2000 AD Online Forum

Link: WTF is a RAINBOW sheep?

And as my niece asked at an early age where in the actual verse does it say that Humpty Dumpty is an egg?

You know it's getting bad when befoer I could buy this computer I had to sign a document promising that if any black lesbian single mothers moved into my street they could use my computer whenever they wanted it.

But that's P.C. World for you.

>And as my niece asked at an early age where in the actual verse does it say that Humpty Dumpty is an egg?

That'll be no-where as the rhyme was originaly about a civil war siege engine. The egg humpty is Lewis Carrol but gets added to the nursery rhyme all the time.

Still I always get a bit worried about 'it's political correctness gone mad!' stories as most of them turn out to be bollocks

I think it's how a sheep looks when you've taken an inordinate amount of LSD.

I can confirm that dweezil speaks the truth.

Is that wall breathing?

I am disgusted by this story!

They've added an extra syllable and now the entire pentameter of the rhyme is fucked.

Morons.

At least, I think that's the correct use of pentameter, if it's not, it's the department of educations fault for not teaching it to me properly.

There is a mistaken belief out there that "Baa Baa Black Sheep" originates in the slave trade.  In fact, it predates trafficking in African slaves by over 300 years.

Investigations suggest that this is a rare case where the "non-PC" (i.e. racist, sexist, homophobes) brigade haven't particularly twisted the facts.  This Stewart Chamberlain chap appears to have thought about the idea of a white child singing "baa baa black sheep" at a black child, as a form of bullying - which, incidentally, does go on - and, inspired by an old idea from America, brought in "baa baa rainbow sheep" as a substitute.  

It's an unintelligent action for several reasons.  1) The original purpose of the rhyme was to educate children about real animals, but there's no such thing as a "rainbow sheep".  2) As Garamin says, it buggers up the rhythm something awful.  3) By censoring the word "black", it separates out and suggests there is a stigma to blackness.

However, I do think that the motives of the tabloids in whipping up a storm about this (It was the front page headline of at least one) are deeply suspect.  The action was misguided but not malicious, and comes from the same benevolent impulses that mean that most children today don't sing "eeny meeny miny mo, catch a nigger by his toe" in the playground.

Oh, and by the way, this isn't the first time...

Link: News from the year 2000

A couple of years back my mates wife was telling us that their kids nursery had started singing...

"Ba Ba woolly sheep, have you any wool?"

To which I pointed out of course it fucking does, its called woolly sheep. So overly PC and stupid.

Now when the vicar drops in to the Broons and sits on a freshly painted chair will Ma be "rainbow affronted"?

I think the use of the word "rainbow" is a device to promote homosexuality amongst children!

Down with this sort of thing!

This cropped up in the mid-80s as well, except that time it was "Baa Baa Green Sheep", and people were saying "Why it's PC gone mad, I tell you - who ever heard of a green sheep!" etc.

It might just be papers making up stories to sell themselves - they do that, you know.

Or it might be the same stupid idea about censoring the word "black" that crops up on a regular basis.

If you don't agree with this censorship that makes you a racist.

And a nazi.

There, I said it.

It's like, how much more black could this be? and the answer is none. None more black.

Ah, rhymes about rainbow sheep: preparing our nation for the inevitable arrival of genetically modified sheep.

"who ever heard of a green sheep!"

Weell, if a sheep dies and the farmer doesn't get to it for a few days, it gets a wee bit greenish.  It can also swell up considerably, what with gases and decomposition and all, which is all fine and good until your bastard of a dog runs off and jumps on the bloody thing and it bursts.  Which is actually fecking hilarious if you're not the one that has to clean the dog off afterwards.

 

"i.e. racist, sexist, homophobes"

Tsk!  That's me you're talking about, there, Duds.  What did we say about the wrongness of generalising?  I dislike a lot of silly P.C. nonsense- this does not make me racist, sexist or homophobic.

You big gaybo.

"Still I always get a bit worried about 'it's political correctness gone mad!' stories as most of them turn out to be bollocks"

Yeah, what Gary said. And what James said too. And The Satanist, and johnnystress, and the lone funter, and 54 Jones...

It's like an episode of South Park. Gone mad. Well-meaning but misguided it seems to me, and not having learned anything from previous experience. This sort of thing always gets people's backs up. If they don't like this nursery rhyme, they don't have to teach it to kids in their care, unless it's a brainwashing effort. Rainbow sheep is obvious nonsense, and totally overlooks the existence of big sheep, which would, by implication, have more wool on them...

As to the guff about Humpty Dumpty, I'm totally nonplussed. Does Jack to longer fall down and break his crown either, or is that one okay because it can be mended with vinegar and brown paper?

