screen death, not that it did anything interesting with him. If D. Bishop is up for it I would genuinely prefer another series of Space Girls to more of this, as long as Fraser got to draw it. Utterly gorgeous, but irredeemably awful.
4/5, I'll take it.
First things first, thank you Tharg for another prog
I see there is some mix feelings about this week's prog especially certain stories, but I really enjoyed the current run of stories.
Dredd – I am glad that Chimpsky did not bite the bullet and we will see his return (hopefully for more fun). This story was a great combination of art and storytelling.
The Order – This story is the reason why I love 2000AD. It might not be everyone's cup of tea but then again what is wrong with coffee? I always liked the fact that AD is prepared to publish stories to is not your normal run-of-the-mill type like The Order. I cannot wait for the story to kick-off in 2 weeks' time.
TFC – I enjoyed the story. It almost was becoming predictable but then that last panel just delivered the kick. That is the thing about these stories only one panel can make the story.
Hersey – I enjoyed this series. I am glad that we will see some more. There are two things for me out of this series and the first is that it looks like Hersey will wrap-up Smileys shenanigans and when did we really get a Hersey series other than just a bystander in the Dredd stories. The real highlight for me was the return of Simon Fraser to AD and getting some more art from him is a bonus.
Survival Geeks – The story comes to a satisfactory conclusion. Throughout this series we where treated by some great art from Googe.
Quote from: davidbishop on 20 May, 2020, 01:34:32 PM
Having been responsible for co-creating Space Girls, I offer heartfelt apologies for that mis-step. FWIW, the strip only ran five episodes and 30 pages, so the error was short-lived. If nothing else, it certainly got a reaction...
For context, that's 0.23% of the progs and 0.04% of the pages.
I feel like a bit of a clint now rocka i am so sorry :o
Just a quick review:
Dredd: Superb. This has been my favourite multi-part Dredd story this year.
Future Shock: Definitely how I want to see these things go in future. Worrying advances in AI, the fact that your devices may shortly end up knowing you better than you know yourself- perfect. Almost what I'd say was proper futurism. That's what the strip SHOULD be.
Hershey: Will have to read this again now, as I'm not sure I understood who anyone was or what they were doing. Nice art though.
The Order: I had rather hoped that this wouldnt come back, or if it did, that it would be under heavy editorial so it was forced to tell a more straightforward story and explain itself a bit more. Sigh. More digging around in the back progs needed. I want to like this- as I've wanted to like every other story its told. But, I never seem to be able to follow a word of it.
Survival Geeks: Not my thing.
SBT
Quote from: Funt Solo on 20 May, 2020, 04:23:49 PM
Quote from: davidbishop on 20 May, 2020, 01:34:32 PM
Having been responsible for co-creating Space Girls, I offer heartfelt apologies for that mis-step. FWIW, the strip only ran five episodes and 30 pages, so the error was short-lived. If nothing else, it certainly got a reaction...
For context, that's 0.23% of the progs and 0.04% of the pages.
You sir are a data monster.
The Dredd story was only a comedy so I wouldn't take the helmet thing too seriously. It made me laugh, and that's all it was meant to do.
Survival Geeks ended just the way it should, and I'm glad they got the cover.
Hershey -- what Tordelback said. I did like the Bolland impersonation for the flashback though.
The Order -- what Rocka said.
The Future Shock was alright, a hint of Black Mirror there.
I could actually live with a Dredd helmet neurosis. I mean, if it was going to be one thing creeping in as he advances in years, I could buy it being that! Very nice story and art all round, this one. Vintage Dredd Feel.
Was that really the last Survival Geeks? That caught me by surprise somehow. It's been a great ride, I must say and the Googe art has been top notch, it really has.
Quite liked the future shock. Keep giving the new blood a showcase, Lord Tharg.
With Hershey, I must admit I can sort of see what Tordels means based on this first arc. I think I need to see the whole thing though and it should be interesting to see how this develops from here. Absolutely lovely Bolland flashback, as mentioned above.
All in all, Praise Be To Tharg.
Dredd- Niemand continues his excellent run, Holden is in great form at the moment. Hopefully there's lots more to come.
Hershey- A disappointing end to a series that started so well. The enceladus energy stuff is meh, give us more Fraser-drawn shoot out sequences, please.
The Order- Beautifully drawn but still incomprehensible to me. This story lost me so long ago that I just skim it. Kek-W shows no interest in helping new readers or letting anyone catch up. The last time it ran, I seem to remember there was a page of "background" that must have been written by Tharg or Kek-W as a joke.
I remembered the Future Shock from the podcast, so can't judge whether it would be a surprise to a new reader. It was good, though. Not an all time classic, but certainly promising.
