The Political Thread

[TordelBack]

I'm intrigued.  How does having the right to do something (earn paid holidays, for example) in any way restrict people from not earning them if they don't want to? Whereas conversely not having that right means most of those who do want those benefits will never get them... 

Unnecessary anecdote time:  I recently took on some PAYE work with my major client, since it had become obvious I was going to be full-time on a single project for them with no clear end-date and was thus ridiculous to claim I was anything other than employed, and while the Bank Holidays and TOIL stuff is certainly nice, I still can't wait to get back to working solely for myself (I'm keeping the business ticking over with existing contracts, but not taking on any new contracts until I have the time).  It's a pleasant novelty, but it's not for me at this point in time.  But why would I want to deny other people the chance? 

The only argument I can see is a reduction employer costs, but if we assume businesses need people to do the work, then these super-flexible micro-entrepreneur shelf-stackers will presumably be charging more for their services so that they can afford to give themselves the benefits they have surrendered... I certainly charge more for my time as a self-employed person than I get paid as an employee for this very reason. 

One can only imagine that the intention is that the one-time employee does not do this, keeping business costs down, and having the knock-on effect of putting downward pressure on existing employee wages. And therefore that the hope behind this bollocks is that quality of life will be driven down for everybody but the usual suspects.

[IndigoPrime]

For a start, if you run your own business or are self employed you can still get a mortgage based on your historic and projected earnings.

Although, as we discovered recently, that's not exactly simple now. We wanted a remortgage, to build an extension. I had years of bank statements, a letter from my accountant about projected earnings, and a comprehensive list of expenses and outgoings. The lender was not remotely interested. As I was PAYE with one company at the time, that was all they cared about. The other income was almost dismissed. (All non-UK income was dismissed, including all royalties from book writing.) In the end, we got the money, but as a home-investment loan or some such. We were told we basically only got it because we'd been with the lender for 15 years, never missed a payment, and weren't asking for insane money. As a new customer in such circumstances, we'd have been shit out of luck.

[The Legendary Shark]

You Are Still Crying Wolf. Long but very interesting blog post exploring Trump's association with racism.

[Hawkmumbler]

I'm sorry Sharky but that article is the biggest load of bollocks i've read all week.

[Frank]

I realize that all of this is going to make me sound like a crazy person and put me completely at odds with every respectable thinker in the media, but luckily, being a crazy person at odds with every respectable thinker in the media has been a pretty good ticket to predictive accuracy lately

http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/11/16/you-are-still-crying-wolf/

I broadly agree, but posting that here is like tossing a grenade into a grenade factory staffed entirely by grenades.

Alexander's numbers - Trump got more votes from minorities/fewer votes from caucasians than Rommney, and ethnic minority voters outnumber the alt-right by a factor of 2000 - are more convincing than the suggestion that no racist would ever pose with a bowl of chili.

[Modern Panther]

There's a massive amount of effort being put into rewriting history to make Trump seem reasonable. 

We're being told that the rise of the hateful right is the fault of the complaining left, who spent too long calling racists racist, and not long enough listening to how difficult their lives are.

We're being told that, hey, the shitty things that Trump says were just to get into power, so now we don't have to worry, cause he's really a decent guy.  We're being told that its irrational to complain about racism, sexism, antisemitism, because it's just words and Mill's fighting for our civil rights when he launches hate campaigns at black actresses.

First off - Trump received more of the black vote than Romney?  So what?!  Romney was up against Obama. 

The idea that the alt-right isn't a powerful movement and so can be discounted?  And as evidence for that, we're told that /r/altright has only 5000 users.  Have a look at /r/altright...it currently has 6,855,000 subscribers.  It also helpfully says that it is devoted to white supremacy.

(Can we stop calling them "alt right".  We all have a word for what they are)

Enough understanding.  Enough apologies.  Fuck these people and their hateful little opinions.

[Modern Panther]

Milo, not Mills.

[Hawkmumbler]

Alt-reich.

[Frank]

we're told that /r/altright has only 5000 users.  Have a look at /r/altright...it currently has 6,855,000 subscribers

That conflates daily users and total subscriber numbers:




I don't like Trump; I think he's a vulgar idiot who is motivated entirely by egotism. But he won a similar number of votes to the previous successful GOP candidate, who wasn't running on a KKK ticket.

Given the rising US population since 2004, Trump actually lost voters, but the Democrats fielded a divisive candidate who was unable to turn out their base in the same states that voted for a mixed race dude for the last eight years*.


* but are now suddenly frothing Nazis?

[ZenArcade]

I broadly agree, but posting that here is like tossing a grenade into a grenade factory staffed entirely by grenades

And we take our lead from the Pat Mills bomb!  Z




[/quote]

[Modern Panther]

Of course their claimed figures are nonsense.  But this is the post truth future.

I certainly don't think that republican voters are frothing Nazis.   I do think that Trump deliberately appealed to the bigotted minority, drawing attention to himself by race baiting. He was supported by racists.  He was also supported by a disgruntled majority, who decided that having a morally bankrupt  billionaire conman who boasted  about sexual assault was better than Clinton.

[JOE SOAP]

We're being told that, hey, the shitty things that Trump says were just to get into power, so now we don't have to worry, cause he's really a decent guy.  We're being told that its irrational to complain about racism, sexism, antisemitism, because it's just words and Mill's fighting for our civil rights when he launches hate campaigns at black actresses.

Racism and sexism have always existed and as issues should always be denounced but to me they are only covering the real underlying problem that is not being addressed and is helping elevate those who harbour such hateful opinions while conflating them with those who don't but find the only other establishment party who could genuinely be progressive is also against their own interests of survival.

Mark Blyth sums it up better than I ever could -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWMmBG3Z4DI&t=13m11s

[Frank]

(Trump) was supported by racists.  He was also supported by a disgruntled majority, who decided that having a morally bankrupt billionaire conman who boasted about sexual assault was better than Clinton.

That's far too reasonable and nuanced an argument to make here, Panthro.

Mark Blyth sums it up better than I ever could -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWMmBG3Z4DI&t=13m11s

That guy's fantastic; cogent, articulate and persuasive. I couldn't help waiting for the drum machine to kick in though.

[JOE SOAP]

Mark Blyth sums it up better than I ever could -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWMmBG3Z4DI&t=13m11s

That guy's fantastic; cogent, articulate and persuasive. I couldn't help waiting for the drum machine to kick in though.

He devastates - his lecture Global Trumpism is worth a watch.

[Jim_Campbell]

How can this not be a red line for just about anyone who lives in this country? Are we really so apathetic that we can sleepwalk into this?

Coming hard on the heels of that other stuff: Tories to privatise key NHS agency.