For those who have read them, what are your opinions on the 2000AD Black Flame novels? As a general consensus, were these good?
At home I primarily read comics and graphic novels; however, I read novels when I take the train to and from work nearly everyday. I've been plowing through 2000AD novels lately, including Judge Dredd Year 1,2,3, Rico, and the Judges books. I've also read the Kingdom book, the (awesome!) Fiends of the Eastern Front Bishop novels and Matt Smith's Strontium Dog. For the most part, I love em all. I'm running out of 2000AD novels and am wondering what to read next.
Recently I found a collection of Black Flame novels available, which includes a handful of SD books, a few Dredd, a couple Rogue Trooper and Durham Reds. They are selling for £7 each. So I ask you - are these worth while? I'm might tempted to jump on the lot...
(I'll add, when not reading on the train, I'm typically listening to the incomparable MCBC, or Space Spinner 2000!)
They're a mixed bag. There are some good novels in there, but some poor ones too.
For my money, "Rogue Trooper: Blood Relative" by James Swallow was the best of the RT novels.
"Ruthless", by Jonathan Clements, was the only good SD novel. One of the others annoyingly gives away a major plot point in the blurb on the back cover. [That said, I haven't read Matt Smith's slimline volume.]
...and it's been so long, I can't recall anything particular, good or bad, about the Dredd novels. Oh, the Andrew Cartmel one was a bit odd, like he didn't really know what the Judges were like. Then again, I think it was Pat Mills who suddenly gave us exorcist Judges out of nowhere a number of years back, so who am I to say? I think Dave Stone brought back a character of his that also bored me in the Big Finish audios, despite being played by Stephen Greif.
Bish-Op's Dante novels are pretty fun, if you like homages to the Stainless Steel Rat. And I do!
I should have a go at his Fiends books one day, they seem to be the most consistently praised of any 2000AD tie-in bit of prose.
I would not bother with the Slaine novels by Steven Sevile, as they no conection to the Pat Mills stories and it is like he has not read any of the originals either
Quote from: rogue69 on 22 February, 2023, 11:46:37 AMI would not bother with the Slaine novels by Steven Sevile, as they no conection to the Pat Mills stories and it is like he has not read any of the originals either
Ditto the Caballistics ones. Bishop's Fiends novels are brilliant stuff.
Definitely read Bishop's Fiends novels, the first three are a perfect trilogy!
Thanks for everyone's input - a little disappointed that the Strontium Dog books aren't that great, this was the series I was most interested in. Seeing that they are not written by Wagner/Grant I would have been probably yelling into the wind that the characterization is all wrong and "Johnny would never say that" etc..best to save myself the pain and reread the SD files when I have a hankering for Strontium Dog.
"Ruthless" is worth a read.
Quote from: Dash Decent on 22 February, 2023, 07:31:23 AMThen again, I think it was Pat Mills who suddenly gave us exorcist Judges out of nowhere a number of years back, so who am I to say?
Um, actually - exorcist judges have been with us since the second Anderson standalone story, The Possessed way back in prog 451 (3rd May 1986).
Quote from: Dash Decent on 24 February, 2023, 09:01:26 AM"Ruthless" is worth a read.
Thanks! I'll grab that one then, appreciate the recommendation.
There is also an ABC Warriors novel, the Medusa War, available,
is this just a novelizationof the comic? Not sure about that one as Mills is very hit and miss for me. I love the Meknificant Seven and Volgan wars, everything else...a mixed bag.
Quote from: sheridan on 24 February, 2023, 12:14:36 PMQuote from: Dash Decent on 22 February, 2023, 07:31:23 AMThen again, I think it was Pat Mills who suddenly gave us exorcist Judges out of nowhere a number of years back, so who am I to say?
Um, actually - exorcist judges have been with us since the second Anderson standalone story, The Possessed way back in prog 451 (3rd May 1986).
Yes, you're right. Hmm, what am I thinking of?