I've nothing against do-gooders leaving out things that make them feel uncomfortable, but I'd prefer that they didn't go making up new crap to fill its place.

Idiots.

Hmm. Not exactly the rant I'd planned, but then that's ranting for you.

(Thinks: Daily Mail editorial in 500 words or less...)

Humpty dumpty refers to a cannon used in the English Civil war. So rather than sparing kids feelings why not explain to them that its a cannon (a machine useed for killing and maiming) and stop molly coddling the little snipes.

baa baa nice sheep is it ok if I enquire if you have any wool?

yes, non gender specific terminoloy, yes, non gender specific terminoloy, yes, non gender specific terminoloy, three bags full.

etc etc

Hard to imagine it striking fear through the hearts of the enemy: "Careful lads...they've got a Humpty Dumpty!"

ADE

"Don't worry lads, they're only Daisycutters"

"But being as this is a humpty dumpty, the most powerful canon in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself a question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?"


hmm, you're right

A siege engine that fired giant eggs?

All sounds a bit far-fetched to me, you stupid black girly poofs.

P.c Rhymes sounds like some sort of horrible  character invented by comittee to be "down wit da kids"


He's da rappinist, hiphoppinnest bobby on da beat

I dislike a lot of silly P.C. nonsense- this does not make me racist, sexist or homophobic.

Nor does it make you "anti-PC" - I was more talking about the likes of the Daily Mail.  Then again, you're a Tory so you probably read the thing.  It's probably your dream to become their political cartoonist.  See that Daily Express reader?  That's you, that is.



BTW, what sort of silly PC nonsense do you dislike?  Funding for black lesbian theatre groups?

;)

Um... Gaybo!

"Funding for black lesbian theatre groups?"

Well if they're anything like the one I saw in Amsterdam then I'm all for it.

The stupidest thing about PC is that in the first place the term came about as a result of left-wing types having a sense of humour and being able to laugh at themselves. Before politically correct, things were either 'right on' or not. Political correctness was a joke spawned by the perfectly well-intentioned use of technically accurate terms in place of offensive ones. Thus, it became commonplace to use the phrase 'he or she' when referring to the hypothetical individual, instead of always presuming 'he' as a default.

It led to absurdity when petty officials let their squeamishness get in the way of common sense, as per avoiding the word black in the classroom, as if the word itself is offensive, when it isn't. When it comes to language, context is always important.

By laughing at their own delicate sensibilities and circumlocutory strategies for avoiding offense, and coming up with the term 'politically correct' in jest, the left unwittingly handed reactionary press and politicians a stick to beat them with.

Humpty Dumpty was in fact an unusually large canon which was mounted on the protective wall of "St. Mary's Wall Church" in Colchester, England. It was intended to protect the Parliamentarian stronghold of Colchester which was in the temporarily in control of the Royalists during the period of English history, described as the English Civil War ( 1642 - 1649). A shot from a Parliamentary canon succeeded in damaging the wall underneath Humpty Dumpty causing the canon to fall to the ground. The Royalists 'all the King's men' attempted to raise Humpty Dumpty on to another part of the wall but even with the help of ' all the King's horses' failed in their task and Colchester fell to the Parliamentarians after a siege lasting eleven weeks.

Link: Lotsa nursery rhymes explained (pop-ups may annoy.

How about "Baa baa ovine mammal of non specific racial origin, have you any wool"?

What do you mean "What have I got against bald sheep"?

what is this bizarre fetish these lefty pinkos have of addressing themselves as furniture?..

God, that picture of PC Rhymes is creepy...

"what is this bizarre fetish these lefty pinkos have of addressing themselves as furniture?.."

That's easily answered. To some people, it would appear sexist if a woman is expected to take the title of 'chairman'. Apparently though, not Theresa May, who served as chairman of the Conservative Party from 2002-2003.

The alternative, chairperson, sounds stupid when the gender of the person in question is known. 'Madam Chairperson' is both ridiculous and a mouthful.

Madam Chairman has a nice ring to it, actually, but its simple logic can confuse the unimaginative.

Because in meetings comments should be addressed through the chair, it makes sense to refer to person chairing a meeting also as the chair, and it is a lot less effort and a lot more informal to say.

No-one addresses the chair (man or woman) directly any more. This is partly to do with fear of getting it wrong, but it's also part of the dimunition of common courtesy in everyday life that's part and parcel of de-differentiation and the removal of deference, characteristic of late modernity.

Political correctness can lead to mistakes if not followed logically and applied consistently. Thus it's common to hear 'Mister Chairman' and 'Madam Chairperson', as if men have gender and women don't, which is quite wrong and also sexist.

I'm for euqality of the sexes.

