I've never read any of this and I noticed Borders are selling all the collections half-price. So, is it worth trying them out and, if so, what should I pick up given I have no real knowledge of the series beyond thinking it's about monochrome Mexican lesbians.
And while we're at it, what about Cerebus? I occasionally see people saying that Dave Sim's a nutter, but I don't know why and I'd like to know if it makes his comics bad.
If these are the new editions, go for The Girl from HOPPERS and Human Diastrophism. They're really brilliant, some of the best comics ever.
Love and Rockets is terrific - there's much more to it than monochrome Mexican lesbians (not that there's anything wrong with that) - very Ditko-like art, fun, interesting stories. Highly recommended.
Early Cerebus was fun, in a simple way. Then it became fun in a more sophisticated way. I'm not sure what happened next - I think it became very ponderous.
Dave Sim is a nutter on the subject of women and feminism. He sees women as being unfit for equality because they are 'emotional', whereas men, at least men like him, are logical and that's just the way they are (although he shows signs of great emotion when writing on the subject). He attributes his clarity on the subject of women to his abstaining from sex - it's as if the bonkers colonel from Dr Strangelove were a Canadian comics auteur.
I read comics today because I found Love and Rockets when I was at the age where a boy begins to give them up. Get them you won't regret it.
Cerebus is an interesting case. The volumes Cerebus through Jakas Story are pure gold. After that, well, that's when the debate starts. Sim is not anti-feminist exactly, he's a misogynist. I say this because even in an entirely patriarchal state chicks would still bug him. He seems to hate and resent how much men bend over backwards to please women. But that's been true of heterosexual men since time began.
Anyhow the strange thing about his comics is that if you hadn't read the essays you probably wouldn't know his stance. The women are all well drawn and balanced. Jaka who Sim's said he's exposed as the spoiled princess she is, comes off better than Cerebus. The Cirinists feel more like a comment on totalitarian states and how they are built from good intentions than a satire of feminists. The artist is so strong he wins most battles over the lunatic.
Avoid Reads, Rick's Story, and Latter Days.
Buy them now. NOW.
Cerebus is as good a comic as ever there was, for the first 200, maybe even 250, issues. Unfortunately there are 300 issues.
Early Cerebus is a crude parody of Conan, Lankhmar and Elric and very funny within those parameters. It then moves into an absolutely hilarious exploration of politics, comics Cons, the Marx brothers and a Batman/Moonknight(!) parody (High Society, followed by a slightly less hilarious but much deeper and more beautifully drawn exploration of organised religion, with some great caricatures of the Rolling Stones and Miller's Batman, and a guest appearance by the Flaming Carrot (Church and State).
This is followed by Sim's masterpiece, Jaka's Story, a sort-of love triangle, with an Oscar Wilde caricature as a backdrop. A moving account of the real Wilde's death follows (Melmoth), and then a blast of action (Flight), and an exploration of feminism and a marvellous Sandman parody (Women).
The main story then effectively finishes quite satisfyingly in Issue 200 (the end of Minds) amidst a welter of violence and pretty cool fourth-wall violations and Sim's bizarre text manifesto in Reads (about which more later).
After this apparent conclusion 2/3 of the way through the 300-issue 6000-page run, we follow Cerebus as his life contnues even when his destiny appears to have run its course. It's a brilliant idea, but very unevenly executed.
The first new storyline, Guys is hilarious, an examination of pub culture and the role of men in the post-feminist world, featuring George Harrison and Ringo Starr parodies tending an eternally free bar bar for a plethora of comics characters inlcuding Alec and Popeye. The art is incredible, the serious points sharp and the gags brilliant. Then with Rick's Story things go south fast. Bizarre seemingly endless religious text-pieces jostle for space with comics bios of F. Scott Fitzgerald, Hemmingway (Sim hates Hemmingway, which may or may not be ironic), the Three Stooges, and Woody Allen. Oh, and there's a pretty dire Preacher-slash-Superman parody in there too. It's fascinating, still beautifully drawn, but ultimately way, way too long. And the end is well... unexpected.
It's worth it for the moments of genius, the interesting insights into the real-world characters, and to see Cerebus himself through to the end, but you can't help wishing it had ended back in that pub-that-never closes inGuys
And so to Sim the man, and his manifesto.
Put simply, Sim is bonafide sexist, of the considered and thoughtful variety - which explains the paradox of his well-written female characters - he's really thought about this stuff.
He argues that the sexes are fundamentally different, and have different aptitudes and attitudes that are inescapable. Men are rationalist creative warriors, women are emotional acquisitive maternal manipulators. Each sex has its role to play, and those who deviate from these paths are fooling themselves.
