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2000 AD => Suggestions => : The Sherman Kid 25 May, 2014, 11:39:16 AM

: The Seven
: The Sherman Kid 25 May, 2014, 11:39:16 AM
Way back in  Prog 2016 (October 2000) Dredd asked the deputy Chief Medical Officer how many clones there were of himself in the works (so to speak) ,to which the reply came 'seven'.

We already had Rico (who is currently a long time absent from the pages from 2000ad -Please BRING HIM BACK  :thumbsup:); then a short while later came Dolman.

But what happened to the others?

Would like to see a resolution to this question,which could be very interesting given the original Dredd is becoming ever more aware of his own mortality.

My entry into the suggestion box.

Many thanks
: Re: The Seven
: The Sherman Kid 25 May, 2014, 11:40:39 AM
Correction Prog1216 .
: Re: The Seven
: radiator 25 May, 2014, 10:36:06 PM
Already been at least two more confirmed iirc - Nimrod in Total War and, unless I'm going mad, another was named in Tour of Duty.
: Re: The Seven
: TordelBack 25 May, 2014, 10:46:42 PM
You might be thinking of Cadet Paris, in 'The Forsaken'.

As both she and Nimrod represent genetically altered experiments rather than true clones, do they count?
: Re: The Seven
: Dark Jimbo 25 May, 2014, 11:45:52 PM
It's a bit meaningless, isn't it, given that this throwaway reference was 14 years ago? They could have triple the number of clones in service now, or alternatively lost them all.
: Re: The Seven
: radiator 26 May, 2014, 01:02:17 AM
You might be thinking of Cadet Paris, in 'The Forsaken'.

As both she and Nimrod represent genetically altered experiments rather than true clones, do they count?

Unless I dreamt it, Dredd visited the cloning facility during either Tour of Duty or Day of Chaos and a new Cadet was mentioned. I think it was Tour... Because Dredd was investigating Sinfield's clone. Can't remember the name but it was an anagram of something. Or am I really going mad??!?!
: Re: The Seven
: radiator 26 May, 2014, 01:08:59 AM
Oric! It was Oric!!! I didn't imagine it. *phew*.
: Re: The Seven
: The Sherman Kid 26 May, 2014, 11:35:54 AM
It's a bit meaningless, isn't it, given that this throwaway reference was 14 years ago? They could have triple the number of clones in service now, or alternatively lost them all.

I don't think so, Dredd's ancestry/heritage has  been a core part of his character from the very beginning.  Dredd isn't getting any younger (how old is he now 70 or 75!) ,so in terms of legacy and what he sees as his replacement(s) this would be interesting to explore.

I didn't count Nimrod or Paris as they were altered.

: Re: The Seven
: Frank 26 May, 2014, 06:02:00 PM
It's a bit meaningless, isn't it, given that this throwaway reference was 14 years ago? They could have triple the number of clones in service now, or alternatively lost them all.

I don't think so, Dredd's ancestry/heritage has been a core part of his character from the very beginning.  Dredd isn't getting any younger (how old is he now 70 or 75!) ,so in terms of legacy and what he sees as his replacement(s) this would be interesting to explore

Jimbo's point wasn't that the bloodline saga isn't of interest, just that concentrating on identifying The Seven might be fruitless. Any Fargo clones hatched at the time that passing reference was made would be hitting the streets right now, and The Seven of fourteen years ago would have suffered the same rate of attrition as the rest of Justice Department during Chaos Day or just through a life working the streets.

I agree that it's always interesting to see more of the Fargo clones and explore different aspects of the odd family dynamic, but John Wagner doesn't seem to agree.

: Re: The Seven
: TordelBack 26 May, 2014, 07:31:10 PM
Oric, well remembered Radiator, I've completely forgotten that one.

I don't think so, Dredd's ancestry/heritage has  been a core part of his character from the very beginning. 

Has it?  We didn't find out who Dredd was a clone of until Prog 389.  While admittedly early in the scheme of things his clone nature itself isn't revealed until Prog 30, and not really addressed over the following 6 or 7 years.
: Re: The Seven
: Dark Jimbo 26 May, 2014, 07:45:00 PM
Jimbo's point wasn't that the bloodline saga isn't of interest, just that concentrating on identifying The Seven might be fruitless.

Aye - I loves me some Bloodline stories. Rico II and Vienna prompt fascinating questions and story oppurtunities, but the fact that seven clones were once mentioned fourteen years ago doesn't mean very much. I doubt we'll ever find out who they are, even if they are still alive. The number given could have been four, or twenty, or three hundred - Wagner could decide tomorrow that there's actually only two, and suddenly there will only be two.