Survival Geeks- I'm really going to miss this. I know they've always got a mixed reaction but we need more humour stories in the prog.
Quote from: Colin YNWA on 20 May, 2020, 11:26:38 AM
Rebellion have put of the solicitations. I'll spoiler tag them incase you want it to stay a surprise. Mind one of them I don't think we know anything about so that one will be.
[spoiler]QuoteIncredible SF action from the Eisner-nominated UK anthology! A brand-new line-up of stories start in Prog 2184, the ideal point to jump onboard – the apocalypse is approaching and Judge Dredd is offered aid from an unexpected quarter in "End of Days";
teenage bounty hunter Tee and her gran are back in the deep-space adventure "Full Tilt Boogie";
the shadow-agents are hunting down members of The Order in "Land of the Free";
the oddball cop caper "Nakka of the S.T.A.R.S";
Celtic warrior Slaine returns for the first book of the "Dragontamer" saga, "The Web of Weird"!
[/spoiler]
Looks like I will be me getting 1 out of 5 in a fortnight... Nothing there appealing to me from the titles at least. Fingers crossed I'm wrong
Quote from: Proudhuff on 21 May, 2020, 03:09:01 PM
Quote from: Colin YNWA on 20 May, 2020, 11:26:38 AM
Rebellion have put of the solicitations. I'll spoiler tag them incase you want it to stay a surprise. Mind one of them I don't think we know anything about so that one will be.
[spoiler]QuoteIncredible SF action from the Eisner-nominated UK anthology! A brand-new line-up of stories start in Prog 2184, the ideal point to jump onboard – the apocalypse is approaching and Judge Dredd is offered aid from an unexpected quarter in "End of Days";
teenage bounty hunter Tee and her gran are back in the deep-space adventure "Full Tilt Boogie";
the shadow-agents are hunting down members of The Order in "Land of the Free";
the oddball cop caper "Nakka of the S.T.A.R.S";
Celtic warrior Slaine returns for the first book of the "Dragontamer" saga, "The Web of Weird"!
[/spoiler]
Looks like I will be me getting 1 out of 5 in a fortnight... Nothing there appealing to me from the titles at least. Fingers crossed I'm wrong
Sadly, it's likewise for me as well
Acknowledging that Huffster and Batson are squaxx of long standing whose opinions are informed and weighty, I do wonder about dismissing in advance (1) a new series that no-one has read yet, (2) another of which there has been precisely one episode and (3) an as-yet unseen Dredd story.
Opinions on The Order and SIáine I get, those are largely known quantities at this point. Do y'all know something I don't...?
Quote from: Colin YNWA on 20 May, 2020, 11:26:38 AM
Rebellion have put of the solicitations. I'll spoiler tag them incase you want it to stay a surprise. Mind one of them I don't think we know anything about so that one will be.
QuoteIncredible SF action from the Eisner-nominated UK anthology! A brand-new line-up of stories start in Prog 2184, the ideal point to jump onboard – the apocalypse is approaching and Judge Dredd is offered aid from an unexpected quarter in "End of Days";
teenage bounty hunter Tee and her gran are back in the deep-space adventure "Full Tilt Boogie";
the shadow-agents are hunting down members of The Order in "Land of the Free";
the oddball cop caper "Nakka of the S.T.A.R.S";
Celtic warrior Slaine returns for the first book of the "Dragontamer" saga, "The Web of Weird"!
The Dredd story in prog 2184 will by written Rob Williams and art by Colin MacNeil
To add a bit of counterpoint, I'm absolutely thrilled about the return of both Slaine and The Order, and adored the first Full Tilt Boogie, so massively looking forward to 2184. It's probably my most anticipated prog since I resubbed. Although being lonely and bored during the lockdown may have coloured that view.
I am with you Mumbo I cannot wait for prog 2184 plus now that I know MacNeil is back on Dredd that is a added bonus
Yeah, both of these Tordelback observations hit the mark for me. Neimand falls into the "my chaarcter has to make Dredd look like a chump" trope, when having Dredd go against his expectations whip off the helmet and then eing him would have been both in keeping with the character (who has always took off the helmet when required) and avoided the danger of creeping "Poochie" syndrome.
Hershey is nonsense, beautiful looking nonsense, but super hero nonsense that I feel is utterly out of place in Dredd and 2000AD for the most part.
Quote from: TordelBack on 20 May, 2020, 02:40:44 PM
As to Dredd, oh it does seem a pity that (in my opinion) Niemand made his first Dredd mischaracterisation in any kind in a good end to such a great story. As others have said, Dredd would take his helmet off in a heartbeat, any neurosis rests entirely with the readers: as a solution the sticky goop could have meant he was unable to get his hands free having done so, and we'd have the same result but with some traditional face-hiding sleight of hand from PJ and a mis-calculation from Chimpsky, evening out his 'victory' over Dredd. But look, this was an uplifting an enjoyable story with characters I look forward to seeing again, and absolutely terrific art throughout.
