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[two]

Second vote today - these votes are running in no particular order, just as they appear in my spreadsheet - some glorious characters here that show the diversity of story in the Prog. A bunch of Travellers and Explorers

Pop the names if the two characters you'd like to progress into Round 2 in a reply to this thread and I'll count up early Wednesday 22nd July.

Halo Jones (Ballard of Halo Jones) https://britishcomics.fandom.com/wiki/Halo_Jones
Jack Dancer (The Red Seas) https://comicvine.gamespot.com/captain-jack-dancer/4005-29321/
Wren (Brass Sun) https://comicvine.gamespot.com/wren/4005-85661/
Cyd (The Out) errr this will have to do...https://britishcomics.fandom.com/wiki/The_Out

What is all this nonsense? Well the 'rules' (ahem) for Round 1 are here:

https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46676.0

And there's more about the structure of the tournement here:

https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46631.0

[two]

So here we are - these votes are running in no particular order, just as they appear in my spreadsheet - and first up for the villains half is a bunch of Scoundels and tricksters.

Pop the names if the two characters you'd like to progress into Round 2 in a reply to this thread and I'll count up early Wednesday 22nd July.

Claw Carver (Flesh) https://britishcomics.fandom.com/wiki/Claw_Carver
Mr Brass + Mr Bland (Rogue Trooper) https://britishcomics.fandom.com/wiki/Mr_Brass_and_Mr_Bland
Cap'n Evilbood (Ace Trucking) http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/e/evilblood.htm
Protoid (Bad Company) https://britishcomics.fandom.com/wiki/Protoid

What is all this nonsense? Well the 'rules' (ahem) for Round 1 are here

https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46676.0

And there's more about the structure of the tournement here

https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46631.0

[Rules]

So here we go the Ultimate Not Dredd Tournament kicks off and here's how Round 1 will work.

Each day I will start 2 threads (Mods are you cool with this in the General Section as it does tend to swamp things - happy to move things if you wish). One for a group of 'Heroes', one for a group of 'Villains'

Rules

1. In each group you can vote for the two characters you'd like to go through to Round 2, just type the names in a reply to the thread.

2. There is no weighting to your vote, each vote gets that character 1 point.

3. If you vote for only one character in a vote thats fine but they will still only get one vote. If you name more than two I will give the first two mentioned a vote each (unless you make it clear who you are voting for in which case I will allocate accordingly)

4. After 3 days I will count up the votes in each group and the 2 characters with the most votes will progress into the next round.

5. Some groups for reasons of trying to be fair at nominations, have 5 characters in. This is just bad luck and only two will progress.

6. In the event of a tie I will have any casting vosts needed (I will therefore not vote in the actual rounds)

7. What makes the best character - well that's up to you. Its not meant to be the best, or most stories a character appears in, its how much you like the character. Can be best design, most interesting, heck you can decide it on who would win in a fight for all I care. All I ask is this is about the character not specifically their story.

So I'm not a big fan at all of original Rogue Trooper but I might vote for Mr Brass and Mr Bland as I think they are great characters.

8. As ever I'm making this up as I go along and might change things as I go on?

[Scoundels and tricksters]

Have a nosey here for how this will work.

https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46632.0

Got it - cool. Here are the groups and characters in each (in no particular order). There is no need to nominate the characters listed, we're looking for characters not included in the list below.

Nominations close early Sunday 19th July

Scoundels and tricksters

Claw Carver
Brass + Bland (exception as two characters)
Cap'n Evil Blood

Mega City One Mass murders

Orlok
Fink Angel
PJ Maybe

Cross world capers

Doctor Orlando Doyle
Mr. Cheetl
Satannus

Beasts and animals

Old One Eye
Tiger Commander
Shako

Cyborgs

Artie Gruber
Howard Quartz
Mean Machine

Strontium Dog

Max Bubba
Nelson Kreelman
Stix Brothers (see Brand and Brass!)