Don't mean to be a killjoy - I'm guessing this is not in the intended spirit of your thread, Zen!
: Re: The Seven
: Frank 26 May, 2014, 07:52:49 PM
Don't mean to be a killjoy - I'm guessing this is not in the intended spirit of your thread, Zen!

Sherman, neebs. Why don't you just say something mean about his momma?

: Re: The Seven
: Dark Jimbo 26 May, 2014, 07:54:05 PM
Er... their avatars look alike?  :-\
: Re: The Seven
: Frank 26 May, 2014, 08:02:09 PM
Er... their avatars look alike?

They all look alike to you, don't they? UKIP scum. Just to derail the thread by talking about The Seven again, Mike Carroll seems like the writer who does most raking through old stories for ideas to spin out new stories from or drop references to as fan-bait - maybe he could include an inventory of Fargo clones on a screen in the background of a panel to sate Zen Sherman's lust for lists. Or, you know, write a story about them.

: Re: The Seven
: The Sherman Kid 27 May, 2014, 08:59:46 PM
Looking to maintain  my high batting average ,got my namesake back (albeit briefly) and the Ten seconders so come on Mike or (dare I say it....YES!) John, you know it makes sense  :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:  :P :P :P

 ;)
: Re: The Seven
: mogzilla 27 May, 2014, 09:26:00 PM
also can we be sure any we've not met yet survived chaos day ?
: Re: The Seven
: ZenArcade 27 May, 2014, 09:48:52 PM
Well if they're Fargo/Dredd clones they'd be a good bet.
: Re: The Seven
: Frank 27 May, 2014, 09:56:43 PM
Well if they're Fargo/Dredd clones they'd be a good bet

If they're Fargo clones, there's a 50/50 chance they either saved the city or went bad/sided with the enemy/shacked up with a woman/quit the department/were killed by Dredd.

: Re: The Seven
: ZenArcade 27 May, 2014, 11:00:09 PM
Teey've got a reasonable success rate?
: Re: The Seven
: Frank 28 May, 2014, 05:50:38 PM
They've got a reasonable success rate?

Rico was a gangster, Kraken was a mass murderer, and Dolman's turned out to be the dullest character ever to see print. Fargo scrapped the constitution and abandoned due process, and whatever other fine qualities they may possess, Dredd and Rico II are fascists. Some of you bleeding heart do-gooders are going to insist that agoraphobia and degenerative mutation aren't Vienna or Nimrod's fault, but that's why none of you pull down 500K per annum as a Wall Street trader and date an underwear model, like I do.

: Re: The Seven
: The Sherman Kid 30 May, 2014, 12:05:55 PM
They've got a reasonable success rate?

Rico was a gangster, Kraken was a mass murderer, and Dolman's turned out to be the dullest character ever to see print. Fargo scrapped the constitution and abandoned due process, and whatever other fine qualities they may possess, Dredd and Rico II are fascists. Some of you bleeding heart do-gooders are going to insist that agoraphobia and degenerative mutation aren't Vienna or Nimrod's fault.

Hey Nobody's perfect  :D
: Re: The Seven
: 8-Ball 30 May, 2014, 12:40:53 PM
They've got a reasonable success rate?

Dolman's turned out to be the dullest character ever to see print.

I'm pretty sure that title goes to Hershey.
: Re: The Seven
: ZenArcade 30 May, 2014, 01:25:48 PM
Ok, I was maybe a wee bit too liberal with the success rate quip! Z :lol:
: Re: The Seven
: Dark Jimbo 30 May, 2014, 01:56:14 PM
They've got a reasonable success rate?

...Fargo scrapped the constitution and abandoned due process, and whatever other fine qualities they may possess, Dredd and Rico II are fascists.

Given that it's Justice Department doing the cloning, I hardly think 'is a fascist' on the school report is going to be a detriment to future success.

: Re: The Seven
: ZenArcade 30 May, 2014, 02:41:46 PM
Well yes that's right. Our moral view would be diametrically different from that of what ever Justice Department strategic planning committee ok'd the cloning programmed. I guess there would be a lot of ends justifying the means stuff present in the minutes after that meeting.
On deeper reflection the basal success stat which would be frying heads in the Dept would be the pop figures from say 2099 (800,000,000) through till 2035 (50,000,000). Now could it be argued how did cloned Judges adversly affect that result?
: Re: The Seven
: Dark Jimbo 30 May, 2014, 04:55:49 PM
Purely for my own amusement I spent lunchtime doing this. It doesn't lean as wholly in favour of the bad I thought it would.