I'd look away now, true believers: the end of this 'Book' (groan) of Hershey was the worst kind of nonsense ("For you see, oh villain we don't really know anything about, I too secretly have Magic Enceladus Powers, and my Magic Enceladus Powers are bigger and bluer than yours, zzzzaaapppp"), all drawn in the most beautiful way. Even The Twist was only good in as far as it rescued a beloved character from a pointless off-screen death, not that it did anything interesting with him. If D. Bishop is up for it I would genuinely prefer another series of Space Girls to more of this, as long as Fraser got to draw it. Utterly gorgeous, but irredeemably awful.
Oh and to be positive for once, the Future Shock was aces (though an extra few panels showing the guy realise he was being set up just before the police break in would have made it spot on)
For my part I did like the Hershey story, mainly for her declaration that "Judge Dredd doesn't get to define me". One of my favourite Judge Dredd scenes in the whole past decade was when Hershey gave Dredd a carpet parade in "Bullet to King Four" and the breakdown of their relationship was something that I think the comic really didn't take proper full advantage of (Joseph "I no longer recognise your authority" Dredd suffered literally zero consequences for outright mutinying in public). I welcome an opportunity for a dedicated Hershey adventure to work that out in greater detail.
Quote from: Robert Frazer on 22 May, 2020, 05:02:16 PM
For my part I did like the Hershey story, mainly for her declaration that "Judge Dredd doesn't get to define me". One of my favourite Judge Dredd scenes in the whole past decade was when Hershey gave Dredd a carpet parade in "Bullet to King Four" and the breakdown of their relationship was something that I think the comic really didn't take proper full advantage of (Joseph "I no longer recognise your authority" Dredd suffered literally zero consequences for outright mutinying in public). I welcome an opportunity for a dedicated Hershey adventure to work that out in greater detail.
Yeah pretty much all of this for me too. In addition regardless of the character developments, the way it moved Hershey on so confidently (in terms of development, clearly not her confidence) and made for an elegant way to continue her story, yet keep it entirely seperate from what's gone before I really admired the innovation in the way it approached the story.
Both script and art pushed things along at a blistering pace in a way that seemed on the surface to provide singluar, simple focus on action and event, plot, action and event, plot ... and on... that gave it a restless energetic style. Yet at the same time, almost deceptively under that it was sharply focused on revealing character with great economy. I agree the mistakes made were atypical of Hershey, but that's it this was atypical Hershey, trying to redempt herself. The whole thing was so striking and stylish. But for me that style, as so often is the case was NOT at the scarifice of substance, far from it.
Just a triumph, with the emphasis on mph!
Quote from: TordelBack on 21 May, 2020, 09:13:09 PM
Acknowledging that Huffster and Batson are squaxx of long standing whose opinions are informed and weighty, I do wonder about dismissing in advance (1) a new series that no-one has read yet, (2) another of which there has been precisely one episode and (3) an as-yet unseen Dredd story.
Opinions on The Order and SIáine I get, those are largely known quantities at this point. Do y'all know something I don't...?
I'm sorry Tordle but I'm sorry to have to say this but I just don't like either The Order or SIáine as much as the rest of the community for various reasons which if I say, might cause some offence with some users, including both the mod's and the staff of the comic (since I respect them you all equally). As for the other strips:
1) Dredd - I have nothing against Dredd, I absolutely love Dredd.
2) Full Tilt Boogie - It sort of had my interest back when it was in the Prog last year, but I'm not eagerly looking forward to it than say Dredd, Brink, Shakara, Stickleback, Dante, Ten-Seconders, Proteus Vex, Cradlegrave, Survival Geeks, 86er's or Damnation Station in the Prog or even Lawless and Blunt in the Meg.
3) Nakka of the S.T.A.R.S - Since it's a relatively new strip, I'll best reserve judgement on it.
Incidentally, I think Tharg may have missed a trick by not starting the new Full Tilt Boogie series in next week's all ages issue. If he wants people who buy it buy the next issues, that is. Of course, there's two obvious drawbacks: firstly it would no longer be a completely self-contained affair, and secondly your usual 2000 Ad prog may not be suitable for youngsters who might read the All Ages prog. But if it's not a way to get more people reading the prog, then what are the All Ages progs for?