27th Century Russia

Dmitri Romanov
Lulu Romanov
Tsar Vladimir the Conqueror

Robots

BlackBlood
Mekquake
Toby (no need for spoiler right?)

Rogue Judges

Rico Dredd
Judge Cal
Judge Edgar

Demons and Undead

Ethan Kostabi
Jenny Simmons
Hauptmann Costanza

Dark Judges

Fear
Fire
Mortis

Crime lords

Stickleback
Moses Tenebaum
Al Bestardi

Military and Government

War Marshal Kazan
Van Owen
Traitor General

Mythical

Elfric
Slough Feg
Masterman (Lloigor)

World Leaders

Torquemada
President Booth
Mekon

Magic PSi types

Malok Brood
Judge Child
Sagon

[Travellers and explorers]

Have a nosey here for how this will work.

https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46632.0

Got it - cool. Here are the groups and characters in each (in no particular order). There is no need to nominate the characters listed, we're looking for characters not included in the list below.

Nominations close early Sunday 19th July

Travellers and explorers

Halo
Jones
Jack Dancer
Wren

Mega City Judges

Judge Hershey
Judge Anderson
Dirty Frank

Judges outside MC1

Metta Lawson
Devlin Waugh
Armitage

Citiziens

Max Normal
Chopper
DeMarco

Rebels

Nikolai Dante
D.R.
Bill Savage

Sports stars

John 'Giant' Clay
Matt Tallon
Bad' Jack Keller

Strontium Dogs

Johnny Alpha
Middenface McNulty
Durham Red

Robots / Cyborgs

Hammerstein
Ro-Jaws
Armoured Gideon

Soldiers

Rogue Trooper (original)
Kano
Jaegir

Killers

Harry Exton
Ramone Dexter
Finnegan Sinister

Historical

Aquila
Defoe
Slaine

Aliens and beasts

Skizz
Gene Hackman
Shakara

Criminals

Jim DeGriz
Lobster Random
Tyranny Rex

Police / Agents

M.A.C.H 1
Harry Absalom
Bridget Kurtis

The Rest 1 - yeah I know I know!

Zenith
Ace Garp
Nemesis

The Rest 2

Zombo
Dan Dare
Sam Slade

[Rules(ish)]

So if you've not read https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46631.0, yet give it a quick glance, it tries to explain what all this nonsense is about.

Done, okay cool. So here's how nominations will work. In a bit I'll add a thread a thread for nominations for each division. This will list the all groups in that division and three characters I have put into each. You then nominate who you'd like to fit into the 16 remaining slots.

Rules(ish)

1) You can vote for as many up to 16, or as few characters, as you like in each division.

2) Each character you nominate will get one point if you don't worry about which group they fit in - there isnabsolutely no need to do that as I will shuffle folks into groups as best I can when nominations are done and if its not a neat fit we'll all just have to get over it - no harm no foul.

3) If you nominate a character and allocate them a group I'll give that vote a bonus point, so it'll get two points. This will not mean that character fits into that group in the end but it'll help me.

4) If you share my pain and nominate one character for all 16 groups in a division (and trust me this has been hard to do I've had about 45426 variations and Group ideas!) I've give you another bonus point for your pain. So if you nominate a character, in groups for all 16 groups in that division, each vote you cast will get 3 points. I'll reward you for your efforts.

5) Total votes will count regardless of which group you vote for so don't worry if your vote is in a different group to other folks that's for me to sort at the end, the votes count the same for the character regardless.

6) Now whether a character is a hero or villian in 2000ad is a point of debate, which is part of why we love the comic so. If you vote for a character in one division and I decide (and it will be done that, but I'll defo listen to folks) they fit in the other division better I'll carry your vote across, even if you already have 16 nominations in that other division. All bonuses will carry as well.

7) I'm making this nonsense up as I go along so will listen to folks and add rules as required.

Most importantly have fun!

[Nominations]

So now the Godpleton cup has been awarded we've moving onto the next thing and I'd like that to be a character based tourney to determine which character, who isn't Judge Dredd is the most popular.

