This Forum

[Dudley]

Let's not forget the sunny place you could have...

Link: http://groups.google.com/group/alt.comics.2000ad/browse_thread/thread/818e037dce9dde2f/187f05acabaae385" target="_blank">if the professionals still visited...

[Matt Timson]

"though when it comes to my own stuff I think the boards been pretty gentle with me"

Pfff- you've just been lucky enough to get paired with really good artists that managed to elevate your otherwise rubbish stories...

;)

[pauljholden]

Don't worry, that won't last.

- pj

[Matt Timson]

Tsk!  I thought you were leaving this thread forever?

:D

[Funt Solo]

"If you can't be constructive, or at least polite, in your criticisms then go off to some other corner of the internet and be needlessly rude and confrontational."

Nothing in that says you can't say you don't like the prog, Or specific work within it.


I read it as saying exactly that: it explicitly says "If you can't be constructive", which I think means "you can't say you don't like the prog" (without offering further explanation).  That's where it becomes subjective, unfortunately.

Also, really, you've only chosen the nice part of his post, where he's being quite reasonable.  The next paragraph is where he tells us that there are other message board crimes being taken into account (so we're being watched and judged guilty without any kind of dialogue) and that if an invisible line is crossed that the message board will be closed.

I know you're trying to be positive about this, but at least take into account all of what was said by Tharg when you choose to describe it as "reasonable".

[Dog Deever]

.....must......resist.....

[Matt Timson]

While discussing this with somebody else, it occurred to me that a bit more interaction from Tharg might make for a little more positivity and generally better behaviour from all.

I'm not talking about Tharg joining in on threads like 'what socks do you wear'- but I'm gathering that a few people are openly irritated not just because Tharg has told them off, but because that it's the only input that he's had in a long time.

Obviously, I know the guy is busy putting together the Galaxy's Greatest Comic- but would it hurt to contribute a post here and there?  Surely something must pique his interest sometimes?

Just out of interest, does anyone know what sort of traffic this place gets- outside of the hundred or so reasonably regular posters?  Do we get many lurkers?

[IndigoPrime]

"it occurred to me that a bit more interaction from Tharg might make for a little more positivity and generally better behaviour from all."

It would be good to see Matt post, even if it's very occasionally. I think it's pretty clear that the interaction Jon has had with the board has been very positive. It has amended certain aspects of the books, and he's also been able to "justify" a couple of slightly leftfield decisions (such as Stone Island), rather than leaving the reasoning to speculation.

[pauljholden]

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080301183718AAgdKjC'>Various definitions of constructive criticism

Constructive criticism certainly DOESN'T mean saying everything is wonderful, in the same way that criticism doesn't mean saying everything is awful.

As regards the rest, well, I think there's a danger of the conversations spiralling downwards into bitterness and recriminations and I think if we can move forwards with a little bit of humour and hope* then the place would never be in any danger of anything.

-pj
*all together now 'PJ is a wanker' :)

[W. R. Logan]

The trouble is in the past we've been spoilt by the input of many Nerve Centre Droids but since those Days Jamie moved on who was forever on the board and his replacement Jon Oliver not only is responsible for an ncreased Graphic Novel line but also the Abaddon Books. There are no longer two editors as Cyber-Matt does both Jobs and with the increased work load due to the move tc I'm amazed we have seen more disruption to the schedule let alone anyone popping up for a chat.

Now if there's a job going that is well paid and means you sit on your arse all day answering the questions on the message board how do you apply 8-)

[Peter Wolf]

 I dont believe for a second that this messageboard is going to be pulled for transgressing an invisible *unknown* line of *whatever* it is as it would be very damaging to those that use it,those that read but dont post  ,and more than anything the comic itself.


 A very very bad move that would be indeed .


 I dont think that Rebellion want a forum full of fawning sycophants or to use an underlying threat of pulling the board if readers express opinions [positive or negative] as thats what its all about.

 I think Matt/Tharg was being reasonable if i understood the post correctly by that i maen Matt/Tharg is not saying dont be negative or critical about the content of the prog just do it with a bit of respect.

 Not "I think its shit ".

 No one likes that .

 Truly

 Either in print or to their face in the pub or whatever.I wouldnt like it and you wouldnt either if you are being honest with yourself and whats more i would not do it to someone else even though i am not scared to tell anyone exactly what i think of them to their face or in print.

 Unless its justified of course which it never is as nothing is ever that bad.


 It seems a fairly small thing to ask of us in return for having this place and i am willing to compromise[not that i ever posted disrespectful reviews] .Its such a small thing when everyone more or less has a free rein when posting [apart from the code of conduct] or starting topics.



 As for the rest of the implications of the post that started all this i really dont know as 10 pages later Matt or Tharg has not added anything else to the debate since to clarify exactly what they meant by pulling the board but it seems to lead back to Creators grievences about posted comments as quite honestly i cant see what else there is to complain about.

 It has already been confirmed that swearing is ok  to a certain extent even in a review if you care to say why.

[House of Usher]

"Surely not everyone buys each issue on blind faith?"

Well, I certainly do, and so does anyone who has a subscription. I buy Private Eye and Times Higher Education on the same basis. It's not unheard of.

[Matt Timson]

"Now if there's a job going that is well paid and means you sit on your arse all day answering the questions on the message board how do you apply 8-)"

Which is actually nothing like what I suggested at all, is it?

[Dog Deever]

cant....resist...

Philt was cited, by Tharg, as the offender for this. Philt did give constructive criticism of both Dead Eyes and 10 Seconders. He said they were 'incomprehensible'. Many agree. To improve the stories, they could have been made easier to follow. Fairly simple, really.

I don't think anyones hating you PJ- you're trying to be reasonable, as are we, but we don't believe that what Tharg is asking for is reasonable. Perhaps he can clear up what he is looking for. And why philt was the sacrificial lamb. Really, it could have been any of us. I thought one of my reviews of Dead Eyes in an earlier prog was a hell of a lot worse than his. Though it wasn't a personal sleight against any creator.

[Matt Timson]

Well I guess, despite protestations to the contrary, Tharg is only human.  People in all walks of life absorb what they perceive to be slights all the time- then blow up at some seemingly inconsequential or innocuous comment that, to them, is simply the last straw.

Have you never blown your top, to the almost total bemusement of those around you?  You'll be shocked to learn that I have, I'm sure.