I doubt that kids themselves are buying the all-ages editions of 2000AD - rather, it's more likely that parents are buying the all-ages 2000AD so that when they sit down for their afternoon reading they have something they can share with their kids... or, alternatively, the sort of adults who review Nicktoons on Twitter are just buying it for themselves. In any case, seeing as they've revived the all-ages takeover multiple times now it's a strategy that's clearly working to bump up the sales figures.
Yes, good point
If it means more revenue for Rebellion to invest in 2000AD or in the Treasury of British Comics, then I'm all for it. It's only four times a year and it doesn't cost subscribers extra. (But I wish they'd stop this Cadet Dredd business; when I was of primary school age I wanted to read stories about grown-ups, not about kids.)
Quote from: MumboJimbo on 20 May, 2020, 11:16:48 AMVery much enjoyed the whole Chimsky's Law tale although agreed with what has already been said about the helmet debacle. Given the choice between enforcing the law and keeping on his helmet, Dredd would unhesitatingly choose the law.
Probably, but we have for years had people pretty much screaming at the Prog to add a bit of whimsy back to Dredd, which is so often these days a grim procedural. That kind of throwaway nonsense was, to me, a grin-inducing throwback to a different era of the comic, which dared to marry fun with death and destruction. Sure, it was silly and logically doesn't really hold; but it for me was one of the best moments in recent Progs.
On Hershey, I'm happy they made a woman of her age look like a woman of her age. It's a small thing, but 2000 AD still really struggles with diversity. Scan through most strips, and they are packed full of average-bodied white men. The Judges — in a future USA — are mostly white blokes. When female judges do appear, they often appear to resemble models. Anderson, despite being, what, in her 50s, mostly looks like a 20-year-old in the 1990s, hunting around for a gig in Loaded or FHM. So actually showing Hershey
as she would be is really great, even if it shouldn't at all be anomalous.
Quote from: MumboJimbo on 22 May, 2020, 09:42:10 PMthen what are the All Ages progs for?
Money. Rebellion's already noted the Regened Prog sold more than any other single issue. So under normal circumstances (i.e. with existing newsstand), you can assume this upcoming one would have done much the same, acting like a pseudo special. There's also value in the content. Get enough Cadet Dredd strips and you can compile them into a collection.
There may also be an element of testing the water. See which brands work. Do any look potentially sustainable for a new title? With 2000 AD more or less abandoned to old gits like us, is there a way for Rebellion to issue something regular for the kids? (And, let's face it, the kids aren't terribly well catered for once they grow out of bagged plastic tat. Frankly, I desperately hope The Phoenix's primarily subs model sees it through unscathed.)
Quote from: Richard on 23 May, 2020, 12:54:21 PM
If it means more revenue for Rebellion to invest in 2000AD or in the Treasury of British Comics, then I'm all for it. It's only four times a year and it doesn't cost subscribers extra. (But I wish they'd stop this Cadet Dredd business; when I was of primary school age I wanted to read stories about grown-ups, not about kids.)
One great thing about the Regened progs, is that they really, really annoy the kind of people who are most vocal on Facebook "fan" pages.
I do not mind the regen prog per say but I only want it to create a natural break between stories. prog 2184 is all new stories rather than waiting for 2 weeks for continuous of the current stories.
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 23 May, 2020, 01:52:09 PM
On Hershey, I'm happy they made a woman of her age look like a woman of her age. It's a small thing, but 2000 AD still really struggles with diversity. Scan through most strips, and they are packed full of average-bodied white men. The Judges — in a future USA — are mostly white blokes. When female judges do appear, they often appear to resemble models. Anderson, despite being, what, in her 50s, mostly looks like a 20-year-old in the 1990s, hunting around for a gig in Loaded or FHM. So actually showing Hershey as she would be is really great, even if it shouldn't at all be anomalous.
Yeah I know some folks on in some places can be a bit sneering about this being an issue but it is. As you say 2000ad has struggled with diversity in the past and the way Anderson is presented is at times a little embarrassing in this day and age.
Why shouldn't a woman of age be shown as a woman of age? We have no problem showing Dredd as a weather beaten older man. Why on earth can't Hershey and Anderson? Some folks can bemoan characters being portrayed 'out of character' yet in a visual medium still seem to expect female characters to be shown as 'pert young things' with bodies contoured at curious angles.
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 23 May, 2020, 01:52:09 PM
There may also be an element of testing the water. See which brands work. Do any look potentially sustainable for a new title? With 2000 AD more or less abandoned to old gits like us, is there a way for Rebellion to issue something regular for the kids? (And, let's face it, the kids aren't terribly well catered for once they grow out of bagged plastic tat. Frankly, I desperately hope The Phoenix's primarily subs model sees it through unscathed.)