Euqal rights for all humans/huwomans

Hey, Huwomen are people too!

aye thats all very well and good but if its a man in the 'Chair' its Chairman and if its a woman its Chairwoman...why do they ignore the simple?

What if its one of those times when you aren't quite sure? Woman with a strong jaw or effeminate bloke? Then you're in trouble.

Ah, well -  then you're looking at yer basic chairdyke or chairpoof, aren't you?

I'll get me cloak...

but if its a man in the 'Chair' its Chairman and if its a woman its Chairwoman...why do they ignore the simple?

Cos its a pain in the arse changing the stationary every time you change the gender of your glorious leader.

Because you only need chairman or chairwoman when referring to the chair, in which case you can just use 'chair' for short: "I put my question to him through the chair", "I had a comment to make but the chair wasn't taking any more questions or contributions from the floor".

These days people are reluctant to address the chair directly (Mister Chairman; Madam Chairwoman) both because it's stiff, formal and cumbersome and because people are nervous about etiquette and getting it wrong.

"people are reluctant to address the chair directly because it's stiff and cumbersome"

Items of furniture so often are, I find.

Bit offensive to beanbags and hammocks though.

True, but why would you address a hammock as a chair unless you were deliberately trying to stir up trouble?

One of the boy's nursery rhyme books has Baa Baa Black sheep, followed by Baa Baa White Sheep and finishes off with Baa Baa Rainbow Sheep...so we get 3 verses, and they're not too bad either.

For some reason the nursery he goes to has added, 'Because he is an Egg' to the end of Humpty Dumpty, which was cute in the way the boy used to say it.

Slightly off topic (Can you get off topic on an Off Topic thread?).

I believe the term you're looking for would bewould be Meter.
 
Pentameter refers to a verse where there are specifically  5 (Hence the pent Latin Fans!) Iambs in a line.

(Ref: just about everything Shakespere everwrote, with the possible exeption of his Shopping Lists.)  

An Iamb is, IIRC a pair of syllables  eg. Baa-Baa, Black sheep...

I think the rhyme we're talking about is in Duometer, I could Be wrong.


  BTW Thanks for FINALLY validating those three years I spent(Yes, spent, not wasted!) getting a Creative Writing Degree.

  Back to the theme of the thread, what really bugs me is the flagrant misuse of the phrase `gone mad` to indicate a thing being taken to it's logical extreme.

  If they started to restrict use of the word 'The' because it's offensive to Bees,
THAT would be Political Correctness gone mad...

  And also, at what point did these overly cautious abusers of Political Correctness organise themselves into a Brigade? What's the Command structure, do they have Meetings?

Owing to the outpourings of the likes of Anne Leslie, Melanie Phillips, Norman Tebbit, Gary Bushell, Peter Hitchens at al, one might be forgiven for imagining that 'gone mad' was the natural state of political correctness.

Rent-a-gobs looking for easy targets.

'chair' makes sense to me; since the gender of the person isn't relevant to the job, why specify it?
   I took my son's nursery teacher to task last year. She'd taught the kids that the rhyme "easy peasy Japanesey lemon squeazy" etc wasn't good to say because Japanesey might offend Japanese people. I explained to her that, unlike the 'n-word' in eeny, meeny,miney mo, 'Japanesey' has no meaning as a racial epithet, it's just a nonsense rhyme and that I didn't want my son worrying about his ethnic background when he didn't have to.
  It was very difficult to do, as I respected the teacher and I liked her efforts in general.

if i were a four poster bed i'd be a bit miffed to be addressed as a chaise longue...also if you totally disregard the rights of sideboards and lump them in with (choke) drinks cabinets and chest of drawers you better be damn well prepared for revolution..

viva la comode...

Going back on-topic?

?Children at the two family centres sing a variety of descriptive words in the nursery rhyme to turn the song into an action rhyme.  They sing happy, sad, bouncing, hopping, pink, blue, black and white sheep etc.  This encourages children to extend their vocabulary.?  
- Press release from the charity Parents and Children Together, which runs the nurseries in question.  

This press release has not been reported by any national UK newspaper or broadcaster, despite being released via the Press Association.  As per usual, a combination of tabloid press need to sell product and some people?s eagerness to believe anything about the mythical PC lobby has collided to produce a ?scandal? out of almost nonexistent ingredients.

But if we hadn't blown this thing out of all proportion, we'd have had to've spent all this time WORKING!

The 'PC Brigade' have caused another storm by rewriting a favourite nursery rhyme. They have changed Baa Baa Black Sheep to - Baa Baa Rainbow Sheep. Several nurseries have changed the traditional rhyme so as not offend ethnic minorities, it has been reported.




Courtesy of the Eye...