As previously mentioned, I'm currently on a mission to read every 2000AD in history.
It's been a right old slog up to this point, with some real dire strips, but finally (prog 350) it's getting into its stride and some cracking stuff is being produced. Slaine, Judge Dredd and Strontium Dog are all in full flow, and even Rogue Trooper is getting good.
I'll let you know if this is just a blip :o
It's not. It will be consistently good from now on.
...although I'm surprised you didn't think so a bit earlier!
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 18 March, 2014, 06:17:24 PM
It's been a right old slog up to this point, with some real dire strips, but finally (prog 350) it's getting into its stride and some cracking stuff is being produced. I'll let you know if this is just a blip :o
It
was just a blip. The next 350 progs are solid gold, but I'll be surprised if you make it through the following 350 without hollowing out your eye sockets with a spoon. Mike Fleischer's
Rogue Trooper, Alan Craddock and Carlos Ezquerra's computer colouring,
Urban Strike and A Life Less Ordinary ... >ugh< Everything gets incrementally better after that.
Quote from: Richard on 18 March, 2014, 06:24:38 PM
...although I'm surprised you didn't think so a bit earlier!
Quite. I'd argue (and have argued) that you could pick a 100-prog block starting somewhere in the mid-200s and make a case for it being the strongest two year run in the title's history — the only real question is exactly where you start. (If you start as early as the 220s, to get in the start of Rogue Trooper and Judge Death Lives, then you miss the start of Slaine and DR & Quinch at the back end, and so on...)
Cheers
Jim
Oh, and I forgot DR and Quinch.
This is currently the highlight of the prog
I'm currently on a similar mission to you. I'm trying to catch up from where I left off in 1986 at prog 501 and have made it to prog 1322 and meg 202 so far.
You've got loads of good stuff ahead of you but as other posters have mentioned, there's a lot of stuff between about 700 and 900 that will make you laugh and cry in equal measure (Timehouse anyone? I mean what the hell was that all about? Wireheads?? I couldn't even finish reading that one. And don't even get me started on that bloody vegetarian goat nonsense.) Keep going though when you hit that particular wall - it gets a lot better!
Quote from: robcooknell on 21 March, 2014, 07:54:23 AMAnd don't even get me started on that bloody vegetarian goat nonsense.
Inspector Raam/
Dead Meat coulda been a contender - funny concept, great art - just never found the right story.
Trash now, that was just poor - not even Nigel Dobbyn could save that one. Trask sounds a bit like trash,
geddit - he's like Judge Dredd, but he's an eco-cop so he wears green,
geddit, he's got a bobby's helmet because he's British,
geddit... oh sweet Jovus make it stop.
Dead Meat and Trash were both far better than any 3hriller I've read.
Cheers
Quote from: NapalmKev on 21 March, 2014, 08:25:19 AM
Dead Meat and Trash were both far better than any 3hriller I've read.
Obviously these things are subjective, but...
Trash ran for 66 pages.
Dead Meat for 90.
A 3Riller is 15 pages.
Dead Meat alone is as almost as long as ALL the 3Rillers so far put together. It's a different game entirely.
Quote from: sauchie on 18 March, 2014, 06:31:04 PM
It was just a blip. The next 350 progs are solid gold, but I'll be surprised if you make it through the following 350 without hollowing out your eye sockets with a spoon. Mike Fleischer's Rogue Trooper, Alan Craddock and Carlos Ezquerra's computer colouring, Urban Strike and A Life Less Ordinary ... >ugh< Everything gets incrementally better after that.
Steady on sir. Urban Strike is a real high point of that time, as I conclusively proved here (http://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=33712.0).
I know it's all about the balance but I think there were only ever one or two Progs with absolutely nothing worth reading in them. Although it was sometimes a long walk between the Firkeinds and the Button Men.
Quote from: TordelBack on 21 March, 2014, 08:41:46 AM
Quote from: NapalmKev on 21 March, 2014, 08:25:19 AM
Dead Meat and Trash were both far better than any 3hriller I've read.
Obviously these things are subjective, but...
Trash ran for 66 pages.
Dead Meat for 90.
A 3Riller is 15 pages.
Dead Meat alone is as almost as long as ALL the 3Rillers so far put together. It's a different game entirely.
You're right, but - the 3hrillers are widely regarded on here as 'good' while Dead Meat and Trash are almost universely hated.
I just felt compelled to defend what some may consider
indefensible. I genuinely liked those older tales and I haven't liked a single 3hriller yet.
Each to their own, and all that Jazz.
Cheers
Quote from: NapalmKev on 21 March, 2014, 08:53:07 AM
I just felt compelled to defend what some may consider indefensible. I genuinely liked those older tales and I haven't liked a single 3hriller yet.
Each to their own, and all that Jazz.
That's what it's all about! 37 years of 5 stories a week, if we all thought the same about all of them it'd be a nightmare.
Although note I didn't say anything too ba(aaa)d about Dead Meat either- that one almost worked. And Simon Jacob can sell me on most things. As to 3Rillers, in general I've enjoyed the concept and the original format more consistently than I have the stories - there have been some fab ones, and some not-so-fab. The current David Bailie one has been a treat.
Anyway, I'll see your Trash and raise you a Dry Run.
All ahead of you, Bongo Clive!
Quote from: NapalmKev on 21 March, 2014, 08:25:19 AM
Dead Meat and Trash were both far better than any 3hriller I've read.
Cheers
GET OUT!
Dry Run, bloody hell. A dreadful story that never made any sense and always left me feeling that it had missed parts out as one episode never seemed to follow on at all from the previous one.
Timehouse was a fun strip with nice art.
Quote from: Trout on 21 March, 2014, 12:29:53 PM
Timehouse was a fun strip with nice art.
I agree. It was more whimsical than one might consider the 'norm' for a 2000AD strip, but I've never understood the hate for it... it passed the time amiably enough. It was certainly no Wire Heads or Dry Run.
Cheers
Jim
Yeah, each to their own. Wireheads might not be the finest strip to appear in the prog but as I recall, some of Mike Hadley's artwork was very nice.
I think of more complaint from that period would be some of the reboots of older characters. Cmon, does anyone really like Mark Millar's Robo-Hunter?
I have absolutely no memory of Timehouse, bar a vague impression of some nice clean art by someone I don't recognise. I keep confusing it with Time Flies, which doesn't help.
MillarHunter I remember all too well.
I really enjoyed Return to Verdus when it ran in the Prog. In my defence I was about 12 and had heard of the original run but only read a small amount of it.
Quote from: Colin Zeal on 21 March, 2014, 03:13:43 PM
I really enjoyed Return to Verdus when it ran in the Prog.
