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Spoilers => Prog => : Colin YNWA 09 November, 2019, 08:10:36 PM

: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Colin YNWA 09 November, 2019, 08:10:36 PM
So its the small things that make a difference.

Dredd - Okay this is probably just me, and I don't know what I expected, but Dredd didn't completely stick the landing. Everything finished perfectly satisfactorily. The commentry on Dredd as the survivors flew back was just wonderful. The end reveal allowed a legacy without tainting a record, which was really neat. The art was stunning... but for some reason - and I think it was simply that this has been so good - I greedily wanted more. I wanted this to amaze me and turn on a sixpence ... or something. Instead I got what I should have expected a gloriously crafted masterwork with nice resolution and a great character moment.

Defoe - Well I'll be I see improvement. I'll be honest I've almost entirely dropped off the story by this point but I think the art is much improved this week. Last time I whined and cried for the art to express moments of calm and quiet when required and here we get this. Its has all the talent but dialled back enough to allow it to be appreciated. You know what it might be as simple as more panel boarders?? One really striing moment is the cutout. Now it has the same problems as the art to date. Too  much going on to really be able to pull anything useful out but in this context it looked like a 17th Century cutout of a spaceship would in my minds eye and the splash of colour was very effective.

Not going to say I liked this I didn't but was very happy to be able to appreciate the art this time out.

Everything else as you were sir (or madam).

Brink is a character masterclass. For folks who complain about talking head we get a very clear lesson in its not just the words, this strip is as much about what is conveyed in the art and here it is masterful.

Hope - might just be a cliche baddie being bad to a bunch of this up til then baddy peers but jeepers creepers its done well.

Deadworld kinda spins off on one but I enjoyed it and its really comics turned up to 11. But a good eleven.

Its a great Prog and has the Art Stars Winner Star Scan - which looks wonderful but for me doesn't quite have the impact and imagination of a couple of the entries but its hard not to be bowled over by the technic

AND wonderful confirmation that Full Tilt Boogie is heading our way in Thrills of the Future.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Richard 09 November, 2019, 11:26:44 PM
I loved Dredd. I feel sorry for my favourite chapter though -- the little note-taking robot. He deserved his own 50-episode series.

Hope was brilliant. I have no idea where this is going next, but if this had been the last episode it would have worked perfectly well.

The star scan looks fantastic. It's the entry I wanted to win, and it looks gorgeous. In full size, I now notice for the first time that the artist's signature blends into the artwork itself, which is a nice touch.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: broodblik 10 November, 2019, 03:30:37 AM
The cover:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YdqWTLD7h-M/XcLlBlhbGlI/AAAAAAAAl7k/ZpLCHKltClI7GSqb_5TR75zUQwaJjGeZQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/9a80a96f-2fdf-45b6-90c2-d5a193b753e3.jpg)
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Tiplodocus 10 November, 2019, 04:03:41 PM
So lovely as it is  it doesn't exactly scream DEADWORLD  to me.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: TordelBack 10 November, 2019, 05:50:05 PM
Goblins versus, I dunno, a Mean Arena team, possibly the Bolsover Bolsheviks?
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Greg M. 10 November, 2019, 06:40:28 PM
I think I'd probably enjoy Deadworld a lot more if it looked like that! (Not intended as a dis against the supremely-talented Mr. Kendall's art - just that the cover has the sort of old-school, rough-and-tumble, boys-adventure-comic vibe that appeals to me.)
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: TordelBack 10 November, 2019, 10:23:01 PM
Heh, good points!
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: 73north 12 November, 2019, 02:01:48 PM
Tuesday . Still no Prog . 😕
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: broodblik 13 November, 2019, 05:09:55 AM
Good prog for it is another fiver for me.

