Now that we're on 9, with 10 confirmed as coming soon, I wanted to ask-- do we know how long the case files will keep going to?
I heard awhile back they were planning at stopping with 11 or so, right around when Dredd's strips started having the color first 2 pages...
Some argued that they should continue to release them, at a higher price to account for the color pages, or release them with half the pages at the same price... I wasn't sure if any official decision had been made, or what.
Do you think we'll get more Dredd after volume 11? Any ideas?
All I know is, if they don't come up with some solution to keep the line going there will be much gnashing of teeth from this fan.
I vote full-color-half-size myself. Since they're doing that for Nemesis Vol.3 I really hope that's the experiment to test the waters to see if it's practical for Judge Dredd.
I heard awhile back they were planning at stopping with 11 or so, right around when Dredd's strips started having the color first 2 pages...
I thought they'd passed that point with The Judge Child in Case Files vol 4. Is that not the case?
I'm pretty sure we've been getting two-color page parts printed in Black and White for a while.
It's the full color era that's the sticky point.
I just hope they make it to oz before they stop its hardly been reprinted compared to other dredd megaepics
"I vote full-color-half-size myself. Since they're doing that for Nemesis Vol.3 I really hope that's the experiment to test the waters to see if it's practical for Judge Dredd."
It worked fine in Nem3, so I hope they go for full-colour-half-size as you suggest for Dredd.
It's a bit of shame that the Strontium Dog bonus stories that were originally in colour couldn't have had the same treatment as Nem3.
Slightly off topic, but I was disappointed that the first ABC Warriors collection I recently picked up didn't include the 3 page prologue story that the Titan edition included.
Regards
Robin
I just hope they make it to oz before they stop its hardly been reprinted compared to other dredd megaepics
By my (admittedly incautious) calculations, Oz is due to appear in CF11, so I'd imagine we'll definitely get that. Another two (one in colour, the other 50/50) would take us as far as Countdown to Necropolis which is overdue a full reprint.
I'd be ok if they stopped right around the lead up the Necropolis as long as they then immediately reprinted the whole shebang "Final Solution" style.
All the Kracken Stuff, The Deadman, and Necropolis itself. I really want to read that.
All the Kracken Stuff, The Deadman, and Necropolis itself. I really want to read that.
It really could be a licence to print money, properly handled - I'd love to have it all in one place. The Deadman would have to be included, Keef Ripley be damned! How does all that good gumbo work out page-count wise?
Back in 2005, Jamie Boardman explained that Rebellion did not have the rights to the ABC Warriors prologue and epilogue from the two Titan books. Those were commissioned by Titan for their albums.
Bear in mind that although the Case Files was initially conceived as a 13-book run, that doesn't mean things will necessarily pan out that way. Strontium Dog was originally supposed to be a line of standard trades, for example, but we now have four chunky volumes. Red Seas and others were initially released in hardback, but have now been reissued in softback, sometimes with extra content. The point being that things change. There's nothing to say Dredd won't continue being collected right through the dodgy years, past The Pit, and beyond. The main problem will likely be any decision on whether to integrate the Meg stuff, or just leave it with 2000 AD material. (Personally, I'd also bung The Dead Man in the appropriate place, but that's not strictly a Dredd tale, so...)
Megazine stories have been criminally under reprinted.
Some of them (non-Dredd) should get EE treatment.
Megazine Dredd tales should be reprinted in Case Files, but not the Dredd Case Files. ("Megacity Crime Files" maybe)
The cross over stories should be reprinted individually (ie 2000ad in Case files and Megazine in whatever form they take), and again in books that contain the complete stories. That way people have the option to buy both, neither, or whatever takes their fancy.
Anybody heard any rumours about EE plans for this year?
2000 AD EXTREME EDITION #27
by Various
The best of the Galaxy's Greatest Comic, complete and uncut! This issue, Matt Tallon's vicious quest for vengeance continues in "The Mean Arena," by Tom Tully, Steve Dillon, Eric Bradbury, and more! (C: 0-1-2)
Magazine, FC SRP: $5.99
"The cross over stories should be reprinted individually (ie 2000ad in Case files and Megazine in whatever form they take), and again in books that contain the complete stories. That way people have the option to buy both, neither, or whatever takes their fancy."
Mm. But then you have the problem of the Case Files omitting, say, Judgement Day, on the basis that it has crossover elements.
See, I would entirely skip over stories that have stand alone TP releases (and notate this in the Case Files volume they are omitted from) but then that kills the whole "complete/uncut" part of the title.