Here's how I plan this to work, its a bit like American football (in my head at least, I've not watch that since like 1988 or something!). The Tourney will start with 128 characters split across two divisions 'Heroes' and 'Villians' and we can discuss which characters are which as we go on! The 64 in each division will be split into 16 groups, each group based on a theme... but with enough room for me to cheat a bit!

Nominations: I have selected 3 of the 4 characters in each group, so 48 slots in each division have gone. To cover the fact I will have missed folk (cards on table I've had this set up for a few weeks now and until last week I'd missed Nemesis out!) or there are characters whose popularity I have under estimated. But mainly as there are just too many characters, I've left a slot in each group open for nominations by you fine folks and I'll explain that in another thread.

Round 1: The 128 characters will be halved as we vote on each group of characters across the two divisions and 2 from each group go through.

Round 2: We Get it down to 32 characters. Still in Groups (two getting through from each Group) still in divisions

Round 3: Still in divisions we go into a knockout format, with characters facing off against each other.

THE MERGING - As it can be so difficult to determine whether a 2000ad character is a hero or a villian we mush the two divisions together from here on in.

Round 4: 16 characters, 8 votes completely random draw, you know the format.

Quarter finals: Random draw you got it by now.

Semi finals

Finals

Maybe a face off with the winner against Dredd - who I'm excluding - or maybe we'll just assume Joe'll win, but on this one maybe not? Let's see how we feel hey.

[Dredd]

Steady Prog,  so stories felt like they were taking a breather.

Which is a weird thing to say when you consider Dredd. Our emaciated squad health and reflect, but trying to tackle the next 'horseman' from the air and releasing a deathy plague... and I call this taking a breather. Well it did feel like it to be honest. Rob Williams is joined by the wonderful Henry Flint in a solid episode that lacks the immediate tension that made the previous few work.

Full Tilt Boogie deals are reached, beaches sort, enemy contact made. Solid episode but not as good as the last few.

Diaboliks lacked a bit of the 'charm' I use the term loosely here of course of the last two episodes. Seems to be back to a nasty off between the opposing sides. Decent.

And then we get two thrill that just don't know how to let up.

The Order keeps its relentless entertaining pace as the desperate regard action is made and loses counted. The big frustration here is the final panel.

'Armoured Gideon! Turn and face me... Face your Doom!' but from off panel as if we're about to get a reveal. Or is it just Bacon from afar having released his army against him, the turn and face me suggests not. Bit of a weird cliff hanger.

The Out gets better and better as tone shifts and we get a sense of Cyd as a desperate refugee. Brilliant stuff.

So yeah not as strong as the last couple of Progs but nothing to worry about as nothing has taken a particularly bad turn, just episodes that aren't quite as strong.

As the flash bulbs cool and the red carpet is sweep clean inside the Rebellion Theatre Ballroom Dan Abnett makes his way to the stage as Pat Mills, Ian Edginton and the Original Writer fix grins to their faces and claps more heartily than anyone in the auditorium. Slightly flushed and getting his hanky ready he approaches the mic to give this his acceptance speech

I am surprised and flattered to find myself the winner of the Godpleton Cup for (*checks base of statuette*) "Best Not Wagner". This means a lot: if nothing else, it means the guy I'd have voted for would have won if he'd been allowed anywhere near the competition. I would like to thank all the members of the Forum who voted for me, or who campaigned and argued on my behalf, and I'd also like to thank the members of the Forum who voted for other writers so that some illusion that it wasn't a fix could be maintained. As a great man once said, "florix grabundae - this is ghafflebette." He was clearly as pissed as, but I think you get the sentiment.

   I feel vindicated by this award, that a writer responsible for such cutting edge work as Sancho Panzer and a quarter century of will-to-live-destroying puns in Sinister Dexter can finally gain appropriate recognition. I am also glad that, 2000AD credit cards not withstanding, you are now persuaded that there really is a writer called "Dan Abnett" who has produced such frankly stylistically incompatible series as Kingdom, Brink, Feral & Foe, The Out, Grey Area, Lawless and so forth... rather than "Dan Abnett" being an invented name (like "Tharg") used for newbie and try-out writers down the years. We would all like to thank you... I mean 'I'. I would like to thank you.