Dredd although it ends in a more predictable fashion, I really enjoyed Wagner and MacNeil’s tale. It is almost liked I wanted another twist in the tale, but I just like the way Wagner spins his Dredd stories.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Magnetica 13 November, 2019, 11:39:27 AM
Is it just me or does anyone else think the art in Defoe has a bit of a Kevin O’Neill feel circa Nemesis book 1 about it? Not quite as good mind...

Great to see the cylindrical tank from the Judge Child turn up in Deadworld (even if it was never an Earth thing). Dave Kendall had asked for references to it on one of the Facebook groups back in July.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Frank 13 November, 2019, 12:10:25 PM
Is it just me or does anyone else think the art in Defoe has a bit of a Kevin O’Neill feel circa Nemesis book 1 about it? Not quite as good mind...

When some were complaining about the density and complexity of Moore's art and storytelling, I was going to post a page of O'Neill from Nemesis, but that would have been the cue for lots of replies pointing out (correctly) that Moore's art isn't as good as O'Neill's.

Which isn't the point you or I are making. Most people - even clever people - are incapable of discussing a specific point* without spinning out into irrelevant generalities. This episode's cutaway of the spaceship reminded me of the olden days ...


(https://i.imgur.com/U4nyVdu.png)


.. as did the density of both story and art. In a comic showcasing the leisurely storytelling of the very good Brink and Hope, Defoe used up 60% of the plot Tharg allotted for the entire comic.


* That the density, which they've identified as the reason they have a problem with the art or the storytelling, isn't the sole reason they don't like the art. Internet doesn't do nuance.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Dandontdare 13 November, 2019, 01:26:02 PM
I found the page with the spaceship cutaway totally impenetrable - had a squint at it but did not even bother trying to decipher the ilegible text. The story itself was more interesting this week though.

Dredd sows the seeds for more - who is the father of the unborn child?

The rest were all great - giving Defoe a rare half point this week, it's 4.5 out of 5 for me.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Frank 13 November, 2019, 01:53:46 PM
Dredd sows the seeds for more - who is the father of the unborn child?

There's the question of what happens to Elinora and, maybe more interestingly, Mariella in MC1.

Do they repeat the Vienna beat of unwanted family Dredd feels bound to help, or is Mariella given the Giant Jr pass to the Academy despite her advanced years? That'd sort of be replicating the Dredd/Beeny relationship, too.

Not sure Wagner has that many Dredds left in him*, so if The Garcias ever become a regular fixture on MCTV, someone else may be running the show.


* John is now free to do the work he likes, although he does dabble in writing the occasional Judge Dredd story. But he added: “I’m not intending to do many more.”  LINK (https://www.shropshirestar.com/entertainment/features/2019/06/01/the-dawn-of-the-dredd-meet-comic-book-writer-john-wagner/)
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: JayzusB.Christ 13 November, 2019, 10:00:14 PM
So... was the thing that Hershey gave Dredd just information about where to find her granddaughter?
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: titchard 14 November, 2019, 10:47:46 AM
Tuesday . Still no Prog . 😕

Me either - hoping it is on the mat when I get home tonight, its been a terrible week and could do with a pick me up.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: IndigoPrime 14 November, 2019, 11:14:19 AM
So... was the thing that Hershey gave Dredd just information about where to find her granddaughter?
It was a request rather than a thing, wasn’t it?

As for the Prog, Dredd ended well, although could easily have gone on at least another four episodes. Brink remains one of the best things 2000 AD has done in the past decade. Defoe has lost me, and so will need a re-read during that magical time when I get a clone and have the time. Hope has grabbed me more than the previous run, which I now kind of wish I’d grabbed in the Hallowe’en sale. Deadworld… has kinda lost me too. I loved the set-up and initial run to this one, but I found it more intriguing as a messed up plague strip than what’s become an oddball elseworlds Dredd. Oh well. It’s still good, mind.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Proudhuff 14 November, 2019, 04:31:00 PM
I loved Dredd. I feel sorry for my favourite chapter though -- the little note-taking robot. He deserved his own 50-episode series.

