wagner, rennie, abnett

[Jim_Campbell]

<>

Don't  forget that, back in the second half of the 80s and early 90s, there were _far_ more small press publishers than now.

(By which I mean a step above fanzine - professionally printed, if not always professional in quality ...!)

I distinctly recall seeing Nigel Dobbyn's first (or very early) work published in Harrier Comics titles, as with Staz Johnson. And some little-known chap called Steve Yeowell did a short for them, before going off to work on Zoids with some bloke called Grant Morrison.

(Morrison also had a mini-series advertised as "Coming Soon" from Harrier, IIRC. Pretty sure it was called 'Abraxas', or some such. Never appeared, mind ...)

These days, there seems to be precious little between fanzine and what's left of the establishment ... 2000AD and the Meg, plus the Black Library stuff, which has its own built-in fan-base and doesn't need to worry  as much about the state of the comics market in general.

So, I don't think anyone has _ever_ made much headway through the slushpile route, it just used to be easier to go the fanzine -> small press -> mainstream route ...

Cheers

Jim

[Art]

Which leaves wannabe writers like me pretty much stuffed, unless we happen to want to self publish. Last couple of times I did that it all went disastrously wrong - organising artists is like herding cats, financial or life crises have a knack of popping up just as some progress seems to be being made, etc... etc... the worst aspect of which is that I've probably damaged my credibility with would be collaborators beyond repair.

I'm just not cut out for that sort of thing.

Maybe I should just give up and write bad first-person short stories consisting of philosophical ramblings and submit them to Interzone.

[paulvonscott]

No, I've seen that interzone shite, I wanted to write hard SF, then I realised that no fucker wanted it, they want philosophical life ramblings of some chick who lived in an SF world, but it didn't really effect her, she was too busy talking about some emotional crisis she was in.

To be honest arthur I'm in the same boat, but I'd really rather hear the hard truth, cos there is too much pie in the sky malarky.  I think self-produced projects are the way to go, as Jim said the boundaries are very blurry.  Of course then you have the problem of many writers and few artists.  

I only wanted to concentrate on writing because I was born with rat-like claws that couldn't draw the pictures I saw in my head.  I have started numerous strips 'Rathbone and the last of the organic wars', 'a fistfull of multiverses, 'dirk despair at the end of time' 'onan the barbarian' and I've chucked em all cos it takes me two months to draw someone who doesn't look like a freak.

Anyone who can draw, should try writing cos if they can do both, they've made it.

[christophe]

Dear Paul,

I am sorry Onan the barbarian fell on stony ground! Hi hi hi!

The artists who can write or authors who can draw, normally one side is better. By example, Dave Gibbons has made some good scripts, but he is better artist. Frank Miller is better author than artist, may be?

C

[Ol^ Marbles]

Used to be good. His DD run is my all time comic fave. But his Sin City stuff has degenerated into complete arse. He needs a kick up the pants and a good editor.

Sorry if this is OT !

[Wood]

"No, I've seen that interzone shite, I wanted to write hard SF, then I realised that no fucker wanted it, they want philosophical life ramblings of some chick who lived in an SF world, but it didn't really effect her, she was too busy talking about some emotional crisis she was in."

I should be sorted then :)

Link: http://www.johnheronproject.btinternet.co.uk/alis/index.html" target="_blank">philosophical life ramblings of some sci-fi chick

http://www.johnheronproject.btinternet.co.uk/images/alisphoto.jpg">

[Art]

Nah, Alis is far too up-to-date. Interzone stuff has to read like it was written in 1970 something by hippy liberals.

[Wood]

Um, I'll take that as a compliment, Arthur...

[Art]

Do. Its a nice piece of work.

[Tiplodocus]

I would definitely be of the opinion that the Futrue Shock pile is no way to make a living but if your writing is just a hobby that you do for pleasure (and you do it well) then why not keep submitting.  

I've enjoyed the process of writing and rewiting some tales and the anticipation of feedback (and even browsing this and the script droid site for tips) quite a lot.  I would like to be published but I think I'm lucky that I don't need to do this for a living.

I was in a similar position several years ago when I thought about being a stand-up comedian.  I was, if I may sound immodest, above average but I had a lot of flaws that needed working out.  In the end, the amount of crap you had to put up with from clubs in London and promoters etc. turned what was a good hobby into a bit of a chore that though it would provide a living, it would be only a "beans on toast" for tea every second night kind of a living.  So now I do something else for a living and dabble in comedy/writing to amuse myself.  

I'm lucky. I can see that if you REALLY want to write for a living it would be depressing.

If you want to get really depressed, read the Writers and Artists Yearbook 2002. AD isn't listed in it but there's loads of stuff about how to get work in newspapers, tv and film.  It basically says "No chance!".

[Art]

A mate of mine is trying to get into stand-up. Doing quite well actualy, but theres absolutely no money in it. We meet up every so often to discuss our relative cultral endevours.

Of course he's lucky, he can do his thing on his own, whereas without an artist and a publisher my comics exist only as scripts and in the inside of my head.

Link: http://www.mustardmag.org/comedynights/index.htm" target="_blank">http://www.mustardmag.org/comedynights/index.htm

[Art]

Interesting. According to the latest Megazine Alan Moore was actually picked out from the slush pile.

[W. R. Logan]

>Well, not Si as he got through in a pitchfest.  Which isn't to say that he didn't have to work as hard, in fact a pitchfest sounds too much like those scary school presentations.  All cudos to him.

You mean that after submitting stuff to the nerve centre for 18 months and starting to get positive feedback counts as nothing just because he did a synopsis for a future shock live at Dredd:Con 1?
The way people go on here you'd have thought Si Spurrier just walked of the street and pitched an idea and it got excepted just because everyone else in the room was completely crap. The truth is most of the room was crap but Si's route to 2000AD shouldn't be dismissed because his first future shock was commissioned after pitching it live.

Now not everything that Si Spurrier has written will appear on my favourite list but I've enjoyed most of his stuff and thats all I ask. We'll see how he progresses, and think back and remember how other writers work was when it first appeared.

La Placa Rifa,
W. R. Logan.

Link: http://www.2000ad.nu/classof79" target="_blank">Class Of '79

http://www.2000adonline.com/covers/2000ad/mediumres/1290.jpg">

[paulvonscott]

I don't know Logan, do I have to go through all these threads, looking for where you are trying to trip me up?  Deary me (i.e. for fucks sake)

I know little about Si Spurrier, but what I was saying and actually made pains to point out, was that I wasn't including Si, because he didn't get his first accepted script through the unsolicted submissions pile.  It was in no way some sort of slur on him, you nana, if you think I'm lying or being circuitus in my insults then you've made a big mistake.  I was just pointing out why Si didn't fit into the case at hand, which was...

I was looking at how many writers appear in AD solely through the unsolicited future shocks process and how many go onto have series, i.e. become main contributing writers to 2000AD.

The pitchfest was something different, I never said all the rest of the entires were crap or that Spurrier got lucky.  Just that pitching a story is a different submissions process to something unsolicted sent through the post.

Of the list that did end up there, I'm sure many didn't first come to the attention of Tharg through Unsolicited FS.  But neither is that slur.

If I wanted to say something about someone I'd just say it Logan.  Believe me.  The only thing I don't like about Spurriers stuff is his sense of humour, which makes Bec and kawl a complete no go zone for me, but as I've said before, I look forward to his forthcoming serious stuff.  I even asked him last time he was in the chat room, if the next series he was doing was going to be a serious one, I did that because I reckon I have a serious chance of enjoying it!

So if it's not clear what I'm saying, just ask me!