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Hey Rufus, no apology necessary.

It?s probably one of those simple misunderstandings. Deb quickly became a big fan of Mick?s work when she saw what he could do. It?s just a shame that many of the readers didn?t appreciate Mick?s version of Sonic ? it was a little too idiosyncratic perhaps.

Nigel

?Mick McMahon did a lotta stuff for Sonic in the mid nineties. The Editor, my lovely friend Debbie T. was a big McM fan, and got him alot of work when 2000ad wouldn't touch him, in their wisdom.?

That actually isn?t correct, I?m afraid.

What happened was that I was a big Mick McMahon fan and I really wanted to work with him. The first time I tried at Sonic The Comic was when Richard Burton was editor. I had no luck, Richard had him down as a 2000AD artist and not suitable for the strip I had in mind for him - Decap Attack. Decap was a very silly and cartoony series which I wrote and drew.

Later when Deb was editor I tried again (I was determined to work with Mick if at all possible). Deb had absolutely no idea who Mick was but I played my ace card which was to say I would step aside as artist on Decap Attack so Mick could step in for a few episodes. Deb then had Mick work up samples of the characters before agreeing to give him a go. I remember getting a little worried that I wouldn?t get the strip back when Deb saw how good Mick actually was. Luckily Deb liked what Mick was doing and she gave him work on the main Sonic strip ? unfortunately not on any of my scripts though?

? Debbie did an amazing job on that mag, as forces from ahigh strangled the budget. Sadly missed.
Richard and Nigel both did sterling work. ?

Thanks? Is this ?the? rufus, by the way?

Nigel

So tell me what stories you're after and let me see if I can find them. I should have spare copies.

Nigel

"Checked ebay but nothing there except a couple of overpriced issues... "

Actually there's quite a lot.

See if this link works...

http://search.ebay.com/sonic-the-comic_W0QQsocomparecolumnlayoutZ1QQnojsprZyQQfromZR14QQsorecordsperpageZ50QQsolocationselectorZ3QQsolocationselectorZ3QQsaavailabletocountryZ1QQsolocationselectorZ3QQsalocatedincountryZ3

Prices don't seem bad to me. Most are at around ?2.50 and there's a collection of over 30 issues currently at ?17.

I don't think the best issues are here though.

But I know I have a box of these things around somewhere. Remind me what stories you're after and I'll see what I can dig out.

Nigel

Thanks for that.

But, of course, for me AHAB is endlessly fascinating and it?s great to have this opportunity to talk about it.

Those nine weeks sure went by quickly?

Nigel

?it's nice to have feedback on feedback. ANd yes, you did cover all of the points in a positive manner - it's just me being a bit picky. ?

I have no problem with picky.

?One specific point I was thinking about was the thing about Izzie's kid. Now I was thinking that this sub-plot was only introduced because you needed a reason to keep Izzie on the Elysium - pretty short story if she just hops off and we never see what happens after she left*?

Anyway, you made the valid point that she was disguising her true motives from her shipmates. Why does that mean she has to disguise them from the reader? Wouldn't there be some interestingly tense situations could be had from us knowing that she's trying to keep this secret from her shipmates? As I am a perspiring writer, I'd be keen to get a bit more information on your thought processes for stuff like this.?

Okay, this is a question of how and when information on a character is revealed to the reader. A couple of people have said the matter of Izzie?s child came up very suddenly and without warning ? I don?t really think that is entirely fair. When we first see her her face markings obviously signify something. We then learn that she was once married to one of those aliens and we also find out that her feeling towards the race are pretty negative. The business with Tashtego also gives us a clue as to the alien race?s attitude to their women. It?s only after all this is established that the matter of the abducted child turns up. So this plot wasn?t just introduced on the spur of the moment it was planned from the beginning. I could have clued in the reader about this earlier but I decided not to. One of the things I try to do in my writing is to not leave too many dangling plot threads hanging around. So I?ll often wait until certain threads have run their course before bring up new business. So Izzie?s child is introduced after AHAB has taken control of the ship.