Really, the whole Case Files vs Stand Alone TP thing is the big issue here. Rebellion is reprinted color era stuff fairly heavily right now with only a few strips getting double dipped on (the first PJ Maybe and first Art of Kenny Who? strips spring to mind) so it's not a big deal (oh and all of Dredd Vs. Death. But that's cool)
But if the Case Files continue too far into Color era suddenly The Case Files start stepping on color TP toes.
That and the whole "Megazine issue" are pretty good reasons to stop the Case Files just before Necropolis (which, what with The Dead Man, is the first time the question of putting a non-main-Dredd-series into the Case Files comes up). All the B&W era stuff will be in print, including all the major mega-epics people generally look for as stand alone GNs (Cursed Earth, Judge Child, Apoc War, Oz, etc...) at that point.
Plus didn't everything Dredd go to complete shit post-Necropolis with Millar/Morrison/Ennis era? with their elephant dung style painted art?
Yeah, maybe that kind of crap should be reprinted for posterity at some point, but maybe right now isn't the best time. After wrapping up the Case Files they can redouble their efforts to reprint more of the important and key color era stuff that's actually worth reading.
Yeah, but Ennis/Morrison/Millar, are some of the top creators in US at the moment. So their "case file" could really be pushed and marketed in the US, as long as the tag line insists that Wagner's Dredd is EVEN BETTER (so that they're not put off afterwards).
Bear in mind that it will take years to get to this stage anyway, by which point a lot of the other trades will be out of print anyway. Skipping huge chunks from the Case Files makes no sense at all, even if you can refer to another trade.
I wouldn't be terribly angry if the series stopped with the end of Necropolis, as long as Dead Man's included, but you do then run the risk of doing what DC did with Hellblazer, only having 'choice' cuts, and wondering what the hell went on in-between them.
Indigo: I think everything SHOULD be reprinted, but the case files should only contain the 2000ad parts, and another collection of Meg stories should only contain the Meg parts. Then there should be a third "complete story" collection. (This is only relevant for Judgement Day, Wilderlands, and Doomsday right?)
That could be tricky from a production standpoint, since you'd have to keep the Case File and Meg Files in sync (or risk the same thing that happened with the ABC Warriors spin-off being reprinted way before the events in Nemesis that prompted it), and having a third tier in the mix would likely make people's brains explode (well, distributors' brains). Still, it'll be interesting to see what Jon and the PTBs decide.
I personally would be very unimpressed if I got a Casefile or a MegFile with only HALF a particular story. It would be completely unreadable and in essence worthless. Flipping back an forth between two case files to read one story is clumsy at best. And a down right logistical nightmare at worst. So either reprint the whole thing in both, or don't print it at all in either I say.
"Back in 2005, Jamie Boardman explained that Rebellion did not have the rights to the ABC Warriors prologue and epilogue from the two Titan books. Those were commissioned by Titan for their albums."
Wow, I was totally unaware of the prologue being specially commissioned, and because I only have volume one of Titan's ABC Warriors I didn't know there was an epilogue either. The search begins for volume two! Cheers for posting.
Curious, though, that Titan owns the rights to a strip featuring characters that Rebellion owns the right to. I'll never understand these copyright issues.
Regards
Robin
I'm sure its just that they own the artwork since they commissioned the piece. And won't give Rebellion the rights to reprint it.
Perhaps they should only include key stories from the meg if they do continue the case files. It would be a shame not to include the 'America' story arc's.
V
America is getting a new TP printing here in a few months so I don't see the need to rush it into a Casefile. Which just illustrates my point.
'I hope they go for full-colour-half-size as you suggest for Dredd.'
Think about it - B&W Case Files tend to reprint a years worth of material, yeah? And 11 volumes take us up to 1988/89. So theres another 20 years worth of material to reprint after that. So thats essentially FORTY more volumes.
And thats not even counting Megazine etc.
No, I think the best policy is to go up to Oz, then reprint various storylines and selected highlights from the Meg and 2000ad as the traditional 'red spine' editions.
...Obviously starting with 'Necropolis', then 'Mechanismo' then on from there.
If the Case Files go full colour, they'll drop to c. 200pp, not the 350pp+ volumes we've had so far. Therefore, it's more like six months per volume.
The problem with stopping at any arbitrary point is that gems will get lost. Just taking Oz as an example, would we be likely to see In the Bath or John Cassavetes is Dead? Probably notâ??they're 'small' stories, and while they're much-liked by those that have read them, they're not epics, nor part of a bigger storyline, and so they'd probably be glossed over. And yet they're part of the core of what makes Dredd Dredd.