Get out! ;)
Quote from: Recrewt on 21 March, 2014, 03:33:46 PM
Quote from: Colin Zeal on 21 March, 2014, 03:13:43 PM
I really enjoyed Return to Verdus when it ran in the Prog.
Get out! ;)
I've just checked the Prog dates and I was actually 11 when it ran. Does that mean I'm allowed back in?
Quote from: Colin Zeal on 21 March, 2014, 03:46:21 PM
Quote from: Recrewt on 21 March, 2014, 03:33:46 PM
Quote from: Colin Zeal on 21 March, 2014, 03:13:43 PM
I really enjoyed Return to Verdus when it ran in the Prog.
Get out! ;)
I've just checked the Prog dates and I was actually 11 when it ran. Does that mean I'm allowed back in?
I'll ask Ducky Leatherpants.
Quote from: robcooknell on 21 March, 2014, 07:54:23 AM
don't even get me started on that bloody vegetarian goat nonsense
There are goats who
aren't vegetarian? Chilling thought.
Quote from: The Cosh on 21 March, 2014, 08:48:20 AM
Urban Strike is a real high point of that time, as I conclusively proved here (http://forums.2000adonline.com/index.php?topic=33712.0). I know it's all about the balance but I think there were only ever one or two Progs with absolutely nothing worth reading in them. Although it was sometimes a long walk between the Firkeinds and the Button Men.
Erred on the wrong side of wacky, for me. I know they were only trying to wring some joy from the product placement imposed by Egmont's marketing department, but it's pretty thin stuff.
My brother's pal used to steal old
Blue Peter and
Mandy annuals from the special educational and behavioural needs unit at school, and we'd take turns subverting the original, didactic purpose and prim tone of the text and art with our own tip-exxed speech balloons and surreal imagery, before he sneaked them back onto the shelves. We cracked each other up, but I'm sure they were more fun for us to do than they were for others to read.
If Bishop had
really wanted to do something subversive with
Urban Strike, which made sure they were never asked to run corporate strips ever again, he'd have given the gig to Pat Mills. I didn't
hate Timehouse, Dead Meat, Urban Strike or any of the strips mentioned above, but - after 3 or 4 episodes - they were just more stuff I ended up flicking through. During most of my time reading
2000ad, I've only really been into 1 or 2 fifths of the prog, which is fair enough for an anthology.
Remind me - what was Timehouse about? I think am also confusing it with Time Flies.
Quote from: sauchie on 18 March, 2014, 06:31:04 PM
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 18 March, 2014, 06:17:24 PM
It's been a right old slog up to this point, with some real dire strips, but finally (prog 350) it's getting into its stride and some cracking stuff is being produced. I'll let you know if this is just a blip :o
It was just a blip. The next 350 progs are solid gold, but I'll be surprised if you make it through the following 350 without hollowing out your eye sockets with a spoon. Mike Fleischer's Rogue Trooper, Alan Craddock and Carlos Ezquerra's computer colouring, Urban Strike and A Life Less Ordinary ... >ugh< Everything gets incrementally better after that.
Urban strike was a good story!
Quote from: Magnetica on 22 March, 2014, 02:51:54 PM
Remind me - what was Timehouse about? I think am also confusing it with Time Flies.
It was about 10 parts long.
ok - any other details? Who was the lead character? Brief (very brief) plot summary? I am sure someone must know (I have been very impressed with the knowledge of a lot of the posters on the forum BTW).
Quote from: Skullmo on 22 March, 2014, 03:58:18 PM
Quote from: Magnetica on 22 March, 2014, 02:51:54 PM
Remind me - what was Timehouse about? I think am also confusing it with Time Flies.
It was about 10 parts long.
My mistake, it was actually 7 parts long.
It was inoffensive whimsy. Which is precisely why it didn't really fit in 2000AD despite probably being more competently put together than many of its contemporaries.
Whimsy sums it up. Timehouse (http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_small/10/109303/2521583-comic_0001.jpg) was a boys' own version of Richard Curtis whimsy-fest About Time, but instead of members of the family having the ability to Sam Beckett back and forth along their own timeline, they accessed various historical eras through different rooms in the family mansion. Knights in shining armour and mildly humorous coincidences were the order of the day, rather than crying because Bill Nighy's dead.
The family of time travellers connection made me think of Timehouse when I first heard about Curtis's film, but I realised this forum would be the only place where anyone else might care ... when I say anyone else, I mean 2 people, and when I say care, I mean shrug in silent recognition and carry on with their day.
I care!
That was a very good summing up! All that I can add is that the whimsy was broken into 7 episodic portions.
I never got my head round Timehouse (it came along just as I started to bail on Tooth) but I still think it was something worth trying. It has a decent premise (certainly moreso than Dead Meat) and is quite distinct from everything else Tooth was doing at that time. It might be better remembered if the rest of the lineup had been a bit stronger.
Timehouse ran for two short series. It centred around a House occupied by a sitcom-esque family who are responsible for sorting out time-travel inspired mishaps. The writing (Peter Hogan), art (Tim Bollard) and gerenal tone were an absolute blast of fresh air compared to the OTT Millar-style violence prevalent in the Prog of the day.
I second the view that there are, at worst 2 progs ever with nothing good in them - and, I'd argue, fewer than 50 with only 2 good strips in them.
I haven't attempted a full re-read since I completed my collection when the current Prog hit around 900; it's a daunting tasknow! Wonder if I should wait for my children to reach 6/7 and force them to read through it all with me, Goggans-style.
I'm also undertaking the gargantuan task of re-reading from Prog One! I'm currently at 328 and mostly enjoying it. There have been some appalling stories along the way (though surprisingly few in my opinion).
Dredd is currently going great guns!
And Robo-Hunter is tickling my circuits.
I've never liked Rogue Trooper - but I'm even finding the odd good episode of that. Though the recent slog through Fort Neuro (I promised myself I wouldn't skip anything) has been painful!
Still, I'm loving Skizz again - had forgotten how awesomely cool that strip was!
I'm probably hitting between 1 and 6 Progs a week, so it's going to be a long old project :)
I started this quite soon after joining this forum and I was tempted to do an alternate timeline Prog review as I read each one. But fun as it might be, it would be just too much work :lol:
Timehouse was just too childish for the prog for me, although I'll concede it was better than Tao De Moto ("Where did she go? Nowhere in particular!" "What did she do? Nothing of any interest whatsoever!").
I am however intrigued by this comment:
QuoteI second the view that there are, at worst 2 progs ever with nothing good in them
Which are the 2 progs??? I want to dig them out and have a look!
Quote from: robcooknell on 26 March, 2014, 03:07:44 PM
Which are the 2 progs??? I want to dig them out and have a look!