He rails against the idea of the State and the media trying vainly and expensively to erase these differences by feminising men and pushing women into the workforce and children into childcare. Telling women they can and should have it all is tantamount to cruelty, telling men that they should cry and love babies is worse. A mother should raise her own children full time - the state has no business financially undermining this through subsidised and economically unsupportable childcare (bear in mind he's Canadian). An artist (by definition a man) will only be dragged down by the demands of family, and so should stay clear. Sex and women in general distract men from great pursuits and trajectories of progress, and drag them down into the cyclical directionless domestic world.
Rationality is the only basis for real-world decisions, and so only men should make them - women (or feminised men) will always vote for bigger houses and non-violent solutions, even when the situation demands tight belts and swift war. And so forth.
All well and good, or at least a point of view, however strongly you might disagree. Sometime after issue 185 and the revelation of his world-view, he was effectively ostracised from the independent/self-publishing world he had played a huge part in creating, with the Comics Journal running a cover showing him as commandant of a Nazi death-camp for women.
Then Sim got religion, bad, and began tying up this viewpoint with God, and His perceived demands for fasting, tithing, teetotalism, celibacy and the rest. Deviation from the Sim readings of the Bible, Torah, Koran and Talmud is an affront against God, and was going to be punished big time - in particular, Crimes Against the Natural Order are viewed very dimly (example: People eating Lion meat. No, seriously).
He's a very bright guy, and as with his views on the sexes, you know he's studied this in huge depth. But it does get very freaky, as he fills dozens of hyper-dense pages in the back of the book with his self-defined vocabulary and endless arguments and his very real exasperation that the rest of the world can't see the Truth - mainly because they've had their brains scrambled by their wives, girlfriends and the evil feminist media. He's ended up isolated from the comics world, but I still love the daft old loon and keep track of rantings for old time's sake. I'd dearly love to meet him, although he'd probably despise me for my family leanings and transparent lack of rational thought.
But Cerebus the comic is still well worth your time. After 2000AD, it's the comic that kept me hooked the longest, and like 2000AD even when it seemed like it had lost the plot, past glories and the hope of good times to come keep you going.
Thanks very much for that well-written account of the Cerebus series. The complete set is in my local library - you've inspired me to borrow it.
I've read Sim's writing on Women etc and while he's thought about it a lot, I wouldn't call him "considered and thoughtful" or "rational". Very sad, because I quite admired him up till then, on account of Cerebus.
No doubt my judgement is warped by having had sex (not to mention all that Lion meat I keep tucking into)
Cheers gents. The two volumes Mr Dad mentions are definitely in the promotion so I'll pick them up tomorrow. I'll second Floyd's thanks for that dissection of Cerebus. I'm more intrigued now, but the size and number of volumes might mean it takes me a while to get round to it.
I can only marvel at the Socialist miracle that is the Australian library service! I do get the odd TPB from my local library, but stocking policy in the three I frequent tends to run to two copies each of the second volume of Planetary, assorted volumes of Lucifer (but under no circumstances the first one), a few Marvel Essentials and The Chief Judge's Man.
I wouldn't call him "considered and thoughtful" or "rational".
Indeed, and in using those terms I certainly didn't mean to suggest that Sim's opinions are remotely sane, just that he'd arrived at them after a great deal of thought and internal argument, rather than being an unthinking misogynist.
In my opinion he's a genuine nut because he honestly can't see what's wrong with his theory, and anyone who disagrees must either be scared by the "truth", weak-minded or duped by the feminist agenda.
Sim does have a genuine history of mental illness, and it's hard not to see the more recent ranting as a re-occurrence or development of his earlier problems. What's simultaneously tragic and fascinating is that he attributes the transformation of Cerebus from throwaway parody to mammoth intelligent epic to a revelation during an earlier schizophrenic experience, so the whole project may be intimately linked to the same basic problem that almost derrailed it entirely towards the end.
I know its verging on the Dawkinsian to correlate someone's religious convictions with mental illness, but it's hard not to see a connection.
By the way, Love and Rockets is superb. Some of my very favourite comics, and those new editions are very nice indeed.
I have just finished reading the Palomar stories from Love and Rockets which I thought they were fantastic! I thought I'd like Jaime's Maggie stories more because I preferred the artwork but I struggled a bit to get into them. Palomar is a real corker and I was mistaken about the art, it works a treat! I had a real blast of positivity about comics after reading Peter Bagges Hate and then Love and Rockets. A golden few months of reading.
Cerebus seems very daunting to me. The huge great volumes and heavy detail, maybe one day...
Is anyone here a fan of Jim Woodring? I've been meaning to get something and didn't know where to start.
cheers,
steve
HATE is my fave comic. Peter Bagge is a genius and a very nice bloke too!
Spotted Love and Rockets in a repeat of The IT Crowd tonight. The foxy chick was reading it in the IT office.
The IT office also has a Buddy Bradley doll box in the background.
I would say that L&R made more of an impact on methan Maus or DK, and almost as much as Watchmen.