I can see some merit in halting around Necropolis, at least for a breather, not least because Dredd goes downhill rather rapidly not long after that point. (Anyone clamouring for Sugar Beat in trade? Thought not.) However, I'm not sure I'd like to see the series halt sooner. (And even around then, you're 'losing' the democracy arc, etc.)
Perhaps one approach to the post-Oz stories (c. 1990-94, the "problem period") is to get some reader input on what stories should be included.
I suspect readers would agree we'd like everything Wagner or Ezquerra worked on, but maybe Jon could get a fans' committee together to propose what storylines and episodes most certainly should be included (all those related to democracy or Mechanismo, for instance, or In the Bath, John Cassavates, Bury My Knee at Wounded Heart, Love Story II) and which ones could be safely skipped (Juve Mutant Kung-Fu Kleggs or Eldster Ninja Mud-Wrestling Vigilantes).
One thing I feel very strongly about, as a result of the experience of my Thrillpowered Thursday reread, is that the prog and Meg are very much equally important during the period. Separating the line into "Dredd in 2000 AD" and "Dredd in the Meg" is not a good idea. The continuity crosses more than just with the specific crossover epics. Look how the Mechanismo story comes to 2000 AD with Conspiracy of Silence, for instance.
Actually, let's see if there is any consensus.
Here's the first year or so of stories from the full-color era (ten of which, the ones that ran along Horned God Bk 1, are BW). What do you think should be included or omitted from a Case Files 14?
Twister, 4 episodes, progs 588-591 (Wagner/Ridgway). - I say KEEP for the continuing character (Jug McKenzie)
What I Did During the Summer Holidays, by PJ Maybe, age 13, 3 episodes, progs 592-594 (Wagner/ Sharp) - KEEP - it's PJ!
Strange Customs, prog 595 (Wagner/Simpson) - DROP
A Night at the Circus, prog 596 (Wagner/Weston) - KEEP - first Weston in 2000 AD.
A Night at the Opera, prog 597 (Wagner/Ridgway) - DROP.
Worms, prog 598 (Grant/Weston) - DROP.
The Further Adventures of PJ Maybe, Age 14, prog 599 (Wagner/Sharp) - KEEP
The Power of the Gods, prog 600 (Grant/Fabry) - KEEP, funny + Fabry
Eldster Ninja Mud-Wrestling Vigilantes, prog 601 (Grant/Vanyo) - DROP, godawful
Accident Prone, prog 602 (Grant/Weston) - DROP
Curse of the Spider Woman, 2 episodes, progs 603-604 (Wagner/Simpson) - KEEP, beautiful, fan fave, resonates with mutant storylines
Alzheimer's Block, 2 episodes, progs 605-606 (Wagner/Ridgway) - KEEP, wonderful story, great characters
Tyger Tyger, prog 607 (Grant/Weston) - DROP
Our Man in Hondo, 4 episodes, progs 608-611 (Wagner/MacNeil) - KEEP; I don't like it, but it's the first Hondo story, first appearance of that judge who dies in Judgement Day, first color MacNeil too, I think.
Return of the Spider Woman, prog 612 (Wagner/Simpson) - KEEP, obviously.
That Sweet Stuff, prog 613 (Grant/Vanyo) - DROP.
Spock's Mock Chocs, prog 614 (Grant/McCarthy/Hewlett) - KEEP for the art
Crazy Barry, Little Mo, 4 episodes, progs 615-618 (Wagner/Weston) - KEEP
Lockin' Up the House (Cube Mix), prog 619 (Grant/ Braithwaite) - DROP
Breakdown on 9th Street, 2 episodes, progs 620-621 (Wagner/Higgins) - DROP
On Meeting Your Enemy, prog 622 (Grant/Kitson) - KEEP, ties in to Stan Lee series
Banana City, 3 episodes, progs 623-625 (Wagner/Simpson) - KEEP, first Ciudad Barranquilla, ties into Crazy Barry above
In the Bath, prog 626 (Wagner/Baikie) - KEEP, fan fave
John Cassavates is Dead, prog 627 (Grant/MacNeil) - KEEP, fan fave
10,000 is a Dangerous Age, Cynthia, prog 628 (Grant/MacNeil) - DROP
A Total Near-Death Experience, 2 episodes, progs 629-630 (Grant/Kitson) - DROP
A Child's Tale, prog 631 (Grant/Robinson) - DROP
The Confessions of PJ Maybe, Age 14, 3 episodes, progs 632-634 (Wagner/Sharp) - KEEP
An Elm Street Nightmare, prog 635 (Wagner/Austin) - DROP, pointless
Dead Juve's Curve, prog 636 (Grant/MacNeil) - KEEP, hilarious, esp. when the cits start singing
And the Wind Cried, prog 637 (Grant/Collins) - KEEP, sweet, Anderson
Kirby's Demon, prog 638 (Wagner/Ezquerra) - KEEP, Jack Kirby tribute, first all-color Ezquerra Dredd in the prog.