Yes exactly this - I hope. As MumboJimbo suggests its seem very possible the sales on the previous 'all ages' being high is very likely older folks like me buying multiple copies, one for them, of for the kids. Now if that is the case BUT those same folks are prepared to be this on a more sustained basis all of a sudden its
possible a comic like this could sustain?
As IndigoPrime say The Phoenix as a very fine product - and we do both go on about it quite a lot in these parts and hopefully its built on a model that should not only sustain in times like this but in theory flourish. Jim - I think it is - has said many times that the cost of launching a new title are frightening BUT Rebellion will have a lot of the infrastructure in place to do this. Is producing more and more material with the new Specials, Roy of the Rovers etc so maybe sniffing around the edges of all this here is a place for a new comic - just which one in what format. Certainly the all ages 2000ad is a very different beast to The Phoenix which while wonderful is safe and 2000ad would have more of an edge as it did of old.
Does it have to be 2000ad? Could it draw on a number of sources like the Phoenix. Young Dredd, mixed with Roy, mixed with some of the other Archieve properers, new materials. The Phoenix doesn't have a single theme so that
could work?
Quote from: CalHab on 23 May, 2020, 03:06:30 PM
Quote from: Richard on 23 May, 2020, 12:54:21 PM
If it means more revenue for Rebellion to invest in 2000AD or in the Treasury of British Comics, then I'm all for it. It's only four times a year and it doesn't cost subscribers extra. (But I wish they'd stop this Cadet Dredd business; when I was of primary school age I wanted to read stories about grown-ups, not about kids.)
One great thing about the Regened progs, is that they really, really annoy the kind of people who are most vocal on Facebook "fan" pages.
Snigger.
Though to be fair that doesn't take much. In some case anything published since 1989 seems to do it!
Sometimes for something you love to exist, something else must exits which you do not like.
The thing that kind of gets me on Facebook is how many people haven't read the Prog since something like 1989, and yet still find the need to crap all over what it's doing today. I mean, I get it if you want to remain wrapped in your bubble and think nostalgia beats quality — because, let's face it, a lot of old 2000 AD does NOT hold up that well today, for all kinds of reasons — but to also throw all objectivity out of the window baffles me. (That's not to say 2000 AD is shitting gold every time, note. But 2000 AD has been a remarkably solid comic throughout Smith's run, and juggling everything for an anthology is a thankless and difficult task.)
On representation, I guess I just want 2000 AD to go further. I've had a go about The Phoenix about this. They do quite well, but still struggle (far too many male-led strips). 2000 AD is saddled to some extent by legacy, but it just needs a bit of thought. Why do so many artists default to literally every Judge being a burly bloke, bar when the pert Psi Judge rocks up? Perhaps the gradual increase in female creatives on the title will shift that a little. Here's hoping. (And, yes, Dredd can be — and usually is — a craggy old bastard, and so that looks very odd when he's next to Hershey or Anderson, both only ~15 years his junior, and they look like they're barely older than teens.)
As for another comic, it's hard to know what should be done, and what the market might sustain. Rebellion undoubtedly has a certain amount of infrastructure in place, but a new launch would still be a hell of a risk. Getting anything on to newsstands at the best of times is tricky and expensive, but after COVID is I suspect going to be vanishingly unlikely. But if the company did do this, what title should it be? To my mind, 2000 AD But Younger really muddies the waters. But nothing else really has a brand that shines through these days, bar, perhaps the humour stuff. Even then, Rebellion would have to tread carefully. Although I enjoyed Cor!/Buster a hell of a lot, putting them up week by week against The Beano and The Phoenix would be a tough ask. (Mind you, perhaps that would also just provide more outlets for great cartoonists...)
You make very good points and this is all pointless speculation as maybe, maybe there were plans before Covid19, but whatever they were will almost certianly be thrown into the air now. That said if Rebellion find folks are turning to comics and reading as an outlet in these times, who knows, could be that a sub model and online purchase is working... though overall crushing economic turmoil and no one spending money on expensive luxuries like comics seems far more likely alas. And it feels much more likely these products we hailed here are just in hanging on to survive mode?
But iiiiifffffff we got something new...
I really think a comic called Thrillpower (okay that's probably a terrible title, what do I know), buoyed and shielded in the known(ish) properties of Tharg, but not bound by them. So Roy, or better still Rocky of the Rovers alongside Cadet Dredd, some new materials from the all ages specials - as you so rightly say a new title can't fail where comics of the past have - there is no legacy or history to tie it down. The comic must be representative and have the diversity that society does*.Throw in some Misty Scream titles, so 13th Floor for Future Shocks format and you get the best of safe hands - pull mom and pop in for old time excitment - much like Tharg used Dan Dare, but pop it into the new.