Here's list of all the Black Flame books
Judge Dredd:
Dredd vs Death by Gordon Rennie, Bad Moon Rising by David Bishop, Black Atlantic by Simon Jowett & Peter J Evans, Eclipse by James Swallow, The Final Cut by Matt Smith, Swine Fever by Andrew Cartmel, Whiteout by James Swallow, Psykogeddon byDave Stone,
ABC Warriors: The Medusa War by Pat Mills, Rage Against the Machines by Mike Wild,
Strontium Dog:
Bad Timing by Rebecca Levene, Prophet Margin by Simon Spurrier,Ruthless by Jonathan Clements,Day of the Dogs by Andrew Cartmel, A Fistful of Strontium by Jaspre Bark and Steve Lyons
Durham Red all by Peter J. Evans
The Unquiet Grave, The Omega Solution, The Encoded Heart, Manticore Reborn, Black Dawn
Rogue Trooper Crucible by Gordon Rennie,
Blood Relative by James Swallow, The Quartz Massacre by Rebecca Levene
From Russia with Lust: The Nikolai Dante Omnibus by David Bishop, collects: The Strangelove Gambit, Imperial Black, Honour Be Damned
Fiends of the Eastern Front (all by David Bishop)
Fiends of the Eastern Front, Operation Vampyr,The Blood Red Army,Twilight of the Dead, Fiends of the Rising Sun
Anderson: Psi Division Fear the Darkness by Mitchel Scanlon Anderson: Psi Division Red Shadows by Mitchel Scanlon Anderson: Psi Division Sins of the Father by Mitchel Scanlon Caballistics, Inc. Hell on Earth by Mike Wild, Caballistics, Inc. Better the Devil by Mike Wild, Slaine the Exile by Steven Savile, Slaine the Defiler by Steven Savile
If you go further back to 1993-95, prior to Black Flame/Abaddon, there was a series of in-canon Dredd novels by Virgin Books. The series comprised:
- The Savage Amusement (set mid August 2115)
- Deathmasques (set 20-22 August 2115)
- Dreddlocked (set 29-31 Oct 2115)
- Cursed Earth Asylum (set 6-22 Dec 2115)
- The Medusa Seed (set late Aug 2116)
- Dread Dominion (set mid-late May 2116)
- The Hundredfold Problem (set early Jun - 17 Jul 2116)
- Silencer (set 19-22 May 2116)
- Wetworks (set early Jun 2116)
As you can see, the novels were released slightly out of order according to when the stories are set. If I remember right, The Medusa Seed acts as a sequel to Deathmasques. Silencer is set during the Conspiracy of Silence/Wilderlands prologue comics, and will make more sense if you first read or familiarise yourself with Deathmasques, plus Harmony: Blood and Snow, and Missionary Man: Bad Moon Rising (though their involvement could be considered retcon).
According to Wiki, The Hundredfold Problem was later re-released as a non-Dreddverse story with characters renamed and all references to MC-1 removed.
I would say I enjoyed Dread Dominion, Silencer and Wetworks the most. I found some to be overly long, stretched a bit thin, and confusing at times (especially The Medusa Seed, which - while an interesting concept lay somewhere at the core - didn't make much sense to me).
Deathmasques was the only one I read (that was the Dredd / Armitage crossover, wasn't it?). I really liked it; Dredd's dialogue was a bit off but the Brit Cit worldbuilding was brilliant and really gave the city its own identity.
There were some really nice ideas there too - the notion
I DON'T KNOW HOW TO SPOILER TAG TEXT ON THE NEW LOOK FORUM BUT YOU'VE BEEN WARNED
of the Biblical Cain being a distorted folk memory of the murderous and immortal Jokai was a stroke of genius.
I recall really enjoying the Anderson ones, I think on the whole they were pretty good, some clunky Dredd ones, but worth a read.
Quote from: JayzusB.Christ on 28 February, 2023, 07:31:12 PMDeathmasques was the only one I read (that was the Dredd / Armitage crossover, wasn't it?).
It was. It's been a
lot of years since I last read it, but I remember enjoying it a great deal.
Thanks for that book listing rogue69, a helpful tool for picking out the ones worth pursuing.
I hadn't heard of the virgin book at all, good to know! Will keep my eyes peeled for those too.
If found for the right price, I'd likely try any of these. Anything called "Cursed Earth Asylum" sounds like a must read in my book...
Interestingly Black Flame had also done a deal with New Line Cinema & had made several novels based on films like Jason X,Final destination, Nightmare on Elm Street (Suffer the Children by David Bishop) , Friday the 13th & the Twilight Zone
If you wish to read Cursed Earth Asylum, I'd recommend first familiarising yourself with Anderson: Engram, and Missionary Man. There are some references!
I'll also give a thumbs up to the distinctive Brit-Cit as developed throughout Armitage and expanded upon in Deathmasques. The city is far more interesting with it's own style, than when it's portrayed as an MC-1-Lite.
***SPOILERS for Deathmasques, Big Finish: The Killing Zone and Cursed Earth Asylum***
I've been working through the Big Finish audio dramas too and am enjoying them; though was a little disappointed that The Killing Zone's Dredd/Efil Drago San encounter failed to mention their prior face off in Deathmasques. Their reactions in the audio drama suggested they'd never met before.
While I'm in the spoiler zone, related to Cursed Earth Asylum, it seems later Anderson story Crusade contradicts certain events from the novel, and doesn't seem to acknowledge its existence.
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 28 February, 2023, 10:53:14 PMQuote from: JayzusB.Christ on 28 February, 2023, 07:31:12 PMDeathmasques was the only one I read (that was the Dredd / Armitage crossover, wasn't it?).
It was. It's been a lot of years since I last read it, but I remember enjoying it a great deal.
I've just remembered one of my favourite bad-guy names ever from that novel - Shabba Bel Beth. Sadly he was only a bit-part juvey gang leader who
SPOILER!!!
made a lot of noise but was dispatched very quickly before he followed through on any of his threats. Very much like the leader of the Mutants from DKR, but not half as integral to the story.
Another thing that Dave Stone really nailed was the street patois of the disadvantaged London youth - I thought he'd come up with it himself, but it's taken me decades to discover it's very similar to the kind of West-Indies-influenced London accent that seems to have largely eclipsed the traditional cockney brogue among young Londoners (speaking from the expert vantage point of a small-town Mick whose only experience of living in the UK was a year in Aberystwyth University).
Or did he just get lucky with his predictions? His Brit Cit youth gangs were far more like the pierced and tattooed hoodies that would soon become reality than the 70s-style punk kids of Mega City 1.