Curse of the Spider-Man, prog 639 (Wagner/Austin) - DROP
The Amazing Ant Man, prog 640 (Grant/Ezquerra) - DROP
The Great Little U-Front Disaster, prog 641 (Wagner/Weston) - DROP
Playaday, prog 642 (Wagner/Sharp) - DROP
Cardboard City, 3 episodes, progs 643-645 (Wagner/Kennedy) - KEEP, Maria, first all-color Kennedy
Over the Top, prog 646 (Wagner/Vanyo) - DROP
A Monkey's Tale, prog 647 (Grant/Marshall) - DROP
Confessions of a Rottweiler, progs 648-649 (Wagner/Braithwaite) - DROP
Stick with the keeps and that's a pretty solid Book 14, I'd say, and covers the period well...
I tend to think that regardless of what people think of the 90-94 trouble era, the series is still the COMPLETE case files.
I started buying these because there are a lot of tinier stories in between the mega epics that I like to read, and the trade paper is more legible than my newsprint copies in the garage.
I'd be a bit miffed if after 14 volumes or whatever, COMPLETE Case Files turns into "Eh, Not-So-Complete Case Files."
I say stick with it. Even through the rough patches-- there's a light on the other end of the tunnel after all! A big gorey light!
Its a nice idea in theory, but is even the most demented Dredd fan going to want 50+ volumes on the shelf?
Hopefully most of the worthwhile Dredd stuff will get around to being reprinted in anthology/artist or storyline collections.
Stuff like 'In the bath' could be included as part of volume one of 'Necropolis' for example, 'Cardboard City' could appear in a 'Crazy Meg Cits' style themed collection, and 'Crazy Barry, Little Mo' would go nicely in a 'Judges gone bad' style collection.
I think Dredd reaches a turning point at 'Necropolis' where storylines begin to get a lot more fractured, so it makes more sense to have all of, say 'Mechanismo/Wilderlands' all in one or two volumes rather than flicking back and forth between Case Files to read it all in one go.
"A Child's Tale, prog 631 (Grant/Robinson) - DROP"
One of the better single-parters of that era, IMO...
"Its a nice idea in theory, but is even the most demented Dredd fan going to want 50+ volumes on the shelf?"
Ultimately, the market would decide. If the series because unprofitable, it'd get canned in favour of something else (see: Sam Slade/Sin Dex, etc.) However, I suspect that if the Case Files series is canned prematurely, especially in favour of best-of collections, that's only going to serve to irritate readers. Think about how narked people are about the odd thing being missing from the Nemesis and Stront collections - now magnify that up when people realise Case Files 20 (or whatever) is missing about 50% of the strips from the time.
"Stuff like 'In the bath' could be included as part of volume one of 'Necropolis' for example"
But it wouldn't be, because it's not related. In fact, it's not really related to anything, bar, perhaps, Dredd getting older, and a lot of stories have that hint in anyway. It'd just get lost for more 'important' stories, despite it being a gem.
Well, they've never been the COMPLETE case files. Where's Mega-Miami? Tarantula? The Fear that Made Milwaukee Famous?
Are those Annual stories? Because I've never thought those really count toward the "Complete" moniker.
Are those Annual stories? Because I've never thought those really count toward the "Complete" moniker
In practice they clearly haven't, but they really really should. There's some great stuff in the later annuals and Summer Specials, and no reason other than a lack of good scanning copies) that they shouldn't be shoe-horned in, even a "Volume 0" would do. Particularly if we were to get the Megazine stuff.
I have to say, it's all or nothing for me. I don't want a greatest hits collection (again), I want the Complete Judge Dredd, (cock)warts and all. 'Course, I haven't bought any past No. 7 yet, so I should probably shut up.
Get me as far as Necropolis and I'll be a happy boy.
Oh I can't resist. Firstly, I think you're calculations are out a bit Hipster: at the current rate, Twister should appear pretty early in Volume 12.