Don't put it against The Beano and The Phoenix as they are there, put it between them and 2000ad. Using us lot as a key marketing tool. The older 2000ad readers with kids who we want to pimp our habit on. Find out whatever The Phoenix did to build a new audience since 2012 and easy - see simple as that successful comic.
Though whether there is a market between The Beano / The Phoenix and 2000ad is the question? Is there enough folks there willing to get into a habit like ours? Christ we gotta hope so.
Alas one economic disaster later and we may well never find out... even if we were about to... oh who knows but its fun to speculate.
*Should I refer to this as 'diversity', surely its just representation. Diversity makes it sound forced like you are trying to push things to 'diverse' places, where as what's needed is simply representing society and folks who live in it. Anyway I really am going beyond what I know here ... well even more than normal!
I have been having a long week at work ( 12 hours days in the NHS ) so yet again , I have been
very slow in posting my thoughts on this week's Prog -
frustrating as I get up at 6am and go to bed at 10pm - so my hobbies are dead and buried
( its the dehydration and stress of wearing the Covid Valve face masks in Anaesthetics )
As I said a while ago , the next time Jaegir is back , I know now what Nu-Eartrh would be like
(https://i.imgur.com/7pddWCk.jpg)
What Bruno Stahl very kindly sent me - when I bought his Comic ' The Hans '
( the aircraft to the right is George Preddy's Cripes A' Mighty 3rd
Dredd - very enjoyable and fun - and great artwork ( 5 out of 5 )
The Order - sorry to say , I don't welcome the return of this series - the first 2 episodes were very good and original - but for me its been downhill fast - the arts still great ( John Burns take a bow )
but I now struggle to work out what's been happening in The Order , and I now just don't care to find out .
If my opinion is a minority , that's fine with me , as long as a lot of people enjoy it .
( 1 out of 5 )
Future Shocks - Sublime Story-telling and a nice twist at the end ( 5 out of 5 )
Robin Henley - good job on the artwork , sir .
Hershey - This was a redemption and was a lot better , than last week - I will give the next series a chance and hope its good ( Simon Fraser - great artwork and Simon Bowland - nice colouring )
4 out of 5
Survival Geeks - I am glad the series comes to an end - I just hope it gets replaced with something good .
ABC Warriors by Pat Mills would do .
I thank Gordon Rennie for the great work involved - and Neil Googe for the nice art .
I hope he gives us a new series and character - as we have now lost 2 long-running stories from him
and he fills in a vital part of the Prog - Now can you get writing more Jaegir , please sir ?
I am also delighted Strontium Dog is back , I still hope he gets another new series in the Adult Prog
( 4 out of 5 )
Here is too the Regened Prog
Thank you 2000ad - its appreciated !
It's hard to know where the market will settle after COVID. Some titles will perform better than others, but anything overly reliant on the newsstand is going to suffer to some extent. The question is how many people have decided that they want to convert a habit into a subscription. I know some titles I work on have seen massive subscription upticks, but that doesn't counter the severe newsstand loss.
However, IF shops can reopen to some extent in June or July, perhaps the short-term loss can become a long-term gain, with more subscribers and a return to more-or-less stable newsstand sales. The level of economic shock will determine some of that — although people do still like luxuries, even when funds are tight. Perhaps favourite mags/comics might be OK. Hard to tell.
On something new, I know Matt isn't keen to cross the streams, hence 2000 AD not becoming a home for revamped takes on content from other titles (bar those that already merged with 2000 AD, obviously). But that doesn't suggest the rest couldn't merge into something new, positioned in the bracket below 2000 AD (which is still
technically a 'teens' comic, but in reality is now mostly bought by the 30+ bracket).
QuoteThough whether there is a market between The Beano / The Phoenix and 2000ad is the question?
I heard some interesting stuff about The Beano recently. When the new editor subtly revamped the comic, recognising the need to make it appealing to both genders, sales went up and the gender split of readers quite heavily shifted. Not a big surprise, I suppose, when Dennis stopped going URGH: GIRLS! and had two girls among his best mates. But also, readers have reportedly got older — The Beano now has people checking it out into their tweens — far beyond the
intended audience.
The Phoenix already attempts to address a very tricky and wide age range of 7–14, and it does so very well. So where would a new Rebellion comic sit? Also, these comics are relentlessly solid — and so Rebellion would have to be quite careful to ensure the quality of whatever it puts out isn't patchy. I'd argue, though, it does have a number of ins, when it comes to things like the sheer range of ideas in IP it owns, and also the ability to be a bit edgy. (To my mind, The Beano is too heavily reliant on wordplay in all its scripts. It's pretty relentless. The best stuff is when it frees things up a bit, such as Betty and the Yeti. The Phoenix has a lot more fun in trying stuff, shifting seemingly effortlessly between anarchic Jamie Smart strips, silly one-pagers, and action fare. But there's little grit in there.)