Opinions will vary, since everyone has their personal 'worst ever' strip that someone else will stick up for. However, if you wanted to take a stab at an all-time low (I won't accept
'partially redeemed by nice art' as defence for any of these strips) you could start with Prog 882:
Babe Race 2000 - Script: Mark Millar, Artist: Anthony Williams
The Clown - Script: Igor Goldkind, Artist: Robert Bliss/Greg Staples
Judge Dredd: Manchu Candidate - Script: Alan McKenzie, Artist: Mick Austin
The Grudge Father - Script: Mark Millar, Artist: Jim McCarthy
Robo-Hunter: Revenge of Dr Robotski - Script: Mark Millar, Artist: Simon Jacob
To be fair, though, trawling through BARNEY during the wastelands of the mid-700s to the late 800s, I think AlexF is probably right. For every Junker or Fleischer Rogue Trooper, there's a Firekind or a Button Man, or a Tyranny Rex in there...
Cheers
Jim
I remember really liking The Clown...
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 26 March, 2014, 03:33:51 PM
Opinions will vary, since everyone has their personal 'worst ever' strip that someone else will stick up for. However, if you wanted to take a stab at an all-time low (I won't accept 'partially redeemed by nice art' as defence for any of these strips) you could start with Prog 882:
Ah now, I quite enjoyed... ehh, I mean one of those was... um, and if you take it as ironic meta-commentary the... ahhh.... No. I've got nothing. Errr, nice art?
Dark days indeed.
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 26 March, 2014, 03:33:51 PM
Quote from: robcooknell on 26 March, 2014, 03:07:44 PM
Which are the 2 progs??? I want to dig them out and have a look!
Opinions will vary, since everyone has their personal 'worst ever' strip that someone else will stick up for. However, if you wanted to take a stab at an all-time low (I won't accept 'partially redeemed by nice art' as defence for any of these strips) you could start with Prog 882:
Babe Race 2000 - Script: Mark Millar, Artist: Anthony Williams
The Clown - Script: Igor Goldkind, Artist: Robert Bliss/Greg Staples
Judge Dredd: Manchu Candidate - Script: Alan McKenzie, Artist: Mick Austin
The Grudge Father - Script: Mark Millar, Artist: Jim McCarthy
Robo-Hunter: Revenge of Dr Robotski - Script: Mark Millar, Artist: Simon Jacob
To be fair, though, trawling through BARNEY during the wastelands of the mid-700s to the late 800s, I think AlexF is probably right. For every Junker or Fleischer Rogue Trooper, there's a Firekind or a Button Man, or a Tyranny Rex in there...
Cheers
Jim
They are all fondly remembered. Even if Manchu plot threads didn't get followed up, it was filler I guess. . .
Quote from: sauchie on 21 March, 2014, 04:45:56 PM
Quote from: robcooknell on 21 March, 2014, 07:54:23 AM
don't even get me started on that bloody vegetarian goat nonsense
There are goats who aren't vegetarian? Chilling thought.
As we all know, goats will eat anything. Wrong animal choice. Should have been a panda.
Quote from: Fungus on 26 March, 2014, 04:00:39 PMWrong animal choice. Should have been a panda.
That would have made it 100 times cooler already.
Quote from: The Corinthian on 26 March, 2014, 06:33:28 PM
Quote from: Fungus on 26 March, 2014, 04:00:39 PMWrong animal choice. Should have been a panda.
That would have made it 100 times cooler already.
Inspector Ling Ling?
(f'nar)
Well, Hell Trekkers is getting good, Dredd is doing just fine, Rogue Trooper ended with a bit of an anti climax (although I've just seen that he's due to return soon), and Stainless Steel Rat is chugging along.
Have to say though, ACE Trucking Company is not my cup of tea at all. Found I'm skipping almost all of it. Can't put my finger on it, but I'm finding it very dull and difficult to get into.
When my pal was trying to recruit me to 2000ad, his pitch was based on how great Ace Trucking was. I enjoyed individual parts of it, but it never fully clicked with me either. Same goes for Hell Trekkers, which was originally scheduled to run in the aborted first attempt to get The Judge Dredd Megazine off the ground, as was the excellent Bad Company.
You'd better get used to those Rogue Trooper announcements; the strip's been coming back for the last 25 years, usually with an exciting new direction and creative team, and an injunction to forget whatever the last lot did.
The early Ace Trucker strip was amazingly funny...the latter storylines wern't as good but I still have a soft spot for old Rooster! Z
Quote from: sauchie on 04 April, 2014, 07:05:14 PM
When my pal was trying to recruit me to 2000ad, his pitch was based on how great Ace Trucking was. I enjoyed individual parts of it, but it never fully clicked with me either. Same goes for Hell Trekkers, which was originally scheduled to run in the aborted first attempt to get The Judge Dredd Megazine off the ground, as was the excellent Bad Company.
You'd better get used to those Rogue Trooper announcements; the strip's been coming back for the last 25 years, usually with an exciting new direction and creative team, and an injunction to forget whatever the last lot did.
The bad company that saw print had little to do (other than name) with the Grant/Wagner/Ezquerra original!
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 04 April, 2014, 06:41:16 PM
Well, Hell Trekkers is getting good, Dredd is doing just fine, Rogue Trooper ended with a bit of an anti climax (although I've just seen that he's due to return soon), and Stainless Steel Rat is chugging along.
Have to say though, ACE Trucking Company is not my cup of tea at all. Found I'm skipping almost all of it. Can't put my finger on it, but I'm finding it very dull and difficult to get into.
I always loved the Stainless Steel Rat and Ace Trucking. Both were good fun and had great art by Carlos and Massimo respectively.
On the back of the 2000AD serialisation I went and bought all the SSR books, which were great and well worth a read, although I never could get on with the fact that the slippery Jim on the covers of those looked nothing like Carlos' version (black hair I ask you!!!)
The last series of Ace Trucking was one too far though in my opinion. The format had totally changed at that point and it just didn't have the same feel. I seem to remember reading that Wagner & Grant had wanted to end it earlier and hadn't really wanted to do the last series.
As for Hell Trekkers...sorry never liked it.
I'd kill for a copy of Ace Trucking volume 1. Really want to read that series.
Quote from: Magnetica on 05 April, 2014, 11:55:55 AM
The last series of Ace Trucking was one too far though in my opinion. The format had totally changed at that point and it just didn't have the same feel. I seem to remember reading that Wagner & Grant had wanted to end it earlier and hadn't really wanted to do the last series.
Interestingly (or not), while I always liked the early Ace Trucking stuff, when the second case files collection came out I was surprised how much more I enjoyed the last couple of stories and their ever-escalating silliness than I did at the time.