(http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a113/Darkjimbo2/Bloodline_zps69a1f1dd.jpg~original) (http://s10.photobucket.com/user/Darkjimbo2/media/Bloodline_zps69a1f1dd.jpg.html)
: Re: The Seven
: Frank 30 May, 2014, 05:17:02 PM

That's brilliant, Jimbo, especially 'beard' - although I'd argue that particular quality belongs in column B, rather than column C. I'm not sure the creation of Justice Department qualifies for column A either ... or that it saved MC1. Fargo shares my scepticism (http://www.2000adreview.co.uk/reviews/2007/images/1535/judge-dredd.jpg).

: Re: The Seven
: Dark Jimbo 30 May, 2014, 05:58:10 PM

That's brilliant, Jimbo, especially 'beard' - although I'd argue that particular quality belongs in column B, rather than column C. I'm not sure the creation of Justice Department qualifies for column A either ... or that it saved MC1. Fargo shares my scepticism (http://www.2000adreview.co.uk/reviews/2007/images/1535/judge-dredd.jpg).

But for lack of space, I was going to be clever and put 'created the justice system' in Fargo's bad column as well as the good. As for Dolman... I struggled to know what to say. He somehow managed to be a more interesting character off-panel than when he actually returned to the strip!

Making the table threw up an interesting point - do we know what Ephraim actually did that made him a wrong 'un?
: Re: The Seven
: Frank 30 May, 2014, 06:13:29 PM
do we know what Ephraim actually did that made him a wrong 'un?

Sounds like you're pitching, James. If you don't write that one up someone else will - probably after they're done filling in the details of Orlok the Assassin's schooldays (http://www.ianfleming.com/books/young-bond-books-2/).

: Re: The Seven
: Dark Jimbo 30 May, 2014, 06:25:32 PM
The only mentions I've heard of the character are the various dissaproving but vauge references during Origins - I just wondered if we'd been told more during the rather large gap in my Dredd reading (The Cal Files, maybe)?
: Re: The Seven
: radiator 30 May, 2014, 06:41:56 PM
IIRC Ephraim had never been mentioned before Origins.

The Cal Files is a weird one in light of Origins as it hinges on the 'revelation' that Dredd is not a clone but the result of an affair between the 'incorruptible' Fargo and a mystery woman. A rare example of Wagner tripping up on continuity.
: Re: The Seven
: Frank 30 May, 2014, 06:46:39 PM
The only mentions I've heard of the character are the various dissaproving but vauge references during Origins - I just wondered if we'd been told more during the rather large gap in my Dredd reading (The Cal Files, maybe)?

I'm pretty sure Origins represents the first time Wagner worked out any details of the Fargo clan. It's difficult to imagine the Eustace Fargo depicted in Origins (a proto-Dredd, basically) enjoying the kind of candlelit dinner depicted in The Cal Files - Sequenta Tells don't look like she took much romancin' "when his workload permitted".

That "ornery" is as much as I've ever read about Ephram. If I remember correctly, you started reading 2000ad at the same time I stopped, so between us we've got this two horse town surrounded.

: Re: The Seven
: Frank 30 May, 2014, 06:54:27 PM
The Cal Files is a weird one in light of Origins as it hinges on the 'revelation' that Dredd is not a clone but the result of an affair between the 'incorruptible' Fargo and a mystery woman. A rare example of Wagner tripping up on continuity

Kind of. I read The Cal Files as Dredd being shocked to learn that Fargo had dipped his wick originally, but a re-read in light of Origins suggests it's the allegation that Fargo procured preferential treatment for Arden Polders that gives rise to Dredd's comment about his clone father being "touched by corruption", and it's the suggestion that his clone origins were a lie (and that he had a biological mother) that have the greatest impact on Dredd.

: Re: The Seven
: TordelBack 30 May, 2014, 08:59:39 PM
Agreed, although I'd add that seeing Fargo's single lapse becoming just one of many is factor too.
: Re: The Seven
: The Sherman Kid 11 February, 2019, 11:57:54 AM
Okay, I've been patient but we've not seen Rico for quite a while now ...tapping foot   ;)

Would be good to see him back and what has happened to Dolman (..and fill in the blanks regarding the 'seven'). Too much for a nerd to ask  :D :wave: :thumbsup:?