QuoteShould I refer to this as 'diversity', surely its just representation. Diversity makes it sound forced like you are trying to push things to 'diverse' places, where as what's needed is simply representing society and folks who live in it.
Well, that's my take as well. But I don't really care what it's called, as long as it happens. Although I've criticised The Phoenix and The Beano for this in the past, they are making an effort. The Beano is unfortunately saddled by a lot of legacy (such as Bash Street Kids), but Betty and JJ are POC, and there are girls beyond tom boys now. The Phoenix has a wider range of characters and body types in its strips, and I had a lovely chat on Twitter with Jamie Smart about how even in BvM he realised after a while about how the forest was basically filled with male characters, and sought to address that.
As I've said plenty of times, 2000 AD needs to be better in this area, both in terms of characters and art. But certainly if there's a new title for the younger generation, someone needs to sit and look at what's on offer, and decide whether it wants to be representative or instead be an echo of the past.
"Find out whatever The Phoenix did to build a new audience since 2012 and easy - see simple as that successful comic."
I hate to say it but I am not sure the Phoenix is a 'successful' comic, in the sense of 'does each issue make more money than it costs to put together'. My understanding is that the publisher, David Fickling, basically spent A LOT of his fairly vast fortune (a mix of his own family money + success from publishing books) but had enough money to keep it going for a few years. I believe the Phoenix as a publishing concept now DOES indeed make money by printing and selling collections of its strips, and because it has been going for long enough there's a seemingly endless supply of material it can package and reprint.
Of course, in another measure it's a massive success - it's an antohology comic that comes out every week without fail (even now) and is full of quality strips that appeal to its target age group. (My 10-year old daughter loves it; my 10-year old son not so much, but he's an avid Beano reader so both are well catered for!)
But to get that far, it needed serious cash + a publisher who really, really wanted the comic to exist. Not a million miles away from the Rebellion publishing model...
That makes sense. Even with Rebellion's support it's hard to see how the prog could exist without 2000AD's huge amount of collections. Something no new comic is going to be able to do for quite a while.
With The Phoenix, I'd say you don't get to 400 issues on vanity, and so it must by this point be profitable in some form. Its subs-heavy origins mostly point to a stable footing, and its gradual increase in newsstand presence is good to see — but has been and remains a bit slow. The reprint stuff must help. They're really smart on that score, with loads of great books coming out (although then sometimes going OOP), and they have those whopping great big multi-series collections for a tenner as well. It's interesting that DCT seems totally uninterested in following a similar reprint model — The Beano is comparatively disposable.
As for Rebellion, it does seem similar. People with a passion keep a comic going, and figure out how to make money, often through reprint... On a new comic, though, it's a really big ask, and now even more so.
Enjoying all the discussion here. I just wanted to chime in to say I roll my eyes every time the judges are all interchangeable white men. When I was a kid I always liked seeing more diversity amongst the judges. I presume it's usually down to the artist - a writer shouldn't have to specify 'please don't make all the judges white' or 'can you make some of the background judges women please'.
I can see how from one point of view, in a grim vision of the future you might expect a white patriarchal order to remain in charge. But I don't think the justice system in Dredd has been shown to discriminate in this way and I like that progressive vision of the future. It's one of the few optimistic elements of the strip!
So... Am I the only person who was expecting from the first episode of Hershey that [spoiler]Dirty Frank[/spoiler] would show up?
Quote from: Blue Cactus on 26 May, 2020, 01:52:27 PMI can see how from one point of view, in a grim vision of the future you might expect a white patriarchal order to remain in charge. But I don't think the justice system in Dredd has been shown to discriminate in this way and I like that progressive vision of the future. It's one of the few optimistic elements of the strip!
Exactly. Everyone is equal in the eyes of the law, and the strip's history has primarily concentrated on removing from society those who are genetically 'impure' rather than people by race or gender. (Religion is tricker to figure out—writers seem to paint a picture where the Judges injected a dumbed-down take on Christianity, and the original was probably made illegal; but other strips have dealt with religion in a far gentler way.)
But even if we delve into straightforward demographics today, black people are 13% of the US population, and white are 73%. But of that 'white' figure, something like one sixth is Hispanic/Latino (unless my paths is well off). Recent projections suggest white people will be under 50% by the middle of the 2000s, with Hispanic people accounting for about a quarter of the population. Of course, Dredd is Eastern seaboard, and lost most of its south; even so, it's hard to think by his time that perhaps half or more of the people in MC-1 wouldn't be BAME. Even if white people cling to power, you'd still be looking at a very sizeable number of Justice Dept people who are black or Hispanic (and a smaller but still fairly significant number of Asian); women entering various forces is also on the increase, and would hardly slow down by 2100 on.