   I look forward to putting this (*re-examines statuette*) bronze runner up under fourteens Latin and Ballroom participation trophy labelled in Dymotape... on my "awards shelf" alongside "Best Writer Now" (plastic Bart Simpson bubble bath container with partial Letraset dedication), "Best Writer Who is My Dad" (Play-Doh "ashtray"), and my "Eisner" for most conspicuous use of inconsistent spelling.

   I also very much appreciate the efforts you made getting the trophy to me in these times of social distancing: throwing it through my office window like that gave it an authentic "priority Hermes overnight" feel. Plus, it gives my local glazier some much needed work in these lean times.

Seriously, thank you, members of the Forum.  I'm genuinely funting delighted.

                        — Dan Abnet

A massive thank you to Steev 'Small Blue Thing' for putting me in touch with Dan (don't worry I've not gone all fanboy on him just yet... well fully anyway!) and of course to Dan for taking the time to write this!

So you know I'm going to be pass some of the comments made about Dan's work during the comp to him. I'll do this without names - unless you let me know you'd like either your name or forum name included in which case I'll gladly do so.

Likewise if you don't want your comments passed on let me know as well.

[Dredd]

Oh that sub-tag line 'He is the jaw!' work it Tharg, work it.

Anyway Monday and no review thread - what's going on? I'm guessing folks didn't get it until today like myself. Anyway we're much as you were, which is no bad thing.

Dredd brings the first story in this arc to a suitably horrific ending. And like that we've off to our next big bad. Its solid and Dredd's reaction at the end worked well.

Full Tilt Boogie is a fine, fine comic, maybe not quite as good as last week but as our lines are drawn we head towards the major conflicit one suspects.

The Diaboliks is still all the better for Dellamore.

The Order continues to be sublime as robots march, cannons are fired and the dog has its day. Superb.

The Out continues to be so refreshing as language becomes a barrier and 'human-world person' becomes a refugee. Its fantastic stuff.

All in all it might have taken me a few issues but I'm loving this line-up.

Just as they did with Star Wars comics Marvel have now got the rights for comics relating to the Aliens and Predator franchises. I guess this means a couple of things:

• Hopefully Drak Horse will have an insanely good sale when their contract ends as they did with Star Wars
  
  Loads of Marvel characters while fight nasties I guess

Wonder what happens with Dredd vs Alien and Dredd vs. Predator etc etc.

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/marvel-comics-grabs-alien-and-predator-licenses-from-dark-horse/

Well after much drama - go check the Final Thread for details, the winner of the Ultimate No Wagner Tourney and holder of the Godpleton Cup is:

DAN ABNETT

I want to pull this out into its own thread so we had a proper chance to celebrate, not only Dan's work but that of the magnificent runner up Pat Mills, bronze cup (what?) winner Alan Moore and all the other writers we've discussed, mulled and by and larged deservedly praised to the hilt.

It was also a chance for me to thank all who have contributed to this. Its been such fun and has really kicked off some wonderful conversations / discussion and now with Broodbliks tourneys as well we have some fantastic additions to the chat around here and that's reflected in some astonishing increases in posts over the last couple of months. I wasn't sure if folks would be interested and engage with this, but its clear give a nerd a chance to debate their nerdery and vote and they will come. Long may it continue...

... I've decide a face off with Wagner would be pretty much pointless so I think I'll can that idea... but...

... speaking of continuing I'm hoping the fun will. I have my next tourney all planned and ready to go. AND ITS EVEN BIGGER. I'm going to start the prep for that on the boards in a week or so, but will discuss it here after we've had a chance to do one last celebration of Tharg's wonderful writers and Dan Abnett in particular.

Thanks again everyone its been a blast.

BOOM!

Well I'm on the trail again.