In similar way, I've never much liked Robo-Hunter (I think it's the only story released in case files format which I haven't bought) but I really enjoyed the Slaying of Slade and the one after when they popped up in EEs a few years ago.
EEs?
Quote from: Magnetica on 05 April, 2014, 05:44:39 PM
EEs?
Extreme Edition (http://www.2000ad.org/?zone=reprint&page=profiles&choice=extreme30) reprints.
Quote from: Magnetica on 05 April, 2014, 05:44:39 PM
EEs?
There's no need to laugh (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkguPIbbXUw).
Currently on second prog slog and into the 1200's so passed quite a few of the aforementioned tales by. I've wondered several times what the true 'Anno Horribilas' was but would place it around the 700 - 900's roughly. Past 1000 really does see a pick up for my money.
I did find re-reading some of the early strips quite an eye opener. Some of the strips were guilty pleasures when I first read them but I guess the tender age of 7 or 8 probably had something to do with that. Even Starlord which I abandoned tooth for has some cringeworthy moments alongside the absolutely spectacular early Stront and Ro-Busters.
Quote from: robcooknell on 26 March, 2014, 03:07:44 PM
Timehouse was just too childish for the prog for me, although I'll concede it was better than Tao De Moto ("Where did she go? Nowhere in particular!" "What did she do? Nothing of any interest whatsoever!").
I am however intrigued by this comment:
QuoteI second the view that there are, at worst 2 progs ever with nothing good in them
Which are the 2 progs??? I want to dig them out and have a look!
I remember a good thread on here a few years ago arguing Prog 827 as the absolute lowest of all low points, a notion it's hard to disagree with. It's a perfect storm of shite, a toxic combination of Bradley, Millar's Robohunter, the utterly pointless Kelly's Eye reboot and a truly appalling Future Shock from the unlamented Frances Lynn. On top of that it had the one of the most offensively bad Dredd stories Ennis ever penned.
Just the week after, you had Firekind, Armoured Gideon 2 and new Bad Company all starting. Talk about swings and roundabouts.
"Bradley", Mr Goosegash, sir, with respect, did not contribute to the toxicity of any particular prog and Mr Harrison's art was never less than fine. So there.
Oh, I've no problem with Harrison's art, I think his work on Revere was stunning. But I've never understood the appeal of Bradley as a character or a strip. I feel like it's a concept that might've been funnier under a better writer, but MacKenzie just didn't have the comedic chops to pull it off.
Quote from: Goosegash on 05 April, 2014, 07:31:41 PM
Oh, I've no problem with Harrison's art, I think his work on Revere was stunning. But I've never understood the appeal of Bradley as a character or a strip. I feel like it's a concept that might've been funnier under a better writer, but MacKenzie just didn't have the comedic chops to pull it off.
I love Harrison's art too. His recent interview in the
Megazine doesn't suggest he thought highly of the strip or MacKenzie's writing.
I'm never comfortable when we do the "worst of 2K" conversation, and I think I first saw it happen on this board 15 years ago.
Something I've learned from creator comments over the years is that every strip has people who loved it, often including the people who made it and genuinely believed it was good.
But Chronos Carnival was shite. :D
- Trout
Quote from: Tjm86 on 05 April, 2014, 06:45:19 PM
what the true 'Anno Horribilas' was but would place it around the 700 - 900's roughly. Past 1000 really does see a pick up for my money.
Now this is a b*****d.
Because my first-ever prog-slog is the progs I NEVER read (in theory, it's 20-odd years ago)
and I'm plodding through 700-960. It's hard work. Fleischer needs a slap.
I have considered chucking it in and starting from 200 instead... Ace Trucking, Slaine, ...
Picking up after 1000 is no consolation, um, I have none :)
Quote from: Fungus on 06 April, 2014, 02:19:42 AM
and I'm plodding through 700-960. It's hard work. Fleischer needs a slap.
I found alcohol helpful in the darkest days ....
Quote from: Goosegash on 05 April, 2014, 06:48:29 PMI remember a good thread on here a few years ago arguing Prog 827 as the absolute lowest of all low points, a notion it's hard to disagree with. It's a perfect storm of shite, a toxic combination of Bradley, Millar's Robohunter, the utterly pointless Kelly's Eye reboot and a truly appalling Future Shock from the unlamented Frances Lynn. On top of that it had the one of the most offensively bad Dredd stories Ennis ever penned.
Just the week after, you had Firekind, Armoured Gideon 2 and new Bad Company all starting. Talk about swings and roundabouts.
827 has the excuse of being the Prog before a big relaunch, which is often used a landfill for thrillsuckers. I'd nominate Prog 723 on the grounds, which has the fag end of a Fleisher Rogue Trooper, a duff Dredd opener and Millar's debut on Robo-Hunter and even the better strips are second division stuff... and still Tharg thought this would make an ideal jumping on point for new readers.
The only thing to be said in its favour is that they didn't manage to shoehorn in the return of Junker. We had to wait a whole week for that.
The 'worst prog EVAH' exercise is fascinating (I've been having a go this morning in full-on work-avoidance mode), not least because it's very, very hard to find one that hasn't got just one good strip. Personally I blame John Smith. Even where a prog is otherwise excreable, there's usually a Revere, a Tyranny Rex, a Firekind or an Indigo Prime shoring it up: look at 872 or 879, for example. Anthony Williams doesn't help either, often lending a bit of enthusiasm and energy to a prog that is otherwise utterly dull and lethargic.
While not a winner, an early entry to my shortlist is 816, but mainly because I hate Finn. YMMV.
Quote from: TordelBack on 06 April, 2014, 01:30:47 PM
The 'worst prog EVAH' exercise is fascinating (I've been having a go this morning in full-on work-avoidance mode), not least because it's very, very hard to find one that hasn't got just one good strip. Personally I blame John Smith...
While not a winner, an early entry to my shortlist is 816, but mainly because I hate Finn. YMMV.
Ah, now. I'm always keen to stick up for Ennis' Dredd and
The Kinda Dead Man is definitely one of his better ones.
821 swaps Finn for Legend of Shamana but also has a PJ Maybe outing and this stunning back cover. I bet that bastard Dale probably owns this.
(http://www.2000ad.org/covers/scans/hires/821.jpg)
The maxim that there is always one story that saves an otherwise execrable prog only holds true with issues that stick to the anthology format. If you don't particularly care for Sláine, Rogue Trooper, Sinister Dexter or Dredd (that City of the Damned follow-up and Trifecta), then the novelty issues which featured a single story concerned only with them are going to be strong contenders for worst issue ever.