?I think my "poorly motivated (characters)" thought came from this child thing, the moronic bloke that conveniently hands over all of the command codes to A.H.A.B.?

?Conveniently? is a little unfair, I think. Spence was clearly manipulated by AHAB into giving him the command position. Spence was stupid but I?ve worked for people who were stupid before. There?s a certain kind of person who achieves authority but is actually an incompetent manager (academics and politicians spring to mind) these people are inclined to make the most astonishingly bad decisions ? particularly if they are out of their depth and know it. This makes a certain arrogant type defensive and not inclined to ask for help.

? and A.H.A.B's actions when he wipes out the rest of his crew, burns his memories into the robot etc. I know you said it was a hunter obsession thing?

No, that was a ?survive at any costs? thing. This all kicked off when Cornelius realized he didn?t have long to live. He was willing to sacrifice everyone else as long as he survived. This is nothing to do with the hunting of the Kohenyu, it?s to do with what lengths Cornelius will go to to survive.

? but I just didn't buy it (this shouldn't bother you too much as everyone else seemsto think you've created a top villain, here). His actions, to me, seemed TOO extreme for a hunter obsessed with a beast? ?

But on the matter of Cornelius hunting the Kohenyu right at the start of the story. This hunter business came from research into whaling. Not in depth research just enough to give me a feel. But anyway, there were plenty of examples of whaling ships that went out and didn?t ever come back. A lot were crushed by ice but many lives were also certainly lost during a hunt. One example I did find was a case where two harpoon boats went out from the main ship to kill a Sperm Whale. The whale smashed one killing some of the crew but the second boat carried on the attack regardless of the danger. So I really don?t have any difficulty understanding AHAB (or Cornelius as he then was) and his determination to kill the Kohenyu. I just quickly turned up this from Google:

?WHALING SHIPS OF WHITBY,  1753-1837

A total of 58 ships sailed during this period. Seventeen ships were lost. ?

Those are not great odds but the profits were so considerable that everyone must have thought it worth the risk. Obviously these ships didn?t just sail once out so it?s not quite as bad as it looks?

?Oh and again, it was my poorly worded criticism about the "BIG questions". Of course your story asks a couple - I just felt that, for me, the cackling madman has overshadowed them. ?

I don?t get this ?cackling madman? stuff. AHAB laughed once ? not at some nefarious scheme or at the point where he committed some terrible act. The only time AHAB laughed was when he reacted to Queequeg?s spirituality. He was sneering at Queequeg?s beliefs. AHAB has come back from the dead (in a sense) but he has no faith.

?And hey - you have got me thinking about the strip long after I've read it so that's a big positive. A couple of the shock moments have also been very effective (A.H.A.B killing the captain and then the rest of the command crew) ?

Thanks. I do think that there is plenty of depth in AHAB (obviously I would, wouldn?t I?) but it?s not flagged up with exposition or characters bearing their souls. I?ve tried to have characters be revealed through what they do not what they say about themselves. In the early part of the story AHAB was clearly a bastard but he never actually said anything menacing ? he was actually very civil.

Nigel

?A.H.A.B - well, I reconsidered that nice Nigel's points the other night and I've decided after all that I they aren't "fair enough" after all.?

Really? I thought I?d covered your specific points pretty directly. It wasn?t like I just made those answers up on the spot or anything ? this was all stuff that I spent a long time figuring out.

?This started out promisingly but for me has been lost in a maze of poorly motivated.?

What poor motivations are you talking about? And I know the plot is fairly dense but is it really a ?maze?? ? by that I assume you mean you are confused. I?m not out to bicker about this but I am quite interested. What motivated each character, I thought, was very clear indeed.

?It could have been asking BIG questions but, for me, it's just turned into a maniacal killing spree for a one dimensional villain (something that Ahab wasn't, if I remember).?