So, yeah, it's banging the same ol' drum, but it does irk when a bunch of burly white male judges are standing around yet again, and then a woman Judge rocks up solely because the strip requires a Psi, or a black guy shows up because Giant's making a cameo, or it's time for America and so a Hispanic character finally gets an airing. (And I know that in itself is a bit hyperbolic—but only a bit.)
Quote from: Blue Cactus on 26 May, 2020, 01:52:27 PM...a writer shouldn't have to specify 'please don't make all the judges white' or 'can you make some of the background judges women please'.
I know writers prescribing details to artists is a bad way to go*, but perhaps a general editorial note to remind all players in the Wagnerian sandbox that the Judges are equal-opportunities fascists, and should maybe look like it?
It's perhaps not such a problem with supporting characters, with (for example) 2 black Chief Judges and 2 (1.75?) female Chief Judges out of the last 7 (McGruder and Hershey holding the top spot 4 times between them, and for the majority of the last 30 years), and with half-Hispanic (75%?) Beeny as heir-apparent - but for
background characters it's still pretty resolutely male and white. Do we
ever see East Asian MC1 judges? Kwan, maybe?
*Moore's voluminous scripts generally being misunderstood in this regard - as all his most successful artistic collaborators attest.
Quote from: TordelBack on 26 May, 2020, 03:08:54 PMIt's perhaps not such a problem with supporting characters
In other words, it's not a problem when character gender and race is already mandated. But for everything else, it tends towards white bloke. (This isn't only a Dreddworld problem, obviously — it extends into a slew of other comics, including those way beyond the House of Tharg. But it's something that would in 2000 AD be relatively easy to address in terms of general representation, even if the comic's likely in the short-to-medium term to remain quite weak in terms of representation from the leads.)
For me this has been a good run of Progs.
The only place to start is Survival Geeks. I really wasn't a fan of the story or the art for the first few series but the last 3 have really won me over, to the point where I am really going to miss it. I can't really see why it is ending - I am guessing the creators feel they have taken it as far as they can and are quitting before the joke wears thin.
To pick up on a couple of comments up thread. Each of the quartets have different clothes and glasses (for those that wear them). Reading it in pretty much one go as I have does really help with that.
As to how they can suddenly go home, if I recall correctly they could always have done - it was just that Clive was basically lying to the others about it all along to keep their adventures going. Note his answer to Sam's statement "wait..I thought we couldn't": "well that's not strictly accurate".
The best thing about The Order being back is the Cure inspired title of the episode. Apart from that it has surpassed itself and lost me from panel one. As with Survival Geeks it suffers from multiple incarnations of the same character. At least with Survival Geeks all I had to do was pay attention to this series. With The Order I basically haven't got a clue who any one is anymore. As is noted up thread both Kek-W and Dan Abnett have multiple complex ongoing stories. The difference is with Dan's I can follow them, either no problem or as with the last series of Brink I felt it was well worth the effort to go back and work out what was going on. I tried that with the last series of The Order and regret to say it just didn't work for me. Same thing with Deadworld.
Looking forward to the new series of Slaine, especially the artwork. It seems like absolutely ages since we got a sneak preview of it.
Quote from: IndigoPrime on 26 May, 2020, 03:44:48 PM
In other words, it's not a problem when character gender and race is already mandated. But for everything else, it tends towards white bloke.
Yup.
Sigh, late to the thread again. So much going on these days... and yet, conversely, not much going on at all... can't get my head round the passage of time at all. Assuming time is even still on the move. Anyway nice to see that this is the first 'prog' thread in ages to hit five pages, thanks to some intriguing discussion on the forthcoming Regened issue, the nature of Dredd's neurosis, the role of kids' comics in today's culture and nooo, I can't *believe* that Survival Geeks has finally come to and end, I love that strip so much it's been so brilliant the characters have been adorable and the stories have been fantastic and the art has just been unbelievable, and, and... you know when you just *get* a comic strip or a TV show or whatever and you love it so much you wish you were *part* of it (why am I still adding asterisks when I've stopped using italics) and then it's over and you feel like a little bit of it's gone with you (you don't? well what's wrong with you??!) and even though the last episode was a bit incoherent and didn't really explain everything it's still OK because that just adds to the mystique (yes Blake's Seven I'm looking at you) and ahh no there's only one page left and then it's over and...
Oh f*ck, I've just remembered where the "Look, were not unreasonable..." reference comes from. That is absolutely exquisite. Now actually going to go away and have a little cry.
Elsewhere in the prog: stuff.
^ I should point out that when I wrote that I was very slightly drunk.