Quote from: The Cosh on 06 April, 2014, 01:41:11 PM
and this stunning back cover. I bet that bastard Dale probably owns this.
Cor but that is lovely. Paul Marshall has to one of the most underrated artists in the history of the prog. He's produced some truly fantastic work for decades, and is on noticeably top form at the moment, but he never seems to be feted as one of the 2000AD pantheon of 'greats'.
And good points there, Sauchie. I think the single-story Progs would have to be omitted on the grounds of personal taste, but I don't think any of them are truly terrible. Some aren't great, certainly.
Oh merciful Grud, I've just seen the Barney listing for Prog 881. The best thing in it is Dinosty.
Quote from: TordelBack on 06 April, 2014, 02:19:27 PM
Oh merciful Grud, I've just seen the Barney listing for Prog 881. The best thing in it is Dinosty.
I'm gonna stand by 883 over 881, which has the same line-up but swaps Dinosty for Babe Race 2000.
Cheers
Jim
Quote from: TordelBack on 06 April, 2014, 02:10:59 PM
Cor but that is lovely. Paul Marshall has to one of the most underrated artists in the history of the prog. He's produced some truly fantastic work for decades, and is on noticeably top form at the moment, but he never seems to be feted as one of the 2000AD pantheon of 'greats'.
Flicking through some semi-recent progs a few weeks ago I stumbled across 'The Ecstasy' - a 10-part Wagner Dredd thriller, with Marshall on art duties, that I'd
completely forgotten had ever existed. How often does that ever happen? A 10-part Wagner Dredd that's just dropped out of history. I've not heard it mentioned once since it first ran.
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 06 April, 2014, 02:27:40 PM
I'm gonna stand by 883 over 881, which has the same line-up but swaps Dinosty for Babe Race 2000.
Yep, 883's a triple-Millar issue - surely the true nadir of progdom.
Re: Paul Marshall's art - I think the reason he's not always rated is because of that lengthy period when he simplified his style and seemed to be on constant rotation in the prog. There's a very clear shift in his artwork, round about 'Darkside', where one gets the impression he's going for ease and speed of production rather than the ultra-detailed approach that made 'Firekind' so beloved. Compare the likes of 'New Model Phoord' (some of his weakest work) to 'Escape from Kurt Russell' (the last thing he did for the prog in his 'old' style) for the difference. That said, his recent work in the prog has been excellent.
Quote from: Greg M. on 06 April, 2014, 02:39:34 PM
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 06 April, 2014, 02:27:40 PM
I'm gonna stand by 883 over 881, which has the same line-up but swaps Dinosty for Babe Race 2000.
Yep, 883's a triple-Millar issue - surely the true nadir of progdom.
Cripes, I haven't got to that one yet, it sounds a horror. You'll be shocked to learn that I don't own it.
Quote from: The Cosh on 06 April, 2014, 01:41:11 PM
Ah, now. I'm always keen to stick up for Ennis' Dredd and The Kinda Dead Man is definitely one of his better ones.
Ennis's best Dredd stuff was as good as any writer other than Wagner has done (
and a lot better than some of Wagner's dodgier output). An awful lot of his stuff descends into the same kind of pop culture/nostalgia riffing that Mark Millar was doing a power of at the same time, and his hit-to-shit ratio would be much better if he's jacked it in a few months earlier.
I suppose
The Kinda Dead Man was the kinda
Judgement Day consequences and repercussions story we were all arguing (in the wake of Chaos Day) was a necessity for any epic to be considered a valid part of the continuing Dredd macro-narrative. The lodestone business would have provided a pretty good excuse for all manner of weirdness and story potential too, if anyone had bothered to follow up on it ...
Quote from: Greg M. on 06 April, 2014, 02:39:34 PM
Quote from: Jim_Campbell on 06 April, 2014, 02:27:40 PM
I'm gonna stand by 883 over 881, which has the same line-up but swaps Dinosty for Babe Race 2000.
Yep, 883's a triple-Millar issue - surely the true nadir of progdom.
Yeah been looking using Barney's listings for Michael Fleisher's stories as my guide and even using his material I can't find a Prog to top... well sink below 883. Shocker.
Quote from: sauchie on 06 April, 2014, 02:51:33 PM
I suppose The Kinda Dead Man was the kinda Judgement Day consequences and repercussions story we were all arguing (in the wake of Chaos Day) was a necessity for any epic to be considered a valid part of the continuing Dredd macro-narrative.
Ennis got a couple of his best stories out of the aftermath of his epic - 'Last Night Out', and 'Unwelcome Guests', the latter with its memorable "Where were YOU on Judgement Day?" line.
Christ, the more I read this thread, the more my mind recoils from the 800's. Finn just about sums up the sheer will sapping tedium. I'm proud to say I've never read one single page of this utter bollocks. Z
Amen, ZenArcade. What I really enjoy about the Worst Prog Quest is that this is all so firmly in the past. There's been nothing that fits into this category, or even comes close, for a dozen years. That we can chart the prog's rise and fall and rise again is a wonderful thing.
One day I'll have to undertake a proper prog-slog of my own, just to experience the roller-coaster effect,
Quote from: ZenArcade on 06 April, 2014, 06:53:52 PM
Finn just about sums up the sheer will sapping tedium. I'm proud to say I've never read one single page of this utter bollocks
We'll add psychic reading to your list of accomplishments!
Finn was an interesting fuck-you to the po-faced politicking of
Third World War, with the painfully right-on cast members bewildered to find themselves transplanted to (and obeying the rules and archetypes of) the most base genre fiction. It was fun to watch Mills torching the politically aware and progressive body of work he'd created over the previous decade, and give the ignorant and ungrateful proles what he imagined they wanted (conspiracy theories and hot lesbians), but not for more than one series.
Amen, I came back in the early 1800's and since the Cold Deck through Ulysees Sweet to Titan I have to say I'm in hog heaven. The prog is a much more enjoyable thing. It now has the old balance between the serious and the utterly insane. The balance is a dream, long may it last. Z:-D
Quote from: ZenArcade on 06 April, 2014, 06:53:52 PM
Finn just about sums up the sheer will sapping tedium. I'm proud to say I've never read one single page of this utter bollocks. Z
I'm quite happy to spout shite on the internet too, but this non-sequitur makes you sound like a complete buffoon.
Quote from: The Cosh on 06 April, 2014, 08:21:13 PM
Quote from: ZenArcade on 06 April, 2014, 06:53:52 PM
Finn just about sums up the sheer will sapping tedium. I'm proud to say I've never read one single page of this utter bollocks. Z
I'm quite happy to spout shite on the internet too, but this non-sequitur makes you sound like a complete buffoon.