My lovely Samsung Galaxy Pro 12.2'' is starting to show its age - bless it. Its well over 5 years old now, maybe nearer 6 actually. Anyway its served me well but its beginning to faulter. Battery life isn't what it was and it crashed on me three time in quick succession this morning - seems fine again now who knows what coursed that.

Anyway its time I started to at least plan replacing it and find a target. The trouble is I really like the 12 inch screen space when reading comics - which is a fair chunk of its function.

Having looked around for a suitable replacement to aim for I'm struggling a little. There just doesn't seem a market in the UK for a good twelve incher. There is the Apple but its very expensive and I've never been a fan of any of the Apple devices I've had (have an iPhone from work and had an iPad which I gave back for a laptop for all sorts of reasons).

So I'm wondering if the Microsoft Surface is an option. Its just as expensive BUT will have other advantages being more of a laptop tablet combi. BUT does anyone here read comics on it? If so how is that?

Also can you even get the 2000ad App - or indeed others for it???

[Dredd]

I may have spelt that right.

The tagline might be a word that falls out your cake hole in very clumsy fashion, but man its a lovely cover all the same from Boo Cook. So atmospheric and evocative of Turner, which I assume was the plan and given Turner is one of my all time favs then I was always going to love it wasn't I.

Anyway its taken me a while to fall in line with this line up - though to be fair its taken a wee while for the line-up to settle in itself. Whatever this week its on a blinder.

Dredd is grim, horrific and utterly enthralling.

Full Tilt Boogie has really hit its stride in the last couple of weeks and has the gloriously energetic feel of the story I loved in the Special. Its fantastic this week, just fantastic.

As is The Out. I mean you see the influence of old sci-fi novel covers on that openning splash and the tone is so fresh and lively. Its fun, different (for 2000ad) and a blast. Loved it.

Oh as I do The Order while I've been getting used to other things, or other things have been getting up to their potential, or whatever its been The Order has been there as a rock. Just the best thing in the Prog over these last 4 weeks. The fact that its not this week is nothing to do with it - its still as good, its still as brilliant and this epsiode so much is packed in - its just the other strips have raised their game! Fantastic stuff.

As is Diaboliks which really benefits from shifting focus to a completely different character giving the series a break from wicked and thinking their cool or wicked and just being wicked. Its a blast this week... but can it last? Well lets hope.

So a clear five out of five and all the strips are just superb. All the more so as they all feel so utterly different from each other. The balance is just fantastic.

Oh and I might have forgotten my Hail Tharg last week. So

All hail Tharg

All Praise the Mighty One

Thank you Droids and all. lockdown might be breaking down, but we still need to be mighty grateful we're getting thrills of this quality.

[Ian Edginton]

Now while I've said that I'm not looking to us this tourney to define placing as the random draw, while making it exciting, also makes that unrealistic... BUT...

While the semi draw meant we had a blasting set of vote it avoided the fact that there was a generational thing that I was interested in seeing what folks felt about. So Pat Mills (well possibly his best love work anyway) and Alan Moore are so associated with the first generation of the comic and its perceived Golden Age, while Dabnett and Ian Edginton represent all that is fantastic about the Rebellion Age. So I decided that a 3rd and 4th place vote would be interesting from that perspective. So as one writer seems to be just, just creeping ahead in the Final vote I want to start this one too.

So based purely on their writing for Tharg whose work do you prefer?

Ian Edginton -  http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=profiles&choice=IANE

OR

Alan Moore - http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=profiles&choice=ALANM

What is all this nonsense you ask well we're finding out whose 2000ad (Meg and associated items) writing do you prefer? Voting - just add a comment here with whose work you prefer (and anything else you might wish to say to discuss their work). This vote closes some time early Thursday 2nd July?