On to the content then. No no no. Complete (which is to say, everything that's been in the weekly Prog and the Meg that they are allowed to reprint: annual and special stories are a nice but unnecesary bonus) or nothing, I say. No subjective judgements on worthiness or anything else.
It surprises me that they haven't previously pushed reprints of Meg Dredd material. Given the supposed 50-50 split between Prog readers who do and don't Meg it up, the ability to push genuine, Wagner Dredd that a lot of people haven't read really does seem like a pretty obvious move to me.
Maybe that's why I'm not a publisher.
Well, I'd prefer Complete as well. Fifty volumes, sixty, whatever. But since people are suggesting skipping bits they don't like, it's worth considering the options available to Rebellion. I'd still like a two-volume Mechanismo saga.
I dunno, I was pretty adled on codeine last night when I put that together. How remarkably nerdy of me.
I was pretty adled on codeine last night when I put that together. How remarkably nerdy of me.
Ah yes, in vicodin veritas.
It's a useful excerise, Hipster, and lord knows I never want to see some of your list again, but on the 'quality' basis I'd have cut half of Volume 1 right away, which would have been a shame. Print and be damned!
"Its a nice idea in theory, but is even the most demented Dredd fan going to want 50+ volumes on the shelf?"
Compared to the stacks of 2000+ progs and megazines that are lining my garage, pages falling out, slowly getting sucked dry by the passage of time? IN A NEW YORK MINUTE. These collections are just way more favorable in my opinion, to messy over-sized prog binders.
I think we've almost answered our own questions here, in all these long, complicated threads about how to continue the Case Files.
Future volumes would be such an awkard issue - full colour, extremely variable quality, the birth of the Meg stories, crossovers between the two - that I suspect Rebellion will just leave the whole sticky wicket alone and stop after Oz. It's what I'd do, rather than face the financial and logistical headaches of all this.
...stop after Oz. It's what I'd do...
Actually, I'd make the effort to get at least as far as Necropolis via a couple of colour volumes, not least because otherwise you'd miss out on most of the Kraken stuff and the Young Giant story.
"I think we've almost answered our own questions here, in all these long, complicated threads about how to continue the Case Files.
Future volumes would be such an awkard issue - full colour, extremely variable quality, the birth of the Meg stories, crossovers between the two - that I suspect Rebellion will just leave the whole sticky wicket alone and stop after Oz."
That's not the way I'd interpret this thread - I see a fair number of people who want an ongoing complete collection of Dredds from 2000AD.
When we discussed this in another thread a while ago, it turned out that even during the Dark Days of the early 90s, there were non-Wagner stories that people liked. I'd certainly put up with the stuff I hated in order to get the stuff I enjoyed.
Let's face it, the solid core of the people buying these collections are people who have the original Progs, bought the Complete Law in Order, the Eagle or Quality reprints, as well as Titan and Hamlyn reprints. We have this stuff and are still buying the Complete reprints because they're compact, convenient and very reasonably priced. If sales have been adequate so far, I don't see them dropping. In fact, once we hit the full colour stuff, I think there'll be some more interest from less dedicated fans as well.
Regards
Robin
I find that Slaine was very much a character of his era and a lot jumped onin Bisley but now there's Adventurer for one who cannot see the greatness of it.
Seems like we may be getting close to having an answer on this.
Apparently the latest issue of Deathray has an interview with Jon O, who states:
"Our printers in Malta have now worked out a way for us to include colour material too, which we've done with the last Nemesis volume as a bit of an experiment. It means that in the future, when we get to the fully painted era of 2000ad, we can continue the series but in colour-though the volumes may not be quite as fat".
Also states that Complete Robusters and Ace Trucking are coming soon.
This info courtesy of 2000adreview message board and Commando Forces.
*Presumably he is talking about the Dredd Case Files*
If so then Yay!
I really want the casefiles as my only Dredd GNs (which is why I don't have any of the compiled stories) so that's great news.
Although from the point of view of just getting a mortgage, that probably bad news... :-~
That's sounding pretty promising - Yay!
Although from the point of view of just getting a mortgage, that probably bad news... :-~
Yeah, I am behind on my GN collecting due to having just moved to a bigger-mortgaged home - darn bills!
Colour case files would be amazing.
'"Our printers in Malta have now worked out a way for us to include colour material too, which we've done with the last Nemesis volume as a bit of an experiment. It means that in the future, when we get to the fully painted era of 2000ad, we can continue the series but in colour-though the volumes may not be quite as fat".'
'Also states that Complete Robusters and Ace Trucking are coming soon.'
YES! FUCKING YES!
Regards
Robin
Great news, that.
- Steve