A harsh thing to call him, Cosh. But... why condemn something you haven't read? I quite liked Finn during my last re-read. You should take a look.
I'm thinking of watching Farscape. :)
Jeez cosh, calm down buddy. I read finn when I used to buy crises. I hated the charachter there and couldn't be bothered with the translation to the prog. Hence the never read it post. I found the prog in the 800's and 900's to be unreadable, pointing out Finn as an example of what summed this up for me. This dark time stopped me and I guess many others from continuing with a comic we had read and loved for a good many years.I am happy to engage in any reasonables banter in this thread, but I'll stop at personal insults; you should consider doing likewise. Z.
Quote from: Trout on 06 April, 2014, 08:25:07 PM
I'm thinking of watching Farscape.
You've taken that too far. Why not just go see the new Muppet movie instead?
Quote from: ZenArcade on 06 April, 2014, 08:40:36 PM
I read finn when I used to buy crises. I hated the charachter there and couldn't be bothered with the translation to the prog
There was less of the
hey, why get hung up about my wanting to sleep with other people Hollyoaks inter-racial relationship melodrama and being haunted by his tour of duty on the Shankhill Road once Mills transplanted him from Central America to Cornwall, shoved an uzi in each of his hands, oiled and airbrushed his pecs, and phoned David Icke to see if he could think of an interesting villain for him to fight.
Quote from: ZenArcade on 06 April, 2014, 08:40:36 PM
Jeez cosh, calm down buddy. I read finn when I used to buy crises. I hated the charachter there and couldn't be bothered with the translation to the prog. Hence the never read it post. I found the prog in the 800's and 900's to be unreadable, pointing out Finn as an example of what summed this up for me. This dark time stopped me and I guess many others from continuing with a comic we had read and loved for a good many years.I am happy to engage in any reasonables banter in this thread, but I'll stop at personal insults; you should consider doing likewise. Z.
Okay, this makes things a bit clearer. I'm definitely not in the "If you can't say something nice..." camp but, equally, I don't see how it qualifies as a personal insult to point out that saying something which you haven't read is "utter bollocks" makes you sound stupid. It's a simple statement of fact.
Characters with the same names, different stories, different readership, different approach. Unless you held on to the bitter end of Crisis but, even then, the broader, comic Finn of the 2000AD era is never as much in evidence.
Ok sauchie, I'm now going to put myself through approx 5 hours torture and dig out the old progs and read the damn strip!!!Z
Quote from: sauchie on 06 April, 2014, 08:52:04 PM
Quote from: ZenArcade on 06 April, 2014, 08:40:36 PM
I read finn when I used to buy crises. I hated the charachter there and couldn't be bothered with the translation to the prog
There was less of the hey, why get hung up about my wanting to sleep with other people Hollyoaks inter-racial relationship melodrama and being haunted by his tour of duty on the Shankhill Road once Mills transplanted him from Central America to Cornwall, shoved an uzi in each of his hands, oiled and airbrushed his pecs, and phoned David Icke to see if he could think of an interesting villain for him to fight.
Or this. I too disliked Finn on his original run in the Prog but warmed to him on a reread and actually thought the lengthy Interventions story to be one of 90s Mills best contributions to the Prog.
Cosh, I'm gonna let it go after this post. There should probably be a wee bit of a pause between thought and action in posting comments on on the thread which people (myself in this instance) may take as unmannerly and unfriendly. I follow the site every day, read and enjoy/agree/disagree with the threads, post my views as plainly and cogently as possible (evidently not as cogently as I may have wished in this instance) but I reiterate, I do not personally insult people. If you wished to point out what you thought to be a flaw in the essential logic of my post at least be witty like sauchies funny admonishment. Anyhow ever onwards eh. Z
Quote from: ZenArcade on 06 April, 2014, 09:02:25 PM
I'm now going to put myself through approx 5 hours torture and dig out the old progs and read the damn strip!!!Z
Read a few issues of
Crisis featuring 'Paul' before you dive into the sexy witches and alien/lizard members of the Garrick Club. The contrast is hilarious.
Well here I go prog 770 book 1!
[spoiler]It's working, Cosh. I think we've broken him![/spoiler]
After having trudged my way through Book 1 last night, my servo-motors are well out of sync. Ah well It'll be the hair shirt tonight again with Book 2. Z
Quote from: ZenArcade on 06 April, 2014, 06:53:52 PM
Christ, the more I read this thread, the more my mind recoils from the 800's. Finn just about sums up the sheer will sapping tedium. I'm proud to say I've never read one single page of this utter bollocks. Z
I have never read it but it is rubbish. Nice.
I really enjoyed Finn. The final book felt like it had been chopped up a bit by the editor (as do many stories around this time in the prog), but apart from that I really enjoyed it. As with a lot of Pat Mills' stories it sometimes relies on your knowing some of the material that it references,
I guess I'll probably feel a bit bad once you've read it and realise it is utter bollocks!
Quote from: The Cosh on 07 April, 2014, 11:29:42 AM
I guess I'll probably feel a bit bad once you've read it and realise it is utter bollocks!
Next you will be saying David Icke's books are rubbish too!
Quote from: sauchie on 06 April, 2014, 08:52:04 PM
There was less of the hey, why get hung up about my wanting to sleep with other people Hollyoaks inter-racial relationship melodrama and being haunted by his tour of duty on the Shankhill Road once Mills transplanted him from Central America to Cornwall, shoved an uzi in each of his hands, oiled and airbrushed his pecs, and phoned David Icke to see if he could think of an interesting villain for him to fight.
Clearly Finn used a P90 not an uzi.
Finn was great, a new series would be more than welcome!
I can't remember the Prog number (between 1000/1250, maybe) but it featured a story about some Shite toy miniatures (was it Havok?). Anyway whatever it was it prompted me to leave the Prog for many years.
Cheers
The prog that had the prog length sequel to City of the Damned was what killed my enjoyment. I can remember thinking not even a wagner dredd is good anymore.
Thankfully things picked up again later!
Quote from: Skullmo on 07 April, 2014, 12:19:55 PM
The prog that had the prog length sequel to City of the Damned was what killed my enjoyment. I can remember thinking not even a wagner dredd is good anymore.
Tragic confession: I was firmly on the wagon at the time of
2120, but saw the prog in the newsagents and (marvelling that I should have lived so long as to see this day) in a fit of curiosity read it there and then. I replaced it on the shelf and gave it another year or so. I know, I was taking the polystyrene out of Tharg's mouth, so I don't ask for forgiveness, only understanding.
Quote from: TordelBack on 07 April, 2014, 12:30:50 PM
Quote from: Skullmo on 07 April, 2014, 12:19:55 PM
The prog that had the prog length sequel to City of the Damned was what killed my enjoyment. I can remember thinking not even a wagner dredd is good anymore.