...50 episode series...
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Proudhuff 14 November, 2019, 04:40:56 PM
Why is it that I can suspend belief about zombies in the 1600's but just can do the same for gunpowder propeller space ships? Not to mention sneaking a horde of Zombies aboard it.

Sorry to see this Dredd end, I hope that the BiG W expands on some of the loose ends left dangling.

Brink felt like one of those episodes of TWD that while it doesn't move the plot line any further forward, it does give a bit if insight into characters actions and motivation.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Dark Jimbo 14 November, 2019, 07:58:49 PM
Why is it that I can suspend belief about zombies in the 1600's but just can do the same for gunpowder propeller space ships? Not to mention sneaking a horde of Zombies aboard it.

This is Pat we're talking about -  he has many faults, but his research is never one of them. While the zombies never existed, the rocket may have got as far as a working prototype: https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2018/02/06/englands-17th-century-attempt-to-reach-the-moon/
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: JayzusB.Christ 15 November, 2019, 08:41:19 AM
So... was the thing that Hershey gave Dredd just information about where to find her granddaughter?
It was a request rather than a thing, wasn’t it?


So is the mystery solved? Was it simply a request to find her granddaughter?

I loved this story, and was sad to see the end of El Presidente.  He's a classic Wagner villain - terrifyingly nasty but somewhat ridiculous.  A caricature of a Latin American dictator taking himself very seriously indeed.  He looks great too.  Then again, we don't actually see him die, so who knows.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Frank 15 November, 2019, 05:41:58 PM

(https://i.imgur.com/022QcMU.png?2)


: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Proudhuff 16 November, 2019, 01:30:25 PM
Why is it that I can suspend belief about zombies in the 1600's but just can do the same for gunpowder propeller space ships? Not to mention sneaking a horde of Zombies aboard it.

This is Pat we're talking about -  he has many faults, but his research is never one of them. While the zombies never existed, the rocket may have got as far as a working prototype: https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2018/02/06/englands-17th-century-attempt-to-reach-the-moon/


I think its all the accrued pedantic science in my head that stops that for bursting thro the 'I want to believe' sphere.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: norton canes 18 November, 2019, 10:12:55 AM
Belated opinion on this week's prog since I left it at work and only just got a chance to read it...

Going with the consensus on Guatemala that although it's as fine a piece of comics writing as you'll see anywhere, the conclusion did seem a little rushed. Also it was a shame that having been portrayed as a coldly calculating mastermind, the Presidente ignored every piece of information from his aides and ended up giving the "No, no... it cannot be!" kind of shtick usually delivered by B-move villains.

Elsewhere Hope and Defoe are really in their stride, Brink takes time out for a poignant interlude and Kek-W drops (literally) a bizarre blast from the past into Deadworld. 9/10's all around and once again glad that 2000 AD is still here with its weekly potpourri of thrills.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Tiplodocus 19 November, 2019, 04:46:48 PM
Enjoyed what I read a great deal. The action in Guatemala being particularly lovely. DEFOE awaits a big read in one session as it requires a lot of attention I think.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: Mikey 21 November, 2019, 11:43:15 AM
Due to ongoing late prog arrivals, I just read this last night.

The main thing I want to say is that Brink continues to be my favourite thrill for some time. It's not often I'm moved to manly tears, but there may have been one shed for Bridge. A wonderful character moment.

Elsewhere, Dredd was awesome and I'm still loving Deadworld and its vividly gruesome art, plus Hope keeps giving it gritty.
: Re: Prog 2157 - Red Army!
: 73north 23 November, 2019, 11:00:11 AM
Dreadful week with my home life  - and for added hassle my copy never did turn up - phone Subscriptions
and replacement was mailed to me early this week - and that has not turned up

really kicking myself  for not buying the Prog at local WH Smith - and now that's gone from shelves

received latest issue ( 2158 ) but not read it for obvious reasons
all - really frustrating