Want to know more https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46552.0

[Dan Abnett]

I don't think there's much to say about this one. These two have probably (possibly) done more for the Prog than any other*. You could debate whether Pat Mills ruled the first half of Tharg's reign and Dan Adnett has owned the Rebellion years? Is that the distinction folks will have to make? Well that for you to decide as for the last time (well almost) I ask you to decide:

Dan Abnett - http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=profiles&choice=DANA

OR

Pat Mills - http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=profiles&choice=PATM

FOR THE GODPLETON CUP!

*This of course excludes John Wagner...

What is all this nonsense you ask well we're finding out whose 2000ad (Meg and associated items) writing do you prefer? Voting - just add a comment here with whose work you prefer (and anything else you might wish to say to discuss their work). This vote closes some time early Thursday 25th June?

Want to know more https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46552.0

We'll have a final soon.

[Ian Edginton]

So if the other semis final is the clash of the classic writers (and there is a lot of room for argument there) this one is the clash of Rebellion era writers (and there is a lot of room for argument there two!). Fair to say though these two appeared in the third or even fourth wave of writers but has siginifcently helped shape the Rebellion era and I think we'll all agree we're happy they are still doing that to this day. So whatever era nonsense I spout the important thing is whose writing for Tharg do you prefer.

Ian Edginton - http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=profiles&choice=IANE

OR

Dan Abnett - http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=profiles&choice=DANA

What is all this nonsense you ask well we're finding out whose 2000ad (Meg and associated items) writing do you prefer? Voting - just add a comment here with whose work you prefer (and anything else you might wish to say to discuss their work). This vote closes some time early Thursday 25th June?

Want to know more https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46552.0

We'll have a final soon.

[Pat Mills]

So when this all started I do wonder if asked whether this draw would have been the final that so many wanted? In my head it would be and this semi repeats the final of 12 years ago. Are these two titans of Tharg's  still the best regarded by the throngs of Squaxx dek Thargo overall, or have views changed?  Well fate has intervened as is so often the case in sport, the final people want happens earlier in the contest.

So whose writing for Tharg do you prefer. The fact that one all but created the comic and another went on to create the single most popular comic ever created (probably, hey I don't have the figures) counts for nothing here. So who will it be?

Pat Mills - http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=profiles&choice=patm

OR

Alan Moore - http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=droid&page=profiles&choice=ALANM

What is all this nonsense you ask well we're finding out whose 2000ad (Meg and associated items) writing do you prefer? Voting - just add a comment here with whose work you prefer (and anything else you might wish to say to discuss their work). This vote closes some time early Thursday 25th June?

Want to know more https://forums.2000ad.com/index.php?topic=46552.0

We'll have a final soon.

 Anyone read this. IDW mini by Brandon Easton and Kei Zama - two creators I don't really know at all. Its a bloomin' good read.

Dredd takes a bit of a back seat as we get a Vegaesque lead drive the story. An ex Cadet carrying what he thinks are sex drugs, but turn out to be something much more sinister indeed. Its got some interesting ideas bubbling away and I like the way he uses Dredd - even if some bit might make folks prickle I think he does a pretty good Joe. All in all a brisk and decent read. Not 100% on the art but its far from terrible. If this one keeps up like this could be one of the best IDW have done.

So we approach the awarding of the Godpleton Cup. I've worked out a schedule and done the draw for the semis (both excited and a little disappointed about the draw to be honest). Through to the semis are (in pointless seeding order):

2 Pat Mills
3 Dan Abnett
8 Ian Edginton
20 Alan Moore

So unless I hear strong opinion otherwise here's the schedule I have in mind.

I'll start both semi finals tomorrow. I was going to start them on different days, but realised once you know one, you know what the other one is anyway so might as well start them.

I'll allow them to run a little longer and wrap the up early Thursday morning.

Then I'll do a 3rd and 4th place play off and the final starting Friday first thing and running to wrap things up and award the Godpleton Cup to the winner on the morning of Thursday 25th June (I think it is) and we can all run around carrying the winner on our shoulders.

Well in fact we can concentrate on Broodblik's best of the Rebellion Years vote. Though I might start a call for nominations for what I've got planned next as its all ready to go and its inching away at me.

Cool beans.