I don?t claim to be equaling the sophistication or intentions of a huge novel like Moby Dick in a nine part 2000AD series. And as for big questions, well I don?t know really. I?m addressing ideas such as making choices between personal goals and the greater good and I?m looking at obsession and ruthlessness. And we have a bit of spiritualism with Queequeg. I know I?m not flagging this aspect up a lot but I do believe it is there nevertheless if you care to look for it.

But it clearly doesn?t work for you and you have responded to the story in the way you describe and this really is fair enough.

Nigel

Damn? I can never resist when somebody asks questions.

As long as the questions aren?t along the lines of  ?Why did Tharg print AHAB, it?s crap?...

?Sometimes, the people in AHAB seem to behave in a way that makes the plot more "exciting" but not logical. Surely they'd have got more money from taking the antidote back to earth than they would for selling a carcass??

Well, I?m sure I tried to make the point on a couple of occasions that the chemicals and so on that could be liberated from the Kohenyu?s carcass were worth an absolute fortune ? enough to make every crewman incredibly rich. Sure the crew could have blackmailed whoever organized to expedition back on Earth and maybe raised more money that way but what?s the guarantee that the crew don?t just end up being arrested when they deliver the cure? I know I didn?t have space to go into all that in the strip (and nobody would have thanked me for taking up the space if I had. But I?m sure I did make the point about just how valuable a Kohenyu is.

?Why was the Captain (before he got into A.H.A.B*) so obsessed with the big whale things??

Well, he wasn?t. All we see of this is that one page at the very beginning of the story. What we do know is that he?s been hunting the Kohenyu in a restricted part of space. We see that he is on the verge of capturing the creature and he is determined not to let it get away. He?s just a hunter determined to get his prey and as we discover later on killing the Kohenyu would have made him fantastically wealthy.

? Why didn't Izzie mention her kid before issue 5??

Why would she? She was on board the ship under false pretenses ? her real aim was to get out into space and then steal a ?shuttle craft? and go find her son. She would hardly be likely to make her intentions clear to anybody. She only told Queequeg when he asked her about a picture of her son and at the point where the crew were on the verge of mutiny and she was actually about to leave.

So all this stuff makes sense to me. But that?s not really the point, of course ? it?s got to make sense to the people who are actually reading the story. I hope it does but as the writer you can never be sure.

Nigel

RyanKingo 7

You don't like AHAB and I'm fine with that but I do wonder why you need to say "AHAB is crap" over and over - I think you were pretty clear on that the first time.

You're remarks are mainly just abuse of course but I did manage to find one actual criticism - you say the killings are pointless. That is plainly not true. Every murder AHAB commits is for a particular purpose.

I'm not unhappy for you to express your hatred towards AHAB but I just don't know where the venom comes from. You clearly don't want discussion, the thrust of the thread seems to be your hope that other AHAB-haters would chip in to support your point of view. It just seems a little on the nasty side...

Nigel

"AHHHHH!!!
No.
No that's really really unlikely. Or is it?!"

It's really, really, really unlikely.

Nigel

Thanks for that. I loved working on those Decap Attack stories and I still believe that they actually may have been genuinely funny.

Some of them I wrote with my old mate Richard Rayner who was at the same time working on the grapic novel Road To Perdition. I heard they made it into a film or something...

Also I got the great Mick McMahon in to draw a few - I had to step down as artist but I was determined to work with my hero.

Nigel

"it's my turn coming up on 2000adreview for prog 1393... A.H.A.B had better not have run out of steam by then :)"

In that case can I buy you a beer?

Nigel

I said I could explain, I didn't say I was going to...

Although if you buy me a beer at Bristol I'll probabaly tell you anything.

Nigel

I can explain everything...

Nigel

D.E.C.A.P.A.T.T.A.C.K.

Decap Attack, now there was a strip to be reckoned with...

And, you know, some of the series ideas we've had here actually sound quite good to me...

Still, I think I'll stick with my own ideas:

D.R.E.D.D
S.A.V.A.G.E.
... Well, you get the idea...

N.I.G.E.L.