Tragic confession: I was firmly on the wagon at the time of 2120, but saw the prog in the newsagents and (marvelling that I should have lived so long as to see this day) in a fit of curiosity read it there and then. I replaced it on the shelf and gave it another year or so. I know, I was taking the polystyrene out of Tharg's mouth, so I don't ask for forgiveness, only understanding.
I need to dig that comic out and re-read it. I liked it at the time and can't understand why others don't.
Dragging Finn back to the forefront, I always thought of it as a modern day Slaine especially in its general look. I remember not liking it much on first read...was very disappointed on seeing it as a floppy with the Meg and not that impressed second time around whereas Paul in Third World War was actually quite readable once you penetrated the right on-ness of the strip.
Maybe Third World War needs re-reading too!
Quote from: judgerufian on 07 April, 2014, 02:35:34 PM
Dragging Finn back to the forefront, I always thought of it as a modern day Slaine especially in its general look. I remember not liking it much on first read...was very disappointed on seeing it as a floppy with the Meg and not that impressed second time around whereas Paul in Third World War was actually quite readable once you penetrated the right on-ness of the strip.
Maybe Third World War needs re-reading too!
I always thought Finn was going to be revealed as a reincarnation of Slaine
Same here.
Isn't it that similarity that eventually did for Finn? I'm sure I read somewhere that it was cancelled due to it being too much like Slaine.
I have been biting my lip trying to stay out of this, but I can no longer.
I actually like Finn. There I said it.
As to comparisons between Finn and Slaine...hmmm
So one is written by Pat Mills, has a talk dark protagonist who has a thing for his goddess, who goes around getting into fights and is battling ancient aliens / gods who want to enslave mankind. And the other one is Slaine. :lol:
Quote from: Trout on 07 April, 2014, 01:33:08 PM
Quote from: Skullmo on 07 April, 2014, 12:19:55 PM
The prog that had the prog length sequel to City of the Damned was what killed my enjoyment. I can remember thinking not even a wagner dredd is good anymore.
I need to dig that comic out and re-read it. I liked it at the time and can't understand why others don't.
I read it last week, for the only time other than its original publication. I'm going to employ the wise advice of Thumper's mother in
Bambi, except to observe that the virtual reality storyline which began the 1994 DC Dredd series was afflicted by the problem from which all
'dream' narratives suffer, that nothing makes any sense while reading them, and once they're over there's a disappointment that none of what preceded really mattered.
Stories such as the ill conceived virtual reality plot sequence in the 1994 DC Dredd series always feel like the authors' solution to the problem of having to write a story, rather than something the author considered worth writing, or thought the reader would enjoy. That's what I thought was wrong with the virtual reality storyline in the 1994 DC Dredd series, but I'll keep my counsel concerning the sequel to
City Of The Damned.
Quote from: judgerufian on 07 April, 2014, 02:35:34 PM
Paul in Third World War was actually quite readable once you penetrated the right on-ness of the strip. Maybe Third World War needs re-reading too!
Once the strip broadened out to follow the different characters' paths through the WalMart/Workfare world of
Third World War, I thought it had real legs. Less pissing about with fewer artists might have helped give it a more cohesive feel, but there was potential to tell so many different kinds of stories, and that was the first time I'd been exposed to a lot of ideas about the relation of employment to social control which are now commonplace.
The first time I read of Chinese girls forced to live as nuns in Nike labour camps, my frame of reference wasn't Chomsky - my mind automatically leapt to Eve's pal who got pregnant by one of the pensioners MultiFoods employed as factory porters in just such a captive work environment. Maybe information concerning those kinds of employment practices was common currency in the broadsheets of the late eighties, but it was the dramatization of that scenario which made an impression and stuck with me over time.
Yep, risible and embarrassing though my ignorance was, I was made aware of lot of situations and ideas that I was previously totally oblivious to by the (contrived) setups in TWW. And I was at the time an active member of Amnesty International. I might not always have subscribed to Mills' skewed readings and rather stilted dramatisations, but they made me think a lot, and by the time I got to 3rd level education I found myself encountering supposedly 'new' ideas, about globalisation and 3rd world development in particular, that I was well familiar with thanks to Pat, Eve and Paul (my in-depth knowledge of Rastafari was also to prove useful). Somewhat unusually for these things, the later less fantastic stuff was the better.
Which may explain some of my abiding dislike for Finn.
I seem to recall the biggest issue with Finn was all the characters seemed to have slightly weird noses.
Think that was Finn, if so really annoyed me.
Good Grud above, prog 813: ' for rightly it is said...if one removes the serpentine 's' from the word 'Slaughter House', its true meaning is revealed...The Laughter House'. Well here's one squax who aint! Z
Quote from: Colin_YNWA on 07 April, 2014, 09:33:59 PM
I seem to recall the biggest issue with Finn was all the characters seemed to have slightly weird noses. Think that was Finn, if so really annoyed me.
It's a common problem (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Ahg2GVWHGKY#t=78)
Quote from: judgerufian on 07 April, 2014, 02:35:34 PM
Dragging Finn back to the forefront, I always thought of it as a modern day Slaine especially in its general look.
Part of Slaine's appeal is the meticulously researched historical detail, so doing a "modern day" version of the same themes is inevitably stripping out one of its major dimensions.
Finished Book Two, I really haven't the will to continue. However, some great artwork in the early 800's. The Revere stuff's way out there. I quite like Critchlow's stuff in flesh....jesus I even liked the Ennis Christmas Dredd the second time round: Christmas with attitude...don't go too near the west wall! Still however those were dark times for the prog. Z
Full marks for effort, ZenArcade. We salute you.
Cheers Trout, it was a fair siege! Z
Fair play. Can we now amend the entry in the Hitchhiker's Guide to "mostly utter bollocks"?
Yep cosh we'll call it that! I picked up 1875 + 1876 from FP at lunch, double the thrill power this evening! Yessss Z
Have hit a brick wall with Slaines second story. Aliens? Leyser guns? Dimension jumping? What a load of bollocks.
Looking forward to it getting back to it's axe swinging best
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 11 April, 2014, 12:19:57 PM
Have hit a brick wall with Slaines second story. Aliens? Leyser guns? Dimension jumping? What a load of bollocks.
Umm... Fabry?
Cheers!
Jim
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 11 April, 2014, 12:19:57 PM
Aliens? Leyser guns? Dimension jumping? What a load of bollocks.
I agree completely that it's utter nonsense, but
Time Killer's also fantastically entertaining. Murdach's a great sidekick, Elric and the Guledig are series-defining villains, and I had a ball thinking through the implications of the macrocosmic balance. Tell me you read Sláine's discomfort at having to be nice to Pluke and didn't laugh.
Plus, y'know, Fabry's El-women and Pugh's grotesque exaggeration of the warp spasm. The good news for you is that Sláine doesn't spend too long fannying about in time with Merlin before he's back killing other Celts in the buff, but the Goddess sending Sláine and Ukko on a journey through myth is a recurring feature of the strip.
I just love this period of Slaine that you are hitting now. You have some great stuff ahead of you in the 100 Progs or so...Tomb of Terror, Spoils of Annwn and Slaine the King. Enjoy.
(I love the stuff you have just gone through as well).
In my opinion Slaine up to the of the King is just some of the best stuff ever in the Prog and the art...Belardnelli, McMahon, Fabry..its just a succession of greats. (And lets not forget the stuff by David Pugh, Mike Collins, Mark Farmer either and Angie Kincaid either).
Quote from: Magnetica on 11 April, 2014, 06:58:11 PM
In my opinion Slaine up to the of the King is just some of the best stuff ever in the Prog and the art...Belardnelli, McMahon, Fabry..its just a succession of greats. (And lets not forget the stuff by David Pugh, Mike Collins, Mark Farmer either and Angie Kincaid either).
Wow. I really dislike Belardnelli's work. It all feels so static with very little depth. A major reason I disliked Meltdown Man
Quote from: sauchie on 07 April, 2014, 07:21:09 PM
Quote from: Trout on 07 April, 2014, 01:33:08 PM
Quote from: Skullmo on 07 April, 2014, 12:19:55 PM
The prog that had the prog length sequel to City of the Damned was what killed my enjoyment. I can remember thinking not even a wagner dredd is good anymore.
I need to dig that comic out and re-read it. I liked it at the time and can't understand why others don't.
I read it last week, for the only time other than its original publication. I'm going to employ the wise advice of Thumper's mother in Bambi, except to observe that the virtual reality storyline which began the 1994 DC Dredd series was afflicted by the problem from which all 'dream' narratives suffer, that nothing makes any sense while reading them, and once they're over there's a disappointment that none of what preceded really mattered.
Stories such as the ill conceived virtual reality plot sequence in the 1994 DC Dredd series always feel like the authors' solution to the problem of having to write a story, rather than something the author considered worth writing, or thought the reader would enjoy. That's what I thought was wrong with the virtual reality storyline in the 1994 DC Dredd series, but I'll keep my counsel concerning the sequel to City Of The Damned.
I think the art rather than the story was the real problem for in the Year 2120... It had the vibe of "Behold...The Beast!" storywise, and if the art had matched Carlos' brilliance in that story, I think it qould have been a worthy exercise.... as was, not so much.
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 11 April, 2014, 09:01:48 PM
Wow. I really dislike Belardnelli's work. It all feels so static with very little depth.
Objective wrongness!
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 11 April, 2014, 09:01:48 PM
Quote from: Magnetica on 11 April, 2014, 06:58:11 PM
Wow. I really dislike Belardnelli's work. It all feels so static with very little depth. A major reason I disliked Meltdown Man
That sounds funny said out loud.
Quote from: TordelBack on 11 April, 2014, 09:50:10 PM
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 11 April, 2014, 09:01:48 PM
Wow. I really dislike Belardnelli's work. It all feels so static with very little depth.
Objective wrongness!
Mr Back is correct. His Land of the Young was absolutely perfect, and the Ace Garp universe could never be properly resurrected without Belardinelli. Which, of course, is impossible.
Though I must say I didn't like how he drew Slaine as a character. It was only in the last few years I realised that Angie Kincaid drew him the way he was, well,
meant to look, while Belardinelli and McMahon veered off drastically before he went back to his original appearance at the hands of Fabry, Pugh et al. I loved how McMahon drew him, but he was a different character from the Sláine we're most familiar with.
Quote from: JayzusB.Christ on 12 April, 2014, 07:42:37 PM
Quote from: TordelBack on 11 April, 2014, 09:50:10 PM
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 11 April, 2014, 09:01:48 PM
Wow. I really dislike Belardnelli's work. It all feels so static with very little depth.
Objective wrongness!
Mr Back is correct. His Land of the Young was absolutely perfect, and the Ace Garp universe could never be properly resurrected without Belardinelli. Which, of course, is impossible.
Though I must say I didn't like how he drew Slaine as a character. It was only in the last few years I realised that Angie Kincaid drew him the way he was, well, meant to look, while Belardinelli and McMahon veered off drastically before he went back to his original appearance at the hands of Fabry, Pugh et al. I loved how McMahon drew him, but he was a different character from the Sláine we're most familiar with.
Yes and yes. With a "yes" jus.
868-871 for me. Any of the four. You have my least favorite Dredd story, "Frankenstein Division," running at the same time as my least favorite thrill ever, "Mother Earth." Doesn't matter that I like two of the other stories. Those two. Why Tharg Why etc
Quote from: Trout on 12 April, 2014, 08:07:59 PM
Yes and yes. With a "yes" jus.
:lol: I'm going to say that as frequently as I can for the rest of my life.
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 11 April, 2014, 09:01:48 PM
Quote from: Magnetica on 11 April, 2014, 06:58:11 PM
In my opinion Slaine up to the of the King is just some of the best stuff ever in the Prog and the art...Belardnelli, McMahon, Fabry..its just a succession of greats. (And lets not forget the stuff by David Pugh, Mike Collins, Mark Farmer either and Angie Kincaid either).
Wow. I really dislike Belardnelli's work. It all feels so static with very little depth. A major reason I disliked Meltdown Man
GET THE FRUCK OF THIS FORUM!!!!!
Massimo on Meltdown Man = Perfection.
Belardinelli does have strengths and weaknesses - if you want bugfuck creatures, bizarre mutants, spaceships and fantastic alien landscapes, he's your man. Anatomically correct humans in motion - not so great.
So I've hit 455, and I'm going to take a little break as I've heard Corey's Expanse trilogy is shaping up awesomely, and as it was a dearth of decent novels that gave me the idea to re-read 2000AD, this seems like a good time to pause.
Have to say, Halo Jones is still genius, Nemesis is fantastic, Dredd is good as always, Rogue Trooper muddles along, but Slaine and Ace Trucking suck big hairy muchachos.
I started reading 2000AD after ACE Trucking had finished its run, and I'm glad I missed it. Could it be that people have rose tinted specs?
Quote from: Bongo_clive on 27 April, 2014, 06:14:44 PM
Could it be that people have rose tinted specs?
No - it's just a story you don't like it.
Bongo_Clive, please, please, please give Ace another chance, he's just....